named item drop rates are miserable

[Arkat]

LH

I see the problem.

Yep.

[droid327]

Yep.

No. Soloists are not second-class citizens, and the game shouldn't be balanced around party play OR around Reaper rates

[Arkat]

No. Soloists are not second-class citizens, and the game shouldn't be balanced around party play OR around Reaper rates

I said nothing about Reaper rates nor did I make a comment about solo vs. group.

Try again.

[Lonnbeimnech]

If that is the problem I probably shouldn't be playing DDo huh?

Here's how you do it.

lets say you want the legendary cloak of balance from the offshore account.

post an lfm for offshore account levels 20-30

in the description, type: r1 farming cloak multiple runs

people will join, they might even pass you the item you want

[droid327]

I said nothing about Reaper rates nor did I make a comment about solo vs. group.

Try again.

Then what's wrong with running LH and/or being solo?

[vryxnr]

Then what's wrong with running LH and/or being solo?

On the surface, nothing... until you then complain that you don't get as many named items dropping as a full group of 6 willing to share loot while running on higher difficulties. Of course 6 people sharing loot will see named items more often than only one person looting per run. That's how numbers work. This game is also set up to encourage (but not require) both grouping and pushing oneself to run higher difficulties, and this is one of the ways it tries to do so (whether it's successful or not is debatable though). Higher difficulties have better drop rates. Like it or not, this is a fact of this game at this moment in time. Thus the implication that solo + hard = part of the reason why they're seeing less named loot than full group + elite/reaper.

[Arkat]

Then what's wrong with running LH and/or being solo?

Nothing wrong with running solo. I never said there was anything wrong with running solo. Go back a look at my first post a little more carefully.

LH, however, is the problem. If you want the best chance for an item compared with the effort to do it, EE is easily the best difficulty to do loot runs in.

An EE difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 33% chance for a named item.

An LH difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 16% chance for a named item.

An LN difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 10% chance for a named item.

Source: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...45#post6091545

[Enoach]

No. Soloists are not second-class citizens, and the game shouldn't be balanced around party play OR around Reaper rates

When you see a group "get more" then the soloist it has more to do with numbers.

Everyone has the same base rate for a chance at the item(s), the difference is the soloist gets a single chance, while the group gets up to 6 chances (12 when it comes to raids).

Now this doesn't mean individually the group is better off then the soloist, until you factor in the "share factor". Not trying to open up the "My loot is my loot" debate of the early days .

It is this "share factor" which gives grouping an advantage. Some of that is because they can complete the quest on a higher difficulty that grants a greater chance. Some of that is because it increases the opportunity that the item desired drops.

Now with PuGs it is hit or miss on the "share factor", static group or more tightly joined groups, such as guilds or "common questing buddies" tend to have a greater "share factor".

So, if the drop rate is increased to give everyone a greater possibility of getting a rare item, you will actually have a multiplicative effect on groups and increase the "share factors" chance even more. Making it even wider margin for these types of groups over soloists.

[Potatofasf]

An EE difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 33% chance for a named item.

An LH difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 16% chance for a named item.

An LN difficulty non-raid end chest gives you a 10% chance for a named item.

So, the real problem is... Game loot design! Not how OP is running it.

Someone will say "Run in groups"... surprise surprise... groups are doomed in DDO right now! Soloist has become a play style for a far wide population that the Drop Rates are totally anachronic and out of sync with the game reality.

The way to someone run solo EE or Er1 is to farm itens on LN and LH, or PIKE in groups begging for scraps that other people already has (I'm not against that... it is just not practical anymore)... but... surprise surprise... high level named itens (L26 to L29) are praised to feed sentient Jewels... so Go beg for itens elsewhere NOOB. Get Gud or Get Lost!

[droid327]

It is this "share factor" which gives grouping an advantage.

Nothing wrong with running solo. I never said there was anything wrong with running solo. Go back a look at my first post a little more carefully.

