Cannith Crafted melee gearset

[dunklezhan]

Unbound isn't realistic. I consider unbound crafting way too expensive to make even a single item unbound.

I concur.

That was kinda the point I was trying to make to the person I replied to earlier. With figures like that, saying that this makes it so that everyone will have all this loot given enough time and that lootgen is now somehow invalidated is just not looking at it realistically in my view.

That said, I don't think the overall costs are that far off. Drop them by about a sixth to a third and I think they're golden - still no one would casually be crafting entire gearsets, but when they do have an effect they particularly want, they would likely be able to make it. I don't even think the unbound costs are too bad in that regard.

My issue is the number of unbound recipes which from looking at the current Wiki entry require a bound loot item to make, namely Purified Eberron Dragonshards.

None of the unbound recipes should have a bound ingredient requirement, what kind of nonsensical crazy-talk is that?

Fine, use PEDS if you must, but for the love of mike, find a way to get hold of tradeable PEDS so that people can provide their own ingredients to friendly crafters.

Honestly, its just this one thing that stops me being able to "live with" the other things I'm not 100% sold on (like the power limitations and generally high collectible cost). I cannot get my head around untradeable bound ingredient becomes tradeable unbound item, conceptually speaking. Its just... wrong.

[Feithlin]

My favorite thing is mixing and matching gearsets. I'm thinking a generic, all-purpose crafted melee gearset to handle leveling would be nice and simple. Figure five copies: three heroic and two epic, then leave endgame gearsets for named items. Something like levels 3, 7, 13, 20, and 26. Or whatever makes sense based on how the effects scale.

This is what I am planning so far:

Belt................Dstrike............Parrying... ....iCon
Boots.............Striding...........Str.......... ....iDodge
Bracers...........Resistance......iPRR............ .iStr
Cloak..............Int (for KtA)....Dodge..........iInt
Gloves............Alacrity...........HA........... ....iAccuracy
Googles..........Seeker............Deadly......... .iSeeker
Helm..............Sheltering.......Accuracy....... iMRR
Necklace.........Con...............Cha............ ..iCha
Ring...............Wizardry.........Dex........... ...iDex
Armor ............False Life

I didn't use trinket (this is the joker slot) and could ease the setup by using more armor slots.

[EllisDee37]

This is what I am planning so far:

Belt................Dstrike............Parrying... ....iCon
Boots.............Striding...........Str.......... ....iDodge
Bracers...........Resistance......iPRR............ .iStr
Cloak..............Int (for KtA)....Dodge..........iInt
Gloves............Alacrity...........HA........... ....iAccuracy
Googles..........Seeker............Deadly......... .iSeeker
Helm..............Sheltering.......Accuracy....... iMRR
Necklace.........Con...............Cha............ ..iCha
Ring...............Wizardry.........Dex........... ...iDex
Armor ............False Life

I didn't use trinket (this is the joker slot) and could ease the setup by using more armor slots.

Nice! I'll spend some time analyzing that, though I'll miss not having blurry due to having crafted bracers. (Could be halfway made up for with a dusk heart, though.) Another plus of not using trinket is that you can easily swap in PLIS without concern. And I like that you incorporated iMRR. That's pretty sweet.

However, giving up Inisghtful Deadly (which only goes on trinkets) seems like a major loss for a melee character.

EDIT: Wizardry is okay, but I'm fine slotting that in a yellow. It's less mana per level, but meh. Plenty for a melee. Still, if you end up with an open spot, and wizardry goes there, for sure. Good choice.

Is it worth throwing in Devotion for Cleric, Druids, FvS and Paladins?

Devotion can be slotted in a red on a named weapon, which will also give you an implement bonus. However, the crafted version might end up a little higher than augment+implement, so it's worth keeping an eye on.

Insightful Spellpower is definitely worth considering, which can be put in the extra slot on gloves or trinket.

I'm also liking some of the suggestions (enchantment save, spell resistance, etc...) so I might do a second pass.

[Gremmlynn]

Nice! I'll spend some time analyzing that, though I'll miss not having blurry due to having crafted bracers. (Could be halfway made up for with a dusk heart, though.) Another plus of not using trinket is that you can easily swap in PLIS without concern. And I like that you incorporated iMRR. That's pretty sweet.

Greater Nimble Trinket from Crystal Cove is full blur at a lower ML, 5 iirc.

