Cannith Crafted melee gearset

[EllisDee37]

My favorite thing is mixing and matching gearsets. I'm thinking a generic, all-purpose crafted melee gearset to handle leveling would be nice and simple. Figure five copies: three heroic and two epic, then leave endgame gearsets for named items. Something like levels 3, 7, 13, 20, and 26. Or whatever makes sense based on how the effects scale.

I'm thinking the list of desired effects would be:

Deadly (+Insightful)
Accuracy (+Insightful)
Seeker (+Insightful)
Doublestrike
Armor-Piercing
Strength (+Insightful)
Constitution (+Insightful)
Healing Amp
Fortification (+Insightful)
False Life
Resistance
Parrying
Sheltering
Insightful PRR
Insightful MRR
True Seeing
Striding

Deathblock and Feather Falling are ignored because they can be slotted as yellow augments.

Any other core effects I missed?

EDIT: Quick links for easy reference: Talk:Cannith_Crafting/U32 * ML Spreadsheet * Planner

[dunklezhan]

Deathblock and Feather Falling are ignored because they can be slotted as yellow augments.

I think you should include deathblock, since you can't get that from a trader - that's store or RNG only. Large numbers of my characters no longer carry a DB item because being current lootgen RNG it is usually polluted with some second effect that's totally useless, and the augment is near impossible to get in game.

[cru121]

Crafting all this is gonna be very expensive.
Fortification is imho best slotted.
Insightful MRR is on remnants gear.
False Life has rather slow progression in the new system, perhaps augments would work here as well, or named/legacy crafted items.

Imho it's better to build crafted gear around the best named items. I am looking at Mysterious Cloak/Bracers, Pansophic Circlet, Ring of Prowess..

[EllisDee37]

Fortification is imho best slotted.

At low levels, but the crafted version goes above 100% starting at level 17. (Only 101%, but still.)

The above crafted fort + insightful fort combine for 99% at level 7, and goes up from there.

I think you should include deathblock, since you can't get that from a trader - that's store or RNG only. Large numbers of my characters no longer carry a DB item because being current lootgen RNG it is usually polluted with some second effect that's totally useless, and the augment is near impossible to get in game.

Fair enough, but I consider them cheap. I think they're only like 75 TP.

[EllisDee37]

Here's a first pass:

Trinket can hold most of these effects, so the idea will be to save trinket for a last resort. And we definitely don't want to be crafting effects on weapons, so weapon is right out. So ignoring weapon and saving trinket for last resort, here's my thinking:

• Ideally bracers and cloak would be left open for blurry (bracers of wind) and ghostly (cloak of invisibility)
• Neck and Ring support exactly one each of prefix, suffix, and extra, and it's the same for both. So for the two rings and one necklace slot, craft a single Health necklace/ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution and leave the other two slots available for named items.
• Armor Piercing only goes on gloves as a suffix, so Gloves of Armor Piercing
• That only leaves a single suffix slot to place deadly, goggles, so Goggles of Deadly
• Insightful Deadly only goes on trinket, so Trinket w/Insightful Deadly
• Eliminating the already-taken effects, armor now only supports one prefix, suffix and extra, so we have Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying
• That only leaves a single suffix for boots, so Boots of Strength
• That only leaves a single prefix for belt, so Doublestrike belt
• That only leaves a single prefix for gloves, so Alacrity gloves (of Armor Piercing)
• Striding for the Boots prefix because...duh. Striding boots of Strength
• Seeker is the only prefix available for goggles, so Seeker goggles (of Deadly)

Here's the gearset so far:

Head :
Eyes : Seeker goggles of Deadly
Neck :
Back :
Wrist:
Hand: Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing
Waist: Doublestrike belt
Feet : Striding boots of Strength
Ring : Health ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution (can be moved to necklace)
Ring :
Trinket: Trinket w/Insightful Deadly
Armor : Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying

At this point I remembered to add Sheltering, and Insightful PRR & MRR, which invalidates a couple of the above statements. The insightfuls go on cloak, ring and necklace, but also head and bracers. Nothing broken so far, continuing...

