32 Point Drow Sacred Fist - Follower of Vulkoor - 16/3/1 Paladin / Monk / FvS

[dogsoldier]

I was running with some folk, talking about dropping SF 18 for Monk 3, and they were appalled - not by the loss of SF Core 18, but the loss of Sacred Defender Core 18, namely:

• +25 Healing Amp
• +3 Lay on Hands charges
• +10% Sacred Bonus to Max HP
• +5 to Physical and Magical Resistance Rating

That's a pretty good laundry list. Added to the rest, for 31 AP... attractive.

As shown, this build doesn't specify the AP spread - wondering if you'd dismissed SD or what, and which tree you were considering for Tier V.

Still theory-crafting here, so the jury's out, but I'm thinking now that this build might(?) be better for Heroic Leveling (i.e. it will get to 20 better), but for going on to 30 it might not be the best mix? Just adding new grist to the mill. :/

Oh I can totally see the perspective of that, no question, if you wanted to main tree Sacred Defender, that is the way to go. And it is sound logic in that scenario.

I am not going further into Sacred Defender than 13 AP. I need all of the extra AP that I can get in Drow and Monk Trees, and Vistani if I swap to Daggers. For Daggers + Sacred Fist that is minimum 24/23 AP in those trees, locking out full investment in Sacred Defender. If you go mostly Sacred Fist and Drow trees and pickup nice stuff from Monk, same deal, you are not going to have the AP for getting to 31 AP in Defender anyway.

It is a totally different discussion about how it may be possible to achieve higher defenses with 13 AP in Defender, and Embracing the Zen of the Monk lifestyle. Versus 31 AP in defender with just 1 Monk level, and ignoring the Zen entirely, but perhaps going into Unyielding Sentinal for even more Lay on hands and recharging there. There are some arguments to be made either way.

I am embracing the Zen and with my setup, and I totally do not need the lay on hands outside of emergency situations.

[dogsoldier]

Still theory-crafting here, so the jury's out, but I'm thinking now that this build might(?) be better for Heroic Leveling (i.e. it will get to 20 better), but for going on to 30 it might not be the best mix? Just adding new grist to the mill. :/

Significantly better this way 1-7, just because of the CHA to hit and dmg with Shadowblades.

8-11, meh, kind of about the same.

12-20:
This pulls ahead, no question, due to better Ki management.

20+:
Gets a little better because can make better usage of GMoF.

32: I know the DPS is going to be higher, simply because it is widely acknowledged that the Sacred Fist tree does not have that great of T5 abilities. Not everything has to be top tier DPS though, and if going T5 Defender and T5 Unyielding, my only question is: "What is your MRR at 32?"

[C-Dog]

... if going T5 Defender and T5 Unyielding, my only question is: "What is your MRR at 32?"

Really? My question would be "How did you get TWO Tier 5's?!"

[dogsoldier]

Really? My question would be "How did you get TWO Tier 5's?!"

I assumed that 31 defender also meant T5s there. Again Sacred Fist T5s are not that great, may as well lean into the tanky aspect of that as that setup. It is the only reason I could see getting to 31 there to begin with.

[dogsoldier]

I did post an 18/1/1 build idea that uses SWF (easier to do with the extra skill points and extra feat from Human). That would have the flexibility of going Swim Cleric in Radiant Servant or being pretty tanky while leveling in Defender. They would not have access to as many martial trees (human doesnt help much there, nor does just one level in monk and fvs). It also musters enough Zen to have the option of embracing it at level 32 if you choose to.

They would have Vistani though. So they would have the option to go DPS, or Tank, or Swim Cleric. I actually think it would be a blast to play just because of the flexibility of having evasion and T5 Radiant Servant aura for the Crucible Swim. On that build, the Crucible would have to be my favorite quest. Another Man's Treasure would be a lot more fun too, wouldn't have the healing aura, but wouldn't need it at level 8 anyway, and that is where either build starts to get good with the level 6 cores and CHA to hit / dmg with Favored Centered weapons.

[dogsoldier]

The first life no gear except what I find test is parked at level 4. Contemplating what to do for gear. For leveling, I just just get anything that I find, and that works. I also want to put together a decent enough gear set to complete Saltmarsh Saga Elite or R1 without too much difficulty. Initially I was eyeing the Cove Shortwords, but I think I am going to try to get one of or both of hopefully, the Tielfling Assassin's Blade and the Sky Pirate's Dagger.

Here were the Enhancements at level 3, Leaning into Drow to make up for the : 1/1/1 Split:



And then at level 4, with 2 Levels of Sacred Fist, I can now move those Drow AP over there and pickup Exalted Whirlwind. I had not really seen how cool this was on an Iconic, as I started with Incinerating Wave as a Ki spell. But this could be really good as a combo option, as long as you have enough Ki for both the melee attack and the spell attack.



Edit: Pulled the Tiefling Assassin's Blade First try, chalking that up to beginners luck, though I had only pulled one shortsword prior to that, and it was a ML5 one that I cannot use, so I suppose I may be due for a little luck. Checked Runearm and Dagger chests too, for something to sell (or keep in the case of the dagger), no dice.



