Cetus: Supreme Bladeforged Fighter Reborn

[djl]

AFAICT, none of the Twists are essential; they just boost DPS further. Whether "slightly lower DPS" makes one "gimp" is obviously a matter of opinion...

However, since you're just back to DDO, you might not want to leap onto a fairly advanced build which requires an LR +1 right off the bat.

Thanks

My current build (back when 28 was the cap) was a 18 fighter/2 monk human, and I have a whole lot of points left over from back then. But, I will hold off on making the leap until I relearn the game mechanics.

[Cetus]

Great to see some aggressive melee action again!

Regarding the PRR, I often fine it useful (for myself) to think of it in terms of effective hit points. How much damage can I take before I die? For example, your 1500 / 150 PRR toon can take: 1500/0.4=3750 hit points of damage before dying. My barb with 2000 / 150 PRR is up to 2000/0.4=5000. A typical fighter with ~1600-1800 (let's say 1700) and +200 PRR has: 1700/0.33=5151 effective hit points. In other words, it can soak 133% of the damage you can take.

That aside, I realize that you putting a lot of emphasis on dire charge to stay alive in LE. How are you currently dealing with stuff like p2 bosses in shroud and such?


pS- I realize you got 1900 in your vid, my bad.

Sure, you can view PRR as effective hitpoints if you find it informs your decisions, there's nothing wrong with that. But when comparing jumps in PRR, I find much more utility in using the percentage difference to justify the return for the investment within a given PRR range. It is not misleading, as Axeyu repeatedly blindly claimed.

P2 shroud bosses typically go well. The orthon is a tough one to navigate flawlessly as I typically play aggressively. The devil sometimes has his way too.

[Axeyu]

Sure, you can view PRR as effective hitpoints if you find it informs your decisions, there's nothing wrong with that. But when comparing jumps in PRR, I find much more utility in using the percentage difference to justify the return for the investment within a given PRR range. It is not misleading, as Axeyu repeatedly blindly claimed.

It is misleading. You are misusing percentages. A percentage describes a ratio, not a difference.
If I say that Joe has 10% more apples than Shmoe what's implied is that Apples_Joe=1,1*Apples_Shmoe. Not that Apples_Joe=Apples_Shmoe+0.1*Apples_Tree
Come on, it's not that complicated.

[Sargentheals]

I have been waiting for you to update your build following the fighter rework although would your old split not be stronger? With power surge also increasing charisma i feel like the paladin levels for divine might would still be worth it even though you wouldnt be getting the full bonus to saves it would still be a slight saves increase as well as a lot more damage.

[adrian69]

I have been waiting for you to update your build following the fighter rework although would your old split not be stronger? With power surge also increasing charisma i feel like the paladin levels for divine might would still be worth it even though you wouldnt be getting the full bonus to saves it would still be a slight saves increase as well as a lot more Udamage.

Unless he was hitting about +20 or more strength from DM by cap, the +20 Melee Power and +1 Crit multiplier clicky will probably be more DPS. Pally saves would be capped at +8, though that would be +8 more than you could acquire through gear, saves are a lot easier to attain these days versus 2 years ago. I actually started off as a 12 ftr/6 ranger/2 pally and I didn't like compared to the pure that I ran. For whatever reason, pure was more dps, though less versatile. I've been trying to put together a 12/6 ranger/2 monk, but in Lamm it's defenses where blah at cap compared to what I am used too. Just not used to the centered thing, and I really need to start at level 1 and not 30. I didn't have long enough to test 12/6 monk/2 ranger before Lamm went down. My pure still had 10 second on Kobold vs the 6 ranger version, but I didn't have gear set up right either, though my damage mod was mostly maxed out.


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Axeyu,

Since I am not adding another post on PRR issue. I have pretty good idea of how it works. You're right, it's not difficult, but you're way over complicating it. It reflects a percentage (%) of damage mitigated, not a ratio (x:x). Ratios and percentages are different in their presentation of a subject. Percentages is how it is expressed the last time I looked.

http://ddowiki.com/page/Physical_Resistance_Rating

[Cetus]

It is misleading. You are misusing percentages. A percentage describes a ratio, not a difference.
If I say that Joe has 10% more apples than Shmoe what's implied is that Apples_Joe=1,1*Apples_Shmoe. Not that Apples_Joe=Apples_Shmoe+0.1*Apples_Tree
Come on, it's not that complicated.

It's not, that's why I'm pretty much done responding to you on this topic.

230 PRR offers you 10% (it's more like 11, but whatever) more damage mitigation off incoming attacks than 143 PRR does. This is a mathematical fact:

100(1/243 - 1/330) = 10.9%

If you don't like it, then we'll just have to disagree. I'm not adding anymore as this conversation is overpowering the rest of the discussion.

[Ellihor]

If I were to build a melee these days PRR and HP would be as important as DPS becuase at least in my own personal view, a melee should be with aggro of at least one of the part 2 and part 5 in Shroud, and possibly rakshasa too.

[Axeyu]

It's not, that's why I'm pretty much done responding to you on this topic.

