A Golden Opportunity

[Nandos]

DDO has one shot at this. I hope they plan for the movie release in advance as well. They absolutely need to change the default new player server from Argonnessen to a different one at the very least. Just imagine if like 600 new players tried to create characters on Argo the Sunday after the movie released. The server would crash and burn. Wayfinder would be the only server running now that could probably handle that.

There are a lot of things they can do such as:

month long server bonuses in celebration of the movie
free quest giveaway or make a lot of quests permanently free (Borderlands especially)
big sales on the expansions
allow first lifers to open up quests on hard. normal is just too easy and people will quickly get bored if they can 1 shot everything

[fatherpirate]

sure, sounds good

[TedSandyman]

it'll be totally wasted if they can't get the game to run without the: you need to ask on the forums, find what DX/msi package is missing, find the DX/msi package from 15 years ago you need and download +install nonsense

Personally, in 12 years, never needed to do any of this.

[Artos_Fabril]

DDO doesn't even have a google add on the 3.5 SRD, so imagining they'll capitalize with appropriate advertising on/around the movie is rather unjustified. I'd be surprised if even 1% of the ticket sales convert into people looking for an MMO.

It will be even worse if official WotC websites run ads for the other "D&D MMO"

[Oxarhamar]

DDO doesn't even have a google add on the 3.5 SRD, so imagining they'll capitalize with appropriate advertising on/around the movie is rather unjustified. I'd be surprised if even 1% of the ticket sales convert into people looking for an MMO.

It will be even worse if official WotC websites run ads for the other "D&D MMO"

Exactly

[Uska]

Can’t be as bad as the last one

Low bar

For a better d&d movie watch Dragonslayer better plot, acting and especially better Dragon and it’s a 41 year old movie

[Uska]

DDO doesn't even have a google add on the 3.5 SRD, so imagining they'll capitalize with appropriate advertising on/around the movie is rather unjustified. I'd be surprised if even 1% of the ticket sales convert into people looking for an MMO.

It will be even worse if official WotC websites run ads for the other "D&D MMO"

Is it still running?

[Artos_Fabril]

Is it still running?

As I post this there are twice as many people playing the other game through Steam as DDO (I don't know the proportion of each game that play through steam, but I'm pretty sure it's not the most common way people access DDO, so I can't guess what the actual player comparison is.

DDO is the #1 result for googling D&D MMO, but the other one is #2, and links to a page on the wizards.com domain instead of ddo.com, so it looks more official.

Maybe someone at EG7 has done the marketing legwork and has a plan, but it seems pretty clear that SSG hasn't.

The major point in favor of DDO (from the perspective of an MMO player who isn't familiar with either product) is that while SSG is relatively unknown, Perfect World has an actively negative reputation.

[Oxarhamar]

For a better d&d movie watch Dragonslayer better plot, acting and especially better Dragon and it’s a 41 year old movie

I agree it’s much better probably because it isn’t an official D&D movie

[Oxarhamar]

As I post this there are twice as many people playing the other game through Steam as DDO (I don't know the proportion of each game that play through steam, but I'm pretty sure it's not the most common way people access DDO, so I can't guess what the actual player comparison is.

DDO is the #1 result for googling D&D MMO, but the other one is #2, and links to a page on the wizards.com domain instead of ddo.com, so it looks more official.

Maybe someone at EG7 has done the marketing legwork and has a plan, but it seems pretty clear that SSG hasn't.

The major point in favor of DDO (from the perspective of an MMO player who isn't familiar with either product) is that while SSG is relatively unknown, Perfect World has an actively negative reputation.

DDO is on buried on Wizards page

Wizards adverts extremely bad mobile apps games before DDO embarrassing

[Uska]

As I post this there are twice as many people playing the other game through Steam as DDO (I don't know the proportion of each game that play through steam, but I'm pretty sure it's not the most common way people access DDO, so I can't guess what the actual player comparison is.

DDO is the #1 result for googling D&D MMO, but the other one is #2, and links to a page on the wizards.com domain instead of ddo.com, so it looks more official.

Maybe someone at EG7 has done the marketing legwork and has a plan, but it seems pretty clear that SSG hasn't.

The major point in favor of DDO (from the perspective of an MMO player who isn't familiar with either product) is that while SSG is relatively unknown, Perfect World has an actively negative reputation.

Never use steam if a game requires it then I don’t play

[WallStreetDragon]

SSG will finally have an opportunity to bring in new players in and around March 2023

They will leave just like the thousands of players we got during the pandemic and they all left looking at the state of the game.

2018: Severlin - we are working on server merge and MEGA server.
2020: Lynnabel - we need 2 years to update the graphics.

Just promise after promise, turns out to be lies after lies. EG7 has proved that they are only interested in their return on investment and not actually grow the game. We haven't heard a single word from them on the forums. The current team at SSG....I will stop here.

Nope, this game is not going anywhere until there are outright changes from top to bottom.

