Tempests are Rediculous

[Sam-u-r-eye]

Tempest Dance of Death AOE makes cleaves look awful comparatively. DoD is the best aoe in the game and in R10 it is a major detriment to the THF playstyle by relative balance.

[Kaboom2112]

The best solution to this is to further nerf monks.

[Tilomere]

The best solution to this is to further nerf monks.

And warlocks.

[askrj1]

Just curious what weapons do tempests usually use nowadays.

[droid327]

Just curious what weapons do tempests usually use nowadays.

Set knives with vkf?

[AlsoWondering]

The best solution to this is to further nerf monks.

This is a ranger ability. You and Tilomere sound like my soon to be ex-Congressman. (We have a new guy taking office in 1.5 months.)

[Sam-u-r-eye]

Just curious what weapons do tempests usually use nowadays.

Flow + Nightshard on trash,

VKF is lower dps since they already have a very good second dps tree (Deepwood Sniper)

[Maldorin]

Not sure are you calling for a tempest nerf or a thf buff?

Personally I enjoy playing tempest builds. So much so that I rarely play any other melee.

That being said, it is my understanding there are some super high dps maul (silvanus) builds possible out there that are comparable.

But the tempest tree has been around for years. If they were to suddenly nerf it, I don't know... I'd have to make signs and go protest or something.

My opinion of course is limited as I don't run R10 and never have. Nor do any of my friends. Nor any of the guilds I am in.

Balancing the game around R10....might not be the best choice?

[Proton]

Not sure are you calling for a tempest nerf or a thf buff?

Personally I enjoy playing tempest builds. So much so that I rarely play any other melee.

That being said, it is my understanding there are some super high dps maul (silvanus) builds possible out there that are comparable.

But the tempest tree has been around for years. If they were to suddenly nerf it, I don't know... I'd have to make signs and go protest or something.

My opinion of course is limited as I don't run R10 and never have. Nor do any of my friends. Nor any of the guilds I am in.

Balancing the game around R10....might not be the best choice?

+++ (not again... You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Maldorin again.)

You are a sharp player, very consistent with your good observations! Sooner or later I will get to up your rep again!

[Sunnie]

This is a ranger ability. You and Tilomere sound like my soon to be ex-Congressman. (We have a new guy taking office in 1.5 months.)

You don't suppose he might have been a tad bit sarcastic there?

[Thrudh]

Flow + Nightshard on trash,

VKF is lower dps since they already have a very good second dps tree (Deepwood Sniper)

How do you figure?

11 in Deepwood for sure for Exposing Strike.

But Tier 3 and Tier 4 stuff Deepwood enhancements? How are they better than VKF?

Killer (20% morale doublestrike after killing a few mobs, fades over time) in Tier 4 doesn't compare very well to always on (10 sec duration, 10 sec cool-down) 20% morale doublestrike from Tier 1 (Tier 1!) Rapid Slash.

+3 to damage to Favored Enemies from Deepwood Tier 3 Favored Hunter? How much is that worth? VKF gets you a free Undead favored enemy, so there's +2 to all favored enemies.

11 points in VKF gets you free Quick Draw and 5% more Doublestrike and Doubleshot.
13 points in VKF gets you +1(W) with daggers
21 points gets you another 5% doublestrike and doubleshot

VKF has a ton of good stuff.

BUT, you have to use daggers. That indeed might be enough of a DPS drop to make one skip VFK. Is it? I haven't done the math. Pain and Suffering with a deep splash into VKF is pretty decent.

[Thrudh]

Dance of Death is indeed very nice, but it's also situational.

It only works on bunched up groups of mobs. They don't always group up on you.

Rats and oozes are nice enough to surround you, but humanoids have this annoying tendency to have two archers spread out, along with a caster way over there, and then 2 fighters in your face. Sure, the 2 fighters go down fast, but then you got to take down the other guys one-by-one.

[droid327]

Dance of Death is indeed very nice, but it's also situational.

It only works on bunched up groups of mobs. They don't always group up on you.

Rats and oozes are nice enough to surround you, but humanoids have this annoying tendency to have two archers spread out, along with a caster way over there, and then 2 fighters in your face. Sure, the 2 fighters go down fast, but then you got to take down the other guys one-by-one.

Plus what's the arc on that? Its not 360. Great Cleave AFAIK hits further to the sides, meaning a THF doesnt have to keep scooching back to keep mobs from flanking and getting out of the DoD AOE

[askrj1]

Dance of Death is indeed very nice, but it's also situational.

It only works on bunched up groups of mobs. They don't always group up on you.

Rats and oozes are nice enough to surround you, but humanoids have this annoying tendency to have two archers spread out, along with a caster way over there, and then 2 fighters in your face. Sure, the 2 fighters go down fast, but then you got to take down the other guys one-by-one.

Plus what's the arc on that? Its not 360. Great Cleave AFAIK hits further to the sides, meaning a THF doesnt have to keep scooching back to keep mobs from flanking and getting out of the DoD AOE

To be fair if the DoD grazes or misses somehow you also get stuck on 15s cooldown with no AoE at all. So yes DoD situationally better, the problem being it's MUCH better during those situations, and people who use it do all they can to reproduce the situation.

And thanks for all the info on weapons.

[FuryFlash]

VKF has a ton of good stuff.

BUT, you have to use daggers. That indeed might be enough of a DPS drop to make one skip VFK.

That's basically it. The VKF tree may have more in the way of direct DPS boosts like doublestrike and weapon damage, but it forces you into daggers, which are otherwise a relatively weak weapon type. Compared to a scimitar, you have:

Dagger: [1d4] 19-20/x2 Pierce
Scimitar: [1d6] 18-20/x2 Slash

Everything about the scimitar is better there, and you also have to consider that the best named endgame light melee weapons right now are not daggers. You have Flow (rapier) and Nightshard (scimitar) as arguably the best options, and other great choices like Timeshard (shortsword) and Vulkoor's Edge (scimitar). Being locked into daggers means losing these powerful gear choices.

[Dread131313]

The best solution to this is to further nerf monks.

I see what you did there :P

[Dread131313]

But the tempest tree has been around for years. If they were to suddenly nerf it, I don't know... I'd have to make signs and go protest or something.

It is [current year] and protest are good to do when bored.

[Vish]

They're rediculous now that monks are nerfed...

[janave]

Characters with 100+ PL feats, 80+ ReaperPTs, some Racial APs are Rediculous, and feedback sourced from them is mostly useless for the sake of class balance.

Yes, some classes scale better on the high end of the carrot stack and once geared out properly.

Had this discussion too many times before, if you have everything that stacks and you beaten content 100s of times, dont expect it to be any harder, it just punishes the player who are still on the grind mill to catch up there -- if they even dedicate to such grinds these days.

[lyrecono]

Tempest Dance of Death AOE makes cleaves look awful comparatively. DoD is the best aoe in the game and in R10 it is a major detriment to the THF playstyle by relative balance.

Dance of Death: Melee Dual Wielding Attack: Deals +1/+3/+5[W] damage. Your basic attacks when dual wielding strike 2/3/4 targets per swing instead of one for 10 seconds. (Cooldown: 15 seconds)

So, 1 tier 5 ability that requires 2wf and locks you out of other tier 5's on a glass cannon class that wouldn't survive long on harder content when surounded, unless mobs are cc'ed has an ok abillity.

Vs fighter and barbs with6+ aoe attacks they can spam due to shorter cooldowns, whille able to last longer then a ranger?


It might work if the tank got ths agro i guess ...

Hey, i'm all for 2hf buffs but this doesn't sound like the best argument for that, imho