Eliminate Ship Buffs!!!

[axel15810]

I HATE ship buffs. Mainly because they are the biggest time sink in the entire game. Every time I join or start a group I have to wait atleast 5 extra minutes per quest because people HAVE to run and get their buffs. What really ticks me off is when people feel they must buff when running content way over level, or when doing simple farming quests. EE I understand, but everything else including most heroic elite...come on really?.

I understand the ship has sailed for getting rid of them completely, so I'd compromise for an all in one ship buff shrine. That atleast would speed things up, and often the ship needs to be used to get to quests so it would help a lot with all the dead time.

[Impaqt]

If you dotn want to wait for people to buff... dont. Start the quest. Put "IP" in your LFM....

sheesh. whiners....

[JOTMON]

Oh who friggin cares. With all the things broken with DDO worrying about how this break low-level play isn't even in the top 50 list of things that should be addressed.

Seriously . . . who cares?

This is how you derail a thread ...

Can you take some time to show Hal how to be a better toll, he is not doing a very good job here.

[axel15810]

If you dotn want to wait for people to buff... dont. Start the quest. Put "IP" in your LFM....

sheesh. whiners....

For me this is a social, multiplayer game. If I wanted to solo I'd play a different game, because there are way better solo games out there. Starting the quest without at least a few people in quest with me defeats the purpose of me playing DDO.

[Sam1313]

So your saying i worked my a$$ off to get my guildship and all her nice buffs and you don't like it, so i shouldn't use it??

Nothing to see here but another i don't like it so you shouldn't use it, even better nerf it thread, very closely related to the play the game MY WAY thread.

+1. Agreed. I have passed up great gear, tomes Comms and XP to take guild renown so my guild could level faster. If the OP doesn't like ship buffs then he should not use them, In fact he shouldn't even be in a guild. Use the public portals to go from house to house like most of us had to when our guild was low level and we didn't have a ship. Also I'd like to add that most the people that join the group at the last minute then ask for a ship invite has probably just gotten out of another quest and their buffs are about to expire and they just want to contribute as much as they can to the current group/quest they are in. I don't know? I'm not sure why some people do this but that would be my guess. And as for the ship buffs making low level toons over powered or over protected in the low level quests, Then so be it. I worked my A$$ off to get my guild to that level and I also PAY for those buffs so I SHOULD be entitled to sleep walk through the low level quests. I earned it. I payed for it. I done my time.

[UurlockYgmeov]

Oh who friggin cares. With all the things broken with DDO worrying about how this break low-level play isn't even in the top 50 list of things that should be addressed.

Seriously . . . who cares?

oh snap! Teh_Troll and I agree on a second point? I Swear, 'they are coming to get me uha, uha'

[TheLegendOfAra]

How fustrating when last player joins your group,everyone at the entrance,and then player chat hits"can I have a ship invite" jesus fruit friggiin christ;

I HATE ship buffs. Mainly because they are the biggest time sink in the entire game. Every time I join or start a group I have to wait atleast 5 extra minutes per quest because people HAVE to run and get their buffs. What really ticks me off is when people feel they must buff when running content way over level, or when doing simple farming quests. EE I understand, but everything else including most heroic elite...come on really?.

The problem I have with people like you is that you buff first, throw your LFM up and the get all ****y when other people join and wish to get their own buffs. In such situations you are the problem. Unless there is a lock out mechanic, or the player doesn't know where they're going don't wait for them. Is it fair that you and the first 3 to join all have ample time to get shipbuffs and get to the quest, but players 5 and 6 have to go without because they joined last?

And then I also always hear "they should buff before joining then" from you people, which doesn't make much sense either; if you buff before you join the LFM just so you don't make someone wait another minute, the chances of you losing your spot in that PUG to someone else gets higher and higher.

Whether people need shipbuffs or not is beside the point. Most TR's will not need them in most quests in heroic levels. But they are nice to have, and make life easier on toons that have better spells to slot besides resists, or simply do not have the hotbar/inventory room for wands.

Simply do not use them if you don't like them, and don't worry about what everyone else is doing.
If the PUG joins and says "Buffing brt" say "Okay, we're starting now."

