Stone of Change - Eldritch Rituals Cookbook

[SneakThief]

Is there a compiled list of all the screen shot links?

[MysticTheurge]

Looking through some examples we have

Goggles: MEN/EEP -> +4 and MON/MEP -> +6 so not the Essence (i.e. order of Positive and Negative)
Goggles: MEP/MEN -> +4 and MON/MEP -> +6 so not the Focus

I really hope its not the Gem because that opens up a boatload of permutations.

You've reversed the words "Focus" and "Essence" in your summary. (That is Neg/Pos is the Focus, Mat/Eth is the Essence.)

[Grimshadow]

I think we have been making it more complicated than it is.

First check this out, http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1074/planesox7.png

This of it like this.
When we imbue a shard, the material or ethereal place it in one of those planes, the fire/earth/air/water place it in a specific spot in this 3D map, the Powering Effect we add, (ie. opposition, dominion or escalation) gives us the direction and purpose to our next location.



Overall Planes ----------------Material----------------------------Ethereal------------

Sub-Planes --------------------Positive----------------------------Positive------------
-------------------------Earth--Fire--Air--Water-------------Earth--Fire--Air--Water
--------------------------------Negative---------------------------Negative------------

Powering Effect -----Dominion-Opposition-Escalation------Dominion-Opposition-Escalation

With that being said, to achieve best effects maybe we have to plot out our path rather than bouncing around. Let me know what you think.

[Agarwaen]

Well, I did a little digging because this existential stalemate issue is now driving me nuts. I was able to find screenie examples of 5 stalemate items. If anyone out there can dig up a few more, please do, because I think we are really close to figuring this out. Here are the ones I found (all upgrades are in order small, medium, large):

Kargon's Neckamerlace (Only +4 wis)
Pos/Mat/Esc
Neg/Mat/Opp
Fire/Mat/Esc

My goggles (only +4 wis)
Neg/Mat/Esc
Pos/Eth/Esc

GwenJynx's cloak (only +4 wis)
Pos/Mat/Esc
Neg/Mat/Esc

Andareal's goggles (great commander name and +6 wis)
Neg/Mat/Opp
Pos/Mat/Esc

Adrinor's Khopesh (+6 wis)
*****This may not be valid for comparison since it is a weapon. Weapons may always get +6 wis regardless of the ingredients used. Until someone finds an example of a weapon getting only +4 wisdom, we can't know.)*****
Pos/Mat/Dom
Neg/Mat/Dom

Please commence your logical deductions when ready

[Raidon]

It seems that one limiting possibility is whether upgrades use all Ethereal or all Material.

The air guard weapon for example had all etherial, and usually people are going material for weapons. Some people are posting mixes of Mat/Eth and often getting lesser or no results, and some seem to get the 3rd tier regardless...

It may be false, as I seem to remember at least some combos with a mixed essence path...but I found it really an unusual pattern that the only weapon with a guard effect was all Eth. Maybe its best 2 out of three?

Just spitballing anyway. But it seems it would be a pretty limiting factor, as if you want a certain type of bonus that is Mat at tier 2 say, and another that is Eth...you are mixing yourself out of a tier 3 upgrade.

Trusted Friend Has Triple MDA Longsword , I was there when he put the final upgrade on. MDA+MDA+MDA = Air Guard. (Longsword)
No Love there im afraid

It would also be nice to get dev confirmation that this isnt a coding bug, because Air Guard on a weapon is totally against any logic....

Finally I would just like to remind people that the weaker upgrade are 3 of the same foci , implying that the para/quasi upgrades (stronger) would probably use more ingredients (16) at the final upgrade and 2 foci..... somehow....the only thing against this is what benefit would be applied? If a Fire and Earth foci were mixed with say Material/Dominion what would one get , the MDF bonus , the MDE bonus or a whole new chart?/

Still time before i can test, so please someone feel free ... we need this eliminated next before any speculations on gem combinations etc etc , imo

[SneakThief]

To be specific ... on Existiential Stalemate I have seen +6 WIS on multiple Weapons and I have seen +4 WIS on multiple items. The anomaly is specific to upgraded Sceptors that both had +4 rather than the expected +6. I don't have screenshots but it was two guildies the same night and I have no reason to doubt either of them. Since these are the first sceptors I have seen upgraded in this manor I am assuming that this is associated with Sceptors and not the way it was upgraded or mysterious circumstances.

