Things that should be known, but often aren't

[Thar]

To the best of my knowledge, Pawnbrokers have never generated their own items.

When people sell items to Pawnbrokers, if the item is within the parameters of what that Pawnbroker is allowed to sell, they transfer it to their own inventory and it appears in their shop. It stays there until someone buys it or the instance the Pawnbroker is in collapses (including through server restarts). If an area (like the Marketplace) has multiple open Instances, the Pawnbrokers in each will likely have different shop inventories. If you see items on a Pawnbroker at all, they were sold recently by another player.

There does not seem to have ever been code for them to generate items that weren't sold to them. The functionality I just described was added just shy of 14 years ago, and seems to have remained largely unchanged through the life of the game.

The vendors used to have a relatively even level split for low, med, high, and end game gear. somewhere (feather of sun's loot pass) this broke to be like level 1, level 2, level 4-5 and everything else. can that be fixed so get gets split and doesnt' all get mushed into one vendor?

[Razor_Wit]

To the best of my knowledge, Pawnbrokers have never generated their own items.

When people sell items to Pawnbrokers, if the item is within the parameters of what that Pawnbroker is allowed to sell, they transfer it to their own inventory and it appears in their shop. It stays there until someone buys it or the instance the Pawnbroker is in collapses (including through server restarts). If an area (like the Marketplace) has multiple open Instances, the Pawnbrokers in each will likely have different shop inventories. If you see items on a Pawnbroker at all, they were sold recently by another player.

There does not seem to have ever been code for them to generate items that weren't sold to them. The functionality I just described was added just shy of 14 years ago, and seems to have remained largely unchanged through the life of the game.

Is it just coincidence that every time I visit the brokers in House D (near AH) there is not a single item for sale? This was my preferred location for buying/selling to brokers since I started playing and I haven't seen a single item in +3 years now.

edit: Is there any reason that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories?

[glmfw1]

Is it just coincidence that every time I visit the brokers in House D (near AH) there is not a single item for sale? This was my preferred location for buying/selling to brokers since I started playing and I haven't seen a single item in +3 years now.

Read my reply (above) which explains why it's empty!

[Amundir]

Any item with spell absorption, such as the mantle of the world shaper, should absorb disintegrate I would think.

[Razor_Wit]

Read my reply (above) which explains why it's empty!

I get all that and agree with you. Still does not satisfy why there is never a single item anymore when I visit. I would swear the House D brokers have been turned off somehow. Might just be my experience and my timing is impeccable. *shrugs*

[Phoenicis]

To the best of my knowledge, Pawnbrokers have never generated their own items.

When people sell items to Pawnbrokers, if the item is within the parameters of what that Pawnbroker is allowed to sell, they transfer it to their own inventory and it appears in their shop. It stays there until someone buys it or the instance the Pawnbroker is in collapses (including through server restarts). If an area (like the Marketplace) has multiple open Instances, the Pawnbrokers in each will likely have different shop inventories. If you see items on a Pawnbroker at all, they were sold recently by another player.

There does not seem to have ever been code for them to generate items that weren't sold to them. The functionality I just described was added just shy of 14 years ago, and seems to have remained largely unchanged through the life of the game.

AFAIK the Brokers have never (at least in the time I have been playing (early 2013, then since mid 2014)) stocked randomly generated items.
Lists would go empty if everything was bought OR after a reset OR if a new instance was created OR if the instance hadn't had people in it for a while. Once lists were full, new items sold to them would replace the oldest of the existing items.
As Brokers offered the best money for lootgen (more than Vendors), doing a quick run round House D, House K and the Marketplace (or Eveningstar if you had the key) was a quick way to get good money, and meant the stuff was there for others to buy. If a list went empty for any reason, it would quickly refill, as it was the go-to place to sell things.
Once Cannith Crafting was revamped, anyone with even a vague interest in crafting started burning their lootgen for Cannith Essences (and a small amount of plat), meaning far fewer items were sold to brokers than before. Named items couldn't be burned, so Brokers frequently had Unbound, BtCoE and BtAoE Named items for sale (as not everyone could be bothered with AH or SE or wanted money fast).
Once Sentient Weapons were launched, anyone getting Named Items that they (or friends) didn't need would be more likely to feed them to sentient gems than to sell them to brokers. As there was little need to go to brokers for any other reason, it meant that sellable named items with filled augment slots would generally be sold on AH or SE (or dumped in Guild Chests) rather than sold to brokers.
That means the Brokers will generally only hold items that are sold by newer players who aren't in a guild (or are in a small guild with less amenities) who haven't yet started crafting.

