VIP, servers transfers and fiscal irresponsability

[mikarddo]

Fiscally irrespnsible might be correct when it comes to giving free gold rolls to VIP. SSG is more likely to have the numbers on sales to back that up than we are to be able to judge by guessing. So, I am not going to judge that particular decision.

However, a couple more things are fiscally irresponsible and more so in my book.

a) Annoying VIPs so much that they stop using money on the game for one and post negatively in spades on the forum which impacts potential new players that read it. Just give VIP +25% xp and give VIP the option to start at level 4 after a TR already and move on. Thats hardly fiscally an issue - those that purchase pots, and I do from time to time, certainly still will do so. Infact, it means VIP earn less free DDO points per life as they run fewer quests.

b) Grossly disfavoring the other servers by given free transfer to two servers. I understand the issue at hand with HC characters but the implications are really bad. Already I am hearing of quite a few high end gamers that will be leaving my server of choice because of the free move. You are gutting the other servers and those of us that do not want to move are more likely to simply stop playing (and paying) due to this horrible choice. If some leave and some stop due to that - you have a ghosttown and even more will stop from that. At the very least restrict the free move to those characters that orginated from HC (or make it free to move to any server to even the field)

c) It gets worse though, fiscally. Anyone on one of the two favored servers will be able to move up to 11 free xp pots from each of the other servers depending on the expansions they have bought. Thats 77 free xp pots. Not to mention any other items they may have rolled on those servers. To prevent that SSGs needs not only to restrict the free move to characters that came from HC but also restrict them to being able to carry items that orginated from HC. Oh, and if you have characters on Wayfinder from 2020 they may have both a heroic and an epic xp stone (btc atleast) so if you care to you can have another mid epic level character in a few mins if that strikes your fancy. Try to tell me that wont entice a significant amount of people to move servers even if it means losing the shards and airship they might have / be part of? Use the shards before you xfer and there are plenty of guilds to join with maxed out ships making the loss rather small and the gain rather large if you are not currently closely attached to a particular guild.

Solutions:
VIP is not hard to fix in a financially responsible way.
- up the xp bonus to +25%
- allow VIP to start at level 4 after a TR
Cost: none (or as close to it as possible). No lost revenue and near no dev time to make it happen. Just do it!

Server transfer:
Thats the really hard one. It almost makes understanding the wife easy SSGs either needs to
- Not give any free xfers (which would rightfully **** those with stranded HC characters off) OR
- Make a technical solution so ONLY characters and ONLY gear from HC can transfer freely OR
- Give free transfers to all servers to even the playing field.
The middle one is the correct solution but sadly also the most difficult one, if at all possible. The first one is the easiest one and infers no fiscal loss - but also means going back on a promise after the problems with xfers from HC making it a bad choice. The third will even the playing field and certainly not annoy any players - but comes as a loss in terms of xp pots and misc other stuff. But given free transfers only to two servers is emphatically not the correct solution!

[Diracorvus]

If Ghallanda wouldn't have those lag issues you would not have to be afraid of people leaving. I can understand why you bring up this issue again and again but the devs said they can't and won't ever solve the lag issues on G-Land so it's useless trying to force people to stay there. I doubt that any server other than G-Land or Wayfinder will lose population from the free transfers.

[Dandonk]

Fiscally irrespnsible might be correct when it comes to giving free gold rolls to VIP.

Agreed. I don't know enough to say anything about this. So if they need to go, so be it.

Annoying VIPs so much that they stop using money on the game for one and post negatively in spades on the forum which impacts potential new players that read it. Just give VIP +25% xp and give VIP the option to start at level 4 after a TR already and move on. Thats hardly fiscally an issue - those that purchase pots, and I do from time to time, certainly still will do so. Infact, it means VIP earn less free DDO points per life as they run fewer quests.

Yeah, annoying VIPs so much, after they had nearly a year to find a new plan. And the one Sev outlined in the twitch does not merit the title plan. It's a vague idea without many specifics of something that might or might not happen, at some undefined point in the future.

Starting at level 4 after TR would be a good start for me, personally. Enough? Not sure, but it'd help. Not sure they'd go for the extra XP, no matter how logical it seems to you (and me).

Grossly disfavoring the other servers by given free transfer to two servers.

I do think the potential ramifications of the free transfers are grossly underestimated, Sadly, I don't think they're going to do anything about it, and we'll be left to deal with the fall out when the other servers start to suffer.

[mikarddo]

If Ghallanda wouldn't have those lag issues you would not have to be afraid of people leaving. I can understand why you bring up this issue again and again but the devs said they can't and won't ever solve the lag issues on G-Land so it's useless trying to force people to stay there. I doubt that any server other than G-Land or Wayfinder will lose population from the free transfers.

