Hassan's Assassin

[Saekee]

I think we will need to consider lootgen now as part of the gear set. I saw min level 25 gloves of murdering (or something like that) on the Cannith ASAH with +5 assassinate and +2 insightful assassinate. Lootgen stats will outdo the old raid stuff also.

I think we should just keep named stuff with unique attributes and not for specific stat boosters. Hard to plan around, but that makes things less static.

With a big boost to assassinate it might make the legendary feat different than astral.

[CThruTheEgo]

I think we will need to consider lootgen now as part of the gear set. I saw min level 25 gloves of murdering (or something like that) on the Cannith ASAH with +5 assassinate and +2 insightful assassinate. Lootgen stats will outdo the old raid stuff also.

I think we should just keep named stuff with unique attributes and not for specific stat boosters. Hard to plan around, but that makes things less static.

With a big boost to assassinate it might make the legendary feat different than astral.

I am really curious how lootgen will affect endgame gear sets. I haven't even logged into the game yet so I have no idea what new lootgen actually looks like, but it certainly sounds rather overpowered.

[TitoFireknife]

what you think about Legendary Greensteel? Some Badass Ideas?

[CThruTheEgo]

what you think about Legendary Greensteel? Some Badass Ideas?

I've not looked it over yet tbh. Haven't had much time to focus on the game the last few days.

I did notice the Leathers of the Celestial Avenger, the new raid light armor, has a max dex bonus of 24 and has some good attributes as well. So this is one gear change I know I will be making. Now that I can reach 51% dodge and max dodge, I'd like to get a better max dex bonus and this armor will bring it up to 50.

[HuneyMunster]

I've not looked it over yet tbh. Haven't had much time to focus on the game the last few days.

I did notice the Leathers of the Celestial Avenger, the new raid light armor, has a max dex bonus of 24 and has some good attributes as well. So this is one gear change I know I will be making. Now that I can reach 51% dodge and max dodge, I'd like to get a better max dex bonus and this armor will bring it up to 50.

Legendary GS Smoke belt will certainly be a nice addition. It seems Dex skill is still only option for Smoke belt so probably gonna have to also craft an Int skills belt just incase its required for trapping at some point. I will probably make hp+hp, but not sure what to do for tier 3.

At least wiki has the combo listed which Im gonna assume its correct for for Smoke - 27% blurry, Enhancement bonus (T1 - Fire, T2 - Air, T3 - Fire+Air)

[BrokenButton]

Great Guide! Quick question from a newer player: What DPS rotation do you use with your build?

I played WoW for a long time and SW:ToR, but I'm really having a hard time figuring out a rotation in DDO for Assassin/Acro rogues.

[CThruTheEgo]

Great Guide! Quick question from a newer player: What DPS rotation do you use with your build?

I played WoW for a long time and SW:ToR, but I'm really having a hard time figuring out a rotation in DDO for Assassin/Acro rogues.

First off, welcome to the forums!

On my main hotbar, I have sneak as number 1, cocoon as number 2, and assassinate at number 3. For all my characters, I always have 2 set as my heal button. On my assassin, I can hit 1 and 3 in quick succession to drop into sneak, assassinate, and then go back to dps.

In the middle of my hotbar, I have sly flourish, shiv, heartseeker poison, and shrouding strike. You can arrange these in whatever order you prefer, it doesn't really matter and should be adjusted to fit your own needs. Each of them boosts your damage in some way (e.g. +[W], +crit range, etc.), but some have other functions as well. Shiv induces sneak attack damage by bluffing them. Shrouding strike marks the target so you can build up shadow charges. Heartseeker poison will reduce an enemy's melee/ranged power by 20 and adds +10 to your own damage against them. You can simply keep them all on cooldown, or use them only when their extra function is needed. So just arrange them in an order that best fits your use of them.

At the end of my hotbar, on all my characters, I keep my boss/burst effects and (generally) order them from longest to shortest duration. That way I can simply click down the line and ensure that I get the most out of the shorter ones. On my assassin, that's assassin's trick and haste boost. If I were human, human damage boost would be in between them.