• The only head prefix not taken yet is sheltering, so Sheltering helm
• Insightful Seeker is the only extra for goggles, so Seeker goggles of Deadly w/Insightful Seeker
• That leaves only Insightful Fortification for the extra boot slot, so Striding boots of Strength w/Insightful Fortification
• Head extra can take either insightful ?RR, so let's go with Sheltering helm w/Insightful PRR
• The only extra effect for belts not yet taken is Insightful Strength, so Doublestrike belt w/Insightful Strength
• Insightful Accuracy's only available slot remaining is gloves, so Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing w/Insightful Accuracy
• True Seeing only goes on trinket (goggles is taken) so Trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly
• Accuracy can now only fit as a suffix on the helmet: Sheltering helm of Accuracy w/Insightful PRR
• Resistance can now only fit as a prefix on the trinket: Resistance trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly

That makes this the final melee gearset for leveling from 1 to late epics, switching out of this only when high enough level to wear your endgame gear:

Head : Sheltering helm of Accuracy w/Insightful PRR
Eyes : Seeker goggles of Deadly w/Insightful Seeker
Neck :
Back :
Wrist:
Hand: Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing w/Insightful Accuracy
Waist: Doublestrike belt (of Stunning or Jump) w/Insightful Strength
Feet : Striding boots of Strength w/Insightful Fortification
Ring : Health ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution
Ring :
Trinket: Resistance trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly
Armor : Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying

The only thing left to slot is Insightful MRR, which just happens to go on every open slot we have left: Necklace (extra), Cloak (extra), Bracers (suffix), Ring (extra). So if you really want Insightful MRR, put it in any of those slots with whatever else good you can find to craft. (Maybe some skills?)

For me, I'll just wear bracers of wind, cloak of invisibility, maybe craft up some greensteel HP necklaces, and whatever the most interesting named ring I can find. Maybe that DR/Lawful one from Gianthold.

[EllisDee37]

What levels make the most sense for upgrades based on the spreadsheet? Ideally, gearsets would be ML2, ML7, ML13, ML20 and ML26.

Sheltering helm of Accuracy w/Insightful PRR
- Sheltering scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Insightful PRR goes up during odd levels
- Accuracy scaling unknown
Best progression: ???

Seeker goggles of Deadly w/Insightful Seeker
- Seeker increases at levels 2, 4, 6, 7, 10, 13, 15, 20, then progression is unknown for epics
- Deadly scaling unknown
- Insightful Seeker starts at level 5 (+1), then increases at levels 10, 15, 20, 25, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 20, 25(?)

Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing w/Insightful Accuracy
- Alacrity scaling unknown
- Armor Piercing scaling unknown
- Insightful Accuracy scaling partially known; progression is unclear
Bets progression: ???

Doublestrike belt w/Insightful Strength
- Doublestrike progression unknown
- Insightful Stats start at level 4 (+1), then increas at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 23

Striding boots of Strength w/Insightful Fortification
- Striding progression unknown
- Stats give +1 @ ML1, then increase at levels 2, 4, 5, 7, 10 (+6), 13, 15, 18, 21, 23, 26, 29, 32, 34
- Insightful Fortification scales smoothly (increases every level)
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 21, 26

Health ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution
- Stats give +1 @ ML1, then increase at levels 2, 4, 5, 7, 10 (+6), 13, 15, 18, 21, 23, 26, 29, 32, 34
- False Life appears to scale smoothly (increase every level)
- Insightful Stats start at level 4 (+1), then increas at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 21, 26

Resistance trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly
- Resistance gives +1 @ ML1, then increases at levels 2, 4, 7, 10, 13, 17, 20, 23, 27, 30, 33
- True Seeing is ML14
- Insightful Deadly starts at ML4 (+1), then increases at 10, 17, 23, 30
Best progression: 2, 7, 14, 20, 23

Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying
- Fortification scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Healing Amp scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Parrying gives +1 @ ML4, then increases at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29, 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 18, 23


And I just realized that I forgot Dodge and Insightful Dodge, but I suppose those aren't relevant for heavy armor builds so it's not a universal effect like resistance or fortification.

