Wilderness areas need to go

[Alrik_Fassbauer]

I was thinking about playing the game 3 times today but then was thinking huh do I want to run for 30 mins plus around the isle of dread to do the quests just aimlessly staring at the screen and my answer was no...

Say that to the creators of the original pen & paper thing ...

[MIvan]

barovia is one example that did it both right and oh so wrong. it has this huge zone (albeit samey and mostly empty), that at the end of the day, nobody has to play because you have access to teleportation right from the start. wheloon (as already mentioned in this thread) and stormhorns did it quite good, but both had some issues in other areas. paying for the travel was a big big nono!

If players enter a wilderness only to run to quests, then it is a waste, both player and dev time.
Having (or not) a teleporter to quests, does not change this at all. What a teleporter changes, is how I feel about the area.
The teleporter system in Ravenloft, makes it the best they ever made. It gives the players the freedom to choose and do what they want to do.
We should not 'have to play' in a wilderness area, we should 'want to play' in it. Forcing players to run through an area wont make it good or 'played', just hated.
The teleporter does not make Barovia wasted, anybody anytime can choose to do it. And ppl do, you can see regular LFMs for Barovia slayer.

In contrast there is stormhorns. Very high ranked on the 'worst wilderness ever' list. Quests are far away from entrance, even far away from teleport locations too.
Making me hate the whole area so much, I enter it only once a life (truly once, doing only epic never heroic) and I don't spend a second more there, than I need to run to quests.

But lets the numbers talk.
In the past few months I did 20 ETRs. After each, I did every quest for ES sagas.
Although I spent more time overall in stormhorns, now I have 7500 kills in Barovia, and less than 100 in stormhorns.
That makes me feel, every second spent in stormhorns is a waste of time. And I hate that.
But we should enjoy the time we spend in game, that keeps us log in the next day again.


The problems with 'unlocking' teleports like 3BC is, that:

• they are like non existent for players who TR frequently and do the quests once a life. (However they are more active and doing the quests more times in total, than the casual players who repeat them few times in a life.)
• big disadvantage for new / returning players. Could be very frustrating to see, that to find they way to quest was so slow and hard, it is finished right after they enter it (and hopefully after, not before).

Wilderness areas should not to go. They have their uses.
They can be done right, like Ravenloft, and bad like, hm, every other.
To make me (and I think a many more) like them better:

• they should have easy and quick access to quests
• teleports should not need to be unlocked, or if they do, they should be unlocked forever (not reseted by any form of reincarnation)
• +something that helps questing in overall: teleport to party member (if target is in quest, then to quest entrance)

Before anyone complains, these wont make wilderness areas less played, just make our life better.
I emphasize, I don't consider it 'playing in widerness', if anyone only runs to a quest.

[carsonfball]

Wow. Of all the things in this game to rage quit over. I would not have even put this one in the top 20.

Right? Are some of the quests annoying to get to? Sure. Does it prevent me from running specific quests? Sometimes. Would I quit the game over it? No, I just run other quests. For most level ranges, there is so much content that I end up skipping a lot of it anyway.

[carsonfball]

No explorers, no rares, no slayers. That whole zone was wasted development time due to the guide format.

I've ran slayers to completion there a few times. However, what I don't want to do is run through the wilderness to get to the quests. Absolutely nothing is preventing you from running s/r/e or even running to the quests there.

[Oxarhamar]

I've ran slayers to completion there a few times. However, what I don't want to do is run through the wilderness to get to the quests. Absolutely nothing is preventing you from running s/r/e or even running to the quests there.

+1
It’s always comes down to this

if a player wants to do Slayers that’s fine but that’s a choice making it so players can teleport isn’t going to change that gameplay as players who are just running to the quests aren’t exactly racking kills

I love doing slayers but if I’m going to a quest I’d rather teleport directly

[carsonfball]

Right? Are some of the quests annoying to get to? Sure. Does it prevent me from running specific quests? Sometimes. Would I quit the game over it? No, I just run other quests. For most level ranges, there is so much content that I end up skipping a lot of it anyway.

Case in point: I really like the two quests in Restless Isles. I haven't ran them in years though because of how annoying they are to get to. The last time I tried (early this year) I got lost getting to the first one because the map isn't even helpful in that wilderness. I would probably run those two quests nearly every life if I was able to just teleport to them.