230 PRR offers you 10% (it's more like 11, but whatever) more damage mitigation off incoming attacks than 143 PRR does. This is a mathematical fact:

100(1/243 - 1/330) = 10.9%

If you don't like it, then we'll just have to disagree. I'm not adding anymore as this conversation is overpowering the rest of the discussion.

It amazes me to see how challenging it is for you to understand the difference between percentage and percentage points.
If 230PRR offers 11% more mitigation off incoming attacks than 143 PRR that means that mitigation_230PRR=1.11*mitigation_143PRR. That is how percentages works. If you phrase it like that but mean something different then you are being misleading.

Lets check if it's true:
Mitigation_230PRR: 1-(100/(100+230))=0.70
Mitigation_143PRR:1-(100/(100+143))=0.59

0.59*1.1=0.65=/=0.7 thus 230PRR does not offer 11% more mitigation than 143, it offers 0.7/0.59=19% more mitigation.
You are getting the 11% from the difference 0.70-0.59=0.11 and not the ratio. That difference means that it offers 11 percentage points more mitigation, not 11 percent more mitigation.

[Cetus]

Unless he was hitting about +20 or more strength from DM by cap, the +20 Melee Power and +1 Crit multiplier clicky will probably be more DPS. Pally saves would be capped at +8, though that would be +8 more than you could acquire through gear, saves are a lot easier to attain these days versus 2 years ago. I actually started off as a 12 ftr/6 ranger/2 pally and I didn't like compared to the pure that I ran. For whatever reason, pure was more dps, though less versatile. I've been trying to put together a 12/6 ranger/2 monk, but in Lamm it's defenses where blah at cap compared to what I am used too. Just not used to the centered thing, and I really need to start at level 1 and not 30. I didn't have long enough to test 12/6 monk/2 ranger before Lamm went down. My pure still had 10 second on Kobold vs the 6 ranger version, but I didn't have gear set up right either, though my damage mod was mostly maxed out.

Its interesting you mention this, I was originally going to roll 12 ifghter / 6 monk / 2 paladin again, but as far as defenses went, I wanted more saves than just +8, as there's no real DPS difference between that build and a 12 fighter / 6 pally / 2 monk - so I rolled that instead.

It did horribly compared to 18/2 on the DPS test kobolds. It seems that the 20 melee power, extra feats, and one cut is more significant of a DPS boost than I was getting from the extra pally levels. I think I did like 4-5 beatdowns and saw how much longer it was taking.

[Stoner81]

Great to see a new build from you Cetus thanks for posting it! I could only spot a Epic RoSS in your gear in the video so you could also farm up a Mysterious Bauble from Weapon Shipment for another spell point clicky.

Stoner81.

[Phil7]

The new Executioner's Helmet is sick and the new Ring of Power too! (except from Persuasion ***???)

Too tired right now to compare raid armor vs. Executioner's armor, I'm leaving that to you guys

Let us know of your gear changes Cetus

[Cetus]

The new Executioner's Helmet is sick and the new Ring of Power too! (except from Persuasion ***???)

Too tired right now to compare raid armor vs. Executioner's armor, I'm leaving that to you guys

Let us know of your gear changes Cetus

Will do! I'm holding off until I get a good feel for this new update.

[adrian69]

The new Executioner's Helmet is sick and the new Ring of Power too! (except from Persuasion ***???)

Too tired right now to compare raid armor vs. Executioner's armor, I'm leaving that to you guys

Let us know of your gear changes Cetus

Still Favoring Celestials. Other than the 5% damage proc, not sure atm what they'll be good for. Someone fill me if I missing anything about them.

[the_one_dwarfforged]

gearing seems like its going to be hairy with the addition of the new stuff...just so much that is a must have...

thinking:

executioners helm
warriors focus
ring of power
ring of prowess
knife boots
animated rope

are the must haves, meaning youve got trinket/chest to choose for profane bonus and goggles, cloak, bracers, gloves wide open. if you assume 2 slots for lgs hp bonus the only two big stats i see that are missing are doublestrike and fortification, which if you keep the avenger docent knocks both of those out, then spending the last 1-2 item slots on u32 crafted items you can get the 3 piece slavers set bonus (assuming the named helm/ring count, they do if i understood correctly) and finishing off any stats youre missing/need from there.

[maddong]

What MP, doublestrike, and damage mod do you end up running with?

[levy1964]

if u go TWF in 18/2 no pally, twist Fanaticism, is micro buff and ani-cancel, so after used ur swing animation start from start

[adrian69]

if u go TWF in 18/2 no pally, twist Fanaticism, is micro buff and ani-cancel, so after used ur swing animation start from start

What? So any 18 fighter/2 x, without pally, twist Fanaticism, and you keep the 1d6 lawful or chaotic damage is what you're saying?

[Cetus]

So I'm not ready to write up the U32 improvements yet, but here's a bit of a taste so far =D



I'm glad I caught that lol

[division]

What greataxe are you using here? It seems to be a fire one?

[SeveredSteel]

What? So any 18 fighter/2 x, without pally, twist Fanaticism, and you keep the 1d6 lawful or chaotic damage is what you're saying?

I think he is saying that Smite Evil for TWF breaks animation delays. Not sure, but that is what I got from it.