Multi-Patch/Update Preview: XP Changes

[mikarddo]

I’m guessing here, but there’s a difference of groups running TRs.

There’s people like me, who zerg r1 +2 levels and don’t care about the lost rxp, because I’d rather level quicker and get my toon to cap where there is more rxp/min.

Then there are people that run r2-4 at level for the rxp bonus.

My guess is that they want to combine the BB/Reaper bonus levels to consolidate the groups and make it easier for people to find groups of players to run with.



Rumor I heard was that they were unaware that BB doesn’t affect rxp when the came up with these changes now they’re trying to figure out a way where they won’t nerf everyone’s ftb.

Except that Reaper xp seems to have its very own 200% first time bonus independently of both BB and difficulty first time bonusses so there is nothing to figure out.

[Grimtooth333]

Greetings! Thanks for the feedback. Some notes:

~ We have looked at the feedback on optional objectives and how they affect the Epic reincarnation process. On live Epic reincarnation doesn't clear out quest flags so players don't have to re-flag for quests. There is no reason that we need to retain quest flagging for optional objectives, however. With the XP changes we will also reset optional objective flags (and only those flags) when you do an Epic reincarnation. This will give characters a fresh set of optional objectives for each Epic life while keeping their flagging for quests intact.

Forcing us to ER is not a solution... this may surprise some of you developers but all forms of reincarnating is loathed by some of your players. I don't like players trying to tell me how I am supposed to enjoy the game, but when developers do it it really leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

Remove this poorly thought out change and maybe do what you did to crucible, pay the optional xp on completion. But I know your all mostly dead set on hurting players fun so you will continue this insanity, and more will leave... wonderful.

[Xgya]

Forcing us to ER is not a solution... this may surprise some of you developers but all forms of reincarnating is loathed by some of your players. I don't like players trying to tell me how I am supposed to enjoy the game, but when developers do it it really leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

Remove this poorly thought out change and maybe do what you did to crucible, pay the optional xp on completion. But I know your all mostly dead set on hurting players fun so you will continue this insanity, and more will leave... wonderful.

"Forcing you to ER"?

What is that? Why did you think that?
The ransack penalty and its reset only applies to optionals, which already gave you 0 XP if you were capped.
You'll earn just as much XP as you do currently, the buffs to reaper xp notwithstanding.

That reset happens because many people will ER and want to repeat a few quests that give good XP because of those optionals. They solved that issue.
People that didn't ER won't get an XP ransack reset, but neither did they earn any XP from those optionals in the first place, so they gained and lost absolutely nothing.

[Veltamore]

Well most of that is going to make what few LFMs we have even fewer. The place is already like a ghost town most of the time. Don't make it worse make it better do a server merge. The population is spread out over too many worlds not enough activity that's a killer for new players and old and the LFM.

[Grimtooth333]

"Forcing you to ER"?

What is that? Why did you think that?
The ransack penalty and its reset only applies to optionals, which already gave you 0 XP if you were capped.
You'll earn just as much XP as you do currently, the buffs to reaper xp notwithstanding.

That reset happens because many people will ER and want to repeat a few quests that give good XP because of those optionals. They solved that issue.
People that didn't ER won't get an XP ransack reset, but neither did they earn any XP from those optionals in the first place, so they gained and lost absolutely nothing.

Being capped isn't the end of getting xp now is it? The ED spheres take far longer to fill. All while xp for optionals has degraded and then I'm expected to run crappy xp quests to fill them or ER to reset them, losing a sphere of ED in the process, putting me further behind having to refill that on ER all while the optional xp is ransacking... again.

So yes it is trying to force people like myself to ER.

Also this thread is for feedback to the devs, I'm not interested in further explaining my positions to non devs, sorry.

[ElweSulk]

3. Increase the Daily bonus.

To further encourage a diversity of dungeons, the Daily bonus will be increased from 20% to 25% for Heroic dungeons, and 30% for Epic dungeons.

Currently today on live this bonus is removed if I summon a hireling. I've bought the top version of the different expansions, so I have scarecrows, owlbears, shield guardian.

I would like to use them without loosing this xp bonus - essentially I've given you money for it, but are hit with a xp penalty (i.e. no daily xp bonus) if I use it.


Please make it so that we can use these without loosing this daily xp bonus.

[Fedora1]

Currently today on live this bonus is removed if I summon a hireling. I've bought the top version of the different expansions, so I have scarecrows, owlbears, shield guardian.