[cru121]

What about run speed? Or are you counting with bugged Chronoscope?

For a heavy armored melee, at least in heroics, some Natural Armor and Protection gear can be useful if you have room left. Jump skill. Charisma/Persuasion gear for UMD, but those can be swapped.

[EllisDee37]

I wonder if I could fit trapping skills in there somewhere. I notice that the belt has no suffix, and I have a whole ring slot open. Hmmm...

What about run speed? Or are you counting with bugged Chronoscope?

Chronoscope has never bugged for me, but I picked up Quiver of Alacrity for all my alts during the birthday event.

But that's a good call. Striding would be a good effect to fit in there. That could take the place of Dexterity as the Boots prefix.

For a heavy armored melee, at least in heroics, some Natural Armor and Protection gear can be useful if you have room left. Jump skill. Charisma/Persuasion gear for UMD, but those can be swapped.

I thought about Charisma/Persuasion, (Persuasion ring of Charisma seems like a natural fit) and also Concentration.

Oh, hey, nice, I see the belt suffix could be your choice of Stunning or Jump. That works.

Concentration...hmmm...not sure where that would go.

[Elfishski]

What levels make the most sense for upgrades based on the spreadsheet? Ideally, gearsets would be ML2, ML7, ML13, ML20 and ML26.

Sheltering helm of Accuracy w/Insightful PRR
- Sheltering scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Insightful PRR goes up during odd levels
- Accuracy scaling unknown
Bets progression: ???

Seeker goggles of Deadly w/Insightful Seeker
- Seeker increases at levels 2, 4, 6, 7, 10, 13, 15, 20, then progression is unknown for epics
- Deadly scaling unknown
- Insightful Seeker starts at level 5 (+1), then increases at levels 10, 15, 20, 25, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 20, 25(?)

Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing w/Insightful Accuracy
- Alacrity scaling unknown
- Armor Piercing scaling unknown
- Insightful Accuracy scaling partially known; progression is unclear
Bets progression: ???

Doublestrike belt w/Insightful Strength
- Doublestrike progression unknown
- Insightful Stats start at level 4 (+1), then increas at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 23

Dextrous boots of Strength w/Insightful Fortification
- Stats give +1 @ ML1, then increase at levels 2, 4, 5, 7, 10 (+6), 13, 15, 18, 21, 23, 26, 29, 32, 34
- Insightful Fortification scales smoothly (increases every level)
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 21, 26

Health ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution
- Stats give +1 @ ML1, then increase at levels 2, 4, 5, 7, 10 (+6), 13, 15, 18, 21, 23, 26, 29, 32, 34
- False Life appears to scale smoothly (increase every level)
- Insightful Stats start at level 4 (+1), then increas at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29 and 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 21, 26

Resistance trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly
- Resistance gives +1 @ ML1, then increases at levels 2, 4, 7, 10, 13, 17, 20, 23, 27, 30, 33
- True Seeing is ML14
- Insightful Deadly starts at ML4 (+1), then increases at 10, 17, 23, 30
Best progression: 2, 7, 14, 20, 23

Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying
- Fortification scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Healing Amp scales smoothly (increases every level)
- Parrying gives +1 @ ML4, then increases at levels 7, 13, 18, 23, 29, 34
Best progression: 2, 7, 13, 18, 23


And I just realized that I forgot Dodge and Insightful Dodge, but I suppose those aren't relevant for heavy armor builds so it's not a universal effect like resistance or fortification.

It's pretty obvious random loot below level 30 is completely dead in the longer term when (given time to afford ingredients) you can craft these. No random loot will ever replace anything anyone crafts, and a crafted set like this will be a huge amount of power creep at all levels.

Devs, tone the bonuses down a bit so random loot isn't invalidated. Then it's still worth crafting an awesome set of effects as proposed here, but it won't be the end of ever looking at loot in chests (again).

It's disappointing.

[EllisDee37]

I went back and edited Striding into the boots, in place of Dex.