Can you get the recipies (or screen shots) from them for recipe comparisons?

[Boulderun]

Trusted Friend Has Triple MDA Longsword , I was there when he put the final upgrade on. MDA+MDA+MDA = Air Guard. (Longsword)
No Love there im afraid

Air Guard on weapons is probably just a bug then. Surprise surprise.

[push7]

Is improved regeneration items working at all? I made my Great Commander Green Steel Goggles of Wizardry VI with improved regeneration last night, and I have not gotten a single hp healed from it since. PEE/POM. The only thing I can think of why this isn't healing, is because my toon is true neutral and maybe, since the heal effect is good energy, it only heals good alignment? Can anyone confirm tis? The Gms were no help and said file a bug report. If I am right then it would be good for others to know. I play on Ghallanda, and my toon is named Nylrem, if anyone needs to contact me.

[SneakThief]

Kargon's Neckamerlace (Only +4 wis)
Pos/Mat/Esc
Neg/Mat/Opp
Fire/Mat/Esc

Andareal's goggles (great commander name and +6 wis)
Neg/Mat/Opp
Pos/Mat/Esc

Ouch ... that makes it interesting ...

[SneakThief]

I think we have been making it more complicated than it is.

First check this out, http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1074/planesox7.png

This of it like this.
When we imbue a shard, the material or ethereal place it in one of those planes, the fire/earth/air/water place it in a specific spot in this 3D map, the Powering Effect we add, (ie. opposition, dominion or escalation) gives us the direction and purpose to our next location.



Overall Planes ----------------Material----------------------------Ethereal------------

Sub-Planes --------------------Positive----------------------------Positive------------
-------------------------Earth--Fire--Air--Water-------------Earth--Fire--Air--Water
--------------------------------Negative---------------------------Negative------------

Powering Effect -----Dominion-Opposition-Escalation------Dominion-Opposition-Escalation

With that being said, to achieve best effects maybe we have to plot out our path rather than bouncing around. Let me know what you think.

Okay ... Opposition is easy to figure out, but which direction are you suggesting for Dom/Esc?

[Coldin]

Air Guard on weapons is probably just a bug then. Surprise surprise.

Should probably bug report it then. It's kinda wierd that all the other weapons upgrades would have an on-hit effect, while the air one is a guard effect instead.

I wonder if Eladrin is still watching this thread...

[Borror0]

Ouch ... that makes it interesting ...

Were they both made prepatch?

[Big-Dex]

Well, I did a little digging because this existential stalemate issue is now driving me nuts. I was able to find screenie examples of 5 stalemate items. If anyone out there can dig up a few more, please do, because I think we are really close to figuring this out. Here are the ones I found (all upgrades are in order small, medium, large):

Kargon's Neckamerlace (Only +4 wis)
Pos/Mat/Esc
Neg/Mat/Opp
Fire/Mat/Esc

My goggles (only +4 wis)
Neg/Mat/Esc
Pos/Eth/Esc

GwenJynx's cloak (only +4 wis)
Pos/Mat/Esc
Neg/Mat/Esc

Andareal's goggles (great commander name and +6 wis)
Neg/Mat/Opp
Pos/Mat/Esc

Adrinor's Khopesh (+6 wis)
*****This may not be valid for comparison since it is a weapon. Weapons may always get +6 wis regardless of the ingredients used. Until someone finds an example of a weapon getting only +4 wisdom, we can't know.)*****
Pos/Mat/Dom
Neg/Mat/Dom

Please commence your logical deductions when ready

The only pattern I see is in the GEM - Andareal's goggles went OPP/ESC on the gem in the first two teirs. Kargon's went ESC/OPP. Perhaps the term Escalation needs to be considered literally? Just shooting from the hip here. I know Kargon went ESC on the third teir, but after a stalemate, it might not have the same effect.