Do you have a link to the Devs saying such a thing? If not you probably should refrain from posting such negative slander about G-land. I have heard it before but I have never seen any evidence at all, nor does it particularly fit with my own experience for what little thats worth. So please post a link to a Dev saying what you claim they have said.

My worries have absolute nothing to do with G-land playing worse because I dont believe it does. If I felt it did I would probably use the opportunity to leave myself.

[mikarddo]

I do think the potential ramifications of the free transfers are grossly underestimated, Sadly, I don't think they're going to do anything about it, and we'll be left to deal with the fall out when the other servers start to suffer.

Unfortunately, you are probably correct. Their track record isnt too good. Atleast I have tried to turn their attention to the problem but I have no great trust in it having a positive effect.

[Lamassut]

I don't see how offering something that players value can be fiscally irresponsible. I would say that what is fiscally irresponsible is to deprive the subscription of value, and that the players stop being VIPs. If you plan to go down that route, why not just take away the suscription?

I don't think that the free servers are going to create population problems, but I do find it curious that they worry so much about a few items that are obtained with the gold dice on a server and are now going to allow two servers to concentrate those items of all other servers. Isn't a problem for their greed? LOL. SSG's contradictions are delicious.

In short, SSG needs a marketing expert to teach them that to win, you first have to invest.

[Fallout47]

If Ghallanda wouldn't have those lag issues you would not have to be afraid of people leaving. I can understand why you bring up this issue again and again but the devs said they can't and won't ever solve the lag issues on G-Land so it's useless trying to force people to stay there. I doubt that any server other than G-Land or Wayfinder will lose population from the free transfers.

My concerns with this, apparently, proposed free server transfer are multiple.

1. This is being talked about as free transfers being offered "for a time". This means that any of my members who are not currently playing will, possibly, be left behind on a decimated server. If the window of free transfers is subject to closing, then there will be multiple stranded players.

2. My guild and I will have to agree on a server, and will loose a Kraken, and all the renown/amenities on our ship. I see this as a pretty bald-faced cash grab by SSG. By their generous offer of 'free' transfers, they gloss over the cost of replacing what the guilds on other servers will be loosing. They apparently lack the desire to merge servers, so this is the easiest and least costly way for them to deal with the problem. I guess without a token to replace the cost of the airship and replenish all the renown, I can at least do a charge back on my credit card for the value of the Kraken, but I run the risk of having an account stolen by SSG.

3. From what I am hearing, more will be lost than airships, personal accounts will loose astral shards, mounts, and other bought/earned items. Without making people financially whole, they will simply decimate further their player base.

I continue to play this game for two reasons, the friends I have made over the years on Ghallanda and the addictive nature of power acquisition in an RPG/MMO. I think we can all see that this particular MMO has become increasingly less so over the years. I think this move will further erode the players we have to group with as people continue to quietly walk away. This game still makes them a ton of money, logical people would conclude that they would want to take care of the customers they have left.

Hegemone, Helter Skelter, Ghallanda

[Sqrlmonger]

Fiscally irrespnsible might be correct when it comes to giving free gold rolls to VIP. SSG is more likely to have the numbers on sales to back that up than we are to be able to judge by guessing. So, I am not going to judge that particular decision.

Why give them a free pass? Do we as a community not understand numbers? Why not ask them to show their work if they want this to be taken as credible?

We have no clue how they are counting this, for all we know they could have added up the $$ value of every item won on gold rolls and compared it to the cost of the VIP subs. That is by far the simplest analysis they could do and thus probably more likely as a result. It's also a complete nonsense comparison when you realize 90% of what you get from gold rolls people destroy or shove onto a bank mule never to be used.

Further, for example, are they considering the XP potions to be valued at the single potion purchase rate which are all universally pretty terrible? There are a LOT of ways to fudge this to the point of being completely disingenuous and we have absolutely no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt on it. How do they take into account people buying more of an item after winning it because they liked it? Do they even factor it in at all?

Please stop just taking their word for it when they tell you something like this.

All we know right now is they don't want to do more daily gold rolls and that by some unknown standard they are claiming it was not fiscally responsible. Great, until we know what that standard is it is impossible to assess the conclusion.

It amazes me how quickly people let a company just shove conclusions in their head without any push back.

[mikarddo]

Why give them a free pass? Do we as a community not understand numbers? Why not ask them to show their work if they want this to be taken as credible?

