Pact sadness!

[losian2]

I was so very much hoping they'd go with the 4th edition base pacts, including astral.. I have to say that having two that are very "fire" and "evil" is kinda confusing to those who aren't rather familiar with the lore and how that all works, especially since we already have plenty of fire and fire-based stuff, something unusual (ie the radiant/light/cold aspect of astral) woulda been really neat.. it seems pretty redundant! Here's hoping they at least have some really strong different nuances to them, akin to the 4th ed pacts, if nothing else.

[Failedlegend]

I agree...I really do hope Warlock isn't' pigeon holed as that evil guy...despite the stereotype Warlocks can make pacts with anything powerful enough to grant them it...including Celestial beings. Some don't even know what their power source is, or their power source isn't even sentient.

I'd like to see the Pacts be a level 1 feat selection with relevant alignment restrictions (with Warlocks themselves being unaligned) than the prestige trees just having a paticular focus instead of being linked directly to the pacts.

My personal fav Packs are Dragon, Celestial & Star although it would awesome if there was a Pact related to one of the magical powers of Eberron..or even house cannith to have a weird half-construct warlock w/ some nice Arty synergy. (see Sorceror-King Pact)

[HastyPudding]

I agree...I really do hope Warlock isn't' pigeon holed as that evil guy...despite the stereotype Warlocks can make pacts with anything powerful enough to grant them it...including Celestial beings. Some don't even know what their power source is, or their power source isn't even sentient.

I'd like to see the Pacts be a level 1 feat selection with relevant alignment restrictions (with Warlocks themselves being unaligned) than the prestige trees just having a paticular focus instead of being linked directly to the pacts.

My personal fav Packs are Dragon, Celestial & Star although it would awesome if there was a Pact related to one of the magical powers of Eberron..or even house cannith to have a weird half-construct warlock w/ some nice Arty synergy. (see Sorceror-King Pact)

I agree; the pacts need to be a first-level feat, like paladins, clerics, and FVS get for religious feats. It could 'grow' depending on which pact you chose, just like the religious feats, each pact type giving particular bonuses as you level.

[fmalfeas]

Considering the nature of Eberron, I'd say that one of the prime sources for pacts could easily be The Silver Flame. In which case, I'd honestly expect the Eldritch Blast ability to be...well...that blue-white fire of the Silver Flame, and do horrible, horrible things to evil outsiders.

And basically everything that has real influence in Shavarath that lives there is strong enough for pacting. Archons, Eladrin, Baatezu, Taana'ri, Yugoloth, Angels. Inevitables (really big ones) could do it too. And of course legit deities could. The Lord of Blades could too, since he seems to have enough followers to have ascended from really being a Warforged to being at least a demigod.

And of course...the Daelkyr. And the big Quori, both the nasty ones we've fought, and the nice ones who hang with the Kalashtar. The elven Ancestors, and Vol as well. And probably the Great Wyrms of Argonessen (the ones who are so stupidly old that they really need a title beyond Great Wyrm.)

And yeah, though it's a 'classic' Prestige for warlocks, I don't think Hellfire Warlock is appropriate, being that we don't allow Evil. Assassin pushes the envelope, but at least it has counterparts in D&D like Imaskari Vengeance Taker, and Slayer of Domiel for non-evil assassins. But when you're wielding Hellfire, that's straight-up the power of ArchDevils. It's the GreenBlack flames of Lawful Evil wrath.

The kind of things I'd like to see for Lock prestiges are a tree based on manipulation of the Eldritch Blast itself...basically, the warlock version of a full-battle mode. Another based on their invocations...more castery. And another based on amplifying the special powers derived from their pact. Like if being Pacted with The Silver Flame gave you +1d6 Good damage on your eldritch blast vs evil, and an invocation that was like protection from evil, that tree would do things like add bane damage as well if the target is an evil outsider, and then at higher levels, add bane damage over time as well, no matter what blast essence or shape was being used. And the prot evil invocation would get things like the resistance bonus and deflection bonus being increased, and eventually additional immunities added to the protection effect. And as you gained more special (and very specialized) abilities from your pact, there would be more possible boosts.

