Nerf SWF's 2x stat mod to damage down to 1.5x

[Ayseifn]

I could also make the case that it was a waste of resources to inject the SWF fighting style into the game to begin with.

And besides, this is old news folks. The problem isn't the nerf, its the fact that it wasn't actually implemented.

So, this is merely a bug fix. And, in accordance with your view on promoting bug fixes, I fit your criteria for caring about the game in my support of this bug fix.

Glad we agree! =D

SWF didn't really add anything good to the game IMO, just bugs, restrictions and balance issues.

Can't take two different weapon styles anymore, can't really ignore the THF feats anymore on feat starved classes or acrobats and then there's all the bugs. Orb paladins with shield masteries(fixed?), 2x stat modifier(going to be fixed), wolf druids(still not fixed), Shining Crescents(still meh with bugs anyway) and whatever else.

[Gimpy007]

I agree with Jaggyjag on this one. This wasn't hurting things at all and directing a limited resource away from developing content or addressing lag to nerf something which had a positive impact on the player was in very poor taste. I think Jaggy is also right that this is almost definately motivated by a bruised ego.

Next time you nerf enthusiests get lag wiped or are stuck due to lag... know that you are part of the problem.

[cdbd3rd]

Intermission from the spiraling chaos...

[Impaqt]

Oh really, so by all means show me the "facts" that it was hurting the game or any player.... go ahead so me that fact.

I actually never claimed it to be a fact. Its my opinion. and Turbine shares that opinion.....

Then show me the Fact that it will goes back to "where its supposed to be".

Its in the feat Description. so, I'll just go with that.

Then share the fact of how that particular mechanic which apparently was complex enough not to be successfully changed when they thought they had done it last time is now somehow going to be changed without pulling resources, and then make sure to explain how YOU KNOW personally what is and what isn't "a lot" of resources.

in software development, sometimes a change slips. Sometimes it gets made, but a reversion accidentally rolls it back. Sometimes, someone purposely manipulates code for personal gain. I have no idea what happened, so sorry, cant provide a fact for ya there either. bottom line, I doubt it will take much to make the change.

See personally, I am SICK of pretend know it alls pulling "facts" out of their ears to justify getting what they want so their egos don't get threatened by all the people who are enjoying a different fight style then the precious THF.


So come on mate, lets see those FACTS, WE ARE ALL WAITING LETS SEE THEM, COME ON........ SHOW US.

The only one throwing the term "fact" around is you.

This thread is about someone wanting SFW damage adjusted to what the description is. Most of us provided the opinion that it did indeed need to be adjusted down to the description. "Facts" are irrelevant.

[Rull]

I agree with Jaggyjag on this one. This wasn't hurting things at all and directing a limited resource away from developing content or addressing lag to nerf something which had a positive impact on the player was in very poor taste.

If you fail to see the importance of things working in the way the description specifies, maybe you understand this:

When you ask the players for feedback on a new feature, then intend to make a change according to this feedback, then once again receive feedback on that change, it would be a huge waste of resources to not execute it properly.
Many players who have the game's best interest in mind think along with the developers.
They put in time and effort discussing the ideas (700 posts here, https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...Fighting-Feats , 500 more here https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...iew-Discussion , etc)
They put in hours and hours in excel or writing simulation programs to make calculations as accurately as possible and discuss them in posts like https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...-vs-THF-vs-SnB
and they spent a LOT of time rolling toons and playing them on lammania and even document it in videos to share their experiences ( https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...-Videos-inside )

That's a tremendous amount of work put in collectively. Directing so much effort to discussing how something should be, only to waste it all by accidentally doing something different than what you have decided (after interpreting all this feedback) to be the best way... now THAT is what I would call squandering resources.

Now I do not necessarily say the devs have decided correctly in this. We can have the whole discussion again, I don't mind, I like the topic. I don't mind discussing more stressing issues either. But I wouldn't put in any effort at all if I knew it wouldn't matter, because what would be implemented is something that slipped in from an earlier build.

It's like building a new house and then not bothering to put in a door because "there are things more important in life than having a large house, my old place will do just fine"

[Scrapco]

It's like building a new house and then not bothering to put in a door because "there are things more important in life than having a large house, my old place will do just fine"

"Hey, that house is nicer than mine! It has a swimming pool! What? No... I don't want a swimming pool. Just fill in that guy's."

[Sehenry03]

I agree with Jaggyjag on this one. This wasn't hurting things at all and directing a limited resource away from developing content or addressing lag to nerf something which had a positive impact on the player was in very poor taste. I think Jaggy is also right that this is almost definately motivated by a bruised ego.

Next time you nerf enthusiests get lag wiped or are stuck due to lag... know that you are part of the problem.

Ummm...so it takes a nerf enthusiast to want a skill to work like it is suppose to? Wow I am such a complete ass then ****!!!!

[Gimpy007]

"Hey, that house is nicer than mine! It has a swimming pool! What? No... I don't want a swimming pool. Just fill in that guy's."