[EllisDee37]

Thinking further about a universal melee gearset for all possible melee, unfortunately all stats become desirable:

Strength - attack and damage, or carrying capacity for a non-strength build
Dexterity - for dex builds, also reflex saves
Constitution - every build wants con, plus for damage on dwarven TYWA builds
Intelligence - for int builds, but also str/dex/whatever builds might still want to use know the angles
Wisdom - for monks, will saves, and to allow paladins/rangers/battleclerics who dump wis to cast spells
Charisma - for cha builds (pdk bards), umd, and paladin saves

Then there are some crucial skills for certain builds:

Concentration - for monks, and also scroll healing
Perform - a melee bard really wants a perform item equipped
Spot - I've run multiple trapper lives without spot, but i much prefer having it where possible
Intimidate - If your build is designed to intimidate, it would suck not having it on your gear

Other useful skills (Heal, Jump, Balance, Bluff, etc...) are nice but not critical, so they can be slotted in a colorless. Heck, some of the "big 4" above might have to be relegated to an augment anyway.

I also looked into tactical bonuses, thinking the two big ones are Stunning and Vertigo. Insightful for either is the same bonus as Insightful Combat Mastery, so ICM is the no-brainer choice. Then I compared to basic bonuses, and Combat Mastery is very competitive with individual bonus effects. +7 vs +10, for example. So I decided that Combat Mastery is the way to go for a universal gearset.

Ignoring "extra" effects, that makes 7 combat effects to fit in: Deadly, Accuracy, Seeker, Armor Piercing, Doublestrike, Alacrity, Combat Mastery.

I looked closer at Enchantment Save shards, which I've long been a fan of. (Most of my alts wear a BTA Enchantment Save +6 helm until level 9, usually.) Turns out that "spell saves" gives the same bonus value, but works for all spells. This would stack with both resistance and enchantment saves, but trying to fit in both is a step too far, I think. Just sticking with Spell Saves (+Insightful) is probably the best compromise. But that brings the total to 8 or 9 defensive effects desired, again ignoring "extra" effects:

False Life, Fortification, Dodge, Spell Resistance, Sheltering, Resistance, Spell Saves, Healing Amp(, Devotion?)

And finally, there are 2 quality of life effects: Striding and True Seeing.




The issue is that there are 12 gear slots including armor but excluding weapons/shields. That's a maximum of 24 prefixes and suffixes that can be crafted. Unfortunately, I just tallied up 27 or 28 desirable effects:

6 stats
4 skills
7 combat
9 defense
2 quality of life
---
28 prefix/suffix effects

That's not even getting into "extra" effects, where we only have 12 total slots to work with. If we want all stats, that's 6 insightful stats and we're left with only 6 available.

A universal melee gearset for leveling may not be an achievable dream.

[Cantor]

I would move con from neck to armor. I like to swap a silverflame neck for beholders etc and it would be nice to not lose hp on swap. Also put parry on armor extra slot. Which lets you move false life to the belt suffix. Which lets you move Hamp to armor which opens glove suffix. There are a lot of nice glove suffixes either unused in this setup, or to move something around.

edit: don't see anything really good to replace neck prefix, I guess that's why you put con there. It just doesn't work well with swapping for me. Maybe a special save type?

If you don't have the swapping issue, you could leave con on neck and put combat mast on armor prefix.

[EllisDee37]

I would move con from neck to armor. I like to swap a silverflame neck for beholders etc and it would be nice to not lose hp on swap. Also put parry on armor extra slot. Which lets you move false life to the belt suffix. Which lets you move Hamp to armor which opens glove suffix. There are a lot of nice glove suffixes either unused in this setup, or to move something around.

Yep. Armor Piercing is a particularly useful glove suffix for melee dps.

The more I play around with different setups the more I'm convinced that the ideal armor is Fortification of Healing Amp w/Parrying because all three shards are super cheap, which makes it easy to create multiple versions. (Cloth, Light, Medium, Heavy, Docent) It's also super easy to replace Heal Amp with Repair Amp on the docent if you prefer.

Figure use base armor with a blue slot and slot in good luck.

[Cantor]

I was thinking about the same thing with armors. My other line of reasoning is that the original setup had Hamp on gloves to coincide with named gloves, also to allow swapping in named armors.

PS: this discussion is a nice break from the constant DOOM anywhere else discussing ccup.

[UurlockYgmeov]

PS: this discussion is a nice break from the constant DOOM anywhere else discussing ccup.

May the Gods bless the ground you are walking on. The constant.... grates on me.