But I'll admit that third idea would be a multiselector bonanza and probably require a lot of coding time.

[DrWily]

We can have the base pacts modified to fit the Eberron theme.

[Zachski]

As far as evil players go... if Assassin pushes the envelope, then Ravager shoves it hard enough into the nearest wall where it explodes into pieces.

[Vargouille]

I was so very much hoping they'd go with the 4th edition base pacts, including astral.. I have to say that having two that are very "fire" and "evil" is kinda confusing to those who aren't rather familiar with the lore and how that all works, especially since we already have plenty of fire and fire-based stuff, something unusual (ie the radiant/light/cold aspect of astral) woulda been really neat.. it seems pretty redundant! Here's hoping they at least have some really strong different nuances to them, akin to the 4th ed pacts, if nothing else.

There's two fire/evil pacts? Huh. News to me!

Hopefully you can be Enlightened: It's in the Spirit of DDO to give a bit more freedom in character building.

[MadCookieQueen]

There's two fire/evil pacts? Huh. News to me!

Hopefully you can be Enlightened: It's in the Spirit of DDO to give a bit more freedom in character building.

you enjoy teasing us don't you?


Admit it...


it's a little bit fun ^^

[TakeItToTheLimit]

I was so very much hoping they'd go with the 4th edition base pacts, including astral.. I have to say that having two that are very "fire" and "evil" is kinda confusing to those who aren't rather familiar with the lore and how that all works, especially since we already have plenty of fire and fire-based stuff, something unusual (ie the radiant/light/cold aspect of astral) woulda been really neat.. it seems pretty redundant! Here's hoping they at least have some really strong different nuances to them, akin to the 4th ed pacts, if nothing else.

Given that 4th Edition was a pile of unadulterated *******************, I'd be far happier if they went with the 5th edition pact options instead - Fiendish, Fey and Great Old One. This would allow more than enough flexibility and still keep an Eberron feel. So you would have a basically evil set with lots of fire powers, A basically good set with an emphasis on charms and a plain weird set of pure chaos.

[MadCookieQueen]

Given that 4th Edition was a pile of unadulterated *******************, I'd be far happier if they went with the 5th edition pact options instead - Fiendish, Fey and Great Old One. This would allow more than enough flexibility and still keep an Eberron feel. So you would have a basically evil set with lots of fire powers, A basically good set with an emphasis on charms and a plain weird set of pure chaos.

I totally agree about 4th edition being garbage.

5th ed is definitely simplified, but let's not forget that pacts were also designed in 3.5, Complete Mage pgs: 7 - 8

Devils, Demons, Fey, Slaadi and Celestials

There's plenty of options to choose from and would allow for plenty of customizing. The problem would really be making the alignment restrictions work within DDO.

DDO does not currently grant evil alignment (granted we have Palemasters and Assassins but hey it's a mechanic thing). So I would argue that Devils (LE) and Demons (E) would be pretty much out.

That would leave us with Fey (chaotic any), Slaadi (mostly chaotic but can be any, within Warlock/DDO restrictions) and Celestials (chaotic good).

If enhancements were to follow any of these I would venture we would see something akin to:

Fey -- Enchantment type, this would be fantastic for a CC person, since Fey are tricky the enchantment is only a set up before the axe falls. Much like a Bard's CDG, if they are helpless they are dead. In fact I would think of this as a nice mixup of Bard's Spellsinger and Wizards Archmage

Slaadi -- Elemental warriors, think like Eldritch Knight but with more Sorc Savant thrown in. You would pick your Slaadi element and go from there.

Celestial -- Prestige Class Enlightened Spirit (Complete Mage page 60) puts these on par with FvS Angel of Vengence, with a bit of War Priest throw in. I could see a crazy Ameoliating strike with a damage boost being workable.