Sorry for the huge quote BUT:

Doesn't the pawnshop standing to the left of Three Finger Thad in the ship amenity generate her own list of items? She only buys extremely low level stuff but always seems to have things for sale.

[0ldschool]

Is it just coincidence that every time I visit the brokers in House D (near AH) there is not a single item for sale? This was my preferred location for buying/selling to brokers since I started playing and I haven't seen a single item in +3 years now.

edit: Is there any reason that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories?

<I'm a newb and still get vendor and broker confused, so I apologize in advance for any errors I may make in that terminology>

There are occasionally a few items at House D brokers, I saw 3 at once a couple of weeks ago (Cannith server). But they were quickly gone, and yes, it is often completely empty. As a first life L8 Mechanic, I can still buy clothing and jewelry items from brokers in the Marketplace that are, in many cases, better than anything listed on the AH. My guess is that this is probably due to the fact that many vets just don't bother auctioning stuff they don't need and broker trash it.

But armor and weapons only go up to a certain point, and anything above a given value (1,500 pp I think) just can't be sold to the Marketplace weapon/armor brokers. Those that are available from the Marketplace brokers are now basically useless for my L8 Mechanic. Those brokers tell me in their blurb to go to the House D brokers for better stuff, but, of course, nothing is there. So the AH is the only source of higher level weapons and armor, at least that I'm aware of as a newb of ~ 10 weeks in the game.

I think that a good solution would be to allow us to sell weapons and armor to the brokers in the Marketplace without a plat cap on its value, just as is already allowed for clothing and jewelry today.

EDIT: I thought a bit more about this, and no, this probably won't help much. The higher level gear dissolves for a good amount of essences, which are more valuable than the gear (if not needed) in every way. So likely most of this stuff is just going to be dissolved no matter what.

[Steelstar]

Is it just coincidence that every time I visit the brokers in House D (near AH) there is not a single item for sale? This was my preferred location for buying/selling to brokers since I started playing and I haven't seen a single item in +3 years now.

edit: Is there any reason that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories?

It's not a coincidence; people don't sell items in House D nearly as often as they used to.

Yes, there are reasons that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories. It basically boils down to "the tech doesn't work that way".

[glmfw1]

Sorry for the huge quote BUT:

Doesn't the pawnshop standing to the left of Three Finger Thad in the ship amenity generate her own list of items? She only buys extremely low level stuff but always seems to have things for sale.

I figured she had special amenity code on top of regular broker code.

[ComicRelief]

To the best of my knowledge, Pawnbrokers have never generated their own items.

When people sell items to Pawnbrokers, if the item is within the parameters of what that Pawnbroker is allowed to sell, they transfer it to their own inventory and it appears in their shop. It stays there until someone buys it or the instance the Pawnbroker is in collapses (including through server restarts). If an area (like the Marketplace) has multiple open Instances, the Pawnbrokers in each will likely have different shop inventories. If you see items on a Pawnbroker at all, they were sold recently by another player.

There does not seem to have ever been code for them to generate items that weren't sold to them. The functionality I just described was added just shy of 14 years ago, and seems to have remained largely unchanged through the life of the game.

Yeah, the pawn brokers have for the most part been ignored with the release of Cannith crafting as people who used to sell to the brokers would decon items instead. I've not seen any inventory in the weapons brokers in House D nor the armor brokers in House K in quite some time.

I've always been curious about what happens to the broker inventory with multiple instances. When the higher numbered instances close (due to lack of players), does the inventory disappear? Does it get automatically transferred to the next highest instance number? does it (in theory) remain in the instance to 're-appear' should that instance re-open?

Also, do airship broker inventories disappear if no one is on the airship? Or after a restart? Or are they persistent?

A peak behind the curtain is always cool.

[0ldschool]

Yeah, the pawn brokers have for the most part been ignored with the release of Cannith crafting as people who used to sell to the brokers would decon items instead. I've not seen any inventory in the weapons brokers in House D nor the armor brokers in House K in quite some time.