[Wizard1406]

If players enter a wilderness only to run to quests, then it is a waste, both player and dev time.
Having (or not) a teleporter to quests, does not change this at all. What a teleporter changes, is how I feel about the area.
The teleporter system in Ravenloft, makes it the best they ever made. It gives the players the freedom to choose and do what they want to do.
We should not 'have to play' in a wilderness area, we should 'want to play' in it. Forcing players to run through an area wont make it good or 'played', just hated.
The teleporter does not make Barovia wasted, anybody anytime can choose to do it. And ppl do, you can see regular LFMs for Barovia slayer.

I agree. The argument : "But if there are teleports nobody plays the wildernesses" is a pretty weak one. Bee-lining to the quest entrances , not killing anything (usually) is not "playing" a wilderness zone. That would be slayer/rare/explorer. For those you can alway choose to do it.

[cdbd3rd]

NO WAY maybe teleports to quests once you have all explorers

I'm curious why folks are feeling this way - locking teleports behind completions of one sort or other.

(Not just you Uska, tho you've been around long enough to remember the game was originally marketed as NOT being about long time sinks)

[cdbd3rd]

Case in point: I really like the two quests in Restless Isles. .....

This map is indispensable for RI:



(...it is missing a couple notes that I had to pen in on my copy. Kaedak, rare spawn is in that dotted hidden passage, Snikket the rare scorpion spawns between the two lower right Wildmen locations, and Than Hap spawns in the passage near the skeletons with the locked loot chest. I do not recall the original creator or would give credit.)

[Annex]

For the two Restless Isles quests, have someone else with the quests share them with your character, then use the guides. A character on a second account will serve. Using a guide, the run to the related quest is fairly short. You will need to memorize those two short paths, though. For Ghola Fan, I also use the key.

[Paragoons]

This map is indispensable for RI:



(...it is missing a couple notes that I had to pen in on my copy. Kaedak, rare spawn is in that dotted hidden passage, Snikket the rare scorpion spawns between the two lower right Wildmen locations, and Than Hap spawns in the passage near the skeletons with the locked loot chest. I do not recall the original creator or would give credit.)

You do know the rule of design right? That if people need schemas and documents to understand how to get basic things such as getting to a quest door for a miserable what is it 17-20k exp?
Then its not worth it and its bad design

[Anuulified]

I was thinking about playing the game 3 times today but then was thinking huh do I want to run for 30 mins plus around the isle of dread to do the quests just aimlessly staring at the screen and my answer was no...
Either make wilderness area exploration somehow more valuable or just let us teleport to quest, this is such boring bs especially on MY 17 TH LIFE
You make us reincarnate and then make us run around to repeat the same pointless thing that is not even gameplay its just staring at the screen until arriving at destination.

Just going to use my VIP sub until its close to expiration and unsubscribe until this if fixed, I came back after 8 month break, probably not coming back until this is gone, just wasting everyone's time

It literally takes 30 to 40 secs to get to every quest. This sounds lazy to me.

[balvix]

I was thinking about playing the game 3 times today but then was thinking huh do I want to run for 30 mins plus around the isle of dread to do the quests just aimlessly staring at the screen and my answer was no...
Either make wilderness area exploration somehow more valuable or just let us teleport to quest, this is such boring bs especially on MY 17 TH LIFE
You make us reincarnate and then make us run around to repeat the same pointless thing that is not even gameplay its just staring at the screen until arriving at destination.

Just going to use my VIP sub until its close to expiration and unsubscribe until this if fixed, I came back after 8 month break, probably not coming back until this is gone, just wasting everyone's time

Only 17 lives? J/k.
I don't really mind the wilderness areas personally, I find it to be about the same as running through the marketplace, or Estar, except with monsters running about. Usually the run about outside is only about 1-2 minutes between quests in a larger slayer zone, but most of them its fairly short, so, not a big deal.

[balvix]

This thread is simply "I want fast XP and that is all I want. Give me that or I quit."

This thread is no different from the many other threads complaining "Why do I have to play the game at all when all I really want is the big XP button so I can zerg my way to full power at end game so I can get bored and complain that there is nothing to do."

