2 Monkcher builds

[emptysands]

I'd start with 13-14 strength, it's cheap damage. Drop INT? Maybe. But easier to bump in the 3rd life.
Don't see the need for so much balance? I generally try push balance as much as possible, especially on a low STR build.
Not sure how you are with LRs but Combat Archery seems to be broken so maybe just aim for 19 dex and fix later as necessary.
Improved Martials Arts doesn't apply to ranged currently, I'm considering Great Wisdom. Might still do some melee dps - see how it goes.
With max UMD I've got no fail heal scrolls without UMD gear, I think you'll be fine too? I probably should work on the numbers. Which slot you using to switch for your +6 CHA skills?

I figure at the moment with Kyosho's Ring:
STR 28 = 12 base +3 tome +7 item +1 exceptional +2 rage +2 madstone +2 rams might -2 water stance

I'd probably go WIS+8/Subterfuge over +3STR/Prowess so it will stay an even bracket - not entirely sure though, not so much of an expert with ranged dps theorycrafting. Plus if I have the stalker ring, Subterfuge is not as much of a jump in sneak damage.

For Wisdom I figure potentially:

WIS 52 = 16 base +3 tome +5 levels +4 enhancements +7 item +2 insight +3 water stance +2 yugo +2 ship +6 shiradi

Could push that with: +1 exceptional +1 item (+8 or +3) + 2 alchemical.

Is it better to use Kyosho over Golden Guile? Never pickup Gilvaenor on this toon, so might have to start running TOD again.

[wax_on_wax_off]

15% x 2 is pretty wide crit range with IC:B.

Quarterstaffs do not proc glancing blows on cleaves at the moment:
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...9&postcount=20

Good points. I had no room for THF'ing feats on the plan Sorc build anyway so no big deal there I don't think.

I figure at the moment with Kyosho's Ring:
STR 28 = 12 base +3 tome +7 item +1 exceptional +2 rage +2 madstone +2 rams might -2 water stance

I'd probably go WIS+8/Subterfuge over +3STR/Prowess so it will stay an even bracket - not entirely sure though, not so much of an expert with ranged dps theorycrafting. Plus if I have the stalker ring, Subterfuge is not as much of a jump in sneak damage.

For Wisdom I figure potentially:

WIS 52 = 16 base +3 tome +5 levels +4 enhancements +7 item +2 insight +3 water stance +2 yugo +2 ship +6 shiradi

Could push that with: +1 exceptional +1 item (+8 or +3) + 2 alchemical.

Is it better to use Kyosho over Golden Guile? Never pickup Gilvaenor on this toon, so might have to start running TOD again.

I'd look to have the option to go max wisdom on gear: +8 item +3 insightful +1 profane +1 exceptional. It gets tight but my experience is that most of my time 10k stars is up so more wisdom is always good (+5% 10k stars DPS per wis mod).

Gilvaenors set is definitely the only choice. More ToDs for everyone! (currently I'm using Connors set).

I really should shuffle my gear to fit +1 exc wisdom ... Currently have 0 slots to put it in though as has avithoul/sun soul/drow goggles/bear cloak/minII/Connors/claw set so my 1 slot available on the eGem has GFL in it. Probably better to go back to old layout with stalker ring etc.

With subterfuge set maybe give up the stalker ring? Seeker +10 on pinion iirc, exc SA on trinket, manslayer ... Well something to think about anyway.

My UMD is: 23 ranks+5 epic+1 PL:SoS+1 PL:A+1 ship buff+4 GH+2 arti enh=37 which is 100% on heal scrolls for arti iirc. No charisma skills, no charisma item, no good luck, no persuasion, no big top ... Mind, I carry +3 cha skills DT, silver conchord cloak and epic big top but rarely use them.

[emptysands]

I'd look to have the option to go max wisdom on gear: +8 item +3 insightful +1 profane +1 exceptional. It gets tight but my experience is that most of my time 10k stars is up so more wisdom is always good (+5% 10k stars DPS per wis mod).

