Fix the preselected character paths and your server population will grow.

[Ereshkigal]

I see soooo many new players all the time. I feel like for every one I see there's probably at least hundreds that I do not.

I recruit for my guild and when i am playing with these new players, the biggest complaint is how weak they feel.

These people almost always have chosen a crappy preselected character path.

Why not fix them? Is growing server populations unimportant?

There's also no need to have so many paths, if it would be too much work. Maybe just make 4? 1 melee cleric, 1 arcane caster blaster, 1 ranged build with trappy skills, and 1 melee build.

Additionally, might be nice if one of the starter quests had an NPC invite the new player aboard a NPC guild ship with maxed out bonuses, just so a new player might see the benefit of looking for a guild. I feel like a new player that's in a guild will have a much higher chance of not being overwhelmed by the game, or disappointed by the results of their lack of how to build a character. The new player experience should gently nudge new players towards trying out guilds - or maybe not-so-gently shove them in that direction.

[Firebreed]

I agree that this should be of higher priority than it currently seems to be.

[DoctorOfLiterature]

Good ideas op.

For guilds, all guilds could have a setting to be open to new members. When new character are created they could be randomly assigned one of these open/recruiting guilds.

[KoobTheProud]

I have no idea what SSG pays the streamers that regularly stream DDO, probably nothing beyond access to behind the scenes information.

However it would make good sense to pay them at least a nominal sum to redo the character paths as part of the streaming process. This would both rebuild the presets and provide probably very interesting content as we do that.

Strimtom and Voodu would be naturals and there are probably a couple of other regular streamers who would be good also.

[mbartol]

I forget how many years ago, but when Lynabel was first hired on (maybe even when still an intern), he was engaging with Five Foot Step over on the vault to hammer out basic/generic first life builds for each enhancement tree/path across a few different classes. They even included some tweaks based on different races.

Though it would be difficult to keep them updated, a new baseline would do wonders for any new players that choose the default route.

[Aelonwy]

I forget how many years ago, but when Lynabel was first hired on (maybe even when still an intern), he was engaging with Five Foot Step over on the vault to hammer out basic/generic first life builds for each enhancement tree/path across a few different classes. They even included some tweaks based on different races.

Though it would be difficult to keep them updated, a new baseline would do wonders for any new players that choose the default route.

I vaguely remember something about that... what happened with it? Did it not get finished? Pushed down from priority and never returned to it?

Couldn't they just get some player submissions and then decide what to go with or even have a couple choices and have the players vote? The game is built for customization but to have just a handful of get-started-options for new players to get to know the game comfortably and without pitfalls would be truly worthwhile.

[Paladin_of_Power]

I have no idea what SSG pays the streamers that regularly stream DDO, probably nothing beyond access to behind the scenes information.

However it would make good sense to pay them at least a nominal sum to redo the character paths as part of the streaming process. This would both rebuild the presets and provide probably very interesting content as we do that.

Strimtom and Voodu would be naturals and there are probably a couple of other regular streamers who would be good also.

Now that is the best thing I’ve heard all day very good idea. Fix and help new players and stream content.

[cmecu]

I have no idea what SSG pays the streamers that regularly stream DDO, probably nothing beyond access to behind the scenes information.

However it would make good sense to pay them at least a nominal sum to redo the character paths as part of the streaming process. This would both rebuild the presets and provide probably very interesting content as we do that.

Strimtom and Voodu would be naturals and there are probably a couple of other regular streamers who would be good also.

It would be nice to get paid to stream from SSG but no.. that is something done for free, but can be rewarding by people subscribing, donating, cheering bits for the stream.

[Antheal]

I have no idea what SSG pays the streamers that regularly stream DDO, probably nothing beyond access to behind the scenes information.

However it would make good sense to pay them at least a nominal sum to redo the character paths as part of the streaming process. This would both rebuild the presets and provide probably very interesting content as we do that.

Strimtom and Voodu would be naturals and there are probably a couple of other regular streamers who would be good also.

