How Does DDo Compare To PnP

[gurslak]

Hi All,

I guess this may have been asked numerous times but my search-fu is failing me this morning.

I'm a long time PnP player and am moving over to DDO with a group of friends, leaving anothe MMO behind me. So I'm trying to decide which class to play, traditionally I've always played fighters (especially half-Orc specialising in spiked chain) or clerics with a combat slant, making great use of Divine Power, Bulls Strength etc etc while also throwing out heals as neccesary.

Now to the crux of the question, do the feats and spells operate in the same manner in DDO? I realise there will be some differences and some things left out.
Also how are Clerics regarded? I've browsed the forums and have seen a lot of posts about how clerics are the healbots, now I dont mind healing people I mean I've got the ability and it'll be rude not too right? But I'm not going to just sit there and heal people or watch buff timers, I want in on the action too otherwise I might as well go back to the old MMO.

Thanks for your thoughts,

G.

[Trillea]

Playing PnP will give you a step up, many things are similar but there are a lot of changes too. As for clerics, they do NOT have to be buff/heal-bots at all, but many people choose to play them that way, because they are easy to build that way.

Half-orcs are coming soon, but I would not count on spiked chain ever. As for melee weapons, for 1-handed khopesh is king, for 2-handed falchions are best against crittable monsters, mauls for most non-crittable.

I would say the best way to learn is to jump in and play. I hope you enjoy it as much as I do!

[Rasczak]

Check out this link and then ask again based on what was left out

I think one thing left out (if you're a Eberron fundi) is enhancements. You get action points in 3.5 pnp which you could use to improve the result of a dice roll e.g attack, a skill check, ability check or saving throw etc (I could be horribly wrong haven't read the books in awhile). Throw a d6 and add the result to your d20 roll and iirc you gained 5 ap's at lvl 1 and then some formula per level up. I can look it up if it's important.

In DDO you get 4 action points per level no matter what your race or class, which you now use to get enhancements which are dependant on class and race choices.

[gurslak]

Thanks for the replies guys and I do indeed have one last question!

Are Large size weapons available in the game? My cleric used to run with a large morningstar in both hands, I know it's a lot to hope for really.

[Rasczak]

Thanks for the replies guys and I do indeed have one last question!

Are Large size weapons available in the game? My cleric used to run with a large morningstar in both hands, I know it's a lot to hope for really.

Tenderiser (Just hover mouse over this link)
Morningstars

Weapons in DDO

[gurslak]

I guess thats a no then

Thanks again for the answer though

[Rasczak]

I guess thats a no then

Thanks again for the answer though

No? lol those links are proof that morningstars exist ingame

[gurslak]

Sorry I meant Large ones....In PNP you could equip morningstars made for creatures one size higher than yours with two hands; so a human can use a ogres morningstar (one handed weapon) in two hands. It gives you a greater amount of damage without having to take a proficiency slot

[Kralgnax]

Hi All,

I guess this may have been asked numerous times but my search-fu is failing me this morning.

I'm a long time PnP player and am moving over to DDO with a group of friends, leaving anothe MMO behind me. So I'm trying to decide which class to play, traditionally I've always played fighters (especially half-Orc specialising in spiked chain) or clerics with a combat slant, making great use of Divine Power, Bulls Strength etc etc while also throwing out heals as neccesary.

Now to the crux of the question, do the feats and spells operate in the same manner in DDO? I realise there will be some differences and some things left out.
Also how are Clerics regarded? I've browsed the forums and have seen a lot of posts about how clerics are the healbots, now I dont mind healing people I mean I've got the ability and it'll be rude not too right? But I'm not going to just sit there and heal people or watch buff timers, I want in on the action too otherwise I might as well go back to the old MMO.

Thanks for your thoughts,

G.

Welcome to DDO! I stopped playing Pen & paper in the days of 1e, so I can't help much with the 3.5 ruleset mapping

Fighter you can be, though spiked chain isn't in, and half-orcs are not yet available.

Fighting clerics are perfectly viable see Cleric Build Catalogue 2010 for loads of info. Clerics have a triangular build space of trade-offs between healing,offensive casting and melee combat.

[Rasczak]

Sorry I meant Large ones....In PNP you could equip morningstars made for creatures one size higher than yours with two hands; so a human can use a ogres morningstar (one handed weapon) in two hands. It gives you a greater amount of damage without having to take a proficiency slot

In pnp there are many optional rules. For instance you could take certain weapons that are normally one-handed and swing it with two hands to gain the str x 1.5 bonus. In DDO unfortunately there is none of that since the mechanics are set in stone. Also size is not an issue in DDO so it wouldn't work that way. You could always grab yourself a spiky greatclub though and pretend it's a morningstar....I'm used to loads of pretending from pnp either way

[Generic_Player666]

As for melee weapons, for 1-handed khopesh is king, for 2-handed falchions are best against crittable monsters, mauls for most non-crittable.

Can you elaborate on this comment? I am fairly new and have been focusing on using weapons preferred by my race (long sword, long bow for elf, rapier for Drow, etc.)

[Brennie]

Can you elaborate on this comment? I am fairly new and have been focusing on using weapons preferred by my race (long sword, long bow for elf, rapier for Drow, etc.)

Working strictly from the number game, falchion (with its high crit range) will outpace other 2-handed weapons against crittable enemies in long-term DPS calculation.