I would like to use them without loosing this xp bonus - essentially I've given you money for it, but are hit with a xp penalty (i.e. no daily xp bonus) if I use it.


Please make it so that we can use these without loosing this daily xp bonus.

That's weird. Was the hire/pet over level for the quest? If not, good catch.

[LightBear]

Greetings! Thanks for the feedback. Some notes:

~ It is not our intention to reduce the rate at which characters gain Reaper XP. We intend to boost Reaper XP to make up for the loss of the Reaper XP gained from the old Bravery Streak bonus. We are looking at the best way to do that.

~ We have looked at the feedback on optional objectives and how they affect the Epic reincarnation process. On live Epic reincarnation doesn't clear out quest flags so players don't have to re-flag for quests. There is no reason that we need to retain quest flagging for optional objectives, however. With the XP changes we will also reset optional objective flags (and only those flags) when you do an Epic reincarnation. This will give characters a fresh set of optional objectives for each Epic life while keeping their flagging for quests intact.

~ We do not intend players to get full Bravery Bonus if they are over level. Like on live, if the player is more than 2 levels above the base CR of the quest they will get less Bravery Bonus and their Dungeons Completed count will not be incremented. The reduction - 25% on Hard and 50% on Elite/Reaper - will be the same as on live.

~ There seems to be some confusion on Reaper XP over level penalties. The XP penalty for characters being over level will match the way it works on Elite. This helps things stay consistent. Characters who are too high level are still prevented from entering quests on Reaper difficulty. In the Epic levels this will work as it does on live; players are prevented from entering a Reaper dungeon if they are more than 6 levels above the base CR of the dungeons. In the heroic levels we have reduced this range to 4 levels.

Example:

You are running a level 10 dungeon on Reaper. The modified challenge rating is 12 - since Reaper uses the CR for Elite. If your character is level 13 or lower there is no penalty. Level 14 would give a reduction of -10% of base XP. Level 15 would give a reduction of -25% of base XP. Level 16 would give a reduction of -50% of base XP. Level 17 would give a reduction of -75% of base XP. Level 18 would give a reduction of -99% of base XP. Higher levels would reduce the XP to zero.

As an aside, I apologize for the delay in response. Any plans for changes that involve tech require some research before we can comment on a definitive plan.

Sev~

PS: While I would love nothing better than to burn the XP system to the ground and re-implement an easier to understand system - maybe with, I don't know, one way to reward first time play and one system to penalize playing over level, we are trying to maintain parity so players don't feel we are trying to take away their XP.

No need to over react and burn things to the ground.
As others have pointed out, yes you don't get a penalty for 3 levels above yet you'll loose the bravery bonus, right now on live (and it doesn't count towards your streak).
I'm not against being able to run 3 levels higher and get full boni tho, makes the leveling much easier and more reaper points.

[Dandonk]

Currently today on live this bonus is removed if I summon a hireling. I've bought the top version of the different expansions, so I have scarecrows, owlbears, shield guardian.

I would like to use them without loosing this xp bonus - essentially I've given you money for it, but are hit with a xp penalty (i.e. no daily xp bonus) if I use it.


Please make it so that we can use these without loosing this daily xp bonus.

In my experience, this is a visual bug only. The daily bonus is shown/not shown semirandomly. Summoning a hire makes it be not shown, killing mobs tends to make it appear again. Doing an optional tends to make it appear.

Whatever the case of it being shown/not shown is, as far as I can tell, it always applies on quest completion.

(This is my experience solely, I cannot vouch for it being 100% true for everyone everywhere at any time... but try and see, at least)

[QueenOfTheHook]

Forcing us to ER is not a solution... this may surprise some of you developers but all forms of reincarnating is loathed by some of your players. I don't like players trying to tell me how I am supposed to enjoy the game, but when developers do it it really leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

Remove this poorly thought out change and maybe do what you did to crucible, pay the optional xp on completion. But I know your all mostly dead set on hurting players fun so you will continue this insanity, and more will leave... wonderful.

It doesn't take that long to cap out all the ED spheres. By the time you cap them all, you will have enough karma to never need to use it since you loathe the idea of an ETR. If you are determined to hang out at end game forever (your choice), then this will just extend what there is actually left for you to do. Or buck up and ETR once in a great blue moon. It's not like they are forcing you to go back to level 1 to reset it now.