Sure, until they create builds that require you to be triple-completionist and having +8 supreme tomes.

[Coffey]

If we are talking full enhancement tree, stat pick, whathaveyou predefined builds, that is a horrid idea. Its good on the surface. But lets say someone actually plays one of those chars. They won't understand why it works, or if it suddenly stops, why it stopped. Laying groundwork for a noobs guide is a great idea, and easier to manage than to update things in the game itself which might end up being counterproductive.

My best experience with relearning to play has just been to read things in the Classes forums. People already have a lot of builds there, and by building it myself level by level, I can see how the parts work.

Top to bottom, I feel I am learning more and having fun by cribbing than if I had a premade that I didn't really understand!

I share your enthusiasm for learning the game by actively playing and experimenting but i dont think many people have the patience to learn. Most just want to be able to pick a game up and start playing immediately and in this case some sort of vehicle to do that.

[C-Dog]

There's also no need to have so many paths, if it would be too much work. Maybe just make 4? 1 melee cleric, 1 arcane caster blaster, 1 ranged build with trappy skills, and 1 melee build.

A good idea (and one I missed earlier, my bad! )

I was going to say "those are not the ones I'd suggest", but it turns out they are..

• Melee (pure 2HF barbarian, nothing fancy)
• Caster blaster (simple sorcerer)
• Cleric/healer (easiest healer is cleric, easiest from there is melee)
• Ranged/Trapper (dual-purpose - the obvious trapper is Mechanic Rogue, which then serves to cover "ranged")

While there are certainly other "archetypal" character tropes the players associate w D&D, (e.g. paladin, assassin, bard, to name but a few), a) those can get a little trickier, more complex to understand/run for the starting player, and b) are potentially(?) more prone to rules changes crippling the build.

[Coffey]

Thats exactly what the devs think the pre-set paths are right now.

Good luck convincing them otherwise when we can't even get them to see very obvious short-term problems.

Edit: I think SSG knows pre-set paths are out of date but will not acknowledge it and add it to the growing pile of unfinished work.

I would like to see a shift of SSG employees and hardware from LOTRO to DDO to right the games wrongs and make serious improvements all round.

Im a Dreamer lol!

[Eantarus]

Edit: I think SSG knows pre-set paths are out of date but will not acknowledge it and add it to the growing pile of unfinished work.

The key problem is the devs don't play the game in any real meaningful way. Back when I was playing WoW you could always tell exactly what class the devs were playing because they kept getting drastic improvement. In DDO we get to see long-standing problems fester.

[Antheal]

The key problem is the devs don't play the game in any real meaningful way. Back when I was playing WoW you could always tell exactly what class the devs were playing because they kept getting drastic improvement. In DDO we get to see long-standing problems fester.

They probably don't even like DDO.

I imagine, back when Turbine were bidding on the rights for a new D&D MMO, they got stuck with the brand new Eberron setting, instead of the highly-desired Forgotten Realms, and as such they put the bare minimum into throwing up, I mean out, a workable game just to get it out of the door and get some return on their "investment".

[lbroyles]

If they never plan on updating those paths then they simply need to remove them. To me it is just giving an option for failure.
If they really wanted to create a path, they should think about a quest path from 1 to whatever.

[Coffey]

A good idea (and one I missed earlier, my bad! )

I was going to say "those are not the ones I'd suggest", but it turns out they are..

• Melee (pure 2HF barbarian, nothing fancy)
• Caster blaster (simple sorcerer)
• Cleric/healer (easiest healer is cleric, easiest from there is melee)
• Ranged/Trapper (dual-purpose - the obvious trapper is Mechanic Rogue, which then serves to cover "ranged")

While there are certainly other "archetypal" character tropes the players associate w D&D, (e.g. paladin, assassin, bard, to name but a few), a) those can get a little trickier, more complex to understand/run for the starting player, and b) are potentially(?) more prone to rules changes crippling the build.

I think barbarian THF is good because it suits all Enhancement trees.

Other classes that have varied Enhancement Trees all need basic represented builds IMHO.