[Jerevth]

They will leave just like the thousands of players we got during the pandemic and they all left looking at the state of the game.

2018: Severlin - we are working on server merge and MEGA server.
2020: Lynnabel - we need 2 years to update the graphics.

Just promise after promise, turns out to be lies after lies. EG7 has proved that they are only interested in their return on investment and not actually grow the game. We haven't heard a single word from them on the forums. The current team at SSG....I will stop here.

Nope, this game is not going anywhere until there are outright changes from top to bottom.

Long range plans don't always happen.
"2018: Severlin - we are working on server merge and MEGA server." Does not equal- "We'll institute a Mega Server by the year 2022."
"2020: Lynnabel - we need 2 years to update the graphics. " Does not mean- "We will immediately start updating graphics and it will be done by the year 2022."

Ballpark estimates don't mean prophecy will be fulfilled on X date.
Interest in a exploring a path is not an ironclad goal being established to achieve something. It isn't even a commitment to go that route.

They've stayed on relative target delivering new quests and system updates, Yet we gripe about bugs and lack of QA (I'm guilty- LAG!). Conversely, if they delayed to get more QA, we'd gripe about missed target dates. It's a Kobayashi Maru. (only we're a bunch of Ferengi, not Romulans)

QA could be better, and target dates could be a bit more squishy, but with a business like this I suppose hitting the target date is the critical factor, and nothing is ever bug free, especially with hundreds of players testing millions of lines of code afterward. Resources are finite and there will always be some unanticipated issues following a major update
SSG is human, they do their best to keep the promises they do make, and overall do a great job of it.
-I think I recall the video where a merge possibility was discussed but Sev was very circumspect not to commit to a course of action that was not directed/funded, though. Exploring the possibility of a server merge is not committing to a server merge.

If a Dev, like Lynnabel, ballparks an estimate of how long something would take, understand that they are giving an estimate. The producer sets the goal, not the dev. If you want to dissect every statement and hold that as ammo against them down the road, they will interact less and less with the player base, which poisons the playerbase and probably the Devs, one against the other.

Ultimately, it comes down to reading comprehension- did they actually promise, or did they say they were looking at it?
Also, the Producer's Letter is essentially the only list of promises we'll get and it's more of a list of goals. The Letter is rarely on time because they want to (/edit start) validate every statement as possible, planned and funded. But goals shift, resources shift, or assets get lost. (Imagine if Lynn quit?)(/edit end)
Imagine if Lynn got fed up dealing with us and left for greener codes? That's ~60% of our Dev interaction right there and, I suspect, the lion's share of the rapid fixes we enjoy after the bugdates roll out (Sorry, I couldn't resist).

All this to say they didn't promise what you think they promised.

[Drachmoril]

We need a good starter pack to help get new people in. That's gonna be the main hurdle to new-player retention.

I hope they choose to make the "free quest code" quests free for everyone around this time. I wouldn't expect most new players to even know to go into the ddo store, apply a coupon, etc. People are going to be looking to quit at a moment's notice; you know how it is when trying a new MMO sometimes.

[Arkat]

They will leave just like the thousands of players we got during the pandemic and they all left looking at the state of the game.

2018: Severlin - we are working on server merge and MEGA server.
2020: Lynnabel - we need 2 years to update the graphics.

Just promise after promise, turns out to be lies after lies. EG7 has proved that they are only interested in their return on investment and not actually grow the game. We haven't heard a single word from them on the forums. The current team at SSG....I will stop here.

Nope, this game is not going anywhere until there are outright changes from top to bottom.

Long range plans don't always happen.
"2018: Severlin - we are working on server merge and MEGA server." Does not equal- "We'll institute a Mega Server by the year 2022."
"2020: Lynnabel - we need 2 years to update the graphics. " Does not mean- "We will immediately start updating graphics and it will be done by the year 2022."

Ballpark estimates don't mean prophecy will be fulfilled on X date.
Interest in a exploring a path is not an ironclad goal being established to achieve something. It isn't even a commitment to go that route.

They've stayed on relative target delivering new quests and system updates, Yet we gripe about bugs and lack of QA (I'm guilty- LAG!). Conversely, if they delayed to get more QA, we'd gripe about missed target dates. It's a Kobayashi Maru. (only we're a bunch of Ferengi, not Romulans)

QA could be better, and target dates could be a bit more squishy, but with a business like this I suppose hitting the target date is the critical factor, and nothing is ever bug free, especially with hundreds of players testing millions of lines of code afterward. Resources are finite and there will always be some unanticipated issues following a major update
SSG is human, they do their best to keep the promises they do make, and overall do a great job of it.
-I think I recall the video where a merge possibility was discussed but Sev was very circumspect not to commit to a course of action that was not directed/funded, though. Exploring the possibility of a server merge is not committing to a server merge.

If a Dev, like Lynnabel, ballparks an estimate of how long something would take, understand that they are giving an estimate. The producer sets the goal, not the dev. If you want to dissect every statement and hold that as ammo against them down the road, they will interact less and less with the player base, which poisons the playerbase and probably the Devs, one against the other.