~ DEX

[SneakThief]

Is improved regeneration items working at all? I made my Great Commander Green Steel Goggles of Wizardry VI with improved regeneration last night, and I have not gotten a single hp healed from it since. PEE/POM. The only thing I can think of why this isn't healing, is because my toon is true neutral and maybe, since the heal effect is good energy, it only heals good alignment? Can anyone confirm tis? The Gms were no help and said file a bug report. If I am right then it would be good for others to know. I play on Ghallanda, and my toon is named Nylrem, if anyone needs to contact me.

ateknogod posted there were 2 problems with the regen. One, it didnt work on WF at all ... and two, you had to un-equip and re-equip them to get the regen icon to show up. Have you tried un/re-equip'ing after entering an instance? But yes, I would bug report it either way.

[Agarwaen]

I think we have been making it more complicated than it is.

First check this out, http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/1074/planesox7.png

This of it like this.
When we imbue a shard, the material or ethereal place it in one of those planes, the fire/earth/air/water place it in a specific spot in this 3D map, the Powering Effect we add, (ie. opposition, dominion or escalation) gives us the direction and purpose to our next location.

With that being said, to achieve best effects maybe we have to plot out our path rather than bouncing around. Let me know what you think.

I'm not sure I completely understand what you are saying here, but it seems like you are indicating that the gem used determines what ingredients you will use in the next upgrade. I suppose that would mean, for example, if you were using opposition and positive for the first upgrade, you would switch to negative for the next upgrade? Or that if you used escalation and positive you would then use positive again? Is that what you are getting at? I'm still not sure how dominion would fit into the puzzle...would that indicate a switch in Essence (Material vs. Etherial)?

That does sound rather interesting though, and come to think of it, those goggles Andareal made seem to back it up: She used opposition for the first gem, and therefore switched from Negative to Positive. The big question would be what to mix next since she used the escalation gem at tier 2. Would it be Pos/Mat at that point, in order to "escalate" tier 2. Or would she need to "escalate" tier 1, and go Neg/Mat? And then there is the question of which gem to use...perhaps Dominion so that she will have used one of each?

Neat theory, Grim.

[SneakThief]

Were they both made prepatch?

Well ... Kargon's were a while back. And the post time on the screenshot for the +6 was 9:05 am yesterday. Servers were back up around noon Eastern ... 9 am Pacific ... I would assume it would take at least 30 min or so to get to the end of pt 3 to craft ... 9:30. Im thinking unless it was Alaskan or Hawiian time, it was probably made pre-6.1

[Borror0]

Well ... Kargon's were a while back. And the post time on the screenshot for the +6 was 9:05 am yesterday. Servers were back up around noon Eastern ... 9 am Pacific ... I would assume it would take at least 30 min or so to get to the end of pt 3 to craft ... 9:30. Im thinking unless it was Alaskan or Hawiian time, it was probably made pre-6.1

*Scratches head*

So I'd guess that Opposition and special mixes well together? In way it's logical since + and - are... well, opposites. The same mgith be observable with Tempered and Balance of Land and Sky?

Missing Minds... what combo you used on your Air/Earth item?

[Hence]

Pre patch: NOM+POM on cloak = +4 Wisdom for the stalemate, it has nothing to do with Material...

Ill post a SS later tonight.

[MysticTheurge]

Were they both made prepatch?

I asked Eladrin about this:

(My Question)

There's some speculation in the crafting thread that some recipes and/or combo-effects may have been altered or added with Module 6.1.

Can you verify whether this is true or false?

(His answer)

The only changes that should have occurred in M6.1 to any of the crafting recipes (other than the Tasty Ham addition to the Stone of Change) should be behind-the-scenes changes for tracking purposes.

[Borror0]

I asked Eladrin about this:

Good to know.