Similarly, Kopesh will out DPS any other single handed weapon as far as long-term-against-crittable-enemies is concerned.

Racial weapons tend to pull in a close second, with rapiers being the favored weapon of many builds for various reasons (AKA rogues are proficient, rapiers are finessable, drow and use enhancements to give them more punch, etc), and dwarven axes being essentially a free upgrade to all martially proficient dwarves (plus they get those lovely axe bonuses).

Longswords fall right in the middle of the "not very good" zone. Elves, however, can enhance scimitars, which have the same damage potential as rapiers, and falchions!

Longbows are ... ranged weapons, which are notably lacking in DPS, far more than any melee weapons, mostly due to attack speed issues.

[HallowedOne]

DDO is DnD until lvl 16 or so, then it totally becomes an MMO

[Kralgnax]

As for melee weapons, for 1-handed khopesh is king, for 2-handed falchions are best against crittable monsters, mauls for most non-crittable.

It's not quite that simple - Where racial enhancements apply rapiers (drow), scimitars (elves) and axes (dwarf) are all viable -and for anyone with limited in-game money, Khopeshes are so insanely overpriced, that you may well not care to use them untill you're well down the levels.

Also, THF Paladins will typically go Holy Sword at 14, and those don't come in Falchion (or greataxe), so they're stuck with greatswords.

DDO is DnD until lvl 16 or so, then it totally becomes an MMO

I'm sorry, can you elaborate that into a meaningful statement ? - because it doesn't make a lick of sense to me.
DnD is a ruleset, MMO is aplaystyle - what has one to do with the other?

[sigtrent]

The core rules are almost the same.. (number of attacks words very differently since there are no "rounds" in a real time game, you simply attack "faster" as your bab goes up)

Stuff like attack rolls, saving throws, hit points and all that are pretty similar.

What is most different is scale. DDO is very high magic so the norm is to have dozens of magic items, all very powerful rather than a few key items. Also DDO characters get enhancements, kind of like feats that add to all kinds of things and further beef up the abilities of characters and specialize them.

Since the characters are beefed up, so are the monsters. Monsters in DDO can have many thousands of hit points at high level.

The factors that made the game different are all about game design
1. Its a real time game so turn based rules don't work well
2. You need to always have something new and shiny to add to your character, thus all the gear and build options.
3. You want to make big battles last a little while (thus the massive monster hit points for bosses)

Once you settle in it plays like "D&D Turbo" You could say its very munchkin but since everyone is munckin here its not such a big deal. I really like the changes. They wouldn't work for PnP because the game would grind to a standstill as folks figured out all thier combat effects, but in a video game that's not such an issue. It gives a builder like myself tons to play with.

[SquelchHU]

Hi All,

I guess this may have been asked numerous times but my search-fu is failing me this morning.

I'm a long time PnP player and am moving over to DDO with a group of friends, leaving anothe MMO behind me. So I'm trying to decide which class to play, traditionally I've always played fighters (especially half-Orc specialising in spiked chain) or clerics with a combat slant, making great use of Divine Power, Bulls Strength etc etc while also throwing out heals as neccesary.

Now to the crux of the question, do the feats and spells operate in the same manner in DDO? I realise there will be some differences and some things left out.
Also how are Clerics regarded? I've browsed the forums and have seen a lot of posts about how clerics are the healbots, now I dont mind healing people I mean I've got the ability and it'll be rude not too right? But I'm not going to just sit there and heal people or watch buff timers, I want in on the action too otherwise I might as well go back to the old MMO.

Thanks for your thoughts,

G.

No, not quite.

You will be glad to hear that Fighters are quite viable here, a definite change from PnP. You won't be using a spiked chain though, they don't exist here. As for Clerics... CoDzilla does not exist here. Get that out of your head now. This doesn't mean Clerics are healbots though. The healbots aren't really trying. The path to victory is damage prevention, same as in PnP. 30 mana for a Greater Command to put the mobs on their ass... probably cheaper than healing, and more entertaining as well. Of course there will be times where the most effective means of damage mitigation is healing, you can do that too. But you're only going to really be meleeing at low level, when it's more about your gear than about you.

[HallowedOne]

I'm sorry, can you elaborate that into a meaningful statement ? - because it doesn't make a lick of sense to me.
DnD is a ruleset, MMO is aplaystyle - what has one to do with the other?

Until mid lvls everything feels true to PnP DnD - the dungeons, the challenges, the monsters (they have similiar HP to the manuals, for example). The group doesn't have anyone with uber leet stuff and even "weak", "pathetic" builds with 10 base con can be playable, considering the player has a minimum knowlegde of what he has to do and is willing to learn and improve.

After 16 and especially when you hit 20, it is all about raiding, repeating the same quests over and over and over to get to the 20th run and the loot so you can be uber. If you have anything that doesn't fall between a "Monster" and an "Exploiter" or less than 400 hp you are virtually useless.

(Mind you, I'm not criticizing it, in fact, I enjoy those both aspects of the game.)

[gurslak]

Thanks for all the replies, I'm happy to say I've had a few hours in the game now and absolutely love it! It's just close enough to PnP for me while still retaining the fast moving MMO game feel. I've tried both a warrior and a cleric and am currently testing out a sorcerer to get the feel of how things work, it's good to hear that all classes are viable at high end though.

Thanks again,

G.