I've always been curious about what happens to the broker inventory with multiple instances. When the higher numbered instances close (due to lack of players), does the inventory disappear? Does it get automatically transferred to the next highest instance number? does it (in theory) remain in the instance to 're-appear' should that instance re-open?

Also, do airship broker inventories disappear if no one is on the airship? Or after a restart? Or are they persistent?

A peak behind the curtain is always cool.

Yep, this. The essences that the loot dissolves into are either more useful to the dissolver or worth way more on the AH than the loot itself, especially the small amount that a broker would pay. I learned this only recently. It is weird for a newbie, because the lack of items available at the brokers gives the impression (at least it did to me) that you're playing in the graveyard of a once thriving community. That is not the impression that you want to give to someone just starting to consider spending real money on DDO.

EDIT: How about this idea? When an item is dissolved, it reappears in a broker inventory for sale. The end result would be that instead draining loot from the game to increase essences, DDO would be draining platinum from the game (as the dissolved loot is bought from brokers). The benefit would be that there would be much larger selections of items from the brokers, and House D brokers would probably be overflowing with choices. Would this result in some kind of endless dissolve-buy-dissolve exploit? Even in that case, it would still just be draining plat from the game, which isn't be a bad thing, right? Or since new loot is being added to the game every day, would this result in an infinite pile of loot that crashes the servers?

[Gratch]

It's not a coincidence; people don't sell items in House D nearly as often as they used to.

Yes, there are reasons that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories. It basically boils down to "the tech doesn't work that way".

Without changing too much tech, could SSG do a slight update so there's 4 vendors and only 4 vendors in the marketplace, eveningstar, (and Sharn) and there's no level limits to what they accept? Then get rid of the House D ones and the extra ones in the marketplace. Might give slightly more use to new players.

[Vyrzain]

....................

When people sell items to Pawnbrokers, if the item is within the parameters of what that Pawnbroker is allowed to sell, they transfer it to their own inventory and it appears in their shop.
It stays there until someone buys it or the instance the Pawnbroker is in collapses (including through server restarts).
If an area (like the Marketplace) has multiple open Instances, the Pawnbrokers in each will likely have different shop inventories.
If you see items on a Pawnbroker at all, they were sold recently by another player.
..............................

I thought as much!

Before the weekly server restarts I would see lots of items for sale at these Brokers.
But now there is not as much : (

I think this is a perception issue; that no one uses the Brokers in House D or House K because of those restarts. In the past items would be there much longer. Now they are cleared out every week. Thus we must check for items Tuesday before the wipe : )

I still sell and buy from the Brokers in House D or House K.
Never on the AirShip nor in The Inspired Quarter though.
In fact, I think I only used The Inspired Quarter Brokers once.


Maybe there could be a way that when the server restarts items on Brokers are not gone forever?
Giving Players (mainly new Players) the chance to get some good gear?

[FuzzyDuck81]

Yes, there are reasons that gear players sell to taverns cannot appear in broker inventories. It basically boils down to "the tech doesn't work that way".

Lore-wise, it boils down to "the barkeep tried making an arrangement with some kobolds to act as runners, taking them to the brokers.. but the kobolds just ran off yelling about 'free shinies!' & they scrapped the whole idea"

[0ldschool]

I think this is a perception issue; that no one uses the Brokers in House D or House K because of those restarts. In the past items would be there much longer. Now they are cleared out every week. Thus we must check for items Tuesday before the wipe : )

Is this confirmed? It would never have occurred to me that this was happening.

Maybe there could be a way that when the server restarts items on Brokers are not gone forever?
Giving Players (mainly new Players) the chance to get some good gear?

If the above is true, this sounds like the best solution. Speaking as a newb, this is one of those things that may not matter to established players, but would go a long way towards making DDO a more enjoyable experience for new players. Being told to go to House D brokers for better gear, only to find nothing there, is yet another "I'm confused, what's going on here?" moment for a new player.

EDIT: My immediate assumption was that this place is a ghost town since no one is selling items to these brokers.

[Hafeal]

I think this is a perception issue; that no one uses the Brokers in House D or House K because of those restarts. In the past items would be there much longer. Now they are cleared out every week. Thus we must check for items Tuesday before the wipe : )

This is NOT true.