[dunklezhan]

It's pretty obvious random loot below level 30 is completely dead in the longer term when (given time to afford ingredients) you can craft these. No random loot will ever replace anything anyone crafts, and a crafted set like this will be a huge amount of power creep at all levels.

Devs, tone the bonuses down a bit so random loot isn't invalidated. Then it's still worth crafting an awesome set of effects as proposed here, but it won't be the end of ever looking at loot in chests (again).

It's disappointing.

They aren't as good as the theoretical values you could get on lootgen, which can be freely traded and could drop for absolutely anyone, anytime. All of the above is being considered as bound.

Have you got any idea how much time would be involved in crafting this lot, even if you ignore the time spent levelling crafting, getting the ingredients for this would be...

Well.

Ellis, you got an ingredient count for all this? I'm not sure I want to know how much it would cost to make unbound, even assuming no crafting failures.

[cru121]

ingredient count for all this? I'm not sure I want to know how much it would cost to make unbound, even assuming no crafting failures.

Here's BOUND math

5 gear sets times 8 slots = 40 items.

purified
insightful con: 5*5
insightful str: 5*5
insightful fort: 5*5
insightful prr: 5*5
insightful mrr: 5*5

125 Purified Eberron Dragonshards
40*15*3 collectables
40*5*3 collectables

essences cost per shard between 10 and 275, let's say avg 100
100 * 40 * 3 = 12k essences for shards

ML shards
8* (20 + 70 + 130 + 200 + 260) = 5440 for ML shards


TL;DR
18k essences
125 purified eberron dragonshards
2400 collectables

[dunklezhan]

Here's BOUND math

5 gear sets times 8 slots = 40 items.

purified
insightful con: 5*5
insightful str: 5*5
insightful fort: 5*5
insightful prr: 5*5
insightful mrr: 5*5

125 Purified Eberron Dragonshards
40*15*3 collectables
40*5*3 collectables

essences cost per shard between 10 and 275, let's say avg 100
100 * 40 * 3 = 12k essences for shards

ML shards
8* (20 + 70 + 130 + 200 + 260) = 5440 for ML shards


TL;DR
18k essences
125 purified eberron dragonshards
2400 collectables

PEDS are only for insightfuls unbound? I thought they were in all the unbound recipes except for a tiny handful of non-scaling effects? Is this not right anymore?

[Renvar]

It's pretty obvious random loot below level 30 is completely dead in the longer term when (given time to afford ingredients) you can craft these. No random loot will ever replace anything anyone crafts, and a crafted set like this will be a huge amount of power creep at all levels.

Devs, tone the bonuses down a bit so random loot isn't invalidated. Then it's still worth crafting an awesome set of effects as proposed here, but it won't be the end of ever looking at loot in chests (again).

It's disappointing.

My understanding of the loot tree is: (best on top)

Really, Really lucky Ran Gen Loot (win the lottery/struck by lightning)
Raid Loot
Named Loot
CC Loot
Average Ran Gen Loot

CC loot is supposed to be better than the majority of Random Loot pulls, but Random Loot can be better. It's just going to be really freaking rare.

[Renvar]

Here's BOUND math

5 gear sets times 8 slots = 40 items.

purified
insightful con: 5*5
insightful str: 5*5
insightful fort: 5*5
insightful prr: 5*5
insightful mrr: 5*5

125 Purified Eberron Dragonshards
40*15*3 collectables
40*5*3 collectables

essences cost per shard between 10 and 275, let's say avg 100
100 * 40 * 3 = 12k essences for shards

ML shards
8* (20 + 70 + 130 + 200 + 260) = 5440 for ML shards


TL;DR
18k essences
125 purified eberron dragonshards
2400 collectables

That's not too bad (in terms of essences and PEDS) for a complete 1-30 set of loot that covers all the bases. I'd say the collectibles cost is too high. Those don't drop in enough quantity, nor can you target them effectively with farming. A collectibles trader would be a nice addition to the game to allow exchanging the collectibles.

[bsquishwizzy]

What about run speed? Or are you counting with bugged Chronoscope?

