Monks are coming, so I am going

[rawfocat]

Wait, wait, wait... your leaving because they are adding content?

/sarcasm on

I demand that Turbine immediately stop producing content and let me rerun POP for the billionth time. My suterranian dark elf using power orbs to summon convicts from multiple planes to kill them during a jail break, while surrounded by 5 friendly sentient contructs who happen to equip the exact correct weapon for the creature that appears is much more immersive and realistic.

Thank you Turbine for not releasing mod 7 in April

/sarcasm off

[CrimsonEagle]

This has to be a joke. If not, *shrugs shoulders*, see ya.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

Blackmoor supplement is before ad&d 1.0 it was put out in 77 or 76 and was after the orignal greyhawk little brown book with the beholder on the cover which had paladins and rangers I belive and it wasnt ad&d then it was just dungeons and dragons and tsr still put it out

Ah, my bad, I had the order confused in my head...

[UnderwearModel]

I agreed to play the first monk in our group of DnD players.

I played before there were canned modules and the DM had to write them all. Yes, that was a long time ago.

Boy, did I discover that the monk was
A) Under powered
B) Died all the time
C) Never any treasure for the monk

Now, why was that? Because the DM was still playing with his stuff from before that did not include any treasure for monks, he had not played a monkso he did not know that the monk was going to be dead guppy in the fish tank, floating belly up all the time. SO, since we were smart college students, we changed the way a monk was. Forget the rules, rewrite them.

We made it so that every attack that come at the monk from the side or the front, the monk could roll his DEX or less to avoid. The monk still had sucky armor class, but the dodge made him more playable.

I then began to have fun with the monk, and I look forward to the monk coming out. As does my son.

And all of us will be going to run CO6 for that bound ICY burst returning shuriken, SNOWSTAR.(I think that is the name)

Speaking of which, has anyone found a nice returning shuriken?

Sorry to see your dislike for a character class forces you to quit, but we are all free to make our own decisions.

Have fun with whatever you move onto.

[Eudimio]

...HAHAHAHA!

Hold on, let me clarify.

HAHAHA!

A martial artist uses what is necessary. He doesn't stick to one thing, yes, but that doesn't mean he'll go for the blade when the hand will suffice.

How does he know when a hand will suffice? That would be AFTER the battle.

Do you practice martial arts? Are you trained to disarm someone first? Why? HAHAHAHAHA!

I win.

[Eudimio]

Any martial artist that would fight with a non proficent weapon he isnt trained on because his own body is too lacking is not a true martial artist. You are confusing samori with martial arts.

No, you're confusing Eastern martial arts with martial arts. A US Navy Seal is every bit as much a martial artist as a ninja. But either of them would prefer using a blade to their bare hands.

[fatherpirate]

I just wanted to post this for anyone who is tracking how many people quit the game due to things that change in the game, etc. In case anyone is tracking those metrics, because they should be.

Anyway, I absolutely hate the monk class in D&D, and I simply can't play in a game that includes them. When a normal man's fist can outdamage a greataxe, my suspension of disbelief turns to simple disgust. I'm sure a lot of people want to play a monk, but since when does lots of people liking a thing make it right? I'm sure many would like to play superman or a Jedi or Klingons or stormtroopers or FBI agents but none of those belongs in a D&D game either. So, I will simply sign off and cancel my subscriptions. I think DDO is a great MMO, and there are lots of things people complain about that I don't really care one way or the other. But Monk class is where I have to draw my own personal line.

I hope DDO continues to have a long and successful life as an MMO, we had some great times here. Goodbye!

Why don't soldiers still use battle axes??
Bullets are faster.

Damage in D+D is abstract...to put it in prospective, every hero should only have 3hp and the maximum damage a
plain dagger can do in 1 hit will kill any human.

so what are hit points then? they are the players raw defensive skill..when ya run out of them, they can get a clean
hit and you die

so back to your question, why would a fist do more damage than a battle axe?
because damage is a mechanism of fighting skill (as far as humans are concerned, in the case of a huge monster, that would be body mass)
and not superhuman durability...speed and accuracy are everything
TRAINED fists are fast and accurate...battle axes are slower

HIGHLY trained monks could...and did...kill heavily armed and armored soldiers in asia through out history
wearing nothing but sandels and a robe.