[Arkat]

No offense, but you could not be more completely wrong. I'm not saying you need to step in and immediately promise things. But had someone stepped in and said, "This looks to be an issue on which a lot of people have provided significant feedback, so we are taking it to the group to discuss. Thanks!" people would have felt a million times better.

You can say all you want about how you guys are always reading. It doesn't matter. Saying that and expecting it to just be okay misunderstands the entirety of human beings and the way they communicate. Let's say you had no face-to-face interactions with your boss and only communicated with him/her by email. Your boss sends out an email about changes to your benefits. You frantically send an email back advising that it isn't going to work the way he/she thinks, and please consider X, Y, and Z. You know he/she read the email. But unless you get SOME response back, you will be super anxious. You will start to feel like you haven't been heard. You will feel frustrated. And if your boss waits almost a week to respond, you're going to feel like you aren't actually important, nor is your feedback.

You guys aren't our bosses, and we aren't talking about anything as significant as benefits, but the principle remains the same. Please stop making excuses for the lack of communication by blaming players for something they haven't even been given the opportunity to do. I can't guarantee that literally no one would be a jerk, but most people would not be. Most people would get it and feel better that they had been recognized.

Seriously. Stop with the silence, guys. It makes more of a mess of everything literally every single time you all do it.

Agree fully!

[nokowi]

As Sev said, for stuff like this we take the time to kick the tires to avoid promising things that are not technically feasible. Plus, if we had stepped in and reassured you folks without something concrete, everyone would be here telling us to not waste time by replying without something to say :P Us reading and responding to feedback is the default, not the exception - we're always listening

"Hey folks, we are juggling around some ideas for changes to how XP and RXP are earned. Our goals are

A.
B.
C.
D.

Here are our constraints:
E.
F.
G.

We would like to get some raw feedback, so we will be waiting X days before we jump in and enter the conversation. Please know that we are reading each and every response during this period, and that we will engage in discussion once we have a better idea of the player response and we have a chance to do some more brainstorming."


SSG, think about what you can do to improve. At each and every turn, you demonstrate an inability to receive critical feedback.

Take all the time you have spent monitoring (R)XP/min and put it to use looking at LFM usage, time spent standing there doing nothing (I'd like to play this game and even logged in, but Y prevents me from actually questing), and time spent moving gear or trying to TR. I'm sure you could find some ways to make the game more enjoyable, if that was your goal.

Closing quests, making them less enjoyable, and punitive XP monitoring is not the answer.


If you were actually part of the conversation, players wouldn't need to waste their time talking about things that are not technically feasible. Be respectful to those making suggestions and providing critical feedback.

You lost me when you you say you can't have a good response to a suggestion that is not technically feasible. The response should be clear and obvious - letting them know that it won't work and why. That's called participating in a discussion and adding value to a conversation. It's part of showing your customers that feedback is valued, and that you are actually listening.

[Jerevth]

Sev,
Thanks for the reply; it is greatly appreciated.
I think taking a measured series of steps with the XP aspect of this would be beneficial rather than the perceived "This is how things will be done" impression would be better received by everyone at the table.

For the Devs to consider:

Assurances that the XP changes will be watched and flexibility in the final numbers, based off constructive discussion and feedback.

-STAYING AT 30: A valid concern was raised about people who would reach level 30 and continue to fill spheres without ETR'ing. The "optional" lockdown would impact that significantly.
*The newly introduced "Wish for Memories potion" seems a bit like a false carrot in light of the coming changes. XP transfer would be reduced if this isn't used before the optionals are locked down without ETR.

-OPTIONALS: Optionals are the antithesis of zerg-running in most cases. Alternately, increasing the optional XP value (Locked to the requirement of the quest completion- i.e. no Completion, no optionals) but putting them on a three day cool down may get better results than "run and done". At least increase their XP value and lock it down to being awarded after quest completion, please.

-SAGAS: The discussion of Sagas has come up a lot as incentive for running multiple quests. Is it feasible to increase the Saga XP pay-off to compensate for the loss of benefits elsewhere (Essentially the dwindling optional bonuses until ETR/TR)?

-RUNNING SOONER: Can running quests 1 level above a character's level net an XP gain commensurate with the XP loss of running a quest 3 under my character's level; If I run a base level 22 quest at level 21, can the XP increase by 25%. (I don't recall the cut-off where a quest is not unlocked). (This would be invalidated if there is a character of higher level running in the group). Should this be a one-shot incentive or until the character levels?