[EllisDee37]

Belt................Dstrike............Parrying... ....iCon
Boots.............Striding...........Str.......... ....iDodge
Bracers...........Resistance......iPRR............ .iStr
Cloak..............Int (for KtA)....Dodge..........iInt
Gloves............Alacrity...........HA........... ....iAccuracy
Googles..........Seeker............Deadly......... .iSeeker
Helm..............Sheltering.......Accuracy....... iMRR
Necklace.........Con...............Cha............ ..iCha
Ring...............Wizardry.........Dex........... ...iDex
Armor ............False Life

On further analysis, I'm unsurprised that you only specified one ring. (The second ring is your second joker slot, along with trinket?) Ring affixes blow chunks.

[EllisDee37]

I decided that there's too many effects to do a perfect universal gearset, so instead I worked on a gearset just for my melee alts. Points of concern for my account in general:

• I want to leave cloak and bracers open for ghostly and blurry
• I want to include Concentration, Devotion (+Insightful), Perform, Combat Mastery (+Insightful), and True Seeing
• All my alts have Quiver of Alacrity, so I don't need Striding
• Necklace or trinket (depending if alt has a PLIS or not) will get swapped out for beholder fights
• I have no dex or int melee builds
• With only 20 prefix/suffix slots, some painful cuts had to be made. Accuracy is the most notable.

I haven't yet hammered out the ideal level versions, so for now I've left that column blank.

Slot	Prefix	Suffix	Extra	Augment	Versions
Helmet	Wisdom	Resistance	Insightful Fortification	Intelligence
Goggles	Seeker	Deadly	Insightful Seeker	Underwater Action
Necklace	Constitution	Spot	Insightful Constitution	Deathblock
Cloak	Cloak of Invisibility			Heavy Fortification	ML9
Bracers	Bracers of Wind	Greensteel Smoke (HP/SP)			ML3, ML11
Gloves	Melee Alacrity	Armor Piercing	Insightful Devotion	Wizardry
Belt	Doublestrike	False Life	Insightful Strength	Vitality
Boots	Dodge	Strength	Insightful Combat Mastery	Feather Falling
Ring 1	Charisma	Sheltering	Insightful PRR	Master's Gift
Ring 2	Perform	Devotion	Insightful MRR	Dexterity
Trinket	Concentration	True Seeing	Insightful Deadly
Armor	Combat Mastery	Healing Amp	Parrying	Good Luck

Some alternate choices:

• Put Intelligence on the trinket instead of Concentration (slot Concentration in the helmet's colorless?)
• Craft a cloak (that has a green slot): Spell Saves of Dodge w/Insightful Int, then put Dexterity in the Boots prefix
• Put Striding, Wizardry or Persuasion on Ring 2 instead of Perform
• ...or just drop Ring 2 altogether and use a named ring instead (slot devotion in a red on a named weapon)
• Create an alternate set of Gloves with Perform instead of Alacrity (bards can cast Haste)
• Put Accuracy on the Trinket instead of True Seeing (and then scroll True Seeing)
• Put Insightful Accuracy on the Gloves (dropping Insightful Devotion)
• Put Intimidate on the Necklace instead of Spot

[UurlockYgmeov]

Ah yes...



Gear Tetris...

All I want for festivault is an autoplanner that gives you a list of effects you want... allows you to rate the need for each and click build...

out comes a list of what goes where and how... (including augment slots)....

viola, fin.

[Feithlin]

On further analysis, I'm unsurprised that you only specified one ring. (The second ring is your second joker slot, along with trinket?) Ring affixes blow chunks.

Ah yes, sorry, I didn't mention it. The ring slot is another bonus. In most cases, it would be where I would slot spell power (either offensive or devotion).
AFAIK iDeadly can only go on trinket.

[dunklezhan]

This thread is amazing.

[Stoner81]

Greater Nimble Trinket from Crystal Cove is full blur at a lower ML, 5 iirc.

Bracers of Wind from the Cannith Challenges grant Blurry at ML3.

Thinking further about a universal melee gearset for all possible melee, unfortunately all stats become desirable:

Strength - attack and damage, or carrying capacity for a non-strength build
Dexterity - for dex builds, also reflex saves
Constitution - every build wants con, plus for damage on dwarven TYWA builds
Intelligence - for int builds, but also str/dex/whatever builds might still want to use know the angles
Wisdom - for monks, will saves, and to allow paladins/rangers/battleclerics who dump wis to cast spells
Charisma - for cha builds (pdk bards), umd, and paladin saves

<snip>

Maybe look at if from a different perspective...

While all those stats are "needed" they only are so on certain builds, by this I mean that not all 6 stats are needed all the time. Maybe you could work out something like "right I want these specific things which covers every build, these other slots are interchangeable depending on the build". So for example you have Gloves which you use for STR/DEX/whatever, the same could apply to any other slot (obviously depending on where stuff can be crafted) anyway you get the idea probably a bad idea knowing me if nothing else I am consistent in bad ideas lol!

