A suggested compromise fix for the HCL DOT issue

[fatherpirate]

...sorry, DOT issue.

A suggestion,

Just turn off the hounds DOTS
and have the debuff strictly timed,
15 seconds only or such.
(yes I know that makes them weaker)
and to make up the difficulty difference,
turn on the mimics.

Should make the HCL season lively but manageable.
- IF YOU DO THIS PLEASE PUT OUT A NOTICE IN GAME-
got to be fair and tell folks when the rules change in
the middle of the event.

Then if one gets stuck in a wall, who cares.
If the hunted bales on the party, again, who cares.

It would fix a lot of issues.

[cdbd3rd]

I didn't see the exact quote, but I've read others say/post that Cord has already confirmed there will no changes to the mutts.

[[ 2nd edit: In fact, I just watched the near party-wipe vid and read more bug experiences. Deleted my previous ill-informed opinion. ]]

[jskinner937]

The DOT spawn issue is the only real big issue here.

But I would be OK if they removed hounds completely or just the DOT on hard and under. This will not affect leaderboards.

As far as mitigation to a bugged hound spawn....quicken with dragonmark of passage or simply teleport if you have arcane spells is an option. Also saltmarsh teleport seems to persist through damage. Or in the case of quests with the potential for water spawns, maybe wait for a spawn if its going to be dicey (like in newcommers).

And yeah a change when others earned a spot on leaderboards already would be unfair...rewards are not affected either way.

[Karthunk]

I didn't see the exact quote, but I've read others say/post that Cord has already confirmed there will no changes to the mutts.

As much as I dislike how they've been implemented, I have to agree that (edit: usually) making any changes after so many have either overcome them (or been run under by them) as they are would be a bad move.

edit: Personally, I'd be okay with it killing the DOTs. Judging by some other posts/threads I've now wandered further and seen, perhaps it wouldn't be hated as much as most other changes would be mid-season.

They need to make changes because the hounds are bugging out and wiping groups. This is not an issue with an ability being too powerful if the source was acting properly, it's as issue with said ability being over powered when players can not make it stop because they can't kill the source.

[Aelonwy]

I didn't see the exact quote, but I've read others say/post that Cord has already confirmed there will no changes to the mutts.

That would be very bad faith with the player base because their implementation is obviously bad and buggy. Their mistake. They need to fix it to the best of their ability. Saying "oh whoops, cats out of the bag too late now" is lazy, ineffectual, and demonstrably shows a lack of care for the players. No not a lack of care a disregard bordering on contempt.

[cdbd3rd]

That would be very bad faith with the player base because their implementation is obviously bad and buggy. Their mistake. They need to fix it to the best of their ability. ....

Agreed. It didn't take much reading to see just HOW badly they were bugged.

In most cases, any change mid-season would be met by an angry mob. That's what I had based my previous opinion on. However, I think this one would be generally accepted fix even by those who have somehow survived.

[fatherpirate]

If the hound fix is not do-able (have no idea how hard it would be to fix on the programming end)
then even swapping them out for standard level
Champions would be fine.

The key is
Fix it or Replace it or Remove it.
but don't leave it broken.

[Oxarhamar]

If the hound fix is not do-able (have no idea how hard it would be to fix on the programming end)
then even swapping them out for standard level
Champions would be fine.

The key is
Fix it or Replace it or Remove it.
but don't leave it broken.

It’s certainly doable as Reapers once had the same issue & we’re fixed


I don’t think that they can stop them from spawning in walls or floors or water but they can fix the dot

[Khimberlhyte]

I think the radius / line of sight DoT like Fear reapers would be more reasonable for the Hounds. Even Fears are buggy as hell on the regular servers, recently applying full stacks on death, etc - and that is with widespread testing, years of bug reporting on live servers, etc. As a new surprise one-off, there was an element of luck in introducing the Hound mechanic, and SSG seems to have rolled a 1. A dungeon-wide DoT, combined with the many bugs and conflicting systems in DDO is just asking for trouble.

For full disclosure, I haven't encountered the DoT yet because the sheer unfairness of party wipes due to bugs has led me to question whether to continue in HC6. My level 5 character is semi-parked, waiting to see if the radius is changed and the water/wall spawn is fixed.

[Jerevth]

Hello! We are actively looking into this issue. It appears to be caused by a very old failsafe system meant to handle monsters falling too far that makes a few baseline assumptions about monsters that are not accurate in the current game. We're working on a fix! Additionally, we're looking at adding some effect cooldowns to make sure that if any other similar situations are floating out there, you can't get stacks of the DOT and vulnerability much faster than the normal rate.

We don't have an ETA for fixes yet, but we will keep you all posted as that develops!