LH, however, is the problem. If you want the best chance for an item compared with the effort to do it, EE is easily the best difficulty to do loot runs in.

On the surface, nothing... until you then complain that you don't get as many named items dropping as a full group of 6 willing to share loot while running on higher difficulties...Thus the implication that solo + hard = part of the reason why they're seeing less named loot than full group + elite/reaper.

The question is one of balance point, though. Not everyone can (or wants to, or should be expected to) group. So balancing the game, or our expectations, around what you can get in a full group running EE is unfair. That shouldnt be the default, and it shouldnt be a "problem" if you arent doing it that way.

Likewise, though to a lesser extent, not everyone can run EE. EH is much more accessible to a wider set of soloists. Especially with the power spike you get with gear designed since RL, and doubly so since Sharn - to run in EE, you need the gear that you can best farm by running in EE. Its an ontological dilemma.

No one is saying that solo EH should give you the same drop rates as 6-man EE passing. Just that the disparity cant be so great that its unreasonably difficult to farm items in solo EH. That should be the balance point for 'baseline' farming, and scale drop rates up from there. Again, it shouldnt be a 'problem' if people are running solo EH, it should just 'be much easier' if you're in EE.

And that gets back to the OP's point, needing to run sometimes dozens of repetitions to farm a single named item. That's unreasonably difficult.

[Enoach]

...

No one is saying that solo EH should give you the same drop rates as 6-man EE passing. Just that the disparity cant be so great that its unreasonably difficult to farm items in solo EH. That should be the balance point for 'baseline' farming, and scale drop rates up from there. Again, it shouldnt be a 'problem' if people are running solo EH, it should just 'be much easier' if you're in EE.

...

So how do you improve the solo EH drop rate without improving the 6-man EE "share factor", without swinging the pendulum to over favor solo driving the game even further in that direction. Just asking for the group of us that prefer grouping over running content solo?

[Potatofasf]

So how do you improve the solo EH drop rate without improving the 6-man EE "share factor", without swinging the pendulum to over favor solo driving the game even further in that direction. Just asking for the group of us that prefer grouping over running content solo?

So many answers to that...

1 - List of guest named itens rewards each 3 completions
2 - List of quest named itens on story line completion
3 - List of quest named itens on saga completion
4 - Buy named itens with an exclusive pack/expansion NPC (i.e. Vistani Totens in Legendary Ravenloft... it would be expanded to Vistani Talismans on Heroics)
5 - Entry Game Mode at Quest Entrance - Farming for named loot (No EXP rewarded for increase at Named Itens drop rate)
6 - Equalize the drop rate percentage for no-bonus loot (Elite and Reaper are the only way to get itens with Mythic or Reaper Bonus)


There are ways to soften/improving it without poke to much on the "share bogus factor"...

[DaggomaticDwarf]

I have no sympathy for you.

In one breath you say these characters sole reason for being is to farm, then with the other, state how you don't want to run with the type of characters that will get you to the chest the fastest.

If it's just to farm, who cares who wins.

Dagg.

[Enoach]

So many answers to that...

1 - List of guest named itens rewards each 3 completions
2 - List of quest named itens on story line completion
3 - List of quest named itens on saga completion
4 - Buy named itens with an exclusive pack/expansion NPC (i.e. Vistani Totens in Legendary Ravenloft... it would be expanded to Vistani Talismans on Heroics)
5 - Entry Game Mode at Quest Entrance - Farming for named loot (No EXP rewarded for increase at Named Itens drop rate)
6 - Equalize the drop rate percentage for no-bonus loot (Elite and Reaper are the only way to get itens with Mythic or Reaper Bonus)


There are ways to soften/improving it without poke to much on the "share bogus factor"...

Each of those actually multiplies the "share factor" indirectly, potentially increasing the willingness to share for those that see named loot as "food".