So if it was me, I would think along these lines, which goes beyond just demons, devils and other baddies and into the world of more like ancient powers who make deals because, why not?

[edrein]

The Dark Pact:
Having long since heard the whispers of the Spinner of Shadows (or Lolth for the iconics) you have been molded by dark forces, your powers and strength derived from the greater darkness.

Level 1: Your melee attacks, invocations, and eldritch blast gain 1d6 magical poison damage. In addition for each Dark Pact feat you have this damage increase by one damage die, IE: 2d6, etc. (Treated as the same type as The Spinner of Shadow's poison damage, which is unholy or evil? Not sure it effects everything including herself.)
Level 6: You gain a new Invocation (SLA) of Spiteful Glammor, this spell applies an poison DoT based on alignment spell power and a small stun effect. DC based on Warlock Level + Charisma mod.
Level 12: You gain the Darkspiral Aura effect upon killing a mob; Your eldritch blast (and/or Hideous Blow/Claws) damage is increased by 5%, this damage effect can stack up to four times and degrades in charges every six seconds. Damaging an opponent under 50% HP has a 5% chance of proccing this effect as well.
Level 18: You have become a Darkwalker, you are now considered ghostly and incorporeal, gaining a passive 15% ghostly effect. (This does not stack with items.)


The Fey Pact:
Despite Eberron lacking a plane quite as robust as the Feywild of Toril, warlock's have learned to tap into the magic of planes such as Lamannia and Fernia.

Level 1: You gain additional cold iron damage reduction as you are considered more fey than your previous form: This adds a stacking 2/cold iron per Fey Pact feat to the Warlock's innate cold iron damage reduction.
Level 6: You gain a new Invocation (SLA) of Eyebite, this spell applies a blindness debuff and a burst of Light, Fire, and Cold damage. Damage and DC based on Warlock Level + Charisma mod.
Level 12: You gain the Wild Magic Aura effect upon striking a blow with melee attacks, invocations, and eldritch blast, having a 5% chance to deal a random burst of fey magic; dealing a combination of either frost and sonic, electric and force, or light and fire damage in a burst effect. (This effect uses an animation similar to sunburst and the same area of effect.)
Level 18: You join your Unseelie allies in the reverie of being a Fey, gaining a 5% chance to reflect any magic spell targeted at you; taking no damage or effect and instead placing it upon the caster.


The Infernal Pact:
With the battleground of Shavarath simply a teleport away, the Devils have long since worked to ensorcel warlocks to their aid and you are no exception.

Level 1: You gain the feat Toughness and the ability to use your constitution modifier for your Eldritch Blast. (As well has Hideous Blow and Eldritch Claws.)
Level 6: You gain a new Invocation (SLA) of Hellish Rebuke, this spell throws up a pillar of hellfire before you dealing fire and unholy damage to enemies based on your constitution score. You use the higher of your Constitution or Charisma score plus Warlock levels for the DC.
Level 12: You gain the Life-stealer Aura effect upon which all damage you deal returns a 5% life leech effect to you. This heal is only effected by healing amp, not spellpower or melee power.
Level 18: You have started the path of hellfire and brimstone early, your eldritch blast gains 2d6 fire damage and 2d6 evil damage. These scale with their respective spellpowers, fire and light.


The Star Pact:
Strange whispers from the cosmos have made their way to you, with them come the promise of untold power from strange alien beings.

Level 1: You have started to become an aberration turning your innate damage reduction from cold iron to byshek. You also gain 10 light spellpower per Star Pact feat you possess.
Level 6: You gain a 5% chance to deal a burst of light damage when you deal damage. This damage is scaled by light spellpower and warlock level. Additionally, this effect applies to DoTs and Auras.
Level 12: You gain a new Invocation (SLA) of Dire Radiance, this spell creates an aura of light and bane damage around the warlock. This ability scales based on warlock level and is effected by spellpower. (This works like Death Aura.)
Level 18: You have become a Doomsayer for the great evils of the cosmos, when you strike an opponent with damage there is a 5% chance they will be struck helpless with fear. Every instance of damage implies the shaken effect on enemies.