+5% dps per +2 WIS. That's pretty big, definitely push that instead of STR.

Gilvaenors set is definitely the only choice. More ToDs for everyone! (currently I'm using Connors set).

I really should shuffle my gear to fit +1 exc wisdom ... Currently have 0 slots to put it in though as has avithoul/sun soul/drow goggles/bear cloak/minII/Connors/claw set so my 1 slot available on the eGem has GFL in it. Probably better to go back to old layout with stalker ring etc.

Will have to drop the claw set when using Conflux anyway. Still that doesn't open up any slots.

With subterfuge set maybe give up the stalker ring? Seeker +10 on pinion iirc, exc SA on trinket, manslayer ... Well something to think about anyway.

With subterfuge you could go Tharnes instead of Drow Smoke and drop Seal of House Avithoul.

My UMD is: 23 ranks+5 epic+1 PL:SoS+1 PL:A+1 ship buff+4 GH+2 arti enh=37 which is 100% on heal scrolls for arti iirc. No charisma skills, no charisma item, no good luck, no persuasion, no big top ... Mind, I carry +3 cha skills DT, silver conchord cloak and epic big top but rarely use them.

I forget about the Arty bonus. I guess I could do this with gear switches:

23 base
02 Arty scroll bonus
05 Epic
04 GH
00 CHA 8 (base) + 3 (tome) = 11
=34
01 CHA@13 with Ship buff

[wax_on_wax_off]

I forget about the Arty bonus. I guess I could do this with gear switches:

23 base
02 Arty scroll bonus
05 Epic
04 GH
00 CHA 8 (base) + 3 (tome) = 11
=34
01 CHA@13 with Ship buff

Can get the last 5 by crafting a +6 cha/+1 cha/+2 cha triple positive or triple air kama and make a weapon set of heal scroll/kama so that it's still only 1 swap to scroll heal@0% failure (and an extra haste/raise clicky) for 2-3 LDS.

+5% DPS from 2 wis during 10k stars - aka, 50% of the time.
I really like Manslayer though and it's only available on stalker ring or drow goggles. For non-drow/humanoind content there are more nice options for layouts with pinion/subterfuge set though.

I'd probably go stalker ring/prowess conflux for humanoid content and then swap them both out for other content.

[MeliCat]

Just got passed Sireth by a lovely guildie <3

Thoughts:
How does it compare to Grave Wrappings with ITWF or GTWF?
My next cleavsorc life is shaping up to be a doozy!
How important is IC:B to it?
Is it a good enough weapon that I can skip TWF'ing line on future AA lives?
Henshin Mystic?

I'm sure I can answer most of this myself just raiding ATM so only brainstorming.

Lol. YW. You did win the roll though and eventually I'll get wraps so there was no point me looting it - curious to see what you do with it. Will you actually really use it? Curious to see what you do with it.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Lol. YW. You did win the roll though and eventually I'll get wraps so there was no point me looting it - curious to see what you do with it. Will you actually really use it? Curious to see what you do with it.

Hmm, I sense chastisement. Adel's on life 6 and I really want to finish her completionist journey with some time spent at cap on each build to try it out, on almost all of her future builds she won't have TWF'ing feats so this becomes an excellent weapon.

That said, I can't deny that rolling on the weapon wasn't in part due to general frustration with the raid and feeling like i need something to show for my time in there. I did trust that you'd make a decision about whether to loot it or not that you would be happy with.

[Relenthe]

For Wisdom I figure potentially:

WIS 52 = 16 base +3 tome +5 levels +4 enhancements +7 item +2 insight +3 water stance +2 yugo +2 ship +6 shiradi

This is nice, but for me personally on Shiradi I like: 1st tier of healing spring and the upgrade (just the prerequisites for ap spent), +2 wisdom, prism to double rainbow, nerve venom, the dr cold iron line, stand and deliver, and tea with the queen.