For a heavy armored melee, at least in heroics, some Natural Armor and Protection gear can be useful if you have room left. Jump skill. Charisma/Persuasion gear for UMD, but those can be swapped.

I'd also add CHR & Intim for pulling mobs away from casters.

Also, a possible consideration for DEX on the fringe DEX-based builds and/or skills (spitballin' here)?

Plus adding Resistance is nice, but I think it helps to maybe have Enchantment resistance additionally with WIS for will saves? Or maybe a modest amount of SR as an alternative?

Again, just throwing out a few ideas here.

[EllisDee37]

Ellis, you got an ingredient count for all this? I'm not sure I want to know how much it would cost to make unbound, even assuming no crafting failures.

Unbound isn't realistic. I consider unbound crafting way too expensive to make even a single item unbound. But I am curious about how much it would cost to make this loadout bound. Where no clear leveling plan is specified, I'll assume 5 copies: 3, 7, 13, 20, 26.

Sheltering helm of Accuracy w/Insightful PRR (3, 7, 13, 20, 26)
ML: 3+7+13+20+26 = 69 * 10 = 690 essences
Sheltering: 250 essences, 75 Skull Fragments, 25 Cryptmoss
Accuracy: 250 essences, 75 Caravan Logbooks, 25 Signets of the Devourer
Insightful PRR: 1375 essences, 25 purifieds, 75 Crypt Moths, 25 Ornate Charms

Seeker goggles of Deadly w/Insightful Seeker (2, 7, 13, 20, 25)
ML: 2+7+13+20+25 = 67 * 10 = 670 essences
Seeker: 250 essences, 75 Cryptmoss Worm Larvae, 25 'Wavecrasher' Cargo Manifests
Deadly: 250 essences, 75 Blades of the Dark Six, 25 Marks of the Keeper
Insightful Seeker: 1125 essences, 25 purifieds, 75 Slime Molds, 25 Blister Beetles

Alacrity gloves of Armor Piercing w/Insightful Accuracy (3, 7, 13, 20, 26)
ML: 3+7+13+20+26 = 69 * 10 = 690 essences
Melee Alacrity: 500 essences, 75 Sour Darkcaps, 25 Fragrant Drowshoods (ouch!)
Armor-Piercing: 250 essences, 75 Skull Fragments, 25 Cryptmoss Worms
Insightful Accuracy: 1125 essences, 75 Mortar and Pestles, 25 Fractured Femurs (no purifieds needed)

Doublestrike belt w/Insightful Strength (2, 7, 13, 23)
ML: 2+7+13+23 = 45 * 10 = 450 essences
Doublestrike: 400 essences, 60 Small Planar Crystals, 20 Scholarly Notes
Insightful Strength: 1100 essences, 20 purifieds, 60 Crypt Moths, 20 Ornate Charms

Striding boots of Strength w/Insightful Fortification (2, 7, 13, 21, 26)
ML: 2+7+13+21+26 = 69 * 10 = 690 essences
Striding: 500 essences, 75 Lodestones, 25 Silver Flame Hymnals (ouch!)
Strength: 500 essences, 75 Bruised Spore Pods, 25 Amulets of the Six
Insightful Fortification: 875 essences, 25 purifieds, 75 Ruddy Fungi, 25 Silver Bowls

Health ring of False Life w/Insightful Constitution (2, 7, 13, 21, 26)
ML: 2+7+13+21+26 = 69 * 10 = 690 essences
Constitution: 500 essences, 75 Runic Parchments, 25 Glass Phials
False Life: 50 essences, 75 Pages Torn from a Research Notebook, 25 Vials of Pure Water
Insightful Constitution: 1375 essences, 25 purifieds, 75 Ancient Texts, 25 Hairy Trumpets

Resistance trinket of True Seeing w/Insightful Deadly (2, 7, 14, 20, 23)
ML: 2+7+14+20+23 = 66 * 10 = 660 essences
Resistance: 500 essences, 75 Romantic Sonnets, 25 Fragrant Drowshoods (ouch!)
True Seeing: 750 essences, 45 Mortar and Pestles, 15 Fractured Femurs (only need three of these since True Seeing is ML14)
Insightful Deadly: 1125 essences, 75 Mortar and Pestles, 25 Stone Fetishes (no purifieds needed)

