Perfect Single Weapon Fighting

[Ykt]

My rogue has capped Shadowdancer, now enough XP to take lvl 26 and the first ED feat but PSWF is not in the list
http://ddowiki.com/page/Epic_Destiny...Martial_sphere
Tactician, Pierce DR and Skill Focuses are, but that one is missing.
I don't have any of the new SWF feats.
It doesn't have any prerequisite (except having 1 Martial ED capped, like the others), this bug is not listed in the Known Issues, so what am I missing?

[CThruTheEgo]

I'm not sure why it's not showing up for you. It did show up for my bard that does have all three SWF feats, so maybe they are a hidden pre-req.

Also, just a note of caution. The feat description specifically states that you gain the increased vorpal threat range while SWF, so I wouldn't expect it to work with any other fighting style (TWF, THF, or crossbow depending on what kind of rogue you are), unless of course the description is incorrect. I don't know if this has ever been tested or not.

[Saekee]

since it is only effective while swf, I can't imagine why someone would take it without the other 3 feats. Maybe it is blocked to protect players.
I assume your rigue is either Staff or TWF? Both would benefit from PTWF's doublestrike

[Ykt]

The release notes don't mention any SWF feat in the prerequisites, just like Perfect THF and Perfect TWF.

[Touriste]

Because it's a regular epic feat and not a destiny feat.

you can get it at level 21, 24 or 27

[Boombastic]

Because it's a regular epic feat and not a destiny feat.

you can get it at level 21, 24 or 27

http://ddowiki.com/page/Perfect_Single_Weapon_Fighting

DDO wiki disagrees and says its an epic destiny feat

[Vargouille]

It does require the first Single Weapon Fighting feat. There's no way to benefit from Perfect Single Weapon Fighting without it, since you wouldn't meet the requirement: "While Single Weapon Fighting, ..."

[Grailhawk]

It does require the first Single Weapon Fighting feat. There's no way to benefit from Perfect Single Weapon Fighting without it, since you wouldn't meet the requirement: "While Single Weapon Fighting, ..."

So why does PTWF not require TWF to get a benefit from, that needs to be corrected with how biased against TWF the current game is.

[Thar]

So why does PTWF not require TWF to get a benefit from, that needs to be corrected with how biased against TWF the current game is.

How is the game biased towards twf?

- requires double the inventory space for weapons
-crafting requires double the ingreadiants and time/raids
- damage output is less due to finessible weapons are approx half the base damage of THf.
- speed of attack for offhand is at most an extra attack per cycle, often less. THF easily out dps's this.
- instakill attacks are for all intents and purposes nerf's and not avaiable endgame with trash having 11,000 hps so off hand benefits from another attack are minimal.
- doesn't apply to feats like whirlwind, cleave, great cleave, etc.

Single weapon easily is just as good with the speed boost and by far surpasses it with bard enhancements with half the effort in obtaining gear for the same feats. THF is still king of DPS. TWF has no niche anymore. it's something you do because you get it for free as a ranger...

Who should be complaining is Sword and board... they can't use SWF and have no good option yet.

[ddorimble]

So why does PTWF not require TWF to get a benefit from, that needs to be corrected with how biased against TWF the current game is.

How is the game biased towards twf?

Someone's got a case of the Mondays.

[Saekee]

It does require the first Single Weapon Fighting feat. There's no way to benefit from Perfect Single Weapon Fighting without it, since you wouldn't meet the requirement: "While Single Weapon Fighting, ..."

Thx for the response!

So why does PTWF not require TWF to get a benefit from, that needs to be corrected with how biased against TWF the current game is.

PTWF adds doublestrike which other styles can use

Single weapon easily is just as good with the speed boost and by far surpasses it with bard enhancements with half the effort in obtaining gear for the same feats. THF is still king of DPS. TWF has no niche anymore. it's something you do because you get it for free as a ranger...

Who should be complaining is Sword and board... they can't use SWF and have no good option yet.