The quests, and the outdoor areas, ARE the game. I don't mind the teleport, but if they don't put it in, then I will run to the quests. It isn't a big deal. It doesn't take that long.

And believe it or not some of us DO ENJOY the outdoor areas and really appreciate the different worlds built for us by the developers. If you like dungeons and dragons, then you like the outdoor areas. If you are simply a zerg everthing and ignore anything that even slows me down player, then you really dont care about content, I don't even know why you are playing the game.

Perfectly said. It seems that there are a lot of people that no longer want an adventure. It seems that they would like the mabar style of every quest in a single room and all you have to do is pick the door that you want to enter. Maybe they would prefer the entire game to be in a single room with about 2ft of room to either side of them and a single door with a multiselector that you can simply choose how much xp you want added to your total. Sounds fun. People, half the game is the stories and adventure, its not just a race to the end of a hallway to see who can loot a chest first and exit. If you want a game with no adventure at all then great, there are plenty out there. I have been playing this game since before level 20 was a thing, and my My main toon has almost 150 lives, but I still don't mind the run through the wilderness, especially with the advent of mounts. Relax people, this is a game built around adventure, its not a job, enjoy it.

[Oxarhamar]

It literally takes 30 to 40 secs to get to every quest. This sounds lazy to me.

This sounds like a serious exaggerated

[Oxarhamar]

Perfectly said. It seems that there are a lot of people that no longer want an adventure. It seems that they would like the mabar style of every quest in a single room and all you have to do is pick the door that you want to enter. Maybe they would prefer the entire game to be in a single room with about 2ft of room to either side of them and a single door with a multiselector that you can simply choose how much xp you want added to your total. Sounds fun. People, half the game is the stories and adventure, its not just a race to the end of a hallway to see who can loot a chest first and exit. If you want a game with no adventure at all then great, there are plenty out there. I have been playing this game since before level 20 was a thing, and my My main toon has almost 150 lives, but I still don't mind the run through the wilderness, especially with the advent of mounts. Relax people, this is a game built around adventure, its not a job, enjoy it.

Yeah after the umpteenth time explorer area is not really an adventure anymore

I love slayers but running out to quests isn't adventure

Give me quest doors all day Ravinloft did it best

[Bogenbroom]

I strongly disagree with the OPs premise. Yes, there are wilderness zones that are... problematic, but almost all of them created since epic hit have there place. For many of them the run to the quest is *part* of the quest (like in the King's Forest). Ravenloft's system works for Ravenloft because it is such a large area. But Isle of Dread is such a small area are so small and the teleports are are built to get you further and further out to the edges. I feel it is an exceptional system. It gets you the flavor of the Isle but also quick access to just about every quest.

Now the Sands and the Restless Isles are bad designs and I chalk them up to learning. And, while I love the Cogs, I can see how it doesn't fit great into a "if the zone is too vast or complex, make a teleport" model.

I can also see how people that stick with Reaper would find explorers too easy and tedious. I wouldn't be against some way to have difficulty options there. If the devs wanted to have those zones be part of the quest experience i could see "You need to be in the explorer on elite to open elite quests" model or some such. Just a thought.

[kmoustakas]

Don't forget for restless isles someone can share you the quests to enable the teleports.

I wish they redo that wilderness with a magic flying carpets and monsters underwater and (insert wishful thinking)

[Oxarhamar]

Don't forget for restless isles someone can share you the quests to enable the teleports.

I wish they redo that wilderness with a magic flying carpets and monsters underwater and (insert wishful thinking)

They really could use the same concept as the soar sleds but, make it sitting position

[iPuffinstuff]

I for one do not want wilderness removed. I play the game because I love d&d. I actually enjoy running to quests because I've never followed any type of TR method. I don't run the highest xp quests or the quickest quests. I run the quests I enjoy. Out of all the wilderness areas each one has like 2 to maybe 3 I enjoy doing and I even skip those some times. I think I have around 20+ trs on main and a few alts with 6 to 10 trs.
So no, please don't remove the wilderness areas. If they wish to give the players who treat the game as a job and want to do nothing except maximize there pots/buffs a portal, I say go right ahead. Don't remove them though.