This means in order to get more wisdom you would have to drop dr 7/ cold iron for 3 ap, tea with the queen for up to 5, and nerve venom (7% proc of paralyzed and helpless) for the 8ap needed for last 4 wisdom. Depends on what you like more.

My UMD is: 23 ranks+5 epic+1 PL:SoS+1 PL:A+1 ship buff+4 GH+2 arti enh=37 which is 100% on heal scrolls for arti iirc. Unfortunately the +2 umd artis are supposed to get with scrolls is currently bugged, and you need 39 umd w/o it for 100% heal scrolls.

Unfortunately the +2 umd artis are supposed to get with scrolls is currently bugged, and you need 39 umd w/o it for 100% heal scrolls.

Can get the last 5 by crafting a +6 cha/+1 cha/+2 cha triple positive or triple air kama and make a weapon set of heal scroll/kama so that it's still only 1 swap to scroll heal@0% failure (and an extra haste/raise clicky) for 2-3 LDS.

Although this is an interesting option, but does it hit you with umd lag?

[Relenthe]

With subterfuge you could go Tharnes instead of Drow Smoke and drop Seal of House Avithoul.

After getting that ring I could never get rid of it again. the one thing that makes it awesome is improved deception. It usually procs within 5 seconds of attacking a mob, and then the rest of the time I am attacking it I get full sneak attack.

[MeliCat]

Hmm, I sense chastisement. Adel's on life 6 and I really want to finish her completionist journey with some time spent at cap on each build to try it out, on almost all of her future builds she won't have TWF'ing feats so this becomes an excellent weapon.

No, not at all. More curiosity. And you're definitely going to use it so all is good.

[wax_on_wax_off]

This means in order to get more wisdom you would have to drop dr 7/ cold iron for 3 ap, tea with the queen for up to 5, and nerve venom (7% proc of paralyzed and helpless) for the 8ap needed for last 4 wisdom. Depends on what you like more.

Unfortunately the +2 umd artis are supposed to get with scrolls is currently bugged, and you need 39 umd w/o it for 100% heal scrolls.

Although this is an interesting option, but does it hit you with umd lag?

My shiradi layout is:
Healing Spring III (3), Illusion of Wellbeing I (1), Wisdom III (6), Double Rainbow (6), Otto's Whistler I (1), Nerve Toxin III (3), Stand and Deliver (2), Tea with the Queen (2) = 24. Works for me, 10 minutes of Healing Spring is enough for most things and it's too expensive to respec constantly now.

The display for the +2 UMD is broken but afaik it is working correctly. The issue, iirc, is that the display counts the +2 with scrolls twice so it will say 100% when you're actually 90%.

Just an option that I provided, I've used an (epic) flameward in a similar fashion before and not had an issue, don't see why this would be any different.

[FengXian]

Hello,
I'd like to get some advice on this version of rogue AA (no longer monkcher but still related to this thread since based off your monkcher acrobat).
I dropped 10k stars for 2 more feats and some more reliable melee in order to be able to use Sireth.

It's pretty late here so please keep in mind it could be complete BS (i.e. I'm starting with 13 wis just for 95% heal scrolls from cleric dilly since I don't want to have to swap gear for 39+ UMD).