(P.S. Before anyone asks, we're also looking into Hounds not becoming attackable on spawning, no updates there yet.)

from here

Still, with an unknown implementation date, I may skirt the edges of level 5 (HH for gearing) and train up some alts until the hounds are somewhat more abiding of the laws of game-physics...

[slarden]

The dog not spawning and staying yellow but still dotting the party could end being a lag issue.

If that is the case not sure it is fixable unless they ensure the dot starts only after it's a red named.

The potential list of pitfalls with the hounds is huge - makes me think the only reasonable fix is to adjust range like a fear reaper. Could still cause a quest to be uncompletable but at least the party can run away and recall rather than die to a glitch.

[fatherpirate]

I will agree totally with one issue.
The DOT should be local around the hound, not the whole map.

I know why they did it.

To ... encourage... coordination in a group
and punish leaches that join a PUG and hide somewhere so the
rest of the part has to do the work.

Great idea ... if the hounds worked perfectly, but they don't
and I will guess they never will.

so in the end, bad idea.
just make the DOT 10 ft and move on.

[Oxarhamar]

I will agree totally with one issue.
The DOT should be local around the hound, not the whole map.

I know why they did it.

To ... encourage... coordination in a group
and punish leaches that join a PUG and hide somewhere so the
rest of the part has to do the work.

Great idea ... if the hounds worked perfectly, but they don't
and I will guess they never will.

so in the end, bad idea.
just make the DOT 10 ft and move on.

No that’s not why they did it or can you quote that reasoning?

It’s already being looked at for a change as reapers that did the same have been changed already

[misterski]

I will agree totally with one issue.
The DOT should be local around the hound, not the whole map.

I know why they did it.

To ... encourage... coordination in a group
and punish leaches that join a PUG and hide somewhere so the
rest of the part has to do the work.

Great idea ... if the hounds worked perfectly, but they don't
and I will guess they never will.

so in the end, bad idea.
just make the DOT 10 ft and move on.

You're so transparent it's laughable. You only propose this so ranged characters don't have to worry about the dot anymore. ROFLMAO

[Kaldair_Returns]

I will agree totally with one issue.
The DOT should be local around the hound, not the whole map.

I know why they did it.

To ... encourage... coordination in a group
and punish leaches that join a PUG and hide somewhere so the
rest of the part has to do the work.

Great idea ... if the hounds worked perfectly, but they don't
and I will guess they never will.

so in the end, bad idea.
just make the DOT 10 ft and move on.

No, just spawn the dogs on the piker(s) - easy enough to track through existing game logging.

[fatherpirate]

You're so transparent it's laughable. You only propose this so ranged characters don't have to worry about the dot anymore. ROFLMAO

I have about 6 characters on HCL currently active and have never been killed by a hound (yet)
mainly because I play solo so I always know they are coming and I always drop them in seconds.

I will be honest

I DON'T CARE IF THEY CHANGE OR FIX THE HOUNDS BECAUSE
IT DOES NOT EFFECT MY PLAY STYLE AT ALL.

I am only posting suggestions, fixes etc. for other players.

for me, hound spawns and is dead before 1 dot
or spawns and is dead after the DOT hits only once (hirelings)

Do not assume I only post about issues that effect me,
I post about issues that effect everyone.
For better or worse.

[Karthunk]

You're so transparent it's laughable. You only propose this so ranged characters don't have to worry about the dot anymore. ROFLMAO

Please try to keep up. The hounds are bugging out, read unable to be killed, and thus wiping groups with the zone wide DoT. This has nothing to do with ranged characters.

[Oxarhamar]

I have about 6 characters on HCL currently active and have never been killed by a hound (yet)
mainly because I play solo so I always know they are coming and I always drop them in seconds.

I will be honest

I DON'T CARE IF THEY CHANGE OR FIX THE HOUNDS BECAUSE
IT DOES NOT EFFECT MY PLAY STYLE AT ALL.

I am only posting suggestions, fixes etc. for other players.

for me, hound spawns and is dead before 1 dot
or spawns and is dead after the DOT hits only once (hirelings)

Do not assume I only post about issues that effect me,
I post about issues that effect everyone.
For better or worse.

Playing solo won’t protect you from bugs forever you aren’t immune to it just because it has not happened yet

[fatherpirate]

Playing solo won’t protect you from bugs forever you aren’t immune to it just because it has not happened yet

If it is bugged and can't be hit, will use teleport or DD (quickened) to bug out,
but has not happened yet.

[Oxarhamar]

If it is bugged and can't be hit, will use teleport or DD (quickened) to bug out,
but has not happened yet.

You can count on that if you like but it’s not 100%