Why can't Named Items be disjuncted for crafting?

[PermaBanned]

As per the title. Many Special Material types are often only available on named loot ever since they were stricken from the loot tables. Crafted Armors, Shields, and some Weapons (especially Quarterstaves) could greatly benefit from having such an option - and it could restore some desirability to acquiring old & outdated named items too ^^

Is there a tech reason they can't be used? Is it a decision related to Base Damage Profiles on named weapons? Concerns over Crafting on a triple slot Trinket or Shield? Something else? Genuinely curious. My interest in craftimg is relatively new, so if this was a discussion topic before I missed it; any informative link would also be appreciated.

[NXPlasmid]

As per the title. Many Special Material types are often only available on named loot ever since they were stricken from the loot tables. Crafted Armors, Shields, and some Weapons (especially Quarterstaves) could greatly benefit from having such an option - and it could restore some desirability to acquiring old & outdated named items too ^^

Is there a tech reason they can't be used? Is it a decision related to Base Damage Profiles on named weapons? Concerns over Crafting on a triple slot Trinket or Shield? Something else? Genuinely curious. My interest in craftimg is relatively new, so if this was a discussion topic before I missed it; any informative link would also be appreciated.

My first impulse was no, not a good idea.. but in thinking about it, I agree. That would really allow for some of these specialty items that are never going to be updated and are basically vendor trash to be valuable again, if for nothing else, multiple augment slots...

[Enoach]

I think for an answer to this question you would need to look no further then the Threnalian War Blade (Red + Purple) & Threnalian War Dagger (Red + Orange). Being able to add a Prefix+Suffix+Bonus to these would then open them up also have a 5th ability. Currently most items have a single augment, and those with multiple are usually limited to the second being blue, yellow or clear.

While these two items may not make up the best base damage for melee as they are long sword and dagger, the power of being able to add up to ML30 with augments based on ML or the creation of Caster items offers more flexibility then many currently available items. Combined (one in each hand) could potentially allow a player to create very powerful casting implements be it for DC or Damage or even a combination of both.

[PermaBanned]

I think for an answer to this question you would need to look no further then the Threnalian War Blade (Red + Purple) & Threnalian War Dagger (Red + Orange). Being able to add a Prefix+Suffix+Bonus to these would then open them up also have a 5th ability. Currently most items have a single augment, and those with multiple are usually limited to the second being blue, yellow or clear.

While these two items may not make up the best base damage for melee as they are long sword and dagger, the power of being able to add up to ML30 with augments based on ML or the creation of Caster items offers more flexibility then many currently available items. Combined (one in each hand) could potentially allow a player to create very powerful casting implements be it for DC or Damage or even a combination of both.

The "it would be OP" argument (to sum up your post, not that we're arguing) is one i tried to consider before posting. My two biggest offender scenarios (off the top of my head, not much research) were:

• Melee • Sword of Shadows - made into a base crafting item with that damage profile could be a disgustingly delicious Heroic item; but still (I believe) leave melee behind Warlocks & other Ranged in the DPS vs Survivability department. In epics, I'm not sure how crafted weapon properties stack up vs available named options /level; so maybe a point to be made there?

• Casters • Skyvault + Luck Blade - yep, two triple slotted base items in the hands and one even provides extra protection. However that means no EGS, no Slavers, and Named hand-held gear which might still be a decent trade off as things like the highest Quality Impulse come on a Named Orb.


It would take more research than I'm personally inclined to do to be certain, but after considering those two cases it seems rather plausible that we wouldn't be any more OP from Crafting off of Named -> Base items than we would be with best named items.

Maybe just flag the triple slotted ones as non-craftable?

[EllisDee37]

My first impulse was no, not a good idea.. but in thinking about it, I agree. That would really allow for some of these specialty items that are never going to be updated and are basically vendor trash to be valuable again, if for nothing else, multiple augment slots...

My thoughts exactly, both the initial reaction and the conclusion after thinking about it.

Main things to be mindful of:

- Improved crit profiles, especially in light of changes from the rebalancing pass when improved crit feat changed
- Augment slots
- Material types, especially when paired with augment slots (Invaders! weapons, etc...)
- +[W] bonuses
- Craftable trinkets just become ubiquitous, plus augment slots

What would this mean for weapons?
- Crafting a quarterstaff would now be done on sireth or elemental bloom or gtfo
- Crafted swashbuckling weapons would have lots of farmable options
- Crafting a THF weapon other than a quarterstaff? SoS or gtfo
- Daggers are real weapons in the hands of an assassin, so those many-augment daggers become really nice
- Crafting on a silver longbow would be awesome
- Carnifex!!!