However, I do like Item 4. I like how that was implemented in RL and also how raids have gained that giving those who have a different path then 20 completions before TR. But even that does not 'balance' the drop rate between solo and group.

It is interesting you call this a "bogus" factor, yet it is the one of issue you have with the difference between solo and group. The other being that "sharing the load" gives groups advantage on completions both in difficulty and time.

Why punish those that have mastered the social aspect of an MMO?

[Potatofasf]

Why punish those that have mastered the social aspect of an MMO?

Because the in-game population is eroding faster and the "social aspect" of the DDO is long overdue... the most social aspect in the game is via private channels, discord or static groups. LFM and PUGs has becoming an critical issue and the solo community has increased massively. DDO has lost the "group effect", so I ask you back, Why punish those that play solo?

Solo players...
1 - waste more time than groups doing quests
2 - work twice as hard to handle higher difficulties
3 - don't benefit from "share factor"
4 - are prone to not do Raids
5 - builds are starve on gear/swap
6 - burnout faster

Isn't a question of "balance" the drop between solo and group... is a matter of softening the game for those that choose to play solo for N motives.

[voxson5]

Isn't a question of "balance" the drop between solo and group... is a matter of softening the game for those that choose to play solo for N motives.

No.

No one is forcing anyone to play they way they want. And IF they decide to go it alone without even bothering to put up an LFM or asking for help to achieve the goal, they should understand consequences of that.

A solo player can also reroll chests, multibox to increase drop chances, play a build which can do the content they are farming, use any number of alternative gearing options (even if they are not them absolute best), and so forth.

[Opener]

No.

No one is forcing anyone to play they way they want. And IF they decide to go it alone without even bothering to put up an LFM or asking for help to achieve the goal, they should understand consequences of that.

A solo player can also reroll chests, multibox to increase drop chances, play a build which can do the content they are farming, use any number of alternative gearing options (even if they are not them absolute best), and so forth.

The game now is Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment.
We have to put a LFM asking for help and wait the good will of others, because we are playing in a wasteland that has 300 players per server at peak hours.

Yes, the game is forcing players to go solo. The actual state of the game has so many subdivisions in population that sticky in a group farming itens is a utopia.
Most are one and done for the sake of TRing faster, most are veterans grinding past lifes boosted on XP Pots and have all itens they even bother open chests, any named loot is food for SJ, they zerg and go out so fast that pass item on chests is a "waste time" for them.

Because of commentaries as yours, many has left this game for good and are playing and putting their money elsewhere.

[krimsonrane]

No.

No one is forcing anyone to play they way they want. And IF they decide to go it alone without even bothering to put up an LFM or asking for help to achieve the goal, they should understand consequences of that.

A solo player can also reroll chests, multibox to increase drop chances, play a build which can do the content they are farming, use any number of alternative gearing options (even if they are not them absolute best), and so forth.

35 shard per reroll? nope.
build a FOTM all the way to 30 just to farm? nope. it take me at least 4-6 weeks to tr. I'm 3 lives away from a ten year odyssey to get basic completionist. that is the only TRing I'll be doing and i don't want to do that.
I'm using the best gear I have available already.

[krimsonrane]

We all know random loot is trash. so why is there an argument?
We all know farming is a huge time sink grind and a bigger turnoff to game play. So why is there an argument?

[voxson5]

The game now is Dostoevsky's Crime and Punishment.
We have to put a LFM asking for help and wait the good will of others, because we are playing in a wasteland that has 300 players per server at peak hours.

Yes, the game is forcing players to go solo. The actual state of the game has so many subdivisions in population that sticky in a group farming itens is a utopia.
Most are one and done for the sake of TRing faster, most are veterans grinding past lifes boosted on XP Pots and have all itens they even bother open chests, any named loot is food for SJ, they zerg and go out so fast that pass item on chests is a "waste time" for them.

Because of commentaries as yours, many has left this game for good and are playing and putting their money elsewhere.

Boo hoo?

Your experience /= others