-THE GRIND: A percentage of quest re-running is not for XP but for the gear that sometimes drops at the end. Can a non-transferrable token (stackable/pouchable) and related to the quest chain be an alternative end chest loot item that always drops for the character and after bulk turn-in (let's start the bidding at 20 tokens) the objective item be made available? (Potential high number requirements for mythic versions).

-OTAR: Optionals That Are Required. There are quests with wickets branded as optionals that are not really optional. DA is a prime example. There are other quests that update requirements as the quest progresses and DA (And several/many others) need to be reviewed and updated to support either with a final XP pay-out increase that equals the current optionals, or change the "optional" status to "required" as the quests progress.

-DEATH AND DISMEMBERMENT CLAUSE: There are some quests that are just a royal pain to complete or impossible (The final Rage chain fight against the beholder is almost Raid-worthy.) That quest needs a tremendous XP pay-out to match the abuse it takes to complete at level +/-2. These quests need review and tweaking to pay experience in balance.)

-More SAGA: Occasional, limited time NPCs who pop up for a week or a month, who offer treasures for the completion of the specified quests. (Level range specific NPCs). Put them where Taj stands uselessly all year or hide them in un-visited bars, in a wilderness, etc. The quests can range across the 'verse. Heck, include some that require owning the pack or VIP status to complete. It's a good incentive to buy/subscribe. But the reward must be worth the run. GH Crucible, the Mind Sunder, +4 more and throw in a raid all within 3 levels of one another and you get 200k xp Stone (BTC, break when used) OR a limited edition weapon/armor/item of choice. (I initially said flavored but we don't want vanilla). Suddenly there will be LFMs and guild runs to these underused quests. It's an event; Flimsy can hid them anywhere in a FTP area and be devious about it. Word will leak out if it isn't announced. Run with it. Lynn can craft the gear and even, via contest, award people with the chance to create something (within a set of guidelines and some sanity checks).

-FINALLY: We're not all elite gamers who live and breathe DDO. I'm not certain how your metrics measure (I started to dive down that rabbit hole and deleted the monversation (I was only talking to myself)). But reruns of a quest should not be taken into the final tally for average run times. There are an astounding number of variables that came up but, suffice it to say, I think the XP revamp is in response to the perception that specific quests are being run too fast and too often. Perhaps an additive approach (Updated gear in un-run quests, quest rennovations/updates, and other incentives) would be the more positive approach. Offer me a reason to go run that horrible Reaver's Rest chain instead of taking away the shinies. You have the framework in place to rebuild that series, and others, already. They just need fixing. AKA: Reaver 2.0.

Too much time spent here, time for me to go adult.

[Requiro]

<snip>

3. Increase the Daily bonus.

To further encourage a diversity of dungeons, the Daily bonus will be increased from 20% to 25% for Heroic dungeons, and 30% for Epic dungeons.

<snip>
Sev~

I read it again, because I felt that there is something wrong here.
How increasing Daily bonus help encourage a diversity of dungeons? Seriously? Daily bonus is.. well... how to say it... bonus for play quest once a DAY (that's why you call it Daily I supposed). So I can play Dailies quests, and repeat it next day, and still acquire this bonus.

If I am correct (and you named that bonuses this way):


- First Time bonus encourage .... the first time you play quest, but not on the same difficulty. Available to all players. RXP affected
- Bravery Bonuses encourage .... the first time you play a quest but on higher than Normal difficulty. Available for VIPs and TR characters only (or if you join groups that open you Hard or Elite). RXP not affected.
- Daily bonuses encourage play every day, no matter if you play the same quest or other quests. All you must do is wait 24 hours for this bonus. Available to all players. RXP affected

So…

If you Buff Daily Bonuses and Lower First time bonuses you actually do opposite to your goal! This way you ENCOURAGE TO REPEAT THE SAME QUEST EACH DAY!

If you really want accomplished your goals, you should do:

First time bonuses:
20% Normal
35% Hard
80% Elite
(I don’t care about Reaper – it should be the same as Elite, but if you want keep current HUGE bonus it should be 130%)

Daily
25% Heroic
30% Epic

BB Steak:
0% Normal
30% Hard
60% Elite / Reaper

The results here:


AND if you want more diversity of dungeons you should at first add a lot more XP to unwanted quest (you will find them easly by yout data and from post in that thred)

Additional if you have no other ideas you can consider something like Diversity bonus XP:

DIVERSITY XP BONUS:
If you play different quest in a row, you gain 20% XP. Quest completion will be removed from Ransack list after 7 days.