What would this mean for accessories?
- Augment-a-palooza; virtually everything could now be crafted on yellow+colorless base mats
- Dragonscale helms for green+yellow, anyone?


How about: Named items used as crafting blanks retain their ML as an AML? So you can craft an ML30 endgame longbow using a silver longbow base no problem, but if you craft an ML1 starter longbow using silver longbow it isn't equippable until 8 due to AML8.

[PermaBanned]

Main things to be mindful of:

- Improved crit profiles, especially in light of changes from the rebalancing pass when improved crit feat changed
- Augment slots
- Material types, especially when paired with augment slots (Invaders! weapons, etc...)
- +[W] bonuses
- Craftable trinkets just become ubiquitous, plus augment slots

What would this mean for weapons?
- Crafting a quarterstaff would now be done on sireth or elemental bloom or gtfo
- Crafted swashbuckling weapons would have lots of farmable options
- Crafting a THF weapon other than a quarterstaff? SoS or gtfo
- Daggers are real weapons in the hands of an assassin, so those many-augment daggers become really nice
- Crafting on a silver longbow would be awesome
- Carnifex!!!

What would this mean for accessories?
- Augment-a-palooza; virtually everything could now be crafted on yellow+colorless base mats
- Dragonscale helms for green+yellow, anyone?


How about: Named items used as crafting blanks retain their ML as an AML? So you can craft an ML30 endgame longbow using a silver longbow base no problem, but if you craft an ML1 starter longbow using silver longbow it isn't equippable until 8 due to AML8.

What about (if it's possible) having the Disjunction process simply restore weapons to their "natural" (matching random loot) profiles? That would still allow this to add Material Types to our crafting options that are otherwise unavailable, while alieviating the Profile concerns.

That still leaves the multiple augment items as a potential concern, but in so many cases the augments are either underpowered (comparatively @ their level) or pointless to stack (five +1DC augments are still just a +1; 5 Golem Hearts, PRR, HP, SP & more all in the same boat...). And again, to equip the crafted stuff you're giving up the Named stuff (slot by slot basis of course) - so there is a balance consideration that way too.

[YUTANG75]

Can't agree with this idea, yes it would promote farming of specific items but that's not always a good thing.
As pointed out enhanced crit profiles would cause specific items to become the only thing to use. Take the adamantine ore weapons for example (long sword in this case)
I would be able to take it and create a craft a long sword that has a 17-20 x2 crit profile in addition to crafted effects and a red slot and is adamantine.

But also purple and orange augment slots. They are only found on named equipment by design. This would break that specific design principle. Items with many augment slots are like that because of the rest of the enhancements on the weapon.

I will say that I know of one set of named items that can be disjuncted though, not that it's useful to do so.

[Hcinrich_Hain]

Definitely behind the idea
If Slave Lords items offer higher and more
bonuses than the CC ones then I see no problem
with CC items having more augment slots
or better crit profiles.

As I say in my thread about the removal
of wondrous items from CC.:
https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...r!-P-L-E-A-S-E

Better base items are a good way of making
Cannith Crafting more interesting.

[psykopeta]

As per the title. Many Special Material types are often only available on named loot ever since they were stricken from the loot tables. Crafted Armors, Shields, and some Weapons (especially Quarterstaves) could greatly benefit from having such an option - and it could restore some desirability to acquiring old & outdated named items too ^^

Is there a tech reason they can't be used? Is it a decision related to Base Damage Profiles on named weapons? Concerns over Crafting on a triple slot Trinket or Shield? Something else? Genuinely curious. My interest in craftimg is relatively new, so if this was a discussion topic before I missed it; any informative link would also be appreciated.

imho there's a trouble, we would put in conflict players that want the item itself, for the original purpose (for example sos base, for make it epic, or leave it base) versus players that only want the named item, most times a btc one, to craft another piece of their 4-10-14-20-24 set (for example sos, 5 sos for that guy)

i think it would ruin one of the (imho) base of the loot rules in mmorpg: need before greed

however it's ddo, so dunno if someone is using it any longer(i've seen plenty players getting an item which has mythic 1 or 3, leaving the 1st lifer toon with RNG gear)

[Hcinrich_Hain]

i think it would ruin one of the (imho) base of the loot rules in mmorpg: need before greed

Agreed but that conflict can be resolved.
We have trade-ins for a couple of raids/quests already:

Legendary Tempest Spine
Legendary Hound of Xoriat
The Shroud
The Slave Lords Chain
Thunderholme Raids

+ many more Ingredients, Collectables, Tokens, Mysterious Remnants...

We could trade those in for CC blanks that would equal
disjuncted named items and no one actually needing the item
would have to roll against people just wanting it for crafting.