Also, a note of caution that may be completely worthless. I have heard it mentioned before that (at least some) clicky attacks can actually lower your dps because they interrupt your attack chain. I have never seen or done any specific testing on this, however, and do not know if any of those claims apply to the assassin clicky attacks. None of them appear to interrupt the attack chain, that is, none of them alter the animation.

[SableShadow]

Great Guide! Quick question from a newer player: What DPS rotation do you use with your build?

I played WoW for a long time and SW:ToR, but I'm really having a hard time figuring out a rotation in DDO for Assassin/Acro rogues.

Rotations aren't really a ddo thing for the most part, at least not in the same sense as my WoW rogue or my SW:ToR IA had (no global cool downs, no energy management).
I basically focus staying on target (and off the mob's target) and work in clickie attacks when they're off their individual cool down or to open up SA.

I generally do something like Assassin's Trick (it if matters) -> Shiv (ensure SA out the gate) -> Sly Flourish -> fightfightfight -> Sly Flourish -> fight-> Shiv -> Assassin's Trick

With a poison build (been trying something else to date), it'll probably be something like:
Trick -> Shiv -> Poison Strikes -> Sly Flourish -> fightfight -> Poison Strikes -> fightfight -> Sly Flourish -> fightfight -> Poison Strikes -> Shiv -> Trick -> fight -> Sly Flourish
<that one kinda got away from me ... wibbly wobbly timey wimey melee>

[BrokenButton]

Thanks for the replies. I'm low level so I only have a couple of those attacks so far (Shiv, Tricks) but looking down the road at all the activated abilities I was wondering if they would all even fit on a single hotbar. I guess I'll start to get a feel for it when I hit the first raids.

Thx again.

[BrokenButton]

Follow up Question:

As I level I'm having difficulty trying to figure out what skill/stat/ability bonuses I should focus on for each equipment slot.

From reading your guide I have an understanding of what skills/stats/etc. to focus on, but because of the random nature of prefixes and suffixes that pop up on gear, every time I get a better piece of gear I have to swap out 3 or 4 others.

I also read the Tips for DDO NOOBS (http://www.gwen-morse.com/wiki/index..._for_DDO_Noobs) and it had tons of good info, but it wasn't rogue (or Assassin) specific.

So what skill/stat/ability bonuses should I look for per each particular slot (armor, rings, gloves, boots, etc.)?

Again, thx in advance.

[CThruTheEgo]

Rotations aren't really a ddo thing for the most part, at least not in the same sense as my WoW rogue or my SW:ToR IA had

I should have mentioned this also. Special attack rotations aren't really essential in DDO like they are in some games. You can just auto attack if you want to and it's not going to really hurt your dps.

looking down the road at all the activated abilities I was wondering if they would all even fit on a single hotbar. I guess I'll start to get a feel for it when I hit the first raids.

Pretty much this^. As you play, you'll learn what attacks best fit your playstyle and how to organize them to fit your needs.

As I level I'm having difficulty trying to figure out what skill/stat/ability bonuses I should focus on for each equipment slot.

From reading your guide I have an understanding of what skills/stats/etc. to focus on, but because of the random nature of prefixes and suffixes that pop up on gear, every time I get a better piece of gear I have to swap out 3 or 4 others.

Hehe. Welcome to DDO. It sounds like you've actually got a good handle on the process already. Gearing is a continual work in progress. And yes, changing one piece usually means changing several others.

Some people, such as myself, strive for optimization at every level and spend far more time than is necessary to re-gear at each level. Some people don't want to spend that much time re-gearing when it won't make that much of a difference anyway and just settle for sub-optimal. Either one is fine. Just do whatever you enjoy and don't feel like one way is correct.

So what skill/stat/ability bonuses should I look for per each particular slot (armor, rings, gloves, boots, etc.)?