The final outcome in all mortal combat (discounting artilery or dropped bombs) is decided first by skill, then by luck.

[thatguy]

I hope DDO continues to have a long and successful life as an MMO, we had some great times here. Goodbye!

OK, cya.

[RazorrX]

No, you're confusing Eastern martial arts with martial arts. A US Navy Seal is every bit as much a martial artist as a ninja. But either of them would prefer using a blade to their bare hands.

You know, I grew up around seals, I have friends who are seals. Seals do *Some* martial arts training. SOME. A seal is trained to shoot people. One once was watching a movie where a guy snuck up and stabbed a guard and laughed. "We sneak up and whisper in his ear with a silenced pistol, no gurgle, no gasp, no outcry.".

A seal is NOT a Martial Artist as a pure martial Artist. They get hand to hand training for WORSE case senarios. They do NOT fight hand to hand by choice. Bullets are faster, grenades clear rooms, etc. Seal training does not focus on martial arts. It focuses on demolitions, espionage, shooting, swimming, etc. Martial arts training is probably about 10% of their work load at best.

A martial artists is capable of some fantastic feats. There was a special on TV (discovery channel I think) that showed a Thai Kickboxer's knee strike hits with the same impact as a car collision at 30 mph, a Ninjutsu guy did a dim mak punch and computer analysis showed that it would have pushed the sternum into the heart causing it to stop.

Martial Artists can kill with one hit. Not all would use a sword, or chose to.

[Sani_Medicor]

Soooo Monks are less DnD that Robots running around casting Firewalls? I'd argue that monks are closer to "true" dnd than Warforged are. And no I don't paticularly like ebberon it's a lil too sci-fi for my DnD tastes.

Yeah...I'm waiting for Dungeons and Dragons Online: Ansalon!

[MerlinSylver]

The final outcome in all mortal combat (discounting artilery or dropped bombs) is decided first by skill, then by luck.

I actually would reverse those two: Luck, or chance, IMO, is the ultimate factor in all things. No matter how trained you are, an embolism brought on by a random DNA mutation at conception will kill you. So, even if you are the most unskilled fighter in the world, with one hand tied behind your back and both legs cut off, blindfolded and leashed in place, you could still win against a ninja if luck is on your side.

[Yshkabibble]

I actually would reverse those two: Luck, or chance, IMO, is the ultimate factor in all things. No matter how trained you are, an embolism brought on by a random DNA mutation at conception will kill you. So, even if you are the most unskilled fighter in the world, with one hand tied behind your back and both legs cut off, blindfolded and leashed in place, you could still win against a ninja if luck is on your side.

If you end up facing a ninja and you have already had both legs cut off then I would say that luck is definitely not on your side.


Unless the Ninja has both arms and both legs cut off. Then that might make for a long fight.

[MerlinSylver]

If you end up facing a ninja and you have already had both legs cut off then I would say that luck is definitely not on your side.


Unless the Ninja has both arms and both legs cut off. Then that might make for a long fight.

Granted... but my point is when the Universe gives you the Finger, there is no saving throw.

[Lorien_the_First_One]

[QUOTE=RazorrX;1690971Bullets are faster, grenades clear rooms, etc. Seal training does not focus on martial arts. It focuses on demolitions, espionage, shooting, swimming, etc. Martial arts training is probably about 10% of their work load at best.[/QUOTE]

You know this reminds me of me of something....Last week I was bored and brushed the dust off Doom3. What a blast! I think we need a new class, Marine I want a BFG 9000, a shotgun, a chaingun, a chainsaw, a machine gun, and of course grenades.

Can we have that instead of monk please?