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.14.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Half-Elf Male
(2 Monk \ 12 Rogue \ 6 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 258
Spell Points: 240 
BAB: 16\16\21\26\26
Fortitude: 15
Reflex: 23
Will: 12

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             17                    24
Dexterity            16                    24
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         10                    13
Wisdom               13                    16
Charisma              8                    11

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    25
Bluff                 3                    23
Concentration         2                     3
Diplomacy             3                     4
Disable Device        4                    24
Haggle               -1                     0
Heal                  1                     5
Hide                  3                     7
Intimidate           -1                     0
Jump                  6                    19
Listen                1                     3
Move Silently         3                     7
Open Lock             n/a                  26
Perform              n/a                    n/a
Repair                0                     1
Search                4                    24
Spot                  5                    26
Swim                  3                     7
Tumble                4                    14
Use Magic Device      3                    23

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Cleric
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Sorcerer
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Soldier of the Faith


Level 4 (Ranger)


Level 5 (Ranger)


Level 6 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Elf
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Arcane Prodigy


Level 7 (Ranger)


Level 8 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 10 (Rogue)


Level 11 (Rogue)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)


Level 14 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Precision


Level 15 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 16 (Rogue)


Level 17 (Rogue)


Level 18 (Rogue)


Level 19 (Rogue)


Level 20 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante I
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante II
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante III
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat I
Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Improved Balance I
Enhancement: Improved Balance II
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I
Enhancement: Improved Tumble II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery II

With the 2 extra feats (6 ranger-2 monk vs 6 monk-2ranger and dropping zen archery) I took PLally and IC:blunt. I was able to drop concentracion and just maxed trap skills (spot too) and UMD, could replace OL with anything else.

Epic feats are still ESA and CA.

I thought trading 10k stars for Sireth could be worth it, especially since 10k stars does require some melee ability anyway to refill your ki bar (even with 12 monk in my experience, I guess even more so with just 6 monk).

I'm looking forward to try some other unusual yet good AA build so please comment/suggest/criticize

[wax_on_wax_off]

Hello,
I'd like to get some advice on this version of rogue AA (no longer monkcher but still related to this thread since based off your monkcher acrobat).
I dropped 10k stars for 2 more feats and some more reliable melee in order to be able to use Sireth.

It's pretty late here so please keep in mind it could be complete BS (i.e. I'm starting with 13 wis just for 95% heal scrolls from cleric dilly since I don't want to have to swap gear for 39+ UMD).

Character Plan by DDO Character Planner Version 03.14.02
DDO Character Planner Home Page

Level 20 Lawful Good Half-Elf Male
(2 Monk \ 12 Rogue \ 6 Ranger) 
Hit Points: 258
Spell Points: 240 
BAB: 16\16\21\26\26
Fortitude: 15
Reflex: 23
Will: 12

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
Abilities        Base Stats          Modified Stats
(36 Point)       (Level 1)             (Level 20)
Strength             17                    24
Dexterity            16                    24
Constitution         14                    16
Intelligence         10                    13
Wisdom               13                    16
Charisma              8                    11

Tomes Used
+1 Tome of Strength used at level 3
+1 Tome of Dexterity used at level 3
+1 Tome of Constitution used at level 3
+1 Tome of Intelligence used at level 3
+1 Tome of Wisdom used at level 3
+1 Tome of Charisma used at level 3
+2 Tome of Strength used at level 7
+2 Tome of Dexterity used at level 7
+2 Tome of Constitution used at level 7
+2 Tome of Intelligence used at level 7
+2 Tome of Wisdom used at level 7
+2 Tome of Charisma used at level 7
+3 Tome of Strength used at level 11
+3 Tome of Dexterity used at level 11
+3 Tome of Intelligence used at level 11
+3 Tome of Wisdom used at level 11
+3 Tome of Charisma used at level 11

                  Starting          Feat/Enhancement
                 Base Skills         Modified Skills
Skills           (Level 1)            (Level 20)
Balance               7                    25
Bluff                 3                    23
Concentration         2                     3
Diplomacy             3                     4
Disable Device        4                    24
Haggle               -1                     0
Heal                  1                     5
Hide                  3                     7
Intimidate           -1                     0
Jump                  6                    19
Listen                1                     3
Move Silently         3                     7
Open Lock             n/a                  26
Perform              n/a                    n/a
Repair                0                     1
Search                4                    24
Spot                  5                    26
Swim                  3                     7
Tumble                4                    14
Use Magic Device      3                    23