Especially with the new lootgen system, it's difficult to recommend what to slot where because it really depends on what you can find in any given slot. Gearing is about finding the key stats, effects, etc., and putting them together with the least amount of sacrifice. To that end, here are the things you want to always have equipped, preferably in the highest value you can find. I don't know the new lootgen system well enough to know what each of these are called, so check nokowi's table here.

fortification
saves
hp
dexterity
constitution
deadly
spot (if you don't know where traps are located)
strength (this is only for carrying capacity, so it may or may not be a necessity depending on your needs)

Here are a list of things that are good to fit in, but not essential.

dodge
PRR
good luck
wisdom (for boosting both will save and spot)
hide and move silently (if you're soling and doing a lot of sneaking, you'll want these always equipped, if you're in a group, you can simply swap them in as needed, make sure you aren't swapping out something essential though)

Here are a list of things that you don't need to have constantly equipped, but do want to be able to swap in as needed. This is mostly trapping gear.

intelligence
search
disable
open locks
charisma (for boosting UMD)

For your trapping needs, set up a single hot bar with everything you need so you can just click down the line to do your trap duties. So it should look something like this:

int item -> any relevant buffs like gh, a good luck item, etc. -> search item -> search skill -> disable item -> disable skill -> open lock item -> open lock skill

Just be sure to keep your regular, always equipped items somewhere else so you can quickly put them back on and aren't running around with your trap gear equipped. You also want to be cautious about what items your swapping out for your trap gear. You don't want to replace your fort or hp item with your search item, for example, or your dex item for your open lock item (since they both boost your open lock skill).

I think that about covers it. I may have missed a few things. Hopefully someone else will point them out if I did. As you can see, there's no straight answer about gearing. This should be a good guide for you but, as with so many other things, over time you'll start to get a feel for what works for you specifically. I hope that helps.

[Calaquende]

Any thoughts on this? I saw the previous message, but I'm wondering if you've had any time to put together a plan. With the random lootgen being so awesome (so I hear), I'm wondering to what extent one can put together a plan.

My Assassin currently has the U26 gear set, with almost all the augments, which I think is frankly pretty close to being 'maxed out.' Or at least it was at U28. (Sure, there's Sightless and Strange Tidings and Pendant of Quiet Movements, but, at least from my point of view, the marginal improvements weren't enough motivation for the grind.) Anyway, level 30 and U29 will most certainly require a new gear set, but I've been too lazy to put it together and so I'm hoping that someone else has done the work.

[CThruTheEgo]

Any thoughts on this? I saw the previous message, but I'm wondering if you've had any time to put together a plan. With the random lootgen being so awesome (so I hear), I'm wondering to what extent one can put together a plan.

My Assassin currently has the U26 gear set, with almost all the augments, which I think is frankly pretty close to being 'maxed out.' Or at least it was at U28. (Sure, there's Sightless and Strange Tidings and Pendant of Quiet Movements, but, at least from my point of view, the marginal improvements weren't enough motivation for the grind.) Anyway, level 30 and U29 will most certainly require a new gear set, but I've been too lazy to put it together and so I'm hoping that someone else has done the work.

Meh, I'm still working on it. I hate the new lootgen because it's so complicated putting together a final gear set. First, you determine what named items offer unique effects that lootgen doesn't (e.g. melee power on Sightless). Then, you list everything that's available that might be useful on your build, including prefixes/suffixes/bonus effects, in each empty gear slot. With that compiled, you can see what effects are only available in one or two slots and start eliminating extra prefix/suffix/bonus effect options based on that. You'll still end up with some slots that can have multiple permutations, but you should have a good idea of what effects you want where. Then you see if any slots are expendable to be used for legendary greensteel. Fortunately this part is relatively easy since legendary greensteel is so useless on melees. Due to the random nature of lootgen, you'll probably never actually find that perfect set at the highest values, but you'll likely be able to get close to it with less than max values and some missing effects.

I have five builds to do this for. It's tedious and time consuming and I'm at a point in my dissertation that doesn't provide me with a lot of free time. When I do actually have free time, I haven't wanted to spend it pouring over gear lists. I've started this process for this build, but haven't finished it yet. Hopefully new named loot will come out that invalidates lootgen before I get around to compiling a gear set.