Items in House D and K pawn brokers will disappear in 30 minutes or less if no one is in the broker (I can't remember the exact amount of time, but is relatively short).

In ye olden days, circa GH coming out, players would "camp" in pawn shops hoping for the rare sale of a +5 weapn, or a puncturing of wounding, or a Power 4 (paralyzer, smiter, disruption or vorpol weapon). For a while, banes were all the rage as well.

Plus, you get more plat. Players would also visit the House K armor vendor to try and visiualize armor - before it was not working anymore.

Fast forward 10 years ... plat is in abundance and the "run" to House D and House K brokers is not worth the time. Further, there are other pawn brokers spread throughout the game - IQ, Eveningstar, etc.

Persoanlly, if I don't destruct my items and I think they are worth something, I throw them on the AH cheap or vendor them in Eveningstar where there is almost always someone running so the pawn vendors rarely reset other than for server restarts.

[noneill]

This is NOT true.

Items in House D and K pawn brokers will disappear in 30 minutes or less if no one is in the broker (I can't remember the exact amount of time, but is relatively short).

In ye olden days, circa GH coming out, players would "camp" in pawn shops hoping for the rare sale of a +5 weapn, or a puncturing of wounding, or a Power 4 (paralyzer, smiter, disruption or vorpol weapon). For a while, banes were all the rage as well.

Plus, you get more plat. Players would also visit the House K armor vendor to try and visiualize armor - before it was not working anymore.

Fast forward 10 years ... plat is in abundance and the "run" to House D and House K brokers is not worth the time. Further, there are other pawn brokers spread throughout the game - IQ, Eveningstar, etc.

Persoanlly, if I don't destruct my items and I think they are worth something, I throw them on the AH cheap or vendor them in Eveningstar where there is almost always someone running so the pawn vendors rarely reset other than for server restarts.

On Sarlona there was one guild that parked a character in the House D broker shop so that it would not reset. Doing a service for the whole server. Ah the golden days.
We also got gold instead of plat, things hadn't been devalued too much yet.
It was worth running around the marketplace and houses to sell all your stuff and see what was for sale. No mailbox and no AH at that time.

[btolson]

This is NOT true.

Items in House D and K pawn brokers will disappear in 30 minutes or less if no one is in the broker (I can't remember the exact amount of time, but is relatively short).

It's 5 minutes. Same window of time you have to re-enter a quest before it gets garbage collected. That's why in these days of low server population, the brokers in House K & D don't stand a chance anymore. Marketplace and Eveningstar usually last a while, because they are central hubs that people pass through for many reasons not connected to the brokers. It's rare to see multiple instances of them though. I can remember when it was commonplace for Marketplace instance 3 to be permanent, with 4 and 5 more transiently available.

[0ldschool]

It's 5 minutes. Same window of time you have to re-enter a quest before it gets garbage collected. That's why in these days of low server population, the brokers in House K & D don't stand a chance anymore. Marketplace and Eveningstar usually last a while, because they are central hubs that people pass through for many reasons not connected to the brokers. It's rare to see multiple instances of them though. I can remember when it was commonplace for Marketplace instance 3 to be permanent, with 4 and 5 more transiently available.

Reading in stunned silence. 5 minutes! Either they should extend this time greatly, or just get rid of those House brokers and let the Marketplace brokers have items of any value. The Marketplace broker NPC should not be telling me to go to House D broker for high end gear every time I talk to them. I get that this matters little to established players, but think about it from a new players perspective. I was forced to learn how to turn my accumulated loot (90% bastard swords, dwarven axes, and docents) into something I could actually use to improve my character. We need the AH and brokers to progress and enjoy the game.

[btolson]

Reading in stunned silence. 5 minutes! Either they should extend this time greatly, or just get rid of those House brokers and let the Marketplace brokers have items of any value. The Marketplace broker NPC should not be telling me to go to House D broker for high end gear every time I talk to them. I get that this matters little to established players, but think about it from a new players perspective. I was forced to learn how to turn my accumulated loot (90% bastard swords, dwarven axes, and docents) into something I could actually use to improve my character. We need the AH and brokers to progress and enjoy the game.

I agree they should consolidate all the house brokers into the marketplace somehow, and probably the existing clothing/jewelry ones as well. The plat tiers on those vendors don't line up well with item value anymore.