I already did a large amount of the work for this based upon a mix of Faerun's pacts in 4.0 and more or less adapting them to fit DDO in general. I mostly took their descriptions and abilities granted in PnP and reworked them to fit DDO, especially the 'SLA' abilities and auras/passive buffs. The biggest issue is almost every thread currently popping up was already looked into by a megathread that started over a year ago, all Cordovan needs to do is move it over to this subforum and a lot of ideas and answers could be there for folks attention.

[Zachski]

4E hate is overrated and boring.

[Impaqt]

Not being familiar with Warlocks, I gotta say that these "Pacts" are very reminiscent of Clerical Domains.

So I would probably just forget the Pacts and do Warlocks without em....

Pretend they never existed.

[FuzzyDuck81]

you enjoy teasing us don't you?


Admit it...


it's a little bit fun ^^

I'm sure that none of the devs or council members are sitting stroking a white cat & saying "excellent" in a Mr Burns voice, maybe with the occasional cackle, as people speculate

[nibel]

Given that 4th Edition was a pile of unadulterated *******************, I'd be far happier if they went with the 5th edition pact options instead - Fiendish, Fey and Great Old One.

And those differ from 4e Infernal, Fey and Star... how?

Seriously, people. 4e is over. Some people liked it, some hated it. Doesn't matter, it is over. There is no need to bash it any longer. Now it goes to the same limbo of best/worst edition ever that anything that is not the most recent version falls into.

[MadCookieQueen]

I'm sure that none of the devs or council members are sitting stroking a white cat & saying "excellent" in a Mr Burns voice, maybe with the occasional cackle, as people speculate

More like this:

[Uska]

And those differ from 4e Infernal, Fey and Star... how?

Seriously, people. 4e is over. Some people liked it, some hated it. Doesn't matter, it is over. There is no need to bash it any longer. Now it goes to the same limbo of best/worst edition ever that anything that is not the most recent version falls into.

Not really 4E drove me from playing pnp d&d to something else and 5th didn't bring me back but if you pull out ad&D I will play and also 3.x if you leave out ALL of the splat books. As to knocking 4E there should never be an end to that.

[cdbd3rd]

...

Seriously, people. 4e is over. Some people liked it, some hated it. Doesn't matter, it is over. There is no need to bash it any longer. Now it goes to the same limbo of best/worst edition ever that anything that is not the most recent version falls into.

My boy's PnP group is still using 4E last I heard - therefore I still get to tease him about it.

Having no PnP experience with much past 2nd ed, I don't have any preconceptions about Warlocks. But reading here and seeing the concept of pacting - a pact with Slaadi would've been tempting had I played the class. Slaadi were cool. I even translated them to Gamma World when my group jumped to that ship for a while.
*Sigh*. ...way back when.

[edrein]

Not really 4E drove me from playing pnp d&d to something else and 5th didn't bring me back but if you pull out ad&D I will play and also 3.x if you leave out ALL of the splat books. As to knocking 4E there should never be an end to that.

4e may be over and many more hate it than they enjoyed it. But don't worry lackluster 5e is here to save the day!

[Lanadazia]

so will it somewhat be like a PrE sorc, that you can select from different styles?
i'd love to see some nieche build paths too. light, cold and force is not around so much, only a few spells there (not talking about untyped damage)

also with the introduction of the warlock, i'd love to see new general arcane/divine spells! especially in higher spell-grades to chose from,

also a spell-grade 3 addition of "resist energy, mass" would be superb!

and can we have extend to affect offensive spells like firewall again? that would make the extend feat viable on actual arcane casters and not bards only!