dev's please answer

**kengsxr** · 12-14-2007, 02:02 PM

I would really like to know the reasoning behind the new death/item damage penalty system. Please no speculation, there has been plenty of that, I would like a reasonable explination of the thinking/reasoning behind the new system.

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:04 PM

Agreed. My questions got lost in the big thread but the bottom line is - Why are we doing any of this? What is wrong with the current xp death system? Sure it is meaningless when capped but we won't be capped forever. Heck give me 5k death xp at level 15. I'd rather have that than item decay worse than it currently is.

**Razvan** · 12-14-2007, 02:06 PM

death should matter...

when the penalty is loosing xp that you get at the end of the quest that means there is no penalty, right?

So they want to make death more significant! Not just a transition from alive do dead to alive again with nothing to show for!

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by Razvan

death should matter...

when the penalty is loosing xp that you get at the end of the quest that means there is no penalty, right?

So they want to make death more significant! Not just a transition from alive do dead to alive again with nothing to show for!

Seriously? You believe this?

Lets say you are level 15 and 200,000 short of 16. The quest is worth 20k. You die once and get hit for 5k debt and a net gain on completion of 15k. 20k > 15k

I agree that when capped it is meaningless but otherwise it isn't.

**kengsxr** · 12-14-2007, 02:17 PM

please, no speculation, lets stay on point and see if we can get an anwser from the DEV team.
thanks

**Laith** · 12-14-2007, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

Sure it is meaningless when capped but we won't be capped forever.

Death shouldn't have waves of "meaning-alot" and "meaning-less". It should be a similar concern no matter what your XP bar reads.

XP penalties alone aren't sufficient.

**Razvan** · 12-14-2007, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

Seriously? You believe this?

Lets say you are level 15 and 200,000 short of 16. The quest is worth 20k. You die once and get hit for 5k debt and a net gain on completion of 15k. 20k > 15k

I agree that when capped it is meaningless but otherwise it isn't.

XP only matters, in any game btw, if you have a timeline to reach X level. Otherwise, it doesn't matter since there will always be an upper limit to your total XP. Thus, even if I lose all my xp it still doesn't matter. I am going to reach the same cap as you only a bit later!

**Laith** · 12-14-2007, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by kengsxr

please, no speculation, lets stay on point and see if we can get an anwser from the DEV team.
thanks

**ArkoHighStar** · 12-14-2007, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by kengsxr

please, no speculation, lets stay on point and see if we can get an anwser from the DEV team.
thanks

look at the thread or use dev tracker they have made several comments on theor belief that as we went higher level it was no longer workable. Eladrin stated this about 3 weeks ago, when he first mentioned they were looking at it

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:20 PM

Raz,

Yeah thats fine. That's not what you said though. Thanks for the "clarification".

**ArkoHighStar** · 12-14-2007, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by kengsxr

please, no speculation, lets stay on point and see if we can get an anwser from the DEV team.
thanks

ok read this
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...&postcount=454

edited for Oreg

**GHOSTRYDER** · 12-14-2007, 02:22 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

Seriously? You believe this?

Lets say you are level 15 and 200,000 short of 16. The quest is worth 20k. You die once and get hit for 5k debt and a net gain on completion of 15k. 20k > 15k

I agree that when capped it is meaningless but otherwise it isn't.

Powergamers will be capped within week of the mod. This means after that they will have no reason NOT to die until the next cap increase, the new proposal makes for a good reason to try to avoid death whether capped or not...probably the way it should be, death should always come at some cost, not just when leveling, which a decent percentage of the population spends VERY little time doing

On the other hand, the xp penalty is much more severe for NON power players who only get to play a few times a week, and take a longer months and months to level their characters. The new system won't impede their progress so much, and frustrate them by rewarding them with very little or no xp for a quest gone bad.

**ArkoHighStar** · 12-14-2007, 02:24 PM

oh wait how about the first sentence of the anouncement

Major systems changes in Module Six: The Thirteenth Eclipse include alterations to the repair system and the effects caused by death. We’ve received overwhelming feedback related to these issues over the past two years which identify them as the systems most closely tied to negative play experiences, and we’d like to take this time to address these issues.

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by ArkoHighStar

ok read this
http://forums.ddo.com/showpost.php?p...&postcount=454

You slipped in between me so i had to edit. Wasn't referring to your post.

**GHOSTRYDER** · 12-14-2007, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by kengsxr

please, no speculation, lets stay on point and see if we can get an anwser from the DEV team.
thanks

soooooooo.... you ONLY wanted your original post and a reply from the devs? good luck with that, as for speculation, it's all WE have, if you want any replies youre going to get speculation

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:26 PM

see below

**Oreg** · 12-14-2007, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by GHOSTRYDER

Powergamers will be capped within week of the mod. This means after that they will have no reason NOT to die until the next cap increase, the new proposal makes for a good reason to try to avoid death whether capped or not...probably the way it should be, death should always come at some cost, not just when leveling, which a decent percentage of the population spends VERY little time doing

On the other hand, the xp penalty is much more severe for NON power players who only get to play a few times a week, and take a longer months and months to level their characters. The new system won't impede their progress so much, and frustrate them by rewarding them with very little or no xp for a quest gone bad.

I couldn't agree more. I also believe that this will push another group of people out of the game. There may be many people who believe that this is the right thing to do. There will be those who don't like it and will leave. It will not attract people to this game. Net: loss of community. Bad!

**GHOSTRYDER** · 12-14-2007, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

I agree with this. I also think that you will never find a balanced death penalty for power players and non power players.

i agree with this as well, but a system such as what they are implementing is probably about as close as youre ever going to get.

**GHOSTRYDER** · 12-14-2007, 02:35 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

I couldn't agree more. I also believe that this will push another group of people out of the game. There may be many people who believe that this is the right thing to do. There will be those who don't like it and will leave. It will not attract people to this game. Net: loss of community. Bad!

well i dont see why a game's death penalty would ever attract people to the game, and i dont see why this one would force people to leave, why would temporary item wear and a short duration de-buff be that big of a deal? especially when they already stated that they are decreasing the chance of temporary item wear becoming permanent damage by 50%, so the amount of total permanent item damage will probably be unchanged. If youre saying it will **** power gamers off, most of them are probably wearing bound raid loot in half their gear slots, which will have 0% chance of taking perm damage.

Also while it's not permadeath, at least this gives new meaning to "staying alive", might be more fun, challenging, and exciting to actually have to worry about it just a LITTLE bit.

**Razvan** · 12-14-2007, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by Oreg

I agree that when capped it is meaningless but otherwise it isn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GHOSTRYDER

Powergamers will be capped within week of the mod. This means after that they will have no reason NOT to die until the next cap increase, the new proposal makes for a good reason to try to avoid death whether capped or not...probably the way it should be, death should always come at some cost, not just when leveling, which a decent percentage of the population spends VERY little time doing

On the other hand, the xp penalty is much more severe for NON power players who only get to play a few times a week, and take a longer months and months to level their characters. The new system won't impede their progress so much, and frustrate them by rewarding them with very little or no xp for a quest gone bad.

I couldn't agree more. I also believe that this will push another group of people out of the game. There may be many people who believe that this is the right thing to do. There will be those who don't like it and will leave. It will not attract people to this game. Net: loss of community. Bad!

Make up your mind: are you on the "xp loss is not enough!" or on the "death penalty shouldn't be change" train?? Because I think you just agreed there with someone from the "other side"! I think Ghostryder was saying that the new system will level the playing filed and not frustrate those trying to level, while giving the capped chars something to think about when they die...

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