Thats not how being a customer works. If a company finds they are hurting financially that will change that if they can - and the customers are not in any way owed full disclosure.

What the customer can do is stop using the company - but demanding the company to show the full details is not how the actual world works. That might be the case with a private DM with a group of 7 players but not here.

This has nothing to do with "taking their word for it" at all, thats not the point at all.

[Malveaux]

I agree with and have said the same thing. I like the solution. I don't really care if I can roll store stuff everyday. Me personally I would still use xp pots. 30's are a sweet spot for leveling. And 50's at cap for max rxp per run.

[Eantarus]

Yeah I don't care about gold roles either. I just need to see some improvement to VIP.

[Diracorvus]

Do you have a link to the Devs saying such a thing? If not you probably should refrain from posting such negative slander about G-land. I have heard it before but I have never seen any evidence at all, nor does it particularly fit with my own experience for what little thats worth. So please post a link to a Dev saying what you claim they have said.

My worries have absolute nothing to do with G-land playing worse because I dont believe it does. If I felt it did I would probably use the opportunity to leave myself.

Sorry, I didn't want to badmouth Ghallanda. It's my home server as well and I'm thinking of taking that opportunity.

[Eantarus]

Do you have a link to the Devs saying such a thing?

No one has a link to the devs saying anything. Any and all meaningful communication with the community stopped months ago. All we get now is the occasional "livestream" and I suspect that'll stop pretty quickly after these most recent debacles.

[mikarddo]

Sorry, I didn't want to badmouth Ghallanda. It's my home server as well and I'm thinking of taking that opportunity.

Thank you for the reply. I take it you dont have a link then. I have heard the same rumor before but always unfounded

[Ereshkigal]

Fiscally irrespnsible might be correct when it comes to giving free gold rolls to VIP. SSG is more likely to have the numbers on sales to back that up than we are to be able to judge by guessing. So, I am not going to judge that particular decision.

However, a couple more things are fiscally irresponsible and more so in my book.

a) Annoying VIPs so much that they stop using money on the game for one and post negatively in spades on the forum which impacts potential new players that read it. Just give VIP +25% xp and give VIP the option to start at level 4 after a TR already and move on. Thats hardly fiscally an issue - those that purchase pots, and I do from time to time, certainly still will do so. Infact, it means VIP earn less free DDO points per life as they run fewer quests.

b) Grossly disfavoring the other servers by given free transfer to two servers. I understand the issue at hand with HC characters but the implications are really bad. Already I am hearing of quite a few high end gamers that will be leaving my server of choice because of the free move. You are gutting the other servers and those of us that do not want to move are more likely to simply stop playing (and paying) due to this horrible choice. If some leave and some stop due to that - you have a ghosttown and even more will stop from that. At the very least restrict the free move to those characters that orginated from HC (or make it free to move to any server to even the field)

c) It gets worse though, fiscally. Anyone on one of the two favored servers will be able to move up to 11 free xp pots from each of the other servers depending on the expansions they have bought. Thats 77 free xp pots. Not to mention any other items they may have rolled on those servers. To prevent that SSGs needs not only to restrict the free move to characters that came from HC but also restrict them to being able to carry items that orginated from HC. Oh, and if you have characters on Wayfinder from 2020 they may have both a heroic and an epic xp stone (btc atleast) so if you care to you can have another mid epic level character in a few mins if that strikes your fancy. Try to tell me that wont entice a significant amount of people to move servers even if it means losing the shards and airship they might have / be part of? Use the shards before you xfer and there are plenty of guilds to join with maxed out ships making the loss rather small and the gain rather large if you are not currently closely attached to a particular guild.

Solutions:
VIP is not hard to fix in a financially responsible way.
- up the xp bonus to +25%
- allow VIP to start at level 4 after a TR
Cost: none (or as close to it as possible). No lost revenue and near no dev time to make it happen. Just do it!

Server transfer:
Thats the really hard one. It almost makes understanding the wife easy SSGs either needs to
- Not give any free xfers (which would rightfully **** those with stranded HC characters off) OR
- Make a technical solution so ONLY characters and ONLY gear from HC can transfer freely OR
- Give free transfers to all servers to even the playing field.
The middle one is the correct solution but sadly also the most difficult one, if at all possible. The first one is the easiest one and infers no fiscal loss - but also means going back on a promise after the problems with xfers from HC making it a bad choice. The third will even the playing field and certainly not annoy any players - but comes as a loss in terms of xp pots and misc other stuff. But given free transfers only to two servers is emphatically not the correct solution!