Yep. Armor Piercing is a particularly useful glove suffix for melee dps.

The more I play around with different setups the more I'm convinced that the ideal armor is Fortification of Healing Amp w/Parrying because all three shards are super cheap, which makes it easy to create multiple versions. (Cloth, Light, Medium, Heavy, Docent) It's also super easy to replace Heal Amp with Repair Amp on the docent if you prefer.

Figure use base armor with a blue slot and slot in good luck.

How about Heavy Fort instead in the Blue slot which opens up the prefix slot though no idea what else could go there that would be worth doing this.

Stoner81.

[EllisDee37]

Maybe you could work out something like "right I want these specific things which covers every build, these other slots are interchangeable depending on the build". So for example you have Gloves which you use for STR/DEX/whatever, the same could apply to any other slot (obviously depending on where stuff can be crafted) anyway you get the idea

How about Heavy Fort instead in the Blue slot which opens up the prefix slot though no idea what else could go there that would be worth doing this.

Yep, both these concepts are incorporated into the most recent gearset listing.

[Cantor]

I decided that there's too many effects to do a perfect universal gearset, so instead I worked on a gearset just for my melee alts. Points of concern for my account in general:

• I want to leave cloak and bracers open for ghostly and blurry
• I want to include Concentration, Devotion (+Insightful), Perform, Combat Mastery (+Insightful), and True Seeing
• All my alts have Quiver of Alacrity, so I don't need Striding
• Necklace or trinket (depending if alt has a PLIS or not) will get swapped out for beholder fights
• I have no dex or int melee builds
• With only 20 prefix/suffix slots, some painful cuts had to be made. Accuracy is the most notable.

I haven't yet hammered out the ideal level versions, so for now I've left that column blank.

Slot	Prefix	Suffix	Extra	Augment	Versions
Helmet	Wisdom	Resistance	Insightful Fortification	Intelligence
Goggles	Seeker	Deadly	Insightful Seeker	Underwater Action
Necklace	Constitution	Spot	Insightful Constitution	Deathblock
Cloak	Cloak of Invisibility			Heavy Fortification	ML9
Bracers	Bracers of Wind	Greensteel Smoke (HP/SP)			ML3, ML11
Gloves	Melee Alacrity	Armor Piercing	Insightful Devotion	Wizardry
Belt	Doublestrike	False Life	Insightful Strength	Vitality
Boots	Dodge	Strength	Insightful Combat Mastery	Feather Falling
Ring 1	Charisma	Sheltering	Insightful PRR	Master's Gift
Ring 2	Perform	Devotion	Insightful MRR	Dexterity
Trinket	Concentration	True Seeing	Insightful Deadly
Armor	Combat Mastery	Healing Amp	Parrying	Good Luck

Some alternate choices:

• Put Intelligence on the trinket instead of Concentration (slot Concentration in the helmet's colorless?)
• Craft a cloak (that has a green slot): Spell Saves of Dodge w/Insightful Int, then put Dexterity in the Boots prefix
• Put Striding, Wizardry or Persuasion on Ring 2 instead of Perform
• ...or just drop Ring 2 altogether and use a named ring instead (slot devotion in a red on a named weapon)
• Create an alternate set of Gloves with Perform instead of Alacrity (bards can cast Haste)
• Put Accuracy on the Trinket instead of True Seeing (and then scroll True Seeing)
• Put Insightful Accuracy on the Gloves (dropping Insightful Devotion)
• Put Intimidate on the Necklace instead of Spot

I like that you left cloak and bracers open. I like ghostly in cloak also, and I will go mysterious bracers. Maybe bring in blurry on trinket. Only way I see to get ghostly and blurry without giving up mysterious , at least until treads of falling shadow or making a new GS smoke. Maybe something can be adapted easily at 20 with an epic golden guile, since you have imr on ring, shift con from neck to ring, myst to the cloak, leaving blur bracers, augment the devotion if it can't be fit in this gives spellcasting implement to offset some loss.

Also if you have a ring of lies, good option to drop ring2.

[LightBear]

Are the augment slots limited to one or can you craft two on them?
If two then it opens up some more.

[Cantor]

Are the augment slots limited to one or can you craft two on them?
If two then it opens up some more.

Two slot items don't drop anymore, but there are some around. It's not crafted, it's part of the blank.

[FuryFlash]

If you guys haven't already, check out forum user ramzes7asit4's CC planner (in beta) and his "gear master" page for the new CC!
Planner: http://ccplaner.esy.es/
Gear Master: http://ccplaner.esy.es/gear_master.html

Thanks, ramzes for doing this!