Ultimately, it comes down to reading comprehension- did they actually promise, or did they say they were looking at it?
Also, the Producer's Letter is essentially the only list of promises we'll get and it's more of a list of goals. The Letter is rarely on time because they want to (/edit start) validate every statement as possible, planned and funded. But goals shift, resources shift, or assets get lost. (Imagine if Lynn quit?)(/edit end)
Imagine if Lynn got fed up dealing with us and left for greener codes? That's ~60% of our Dev interaction right there and, I suspect, the lion's share of the rapid fixes we enjoy after the bugdates roll out (Sorry, I couldn't resist).

All this to say they didn't promise what you think they promised.

Well said.

+1

[brian14]

The main hurdle to new player retention is going to be the dawning realization that DDO has no reset point and the implications of that unique aspect of the game.

What is "reset point"? And how is its absence unique to DDO?

[Weemadarthur]

What is "reset point"? And how is its absence unique to DDO?

Most (read as almost all) MMO's don't have a TR mechanic. They work on a linear system where each new x-pack increases level and gear stats. The new gear each time makes the previous gear obsolete and players reaching the new packs content normally are given a gearset that is just a little more powerful than what was available in the previous pack. This creates a reset point each release where new players and old players are at the same relative power level as gear is for most games the one thing that defines power. The advantage to this is it makes for a game that is far easier to balance but comes at the cost of making almost every other MMO very generic.

DDO is unique in the fact that it not only has a TR system but that the TR system is linked to a lot of character power. The relative power levels of new players are always going to be behind those that have played long term. There is no point where a new player can become as effective as a long term player without a significant amount of time or money being spent on the game (not to mention that new grinds keep being added). The advantages to this is that what you have with 1 x-pack isn't immediately invalidated by the last making long term play much more rewarding. This though does come at the cost of a perceived mountain to climb for a new player to be on par with those that have played long term.

[Artos_Fabril]

What is "reset point"? And how is its absence unique to DDO?

It means every new player starts 16 years behind and the only way to catch up is to consume content faster than the veterans with 16 years of experience.

When other MMOs launch an expansion, it usually comes with a catchup system, or at least a gear refractor. This is good for new players who only need to level up once and gear with the new content when they get into the new expansion areas. It's less good for old players, who "worked" hard to gear up previously and now see their hard-won gear replaced by "greens" but they progress through new content quicker and still get more powerful, so they mostly stick around too.

In DDO, some old loot is devalued by new loot in the level range, but a lot of lower level loot is still useful for a few days each life, and might become relevant again if it isn't, by being given an upgrade path or being made part of a desirable recipe. Meanwhile, with few exceptions, even the oldest content in the game is run regularly by veteran players. That's great for passing on knowledge about obscure or arcane game systems and mechanics, of which DDO has many, but terrible for new players to learn the game organically by playing with other charaters/players of their own power level.

Taken together, it means new players might see how far behind they are from the moment they leave Snowy Korthos, with zero prospect for catching up without investing more time, more efficiently than the vets who will always be clamoring for more new content as soon as (if not before) they have extracted everything of value from the current newest content.

[blarhblarhblarh]

Tried to make the "first time?" meme changing it to first golden oportunity?

We have seen a lot of them and we are still waiting

[PaddyMaxson]

Most (read as almost all) MMO's don't have a TR mechanic. They work on a linear system where each new x-pack increases level and gear stats. The new gear each time makes the previous gear obsolete and players reaching the new packs content normally are given a gearset that is just a little more powerful than what was available in the previous pack. This creates a reset point each release where new players and old players are at the same relative power level as gear is for most games the one thing that defines power. The advantage to this is it makes for a game that is far easier to balance but comes at the cost of making almost every other MMO very generic.

DDO is unique in the fact that it not only has a TR system but that the TR system is linked to a lot of character power. The relative power levels of new players are always going to be behind those that have played long term. There is no point where a new player can become as effective as a long term player without a significant amount of time or money being spent on the game (not to mention that new grinds keep being added). The advantages to this is that what you have with 1 x-pack isn't immediately invalidated by the last making long term play much more rewarding. This though does come at the cost of a perceived mountain to climb for a new player to be on par with those that have played long term.

This is excellently put and explains the problem really well.

Even as a long term on-and-off player I feel like I would have to invest too much time repeating the same content to catch up on Racial TRs, I came back for a month in May and I gave up after 3 more lives when I started Sharn because I really couldn't be arsed doing Sharn again.

The only other game that's quite so "you are behind if you're new and will never catch up" is Warframe, but to get to sort of "Top level of power" where you can solo the toughest content in that only takes a few months if you're really into the game.

I think even if you spent the money on XP pots and every other XP boost you'd struggle to get Racial TR done in 6 months as a new DDO player, and the cost of those XP boosts/the content/the tomes would be $many.