Your problems with shipbuffs are exactly that, YOUR problems. Not everyone else's.

Now all that being said, I do agree that shipbuffs are OP in lower levels, but I also don't think that it matters enough to warrant a change. Most TR's don't need 'em, and most newbs won't have 'em. But that's just my opinion, and it doesn't matter much either.

[redoubt]

I never dreamed when I was 1st playin that such a Gimmick could exist. 30 % resistance buff is what makes Elite dungeons(mid lvl and below) so Easy for the masses...I'm not to impressed with players who use them below 10th lvl.I been using my 20%ers ,hipacriticlly,to keep up with elite runners elem dam resistance.But I would love for them to Be Gone from the Game...or lvl limits for the resistance ones ,at least.Anyone who supports stupid airship buffs ,is walkin on a crutch of inadaquecy...How fustrating when last player joins your group,everyone at the entrance,and then player chat hits"can I have a ship invite" jesus fruit friggiin christ;often it is player, like 26th lvl in max destiny ,no less;what a joke.Real fair to new players too(sarcasim meter maxed)they are thinkin there are items to find to help run elite heroic;dont be to impressed newbs ;older players run the dungeon on crutches !

No thank you.

1. its not 30%. Its 30 points.
2. If you only like to play low levels and don't think the game is fun if you use the buffs, then don't use them.
3. If you don't want to wait for the last person, then don't wait. Start the quest.
4. Take a break and then rerun whatever dungeon crushed you today and feel better after you go back and succeed. (Without buffs of course.)
5. You could also try perma death.

[Buffyanne]

DDO is a byoh and byob game. Ships buffs are needed. What is a wiz going to take time to pass 30 FR in a quest with fire damage? Of course not. We don't have inventory space so I don't want to hear about carrying pots. Ship Buffs played a vital role in moving DDO into the first person shooter game it is now. No going back at this point.

[Azarddoze]

DDO is a byoh and byob game. Ships buffs are needed. What is a wiz going to take time to pass 30 FR in a quest with fire damage? Of course not. We don't have inventory space so I don't want to hear about carrying pots. Ship Buffs played a vital role in moving DDO into the first person shooter game it is now. No going back at this point.

I like ship buffs... could pass but like them. And we actually used to wait and give the needed buffs and it doesn't take time if you do it while moving. People didn't seem so much like AIs back then either.

This mentality of yours is why nerfs constantly happen. "Needed", no. "Vital role", neither.

[Coyopa]

I never dreamed when I was 1st playin that such a Gimmick could exist. 30 % resistance buff is what makes Elite dungeons(mid lvl and below) so Easy for the masses...I'm not to impressed with players who use them below 10th lvl.I been using my 20%ers ,hipacriticlly,to keep up with elite runners elem dam resistance.But I would love for them to Be Gone from the Game...or lvl limits for the resistance ones ,at least.Anyone who supports stupid airship buffs ,is walkin on a crutch of inadaquecy...How fustrating when last player joins your group,everyone at the entrance,and then player chat hits"can I have a ship invite" jesus fruit friggiin christ;often it is player, like 26th lvl in max destiny ,no less;what a joke.Real fair to new players too(sarcasim meter maxed)they are thinkin there are items to find to help run elite heroic;dont be to impressed newbs ;older players run the dungeon on crutches !

Sorry, but I read this as "Waaah! I need ship buffs to keep up with other people on elite". I've run four TR's (2 second life, 2 third life) and I am working on a 5th back through the heroic levels and my guild only recently earned back 20 fire resist. Most of the time, I don't even remember there *are* buffs on my ship - and I'm the guild leader - and yet I manage to either "solo" (that'd be solo w/hireling) or shortman every quest on elite from Heyton's Rest through Gianthold. So, ship buffs aren't required even when others in your party are using them (and I've been in shortman parties where the others used them and I did not). I don't have much patience for ship buffing, to be honest. I'd rather just get into the quest and have some fun.