Level 1 (Rogue)
Feat: (Half-Elf Dilettante) Half-Elf Dilettante: Cleric
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Monk
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Paladin
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Ranger
Feat: (Past Life) Past Life: Sorcerer
Feat: (Selected) Point Blank Shot


Level 2 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Evil Outsider


Level 3 (Ranger)
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Soldier of the Faith


Level 4 (Ranger)


Level 5 (Ranger)


Level 6 (Ranger)
Feat: (Favored Enemy) Favored Enemy: Elf
Feat: (Selected) Past Life: Arcane Prodigy


Level 7 (Ranger)


Level 8 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Toughness


Level 9 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Weapon Focus: Ranged Weapons


Level 10 (Rogue)


Level 11 (Rogue)


Level 12 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Critical: Ranged Weapons


Level 13 (Rogue)


Level 14 (Monk)
Feat: (Monk Bonus) Precision


Level 15 (Rogue)
Feat: (Selected) Improved Precise Shot


Level 16 (Rogue)


Level 17 (Rogue)


Level 18 (Rogue)


Level 19 (Rogue)


Level 20 (Rogue)
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Damage Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Extra Action Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost I
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost II
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost III
Enhancement: Rogue Haste Boost IV
Enhancement: Ranger Sprint Boost I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Acid Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Explosive Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Force Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Slaying Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Imbue Terror Arrows
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante I
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante II
Enhancement: Improved Cleric Dilettante III
Enhancement: Human Adaptability Strength I
Enhancement: Human Improved Recovery I
Enhancement: Human Versatility I
Enhancement: Human Versatility II
Enhancement: Human Versatility III
Enhancement: Human Versatility IV
Enhancement: Racial Toughness I
Enhancement: Racial Toughness II
Enhancement: Ranger Favored Damage I
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +2 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +3 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +4 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer: Conjure +5 Arrows
Enhancement: Elven Arcane Archer I
Enhancement: Rogue Faster Sneaking I
Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat I
Enhancement: Rogue Thief-Acrobat II
Enhancement: Rogue Sneak Attack Training I
Enhancement: Improved Balance I
Enhancement: Improved Balance II
Enhancement: Improved Tumble I
Enhancement: Improved Tumble II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity I
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity II
Enhancement: Rogue Dexterity III
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery I
Enhancement: Rogue Wand and Scroll Mastery II

With the 2 extra feats (6 ranger-2 monk vs 6 monk-2ranger and dropping zen archery) I took PLally and IC:blunt. I was able to drop concentracion and just maxed trap skills (spot too) and UMD, could replace OL with anything else.

Epic feats are still ESA and CA.

I thought trading 10k stars for Sireth could be worth it, especially since 10k stars does require some melee ability anyway to refill your ki bar (even with 12 monk in my experience, I guess even more so with just 6 monk).

I'm looking forward to try some other unusual yet good AA build so please comment/suggest/criticize

If dropping 10k stars I'd be looking for 13 rogue to fit IE and Opportunist.
With just +1 passive Ki gen on my archer from Enlightenment twist I only melee once every 10 minutes.

Overall, no, I don't think even having sireth is enough of a reason to drop 10k. If I was do rogue again I'd use the Combat Archery feat slot for IC:B for Sireth as CA is still broken afaik and leave it as is otherwise. 10k costs IE as. Red to go 6 monk/2 ranger or fighter to fit it in but that trade is worthwhile at least.

[sephiroth1084]

My shiradi layout is:
Healing Spring III (3), Illusion of Wellbeing I (1), Wisdom III (6), Double Rainbow (6), Otto's Whistler I (1), Nerve Toxin III (3), Stand and Deliver (2), Tea with the Queen (2) = 24. Works for me, 10 minutes of Healing Spring is enough for most things and it's too expensive to respec constantly now.