I wish they would release the number of VIP subscribers. Then we could count the handful of angry people and get the percentage of VIPs that are currently unhappy. My feeling is that less than 1% are unhappy, but that's just a feeling. Would be nice to know how right or wrong I am.

[Eantarus]

I wish they would release the number of VIP subscribers. Then we could count the handful of angry people and get the percentage of VIPs that are currently unhappy. My feeling is that less than 1% are unhappy, but that's just a feeling. Would be nice to know how right or wrong I am.

Its definitely a lot more than 1%.

[Drekisen]

I'm failing to see how anyone with any serious amount invested on their current server is going to move. I worked my butt off to make a solo guild and get it up to 100, have a full size astral airship and all of the amenities. I would rather stay on Argo alone than give all of that up.

The ViP suggestion sounds pretty awesome, I am a long time premium but would definitely sub for +25% XP and starting new lives at level 4 for sure!

[superevbully]

Fiscally irrespnsible might be correct when it comes to giving free gold rolls to VIP. SSG is more likely to have the numbers on sales to back that up than we are to be able to judge by guessing. So, I am not going to judge that particular decision.

However, a couple more things are fiscally irresponsible and more so in my book.

a) Annoying VIPs so much that they stop using money on the game for one and post negatively in spades on the forum which impacts potential new players that read it. Just give VIP +25% xp and give VIP the option to start at level 4 after a TR already and move on. Thats hardly fiscally an issue - those that purchase pots, and I do from time to time, certainly still will do so. Infact, it means VIP earn less free DDO points per life as they run fewer quests.

b) Grossly disfavoring the other servers by given free transfer to two servers. I understand the issue at hand with HC characters but the implications are really bad. Already I am hearing of quite a few high end gamers that will be leaving my server of choice because of the free move. You are gutting the other servers and those of us that do not want to move are more likely to simply stop playing (and paying) due to this horrible choice. If some leave and some stop due to that - you have a ghosttown and even more will stop from that. At the very least restrict the free move to those characters that orginated from HC (or make it free to move to any server to even the field)

c) It gets worse though, fiscally. Anyone on one of the two favored servers will be able to move up to 11 free xp pots from each of the other servers depending on the expansions they have bought. Thats 77 free xp pots. Not to mention any other items they may have rolled on those servers. To prevent that SSGs needs not only to restrict the free move to characters that came from HC but also restrict them to being able to carry items that orginated from HC. Oh, and if you have characters on Wayfinder from 2020 they may have both a heroic and an epic xp stone (btc atleast) so if you care to you can have another mid epic level character in a few mins if that strikes your fancy. Try to tell me that wont entice a significant amount of people to move servers even if it means losing the shards and airship they might have / be part of? Use the shards before you xfer and there are plenty of guilds to join with maxed out ships making the loss rather small and the gain rather large if you are not currently closely attached to a particular guild.

Solutions:
VIP is not hard to fix in a financially responsible way.
- up the xp bonus to +25%
- allow VIP to start at level 4 after a TR
Cost: none (or as close to it as possible). No lost revenue and near no dev time to make it happen. Just do it!

Server transfer:
Thats the really hard one. It almost makes understanding the wife easy SSGs either needs to
- Not give any free xfers (which would rightfully **** those with stranded HC characters off) OR
- Make a technical solution so ONLY characters and ONLY gear from HC can transfer freely OR
- Give free transfers to all servers to even the playing field.
The middle one is the correct solution but sadly also the most difficult one, if at all possible. The first one is the easiest one and infers no fiscal loss - but also means going back on a promise after the problems with xfers from HC making it a bad choice. The third will even the playing field and certainly not annoy any players - but comes as a loss in terms of xp pots and misc other stuff. But given free transfers only to two servers is emphatically not the correct solution!

Dude enough with the transfer concerns .people have been waiting since oct 26th im gonna assume u arent one of em ....they messed up, havent taken the bull by the horns to fix this issue when it became clear there was a issue as matter of fact other servers became untransferable later .........they also promised lol ..........u want deathnail to the servers that are named orien sarlona go ahead with your proposals and so u can keep your petty game just how u like it they will die

[Ereshkigal]

Its definitely a lot more than 1%.

I wonder if 1% of VIPs even go to these forums...

[Strider1963]

Solutions:
VIP is not hard to fix in a financially responsible way.
- up the xp bonus to +25%
- allow VIP to start at level 4 after a TR
Cost: none (or as close to it as possible). No lost revenue and near no dev time to make it happen. Just do it!


The OP is 100% right with this one. Starting at level 4 would be a REAL perk and be virtually no cost to their revenue. I would think it actually would increase revenue as it would be much more attractive to become VIP for the many people on the tr train here.