[Calaquende]

Meh, I'm still working on it. I hate the new lootgen because it's so complicated putting together a final gear set. First, you determine what named items offer unique effects that lootgen doesn't (e.g. melee power on Sightless). Then, you list everything that's available that might be useful on your build, including prefixes/suffixes/bonus effects, in each empty gear slot. With that compiled, you can see what effects are only available in one or two slots and start eliminating extra prefix/suffix/bonus effect options based on that. You'll still end up with some slots that can have multiple permutations, but you should have a good idea of what effects you want where. Then you see if any slots are expendable to be used for legendary greensteel. Fortunately this part is relatively easy since legendary greensteel is so useless on melees. Due to the random nature of lootgen, you'll probably never actually find that perfect set at the highest values, but you'll likely be able to get close to it with less than max values and some missing effects.

I have five builds to do this for. It's tedious and time consuming and I'm at a point in my dissertation that doesn't provide me with a lot of free time. When I do actually have free time, I haven't wanted to spend it pouring over gear lists. I've started this process for this build, but haven't finished it yet. Hopefully new named loot will come out that invalidates lootgen before I get around to compiling a gear set.

Ugh. This sounds like lots of fun, but is pretty much what I expected. I was going to take a crack at it but don't have the time. You're awesome at it, so I look forward to seeing what you come up with. I'm just hoping there isn't going to be a lot of grinding, but I'm running out of energy for that. Good luck with your dissertation! I'm not surprised to learn that you're a PhD student. ;-)

[CThruTheEgo]

I'm just hoping there isn't going to be a lot of grinding, but I'm running out of energy for that.

Well that's kind of the problem with random lootgen offering some of the most powerful gear, it's not really about grind, it's just about luck. Whether you're questing and looting chests or waiting for something to show up in the auction/shard houses, it's more a matter of luck than time or effort. I really prefer named loot offering the most powerful gear because then you at least know where to focus your time and effort if you choose to do so. Then it's more a matter of time rather than luck.

I consider gear to be a key aspect of a build and the new loot system really turns me off because it's so cumbersome to incorporate into a build, both in planning and acquiring. That's one reason I haven't gotten around to putting together a gear set, I just don't have the enthusiasm to deal with it. But I'll get around to it eventually.

Good luck with your dissertation! I'm not surprised to learn that you're a PhD student. ;-)

LOL! Thanks!

[Saekee]

Well that's kind of the problem with random lootgen offering some of the most powerful gear, it's not really about grind, it's just about luck. Whether you're questing and looting chests or waiting for something to show up in the auction/shard houses, it's more a matter of luck than time or effort. I really prefer named loot offering the most powerful gear because then you at least know where to focus your time and effort if you choose to do so. Then it's more a matter of time rather than luck.

I consider gear to be a key aspect of a build and the new loot system really turns me off because it's so cumbersome to incorporate into a build, both in planning and acquiring. That's one reason I haven't gotten around to putting together a gear set, I just don't have the enthusiasm to deal with it. But I'll get around to it eventually.



LOL! Thanks!

The easiest solution with the gearing is simply to keep what you have and create a special assassinate gear set
swap-in. With MtF needing time to build up, it is not a bad option (you will be waiting anyway). Basically, it would be gloves with insightful assassinate and a LGS weapon with maxed dex (or even just maxing the tier 2 insightful dex).

Someday I will make a tier 3 Int LGS weapon and use that as part of an assassinate combo since it gives a neg level on hit (30sec cooldown). That inherently buffs the offhand assassinate if on the same mob since the neg level reduces saves (plus if they are fresh hp it is a boatload of initial damage on failed assassinate. I have done this with the sacrificial dagger which itself procs neg levels less frequently). An INT stick will be a nice swap in for trapping too so multiple uses.

A lot of folks seem to be swearing by making a regen item and a 3x pos weapon for massive temp hp (another swap item).

Whenever the endgame changes I jump back into heroics and cringe there a bit.

Good luck with the dissertation; finished mine in August and it was a HUGE relief.