The display for the +2 UMD is broken but afaik it is working correctly. The issue, iirc, is that the display counts the +2 with scrolls twice so it will say 100% when you're actually 90%.

Just an option that I provided, I've used an (epic) flameward in a similar fashion before and not had an issue, don't see why this would be any different.

Do you like Tea with the Queen enough to spend the 2 points on it instead of somewhere else?

Personally, I'd want the highest rank of Whistler, for the reduction on the cooldown, and would want Stay Good at rank III as an option for when I need to break DR--not positive, but I'd imagine that Pinion (if you, or I could ever get the ****ing thing) with Stay Good and metal arrows is probably better than any DR-breaking bow w/ Double Rainbow running, but I could be wrong.

[wax_on_wax_off]

Do you like Tea with the Queen enough to spend the 2 points on it instead of somewhere else?

Personally, I'd want the highest rank of Whistler, for the reduction on the cooldown, and would want Stay Good at rank III as an option for when I need to break DR--not positive, but I'd imagine that Pinion (if you, or I could ever get the ****ing thing) with Stay Good and metal arrows is probably better than any DR-breaking bow w/ Double Rainbow running, but I could be wrong.

I do like Tea yes, it's saved a few bad situations and is exciting besides. I have 55 or so diplomacy, maybe more so generally get good stuff (+10 stats, +300 HP or +100 PRR are the most common).

I find Otto's Whistler pretty situational, it's great for when the mobs are coming at the party to take a few out for a bit but once they close it gets pretty marginal. Once this happens I generally save it for those Oh ****! moments when someones almost dead and running for their life.

If I got a pinion I'd consider stay good, hasn't happened yet. Pretty hard to quantify the damage contribution of Double Rainbow. For the most part I think that the fights that really matter - EE stuff - double rainbow is very strong as there's less broad resistances (compared to old devil content) or DR (how many challenging quests actually have 2 type DR these days?). The exception to this is EE LoB but easy to use holy arrows and have someone cast adamantine weapons on you (or in my case self cast it) and lob has light resistance anyway though wouldn't use double rainbow probably as the dots are too dangerous for aggro management. Seeing as how you've made me think about it ... I'd say no, I wouldn't go Stay Good (my opinion might change though, see when we get there).

[FengXian]

If dropping 10k stars I'd be looking for 13 rogue to fit IE and Opportunist.
With just +1 passive Ki gen on my archer from Enlightenment twist I only melee once every 10 minutes.

Overall, no, I don't think even having sireth is enough of a reason to drop 10k. If I was do rogue again I'd use the Combat Archery feat slot for IC:B for Sireth as CA is still broken afaik and leave it as is otherwise. 10k costs IE as. Red to go 6 monk/2 ranger or fighter to fit it in but that trade is worthwhile at least.

Thanks,
yep I can see Sireth's IC:blunt can be fit in atm somehow (even with the h-elf variation you suggested), but my main concern was the lowish str and thus kinda low melee to-hit (and, well, some less damage but that can be lived with I guess).
If aiming to use Sireth or another q-staff (or even hws) the benefits of ram's and paladin PL (+ the higher base str) get more important prolly. You're right I should go for 13 rogue, can be still done just by dropping CA and splashing only 1 level of monk/fighter.

I know how good 10k stars is but as I said I wanted to try an alternative for now, as long as it's still viable. But if the str/melee to-hit issues aren't as important as I thought, I'd gladly fit in 6 monk too (although it's painful not having room for stunning fist on a high wis build )

[wax_on_wax_off]

Thanks,
yep I can see Sireth's IC:blunt can be fit in atm somehow (even with the h-elf variation you suggested), but my main concern was the lowish str and thus kinda low melee to-hit (and, well, some less damage but that can be lived with I guess).
If aiming to use Sireth or another q-staff (or even hws) the benefits of ram's and paladin PL (+ the higher base str) get more important prolly. You're right I should go for 13 rogue, can be still done just by dropping CA and splashing only 1 level of monk/fighter.