Now I need something to craft on, and I have that vanilla ML5 shortsword, but I hate to craft on anything that does not have at least one augment slot. For Crafting, lest ye think I am cheating, I am only going to craft level 1ish Cannith recipes, and it is really easy to level crafting up to where you can craft a ML4 item, literally just making a few Min Level Shards. I am not going to pillage my mules' dual slot hoard, that would be cheating. I want to find a shortsword with one augment slot on it, hopefully, or if not, at least Flametouched so it could be a DR breaker too, since I cannot craft the Good Effect, that is way out of reach.

Edit: Ran Haverdasher Elite x2 and Irestone Normal, did not find another Shortsword, but I found this little gem, it has ML4 scaling, same as cannith, and a useful kicker effect, and it is centering. I thought I would need dual short swords, and eventually yeah, but I wont have AP for getting back into the drow tree for a little while anyway. So now, getting all of the essentials on my gear: Fortification, Deathblock, Resistance, Protection, Deadly, Concentration, Feather Falling, Speed, etc. so that I can take on Saltmarsh.

[dogsoldier]

I hadn't really considered adding Chronoscope loot into the mix, because it would not have been so easy to acquire on my own, but then someone posted an R1 6-8 Chronoscope LFM, I was just thinking any craftable trinket would be great.

We failed the R1 raid before the first mini-boss (big pack of mobs before the bank fight), went back on Hard, and were able to complete it.

I pulled this, which has +4 CHA:
https://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Helm_of_Frost

And a Gem of Many Facets, which is what I was after, a craftable trinket. Someone passed me another because I mentioned that I wanted to craft a couple. One of those two trinkets has useless set bonuses on them. The other one, has really good ones.

While Sacred Fist Ki Spells scale on Melee power, they can also Crit, so the same rules there apply as would to a caster (fire and light critical chance). This is similar to how they can be interrupted, so concentration rules apply, and then Quicken becomes important at a certain point (good to have by Epic, essential to have at Legendary).

The set bonuses are for BOTH Light and Fire Crit Chance. This is kind of a Unicorn type of combo, so I am going to have to complete the sets. The Red Fens one is easy, because you get named items for those sets included in end reward for those quests on any difficulty (level 9 quest on normal for instance). The Sands part is pretty easy too, but requires more random luck from the chest, its a wilderness rare, level 8-15 zone. I will post an update with the completed set pieces when I get them, and an idea for what to craft on the trinket.

[dogsoldier]

The effects that I am crafting on the Gem of Many Facets are just Cannith Crafting Level 50 effects (high enough crafting to make ML5 items). I am crafting this one for ML10 though, so it lines up with one of the set bonus items that I found, and level 10 is a good place to craft things anyway (Ravenloft cailber effects, and the earliest that you could add a 3rd effect). ML10 is just 100 Crafting levels, so if you are able to keep your crafting up to where you can craft for your own level, this is easy to do.

GoMF Crafted Prefix: Seeker +6, Suffix: Deadly +5

A Third Effect is possible, but that would require either house Cannith favor via high level quests, or a store bought mark of house Cannith, so I am not doing that for now. It is best to hold off on it anyway, until you complete your ML10/11 gear tetris anyway, as you might find insightful deadly or insightful seeker on something, and then you can add the other one to the GoMF.

ML10 Crafted Gem of Many Facets:


ML7 Sacred Band, using this now:


ML10 Robe of Fire, cannot use this yet, but it is not too far off. A couple of ML11 items from Sands would be better (bracers of the hunter, or firestorm greaves), but I do not have those ... yet.

[dogsoldier]

At Level 8 this is now at nearly full investment in Sacred Fist and Radiant Servant trees. We do not need to go past 23 AP in Sacred Fist because we are not going to T5 that tree, and we are not going to have enough AP to go past 6 in Radiant Servant.

Future AP go into Defender, and Drow trees, mostly, and then more into Monk trees when we pickup 2-3 levels of Monk.

[jskinner937]

At Level 8 this is now at nearly full investment in Sacred Fist and Radiant Servant trees. We do not need to go past 23 AP in Sacred Fist because we are not going to T5 that tree, and we are not going to have enough AP to go past 6 in Radiant Servant.

Future AP go into Defender, and Drow trees, mostly, and then more into Monk trees when we pickup 2-3 levels of Monk.

SWF is far superior to TWF at end game, especially with offhand versatility. The healing ki from 3 monk is weak and not worth losing pally levels and level 5 spells. I would love to go Core 5 Sacred Defender but its just too hard to fit considering your dumping so much into vistani, but is possible if you give up on the sacred fist tree altogether. Let me post a build for a dagger for an option to consider, based on my experience running mid to high reapers at cap, not based on levelling. To me this is the only viable sacred fist build at end game, which I agree handwraps are garbage DPS.

https://forums.ddo.com/forums/showth...06#post6545606

[droid327]

I've been running something along these lines lately too,, it's pretty legit. Imo the best part of fist is the aoe, so I leaned into that - it's the new spin to win build and it's so fast, closest thing yet to a melee sorc that I've seen

18/1 fvs/1 monk, MFPPP+, any race, cha>con, max conc+7 balance

Dodge SWF Mob WWA ISWF IC:P GSWF OHV (human: prec)

41 vkf 6 sac def 4 soul 1 shintao rest fist

I find basic sun stance is adequate, just doubling your ki gen keeps you fed. Feat WW is your go-to button for everything, Exalted WW as needed when the feat is on cd, and Wave as your room clear button. Zeal+CSW for your L4s.