So every 7 days, you can play that quest again and get bonus to XP.

[SpartanKiller13]

Thank you Sev for at least taking player feedback into account, but are optional flag resets sufficient to keep ETR rates at least at the same level they are now with dailies ?
I haven't crunched the numbers, but at first glance I don't believe this to be sufficient to keep ETR XP/minute gain on par with on live.

I think increased Daily XP bonus will help Dailies a bit (especially if you do EN today, EH tomorrow, EE the third day); also I expect it won't be the exact same set of Dailies; with Opt ransack, you're better off mainlining quests and going for those with few optionals and faster completion times, at least after the first few runs of each opt-heavy Daily per Epic life.

I also wonder about Devious/Insidious Cunning; with less opts encouraging zerging, those XP bonuses would become available and they're amazing for XP/minute (kill less, complete faster, get more XP).

Also BB's being untied from streaks should help considerably, especially for stuff on EH where currently it's awkward deciding to pause or not (maintain E-streak, or get the HBB bonus); and for throwing in a EH/EE run in your dailies set. It'll also help XP/hour directly by avoiding travel time & load screens.

I expect the first few Epic lives will be slower for everyone, but I also expect it to pick up a bit as people figure stuff out (and add more quests to their list of Daily options, like I just added Garl to mine).

[Merrillman]

Greetings! Thanks for the feedback. Some notes:

~ It is not our intention to reduce the rate at which characters gain Reaper XP. We intend to boost Reaper XP to make up for the loss of the Reaper XP gained from the old Bravery Streak bonus. We are looking at the best way to do that.

~ We have looked at the feedback on optional objectives and how they affect the Epic reincarnation process. On live Epic reincarnation doesn't clear out quest flags so players don't have to re-flag for quests. There is no reason that we need to retain quest flagging for optional objectives, however. With the XP changes we will also reset optional objective flags (and only those flags) when you do an Epic reincarnation. This will give characters a fresh set of optional objectives for each Epic life while keeping their flagging for quests intact.

~ We do not intend players to get full Bravery Bonus if they are over level. Like on live, if the player is more than 2 levels above the base CR of the quest they will get less Bravery Bonus and their Dungeons Completed count will not be incremented. The reduction - 25% on Hard and 50% on Elite/Reaper - will be the same as on live.

~ There seems to be some confusion on Reaper XP over level penalties. The XP penalty for characters being over level will match the way it works on Elite. This helps things stay consistent. Characters who are too high level are still prevented from entering quests on Reaper difficulty. In the Epic levels this will work as it does on live; players are prevented from entering a Reaper dungeon if they are more than 6 levels above the base CR of the dungeons. In the heroic levels we have reduced this range to 4 levels.

Example:

You are running a level 10 dungeon on Reaper. The modified challenge rating is 12 - since Reaper uses the CR for Elite. If your character is level 13 or lower there is no penalty. Level 14 would give a reduction of -10% of base XP. Level 15 would give a reduction of -25% of base XP. Level 16 would give a reduction of -50% of base XP. Level 17 would give a reduction of -75% of base XP. Level 18 would give a reduction of -99% of base XP. Higher levels would reduce the XP to zero.

As an aside, I apologize for the delay in response. Any plans for changes that involve tech require some research before we can comment on a definitive plan.

Sev~

PS: While I would love nothing better than to burn the XP system to the ground and re-implement an easier to understand system - maybe with, I don't know, one way to reward first time play and one system to penalize playing over level, we are trying to maintain parity so players don't feel we are trying to take away their XP.