Fortification armor of Healing Amp w/Parrying (2, 7, 13, 18, 23)
ML: 2+7+13+18+23 = 63 * 10 = 630 essences
Fortification: 50 essences, 75 Pages Torn from a Research Notebook, 25 Small Wooden Idols
Healing Amp: 250 essences, 75 Funerary Tokens, 25 'Wavecrasher' Cargo Manifests
Parrying: 250 essences, 75 Funerary Tokens, 25 Sparkling Dusts (no purifieds needed)

********************** TOTALS **********************

This gearset is complete and functional even without any of the extra effects. The idea would be to make all the base prefix+suffix items to start with, then gradually add in the extras.

Total cost for the ML shards, prefixes and suffixes:

11,110 essences (5860 MLs, 5250 effects)
25 Amulets of the Six
75 Blades of the Dark Six
75 Bruised Spore Pods
75 Caravan Logbooks
25 Cryptmoss
75 Cryptmoss Worm Larvae
25 Cryptmoss Worms
15 Fractured Femurs <=== new
50 Fragrant Drowshoods (ouch!)
75 Funerary Tokens
25 Glass Phials
75 Lodestones
25 Marks of the Keeper
45 Mortar and Pestles <=== new
150 Pages Torn from a Research Notebook
75 Romantic Sonnets
75 Runic Parchments
20 Scholarly Notes
25 Signets of the Devourer
25 Silver Flame Hymnals (ouch!)
150 Skull Fragments
60 Small Planar Crystals
25 Small Wooden Idols
75 Sour Darkcaps
25 Vials of Pure Water
50 'Wavecrasher' Cargo Manifests

All in all, not too bad. The collectable distribution is about as good as it could possibly be. Other than the Fragrant Drowshood and the two new collectables, I probably have all of these in my bags right now.

Of special note is the armor. I'd probably want to make at least two sets: light armor and heavy armor. Fortunately, the armors are far and away the cheapest recipes to make. Even the extra effect (parrying) is super cheap. This wasn't intentional, but rather a happy accident.

Adding in the extra effects is where it starts getting expensive, but since these can be added one at a time in selective fashion, it's a manageable longterm project:

8350 essences
120 Purified Dragonshards
75 Ancient Texts
25 Blister Beetles
135 Crypt Moths
25 Fractured Femurs
75 Funerary Tokens
25 Hairy Trumpets
150 Mortar and Pestles
45 Ornate Charms
75 Ruddy Fungi
25 Silver Bowls
75 Slime Molds
25 Sparkling Dusts
25 Stone Fetishes

That's not actually as bad as I thought it would be. Expensive, sure, but not ridiculously so. All told the above is 39 different items, 44 if you add in a second set of armors. (Costs not included.) That's a mere 2 pages of bank space on a mule, which seems quite doable for a complete 1-29 melee gearset all your melee alts/lives can use as needed.

Oh, one thought, I didn't optimize the armor progression for base types. (Battle, Magecraft, Mountain, etc...) But these numbers are close enough approximations.

[EllisDee37]

For unbound, double all the collectable counts, multiply the essence totals by around 4-ish, add in a couple hundred purifieds, plus a handful each of a couple dozen different types of rare collectables.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and kudos for this:

Here's BOUND math

18k essences
125 purified eberron dragonshards
2400 collectables

Impressively accurate estimate on the essence count!

[UurlockYgmeov]

concerning the artificially rare existing collectible (Fragrant Drowshood and Silver Flame Hymnals etc.) +Cocomajobo posted in the wee hours something that has been long suspected.... when U32 goes live, the drought will be over... or at least down to a more 'standard' level for rare collectibles. All the collectible dispensers are getting new marching instructions. (check the dev tracker to find the posts I am referring to).

[Stoner81]

Is it worth throwing in Devotion for Cleric, Druids, FvS and Paladins?

Stoner81.