I think 3 monk for healing ki is redundant, LoH and cure do the job fine. /1/1 adds the two things the class really lacks - extra ki gen and a cha trance. Spin spam just blenders through trash mobs, and you can rapid slash+haste boost+ex smite to focus hard targets, use your VKF T5s for bosses, plus wwa is still good against them too.

It's hard to describe because you can't tell on paper, but double wwa just fits the flow of combat really well. Mobs seem to arrive around you at just the right time to hit your spin after you buff up against a priority mob. And you don't have to worry about waiting till mobs are in range since you can hit it every ~2 secs anyway. Not having to group mobs in front like you do for cleave and thf is huge, too. Run past a pack, turn, and wave is also an effective maneuver. Overall it just feels like you fly through quests.

[jskinner937]

I've been running something along these lines lately too,, it's pretty legit. Imo the best part of fist is the aoe, so I leaned into that - it's the new spin to win build and it's so fast, closest thing yet to a melee sorc that I've seen

18/1 fvs/1 monk, MFPPP+, any race, cha>con, max conc+7 balance

Dodge SWF Mob WWA ISWF IC:P GSWF OHV (human: prec)

41 vkf 6 sac def 4 soul 1 shintao rest fist

I find basic sun stance is adequate, just doubling your ki gen keeps you fed. Feat WW is your go-to button for everything, Exalted WW as needed when the feat is on cd, and Wave as your room clear button. Zeal+CSW for your L4s.

I think 3 monk for healing ki is redundant, LoH and cure do the job fine. /1/1 adds the two things the class really lacks - extra ki gen and a cha trance. Spin spam just blenders through trash mobs, and you can rapid slash+haste boost+ex smite to focus hard targets, use your VKF T5s for bosses, plus wwa is still good against them too.

It's hard to describe because you can't tell on paper, but double wwa just fits the flow of combat really well. Mobs seem to arrive around you at just the right time to hit your spin after you buff up against a priority mob. And you don't have to worry about waiting till mobs are in range since you can hit it every ~2 secs anyway. Not having to group mobs in front like you do for cleave and thf is huge, too. Run past a pack, turn, and wave is also an effective maneuver. Overall it just feels like you fly through quests.

Well I have tested 16/3/1 and 18/1/1 in epics and cap. I can say those extra 2 pally lives mean alot less than i expected since not going sacred def or sacred fist core 5. Yeah Healing Ki with 3 monk is meh, but the stacking run speed with sacred fist is worth losing 1 4th level spell imo. Ki Explosion is not great, when you will have drifting lotus in GMoF. And as I mentioned in my other thread, You can do better feat selection at 1 if you go FVS or Pally 1st Level and get Beloved Child +3h/d later by taking blood of vol at 1, in exchange for 6 skill points at level 1 that is. Pretty good trade imo.

[Kodwraith]

I just rolled up this split (16/3/1) on my main as a SWF longsword build on my main (I need Dwarf lives so Dwarf). I'll let you know how it goes.

My plan for early level splits was this:

CHA, CON, a bit of DEX.
1 Monk: SWF, Dodge
2 FVS: Celestial Host LS Favored Weapon
3 Monk: WF: Slash, WSS
4: SF
5: SF
6: SF Adept of Forms
7-12: SF Imp SWF at 9, Master of Forms or Imp Crit at 12.
13: Monk Path of Light.
14:20: SF.

This leaves Holy Sword until 18, which is not ideal. I might try the VKF T5 with a dagger while leveling but it just feels wrong. I might drop the third monk level depending on how the self healing goes.

Right now at L4 I'm 12ish API into Feydark for the CHA hit/dmg, but will pull out of that into SF/VKF/other stuff.

[Xandez]

Howdy!


I had a pure sacred fist 1st lifer for which i used TWF longswords @lvl 20... (x2 Oathblades)
Leveling was done with handwraps.

Later it was lesser reinced to 18/1/1 (sacred fist/monk/fvs) and im now using daggers with it.
CHA based (have +8 cha tome. rest +2s)

Using 41 pt into vistani tree, 33 pts into sacred fist tree, 4 pts war soul (cha trance) and 1 pt in monk (henshin mystic 1st core).

The DPS is solid (imo). Im mostly soloing or duoing EEs with my friend and were having a blast. Im sure it prolly falls flat on reaper or needs someone tanking but... for me it works ok.

PS. My friend uses similarish build but used short swords instead (iirc he planned to try daggers, so have to ask how they feel vs SS)

(Currently @lvl 30)

++Xan