[axel15810]

The problem I have with people like you is that you buff first, throw your LFM up and the get all ****y when other people join and wish to get their own buffs. In such situations you are the problem. Unless there is a lock out mechanic, or the player doesn't know where they're going don't wait for them. Is it fair that you and the first 3 to join all have ample time to get shipbuffs and get to the quest, but players 5 and 6 have to go without because they joined last?

And then I also always hear "they should buff before joining then" from you people, which doesn't make much sense either; if you buff before you join the LFM just so you don't make someone wait another minute, the chances of you losing your spot in that PUG to someone else gets higher and higher.

Whether people need shipbuffs or not is beside the point. Most TR's will not need them in most quests in heroic levels. But they are nice to have, and make life easier on toons that have better spells to slot besides resists, or simply do not have the hotbar/inventory room for wands.

Simply do not use them if you don't like them, and don't worry about what everyone else is doing.
If the PUG joins and says "Buffing brt" say "Okay, we're starting now."

Your problems with shipbuffs are exactly that, YOUR problems. Not everyone else's.

Now all that being said, I do agree that shipbuffs are OP in lower levels, but I also don't think that it matters enough to warrant a change. Most TR's don't need 'em, and most newbs won't have 'em. But that's just my opinion, and it doesn't matter much either.

Again, when groups I join and groups I start are constantly delayed because the general attitude of the playerbase is that they need to ship buff for every quest instead of just running straight to the quest, it is not "only my problem". And as I've said before, soloing the quest and expecting everyone to catch up after they buff is not a solution since this is a multiplayer grouping focused game (or at least is supposed to be). Ship buffs are just monotonous dead time. They are bad for the game because they suck time away from questing and give nothing fun in return.

You're also making a lot of assumptions such as I ship buff before I create the LFM and then expect others not to buff, ect. This is not the case, I never ship buff unless it's a tough EE quest in which case I don't mind waiting for people to buff. Or if I'm on a toon without teleport in which case I may grab the XP buff only since it sits by the navigator on the ship anyway and will cause only a few seconds of delay getting to the quest. Or if I join a group and we are waiting for others and I have nothing else to do but wait at the entrance.

I suppose I could put "no ship buffs allowed" in my LFM or tell people not to buff, but then again who would join my groups if I sported that attitude?

As I said before, I don't expect ship buffs to ever go away. I'd be really happy with an all in one ship buff that sits by the navigator so atleast we could eliminate some of this dead time. I think that's the best solution.

I understand that some people may disagree with my opinion, but try to see both sides please.

[Arianka]

I never dreamed when I was 1st playin that such a Gimmick could exist. 30 % resistance buff is what makes Elite dungeons(mid lvl and below) so Easy for the masses...I'm not to impressed with players who use them below 10th lvl.I been using my 20%ers ,hipacriticlly,to keep up with elite runners elem dam resistance.But I would love for them to Be Gone from the Game...or lvl limits for the resistance ones ,at least.Anyone who supports stupid airship buffs ,is walkin on a crutch of inadaquecy...How fustrating when last player joins your group,everyone at the entrance,and then player chat hits"can I have a ship invite" jesus fruit friggiin christ;often it is player, like 26th lvl in max destiny ,no less;what a joke.Real fair to new players too(sarcasim meter maxed)they are thinkin there are items to find to help run elite heroic;dont be to impressed newbs ;older players run the dungeon on crutches !

ur just posting about this now???

[Talon_Moonshadow]

Can I get a Fire resist please?

Me too..

Me too

Me too.

Acid and cold for me.


Oh, yeah. I need an acid also.



Fire and Acid.


Hello! FIRE and ACID Resist!






(how quickly they forget.)

[iRexxar]

end game is pathetic atm.

[slarden]

Oh who friggin cares. With all the things broken with DDO worrying about how this break low-level play isn't even in the top 50 list of things that should be addressed.

Seriously . . . who cares?

Very much this.

Taking away ship buffs will only make it harder for new and casual players. For the hardcore players it doesn't matter.