XP doesn’t mean much if you can’t complete a quest at endgame. Wizard without PM or Running a Toaster to get healing is nigh impossible with a traditional wizard build (and shouldn’t we be able to be an archetype wiz?) on the jump from lev 33 hard to level 52,000 (34) elite or god-forbid, level 75000 Reaper. PLEASE make the Tank & Healer Focus change to where if you solo and only group periodically with friends because we’ve all got kids and crazy lives but LOVE DDO, to a place where Abjuration Magic can be rightly HEIGHTENED to actually absorb more damage (300 stoneskin DR means zippo at level 52000, FYI, as does Energy Resistance, prot from elements, etc...). A better balance at endgame would be allowing either Amplification of healing magic via enhancement trees (potion amp, faster pot cooldowns, a twist like the Tiefs get to swap spellpowers that intra-lock heal and Spellpower, for instance) or upping abjurer spells big time. Stoneskin is useless at 300 DR when that’s one blow from one opponent on elite. Heighten it to allow an extra 100-120/ DR per level when Heightened. We still have terrible AC and no armor, so it’s not like we won’t get hit. But these Abjuration Spells I think could be worth looking at to give casters at least some viability past hard when soloing. Sure, we might have to spend Points in a tree, but if we don’t want to be a PM wraith (awesome PM work, FYI!) or Harper (which anyone can be) I think Abjurer is a great “splash” option we don’t currently have. You can’t even diplo when solo and conjurers should be able to conjure more than 1 helper. At least PM get a same level undead fighter that can at least take a shot PLUS conjured creatures.

Traditional wizard needs a boost to endgame viability. How can I cakewalk hard and it be impossible on e/r1? It seems unbalanced. I’ve been playing D&D for 40 years and top level wizards are just not that fearsome when compared to PM or Warforged arti casters (laser cannons, Machine Guns, Armor, bombs, DR, healing, pets...) in DDO. You’d think they’re smart enough to ward themselves better via proper magic wards. Just a suggestion. Also please let dark negative based clerics have undead/pm type tree. THANKS!!

[Xgya]

To spawn the ghost you have to kill a mob on the right side of the map near the windmill (first mob across the river, level with the shrine) I don’t think there’s any other requirement to spawn her.

Can anyone confirm this?
I don't know if it works, but I'll most certainly try.
Thanks in advance.

----------------------------------------

About the lack of communication: I know you guys can't be on the forums 100% of the time to answer any and every question players come up with, and I'm grateful for the extra work you've done with giving your intentions to the community as a whole before proceeding, but beyond telling us what to expect, anything that has not been related to items seems to have had little to no influence from the community beyond small corrections where you've been shown you've overshot. (e.g: the cores in the new Palemaster not giving enough spell power)

While I certainly don't want that chain of communication to end, and I would gladly understand if you thought most of your time is better spent programming or designing content (which it clearly is) the sentiment that this discussion is pretty one-sided remains.

[erethizon]

Currently today on live this bonus is removed if I summon a hireling. I've bought the top version of the different expansions, so I have scarecrows, owlbears, shield guardian.

I would like to use them without loosing this xp bonus - essentially I've given you money for it, but are hit with a xp penalty (i.e. no daily xp bonus) if I use it.


Please make it so that we can use these without loosing this daily xp bonus.

That's weird. Was the hire/pet over level for the quest? If not, good catch.

He is referring to the fact that almost all actions (like casting a spell) can make the daily playthrough bonus stop appearing on the bottom of the LFM. For most of the dungeon you will not see the daily bonus at the bottom. Certain actions cause it to reappear. But this is purely a display error. Nothing you can do will ever cause you to lose the daily playthrough bonus. It is always applied at the end no matter what.

[Shadow_Jumper]

Except that Reaper xp seems to have its very own 200% first time bonus independently of both BB and difficulty first time bonusses so there is nothing to figure out.

Reaper xp is affected by;

Ftb
Voice
Vip
Pots
In quest bonuses

The 200% independent ftb you are describing is the specific reaper ftb. You can actually run (ex. Grim) EN while leveling, and still have your reaper ftb. Technically it’s a different ftb, but the bonus was still 120%. Now it will be 75% with the majority of the xp difference being moved to bb, which doesn’t affect rxp.

Things like xp tomes, bb, and more commonly buddy bonus have no effect on rxp.

[carsonfball]

Ugh - you're preaching to the choir, here. I have a tentative "fix" that breaks the NPC's scripts to let people in the front door without the stones. Unfortunately, the intricities of this particular flagging method make it not as easy to refactor as it sounds. My "fix" is very much a "let's start deleting logic until the door just appears" thing, and it's nowhere near ready to release as-is.

I am also toying with an "Upgraded Completed Sigil" that will retain your flagging for Accursed Ascension (it'll be an upgraded Completed Sigil that holds your flagging for Litany of the Dead).

Thanks!