Hi thar, those are fair arguments but would derail the thread.

[Grailhawk]

PTWF adds doublestrike which other styles can use.

Other styles could use Vorpal effects on a 19 as well. If other styles can take PTWF and get a benefit why cant a TWF take PSWF and get the Vorpals on 19 benefit?

[Boombastic]

Other styles could use Vorpal effects on a 19 as well. If other styles can take PTWF and get a benefit why cant a TWF take PSWF and get the Vorpals on 19 benefit?

PSWF only works "when single weapon fighting" as per the feat's description :P thats why

[Saekee]

Other styles could use Vorpal effects on a 19 as well. If other styles can take PTWF and get a benefit why cant a TWF take PSWF and get the Vorpals on 19 benefit?

the vorpals on a 19 or 20 help SWF become balanced in relationship to TWF. I did some rough calculations for a kama-wielding monk with ninja capstone and the TWF comes out ahead, even with SWF getting the vorpal bonuses. The SB are the ones that take SWF to high levels, I think.

[EllisDee37]

So why does PTWF not require TWF to get a benefit from, that needs to be corrected with how biased against TWF the current game is.

Just so I'm clear on what you're saying:

The game is biased AGAINST TWF, meaning TWF is treated poorly by the game.
Because of this negative bias, they should ADD a NEW prerequisite to the PTWF feat.

Is this what you're saying?

[ddorimble]

Just so I'm clear on what you're saying:

The game is biased AGAINST TWF, meaning TWF is treated poorly by the game.
Because of this negative bias, they should ADD a NEW prerequisite to the PTWF feat.

Is this what you're saying?

Yeah, he's saying PTWF should be a benefit to only TWF characters, rather than the other fighting styles being able to poach it for 5% Doublestrike. This could be enforced by it requiring TWF (which, as a legitimate TWF character, you will of course already possess). Limiting it to TWFers is somewhat of a relative buff to TWFing (removing 5% Doublestrike from everyone else).

Honestly, I'd rather they just all work only when you're fighting with the appropriate 'style'. I'd totally burn an extra Feat (on Feat-laden characters) on TWFing to be able to poach PTWF again.

[Grailhawk]

Just so I'm clear on what you're saying:

The game is biased AGAINST TWF, meaning TWF is treated poorly by the game.
Because of this negative bias, they should ADD a NEW prerequisite to the PTWF feat.

Is this what you're saying?

Basically yes, but not just because the game is bias. Since none of the other Perfect feat give a benefit to other styles neither should PTWF just to keep things consistent, or they could make it so that any of the fest boost any style they just need to be consistent.

[droid327]

It does require the first Single Weapon Fighting feat. There's no way to benefit from Perfect Single Weapon Fighting without it, since you wouldn't meet the requirement: "While Single Weapon Fighting, ..."

I'm loath to question you about your own game...but that just doesn't feel right. Every other weapon style still works even without the requisite feats. THF get glances. S&B can use defender stances. TWF can use primal avatar boosts. Are you sure SWF without the first great is just "fighting with one weapon" and not true SWF?

Though that being said, I don't know why anyone would take pswf and be in swf without taking the swf feats too, so it may be a moot or difficult to test point.

[Hamlin]

Help me out here. What is the benefit of having your vorpal range increased? I didn't have time to look at all destinies, but other than "vorpal" (which sucks basketballs through drinking straws), what other effects or abilities go off on a vorpal roll?

[Grailhawk]

Help me out here. What is the benefit of having your vorpal range increased? I didn't have time to look at all destinies, but other than "vorpal" (which sucks basketballs through drinking straws), what other effects or abilities go off on a vorpal roll?

There are a lot of on vorpal abilities, the one that jumps out to me as could be crazy good if PSWF works with TWF is Fury Eternal. That said there probably are SWF builds with enough DS that they attack just as fast as TWF meaning SWF gets more Adrenaline uses then TWF now.