[CThruTheEgo]

The easiest solution with the gearing is simply to keep what you have and create a special assassinate gear set
swap-in. With MtF needing time to build up, it is not a bad option (you will be waiting anyway). Basically, it would be gloves with insightful assassinate and a LGS weapon with maxed dex (or even just maxing the tier 2 insightful dex).

Lootgen has a lot more to offer than just assassination DCs though. Insightful false life, insight saves on a number of different slots now, +15 stats, +7 insightful stats, etc. etc. It's definitely time for a full gear set upgrade imo.

Good luck with the dissertation; finished mine in August and it was a HUGE relief.

Thanks, and congratulations to you. I'm getting there, slowly but surely... lol.

[Calaquende]

If you only have a 20 Con at 30th (because you don't have a +5 tome, and chances of buying one are slim) what feat would you take in place of Epic Toughness?

Also, gear - I've been back at it a little bit and I've noticed that there are certainly some interesting lvl 30 stat +14 items. However, even if you had access to everything, it'd be difficult to figure out what item to swap. For example, I have Dex +11 on my Ethereal Bracers. I could try to find Dex +14 bracers, but then I'd lose speed, deadly and feather fall, not to mention that I've also augmented with Draconic Soul Gem and PRR +14. I'm still on the U26 gear set (this is not going to change) and so really the cloak is the only slot that it's packed with all kinds of different effect. Ugh. If you ever do figure out a new gear set, I'm going to be really curious to see it.

[Saekee]

If you only have a 20 Con at 30th (because you don't have a +5 tome, and chances of buying one are slim) what feat would you take in place of Epic Toughness?

Also, gear - I've been back at it a little bit and I've noticed that there are certainly some interesting lvl 30 stat +14 items. However, even if you had access to everything, it'd be difficult to figure out what item to swap. For example, I have Dex +11 on my Ethereal Bracers. I could try to find Dex +14 bracers, but then I'd lose speed, deadly and feather fall, not to mention that I've also augmented with Draconic Soul Gem and PRR +14. I'm still on the U26 gear set (this is not going to change) and so really the cloak is the only slot that it's packed with all kinds of different effect. Ugh. If you ever do figure out a new gear set, I'm going to be really curious to see it.

I can only theorycraft here since I went drow INT and ER'd since then. Basically, it is hard to rejigger an existing gear set with so many synergies.
I consider assassins to be in two 'modes': assassinate, and meleeing non-assassinatable mobs (like bosses). You want a random loot gloves swap with insightful assassinate +2, assassinate +6 or 7. The other swap is with LGS weapons: a Tier 2 LGS weapon with +7 insightful dex (for assassinating) and a 3x positive intermittently for the temp
hp for surviving LE settings (I have not made either). This way, you sneak & assassinate with one set, melee with the other.


(You can also make a LGS gear slot with the healing boost every 10seconds.)

[Calaquende]

I consider assassins to be in two 'modes': assassinate, and meleeing non-assassinatable mobs (like bosses). You want a random loot gloves swap with insightful assassinate +2, assassinate +6 or 7. The other swap is with LGS weapons: a Tier 2 LGS weapon with +7 insightful dex (for assassinating) and a 3x positive intermittently for the temp hp for surviving LE settings (I have not made either). This way, you sneak & assassinate with one set, melee with the other.

Interesting suggestions. Thanks. I'm using the Epic Assassin's Kiss, so I've already got +6 assassinate. The glove are Iron Mitts, so I could swap to insightful assassinate for another +2 or 3 at the temporary cost of Str+7, healing amp and vitality +40. I have +4 insightful Dex already from the Mystic Eidolons, but an LGS weapon could get me another +3, for a total of +5 or 6. Although if I got a +15 Dex weapon with +2 exceptional Dex as well, that would give me another +5 to Dex or +2/3 to assassinate.

That's not too bad (my current assassinate is 75ish so this would get me to around 80), but having to swap two items (weapon and gloves) every time I want to assassinate, and then swap back for melee if it fails, so like a real pain. Perhaps on the highest level content I'll need that extra umph, so it's something to think about.