I know how good 10k stars is but as I said I wanted to try an alternative for now, as long as it's still viable. But if the str/melee to-hit issues aren't as important as I thought, I'd gladly fit in 6 monk too (although it's painful not having room for stunning fist on a high wis build )

+5 attack and +5% to hit with precision compared to power attack should fix most AB issues even with 13-14 base strength.

I don't think an acrobat/archer build without 10k stars is viable as pure purpose built acrobats only just scrape into acceptance when built purely to their intended purpose, when you split it like you're suggesting the outcome won't be good I think as most of your investment is towards archery which you'll mainly use while manyshot is up.

[FengXian]

+5 attack and +5% to hit with precision compared to power attack should fix most AB issues even with 13-14 base strength.

I don't think an acrobat/archer build without 10k stars is viable as pure purpose built acrobats only just scrape into acceptance when built purely to their intended purpose, when you split it like you're suggesting the outcome won't be good I think as most of your investment is towards archery which you'll mainly use while manyshot is up.

Yeah, I can see that. Actually my main purpose would have been an acrobat with just a splash of AA (since they both rely on dex it looked like viable option) but it went a little sideways I guess.

I'll see if I can come up with a more acrobat-oriented version later, maybe even dropping IPS, for example a 12 rogue 6 barb 2 fighter/ranger or something (with great cleave if it's a reliable source of AoE damage, I still have to catch up with a lot of new stuff^^).

Thanks again for the advice.

[sephiroth1084]

I do like Tea yes, it's saved a few bad situations and is exciting besides. I have 55 or so diplomacy, maybe more so generally get good stuff (+10 stats, +300 HP or +100 PRR are the most common).

I find Otto's Whistler pretty situational, it's great for when the mobs are coming at the party to take a few out for a bit but once they close it gets pretty marginal. Once this happens I generally save it for those Oh ****! moments when someones almost dead and running for their life.

If I got a pinion I'd consider stay good, hasn't happened yet. Pretty hard to quantify the damage contribution of Double Rainbow. For the most part I think that the fights that really matter - EE stuff - double rainbow is very strong as there's less broad resistances (compared to old devil content) or DR (how many challenging quests actually have 2 type DR these days?). The exception to this is EE LoB but easy to use holy arrows and have someone cast adamantine weapons on you (or in my case self cast it) and lob has light resistance anyway though wouldn't use double rainbow probably as the dots are too dangerous for aggro management. Seeing as how you've made me think about it ... I'd say no, I wouldn't go Stay Good (my opinion might change though, see when we get there).

I don't mean as a replacement for Double Rainbow all the time, but as an option to swap to when you either need to break DR, or when Double Rainbow isn't an ideal choice.

Also, where are you getting so many Holy arrows? Cannith crafting them?

[wax_on_wax_off]

I don't mean as a replacement for Double Rainbow all the time, but as an option to swap to when you either need to break DR, or when Double Rainbow isn't an ideal choice.

Also, where are you getting so many Holy arrows? Cannith crafting them?

Taking stay good means less wisdom, as per the arguments above I don't think it's worth it.
Yep, 1 greater good and 4 lesser good iirc for 100 +1 holy arrows, I try to carry 2000 and also 1500 Flametouched iron arrows out of chronoscope raid to cover most DR issues but currently I'm using cold iron ewe alchemical longbow slotted with aligned planes so all I really need is the silver flame undead band arrows for abbot or devil quests.

[pappo]

Feats (by level): Dilettante: Ranger (1)

Enhancements (Half-Elf): Arcane Archer I (4), Conjure +5 Arrows (4), Slayer Arrows (5), Racial Toughness II (3), Improved Rogue Dilettante II (6),

I understand why you took Dilettante: Ranger as a feat for the bow skills, but why ( and is it possible) to take Rogue Dilettante in your enhancements ?