QFT.. QQ's all over.

[Impaqt]

QFT.. QQ's all over.

Actually, its more like the neighborhood homeowners association decided every house should have a pool. so they put a nice pool in for everyone complete with a huge water slide with loops and twists and a ring of fire to jump through at the end.

After a few days, they realize the slide is a bit too much. So they remove it and replace it with a basic slide.


Ya still got a freakin pool in the end....

[Fafnir]

SWF is still great. A reasonable fix so that it is WAI / described.

[Gimpy007]

Actually, its more like the neighborhood homeowners association decided every house should have a pool. so they put a nice pool in for everyone complete with a huge water slide with loops and twists and a ring of fire to jump through at the end.

After a few days, they realize the slide is a bit too much. So they remove it and replace it with a basic slide.


Ya still got a freakin pool in the end....

More like the homeowners association decided every house should have a pool. One house put a slide on their pool and it made that pool even more fun. The other homeowners in the association decided they didn't like having a pool that wasn't as good as their neighbors so they had the neighbors slide torn down.

There.. I corrected it for you. Since by your account the SW Fighters decided to nerf themselves when in reality it was the THFs that QQ'ed until it was done "to" the SW Fighters.

I'm so glad dev time was taken to research this, change the code, check to make sure the nerf would function in practice, compile the patch, update the version check software, push the patch to client, and publish release notes... I for one would DEFINATELY not want that time spent on fixing lag, fixing bugs, adding new content, creating new art/textures, looking for cheaters, developing new loot, or anything else that would increase the fun of the game QQ victory underscore!!!! Hip-hip Horay!! Hip-hip Horay!!

[Keladon]

More like the homeowners association decided every house should have a pool. One house put a slide on their pool and it made that pool even more fun. The other homeowners in the association decided they didn't like having a pool that wasn't as good as their neighbors so they had the neighbors slide torn down.

There.. I corrected it for you. Since by your account the SW Fighters decided to nerf themselves when in reality it was the THFs that QQ'ed until it was done "to" the SW Fighters.

I'm so glad dev time was taken to research this, change the code, check to make sure the nerf would function in practice, compile the patch, update the version check software, push the patch to client, and publish release notes... I for one would DEFINATELY not want that time spent on fixing lag, fixing bugs, adding new content, creating new art/textures, looking for cheaters, developing new loot, or anything else that would increase the fun of the game QQ victory underscore!!!! Hip-hip Horay!! Hip-hip Horay!!

This was a bug.

The description didn't match what it did ingame.
The way it was working now was bugged.
They fixed it.

I don't care how they fix it, either make it function like the description or change the description, I just want to see things like that fixed.
Having to test everything yourself before you make a new build is not the way things should be, I want feats/skills/enhancements/abilities to actually do what they say.

[Ako]

You nerf proponents/supports are wayyyy off on this one. The description and the feature didn't match sure. But it was NOT a negative... when you remove a positive YOU are the negative.

I agree with Gimpy all the way. Especially the part where he said the next time you get lag know that YOU are in part responsible for it by redirecting resources.

I understand why you are upset at being called out on it though.. it sux being called out when you KNOW you did wrong.. even if you are able to double talk your way around it.

[Grailhawk]

Na this is more like Halloween for an 8 year old who got a 4 lb bag of candy and has eaten 2 lb and his mom comes in and stops him before he makes himself sick.

The QQing at this point is all about how your candy has been taken away from you and you hate the people who know you shouldn't have that much candy in a single sitting, and if you are the type that things you can have all the candy you want well then your not mature enough to understand the consequences.

[Gimpy007]

it sux being called out when you KNOW you did wrong.. even if you are able to double talk your way around it.

QFT... This one is for you Grailhawk.

[Vargouille]

Players dealing more damage isn't inherently good or positive. Just as players dealing less damage isn't an inherently good thing. Monsters dealing more or less damage isn't an inherently good thing.

No challenge, no fun.

[Ovrad]

Players dealing more damage isn't inherently good or positive. Just as players dealing less damage isn't an inherently good thing. Monsters dealing more or less damage isn't an inherently good thing.

No challenge, no fun.

But certain classes dealing multiple times more damage than others isn't a good thing...

[EllisDee37]

Na this is more like Halloween for an 8 year old who got a 4 lb bag of candy and has eaten 2 lb and his mom comes in and stops him before he makes himself sick.

The QQing at this point is all about how your candy has been taken away from you and you hate the people who know you shouldn't have that much candy in a single sitting, and if you are the type that things you can have all the candy you want well then your not mature enough to understand the consequences.

This is how I see it as well, though your wording is more kind than my thoughts.

[Fedora1]

Let's see how many more analogies we can come up that prove or disprove each others opinions.

I was happy with my SWF/Swash before the "correction" and I still like my SWF/Swash after the "correction". Yes she lost some dps, but she didn't become a gimp by any means.

[schelsullivan]

yea my 2nd life bard swashbuckler is still laying waste EE quest np.