[MTG]

Originally Posted by MerlinSylver
I actually would reverse those two: Luck, or chance, IMO, is the ultimate factor in all things. No matter how trained you are, an embolism brought on by a random DNA mutation at conception will kill you. So, even if you are the most unskilled fighter in the world, with one hand tied behind your back and both legs cut off, blindfolded and leashed in place, you could still win against a ninja if luck is on your side.

If you end up facing a ninja and you have already had both legs cut off then I would say that luck is definitely not on your side.

Unless the Ninja has both arms and both legs cut off. Then that might make for a long fight.

I'm sorry that was to funny.

BTW

Thank you all for giving me something to read on watch.

[RazorrX]

My point was that a Monk is not a seal, nor is a seal a ninja (as was inferred). To argue that it is not realistic in a fantasy setting that a martial arts based character could do equal or more damage than a barbarian with a greatsword, and base it on the fact that it is unrealistic is absurd. But to pull inference that since Seals use weapons, and martial artist would is also absurd.

Also to call a SEAL a martial artist is just wrong. It does both a disservice. SEALS are much more than that, different but in their own world/setting they are quite amazing. Same for Martial Artists.

There is video footage of A karate master ( I think the name was Oyata) killing a Bull with one empty hand strike. Discovery channel did a special on what force, etc. a martial artist could do. Take those real world things and give them the fantasy twist and you DO indeed have a monk who could out strike a greatsword (as far as game mechanics go). However, the same game mechanics would have that barbarian able to do equal or greater damage due to higher str, feats and magic weapons.

The whole argument that something does not make sense in a fantasy setting based on selective real world data (we are ignoring the fact that the DDO barbarian would have 500+ hit points, greater rage, a Magic Greatsword, etc. BUT we ARE looking at the damage a monk can do with empty hands in this instance) is like comparing apples to oranges and deciding that it equals prime rib.

[Raiderone]

if they add that whiny Jahiera from BG... I could understand leaving... NOBODY likes a whiny Harper. (just kidding).

i'd like DDO to add the drunken fighting style (enhancement)...maybe the OP will stay for that.

I'm guessing the OP isn't going to see the new movie coming out...the PANDA movie. new race the PANDA
in mod7a....

[Gornin]

You know this reminds me of me of something....Last week I was bored and brushed the dust off Doom3. What a blast! I think we need a new class, Marine I want a BFG 9000, a shotgun, a chaingun, a chainsaw, a machine gun, and of course grenades.

Can we have that instead of monk please?

I want a SPAS 12 (street sweeper), a fully automatic 12g shot gun with a 20 round mag alternating 00 buckshot and Sabot rounds for the little jobs and a .32 Vulcan cannon for the big jobs.


Razorrx is correct on the training for SEALs, but there are some that specialize in CQC because it is always good to have someone on the team that can handle those problems when they crop up.

[cdbd3rd]

How does he know when a hand will suffice? That would be AFTER the battle.

Do you practice martial arts? Are you trained to disarm someone first? Why? HAHAHAHAHA!

I win.

I so tried to ignore this silliness the first time by....


A martial artist uses what he's trained in, and has available when he needs it. I have not trained on swords enough to feel comfortable in combat with them, so given a choice I'd reach across that sword for a sturdy stick - or two.

As has been discussed before in other similar threads, there are many of us here who have trained to one degree or another.


/Swerves back towards the topic...

I don't particularly like some of the things they've done with monks, but I will certainly be playing one for a while before I make any harsh decisions about them. Harsh, in my book, simply means just not playing them - much as I do with bards now. I don't get all egocentric and say I won't play in a game that has bards. That would be immature. (...and I certainly don't need to slide any further *that* direction!)


Here's hoping the original post was sarcasm.


If not. Take your break, let the newness of monks wear off so town isn't full of them, and see ya back later on hopefully.


(Why does the spellchecker want to change "HAHAHAHAHA" TO "HOHENLOHE"?) lol!

[Ringos]

WHAT???

Your fine with people shooting fireballs out of their hands and chopping up huge giants with little tiny daggers in seconds, but the concept of a martial arts expert actually hurting things with his hand to hand combat is to much for you?

/VERY signed

LOL!