[redoubt]

Again, when groups I join and groups I start are constantly delayed because the general attitude of the playerbase is that they need to ship buff for every quest instead of just running straight to the quest, it is not "only my problem". And as I've said before, soloing the quest and expecting everyone to catch up after they buff is not a solution since this is a multiplayer grouping focused game (or at least is supposed to be). Ship buffs are just monotonous dead time. They are bad for the game because they suck time away from questing and give nothing fun in return.

You're also making a lot of assumptions such as I ship buff before I create the LFM and then expect others not to buff, ect. This is not the case, I never ship buff unless it's a tough EE quest in which case I don't mind waiting for people to buff. Or if I'm on a toon without teleport in which case I may grab the XP buff only since it sits by the navigator on the ship anyway and will cause only a few seconds of delay getting to the quest. Or if I join a group and we are waiting for others and I have nothing else to do but wait at the entrance.

I suppose I could put "no ship buffs allowed" in my LFM or tell people not to buff, but then again who would join my groups if I sported that attitude?

As I said before, I don't expect ship buffs to ever go away. I'd be really happy with an all in one ship buff that sits by the navigator so atleast we could eliminate some of this dead time. I think that's the best solution.

I understand that some people may disagree with my opinion, but try to see both sides please.

They are only a waste of time if you 1) don't need them and 2) wait for them.

You can put up an lfm and enter the quest. No one is stopping you or slowing you down. If someone joins and misses the completion because they are buffing, why do you care? You completed quickly, right? If you don't want to wait for buffs don't. It really is that easy (assuming you are the group leader, which it looks like you are willing to do.)

[Pala-forged]

Again, I recognize that this will never change at this point, and I've accepted it.

But you're not trying to see the other person's point of view here. Because this is a multiple person game, something that affects others does affect you as well.

If player A is in a small guild with some friends and does not have access to Resist 30 shrines (or if he just prefers not to screw around on the ship getting buffed), but he joins a low level elite quest with players B, C, and D who all do have Resist 30 . . . then when player A has to be careful of fire throwing kobolds and acid spewing traps, the other 3 can just rush through them. Either Player A is slow and careful, in which case he falls behind the others and has no fun, or he tries to keep pace with the others, and dies -- in which case, no one is having fun, since A has to deal with the frustration and boredom of being dead, B has to go back and get his stone or raise him, C complains about losing the XP bonus from no deaths, and D is sick of the arguments and drops group.

(Now, again, I recognize that the ship buffs aren't actually essential. I don't use them myself, most of the time, and I do fine in groups -- but that's because I know where most of the traps are and I have plenty of funds and knowledge to buy and use Resist 20 potions when I can't cast the spell.)

It's disingenuous to say that a benefit available to some players doesn't affect the gameplay for those who don't use the benefit.

Or player A could learn to avoid traps, drink pots (regular cure serious are fine until level 20 or so) and kill casters? I don't buff until I hit level ~10, then it's mainly for the exp shrine, teleports and easy bank/mailbox/vendor.

Seriously, player A shouldn't be running with people with that mindset anyway, he won't have fun.

[Nestroy]

Some additives from the guild trench.

1.) When I lead the pug, I always ask before starting a quest, if somebody wants our ship´s buffs. Sometimes yes, somethimes no, but always a thank you. Common courtesy.
2.) When I enter a pug, I am buffed up (XP at least) and ask for common courtesy if buffs are wished / acceptable. Sometimes I get a "yes", somethimes no, always a positive reaction. Common courtesy.
3.) When I run with fellow guildies, I do not ask. These that want the buffs have them, the others do not want them and I know them so I do not have the problem with them trailing behind or running forward recklessly.
4.) I usually are self sufficient in so far I usually am able to either scroll buff or spell buff with the correct resistances if need be. Again, I usually ask before buffing, except I know they will need the buff. Never have seen negative reactions so far, but many a positive one.
5.) The need to buff up is highest on low level heroic quests. Mid level quests common damage mittigation starts kicking in (resistance items and the like) and at high level and epic content I usually do not need to either ask or buff anybody.

Epic as usual everything is different. In EE the buffs are near-to senseless and more of a burden anyway (long run times).

[BoBoDaClown]

People who argue 'don't like them, don't use them', forget this is a multi-player game (or used to be) and that we don't play in isolation.