Crafting Reaper bonuses not accessible to everyone

[droid327]

100 reaper items to enchant a single item?!!? For a bonus that is marginal at best. And one that can become redundant with gear evolution to boot.

What genius came up with those economics?

Having trawled through all my bank toons I've found 43 reaper bonus items.

That's after playing at cap and pretty much exclusively in reaper, other than raids, for YEARS.

You must be flaming on something if you think I'm gonna bother with anything at these prices folks.

A grind is one thing, this is completely flaming deranged.

Surely to Crom someone has made a miscalculation here - either that or they've been listening to the discorderati too much for their own sanity.

10-20 items or 1-2 helms for an item-helm is reasonable. More than that is taking the proverbial. 100 is just flaming deranged. In fact it's an insult.

Average time to earn one item upgrade > average useful lifespan of items, ignore the upgrade mechanic

Mythic worth one point, reaper worth five, both 10, helm 25, mythic helm 100

[nicklesmack]

Average time to earn one item upgrade > average useful lifespan of items, ignore the upgrade mechanic

Mythic worth one point, reaper worth five, both 10, helm 25, mythic helm 100

Mythic - One Point PER mythic bonus maybe....not all are created equal after all. I would rather keep that duplicate +4mythic leg snowscale than burn it for 1/100th of a Reaper item bonus just in case i can use it on another alt later or for gear swapping when new cool augments are introduced...unless mythic and reaper bonus's are going to be made more prevalent with the update?

[Valerianus]

The harder it is to earn something the more unwilling I am to spend the currency. I don't want to add a Reaper Bonus to item X because I cannot be certain I will still be using item X for enough years to justify the expense of upgrading it (since I then lose all the ingredients and cannot upgrade something that turns out to be more valuable later). And considering all the gear we use, there are a lot of things to upgrade. It isn't a long-term goal. I will literally die of old age before I have enough components to upgrade even 10% of the gear that I use. And to be clear, I'm not using the word literally figuratively. I actually mean that. That isn't not getting everything we want immediately. That is not getting anything we want ever. Add to that the bigger problem that this encourages party members to destroy good loot rather than share it with others and the result is that getting loot with any bonus at all is now harder than ever.

There are a lot of ways to design an upgrade system. Destroying loot that other party members need should never be one of them. That is the worst part of the Sentient Experience system and now they just made it a whole lot worse.

...then you are not the target audience for it. (me neither btw)

it's for the endgame high-reaper crowd (with this i mean fast paced\less time + highest setting\chance for loot) BUT at the same time heavy re-rollers, players that don't mind burn a real lot of shards to have the best and now + elixir of discovery available. and after weeks (not years), new gear\new build, do it all again. this is not a bad thing, it's a way to play and have fun if it is your cup of tea. we are talking about cash here dude! and even if they are not spending that much, at least there's a system to upgrade the gear that does not involve randomness, but an extreme grind. i bet for such players it is preferable a plan, a defined grind, no matter how extreme, they'll figure out how to do it, instead of a frustrating random.


also you know, there is a sink. you know, time sink, plat sink...this is gear sink (sorta sent food). but it has a good thing: you can find something "valuable for you" anywhere, if you have everything already (not my case).


edit, oh, i forgot, the target audience i was talking about, they don't really need this, but hey, having the best and being achievers may also be fun. let the players that have fun this way have it.

[Monkey_Archer]

So I was told there would be a reaper crafting system added to this update. Where is it? I went to the reaper trainer and couldn't find it. All he said was this funny joke about grinding literally 6000 quests for a chance to get a single upgrade.

So when is the reaper upgrade system being added? Next update?

[Kraki]

Instead of gating access to the crafting UI, add a set of reaper tokens that are "Free" to buy for certain levels of Reaper points that are required for crafting X recipe. You can then have people with no/few reaper points able to crunch down items and save components for later.
Heavens forbid they even look at the recipes? Half of DDO (and DnD!) is metagaming to find the perfect or perfect for our character!
You can then also feel free to add as many XP gates or P2W buttons as you'd like at that point.

As for the snark about git gud or whatever from certain people, it's completely uncalled for. It's honestly this mentality why I run solo or with my friends 99% of the time.

[DrawingGuy]

While I think cannibalizing reaper gear to make other gear reaper makes sense, I don't think we really needed another named item sink. The exponential cost scaling of Sentient already does this, and between people needing gear, needing sentient food, or sentient food for swaps and alts, pretty much only a 'one percenter' party won't need something already. I was hoping for a plat cost. Wings/eyes are purely cosmetic once per life things for people with tons of reaper XP. They are not true plat sinks, and having something like this were there would be many items existing and future ongoing items to sink plat into, it may be enough to revitalize the AH economy.

Of course this is exasperated by the fact of the absurd costing. Seriously, ONE HUNDRED items for a single one? Or I guess you can save by crunching 20 reaper stat helms instead... these numbers just don't make sense. Moving a matching stat type over for 1 to 1 makes sense (maybe with a plat or thread cost added). 5 to 1 is a realistic exchange rate on high quantity high turnaround items. 10, okay. 20, you're getting very grindy, but something people are willing to do. 100 is, yeah, 99% of the pop will take years to get one item.

I'm hoping they re-evaluate the costs here.


As for the 2.5 million reaper XP needed to access the vendor, mixed feelings on that. I do agree with the concept of gating - after all this is reaper stats from reaper. However what percentage of the population has 2.5mil+ reaper xp? As the reaper system has been around for years, if a vast majority of players fall short, then that poses this may be too exclusive of a system. There is also the issue of reaper XP being character bound rather than account bound, so any player that has alts can face a pretty high bar to be able to upgrade any of their BtC raid gear. I don't have the numbers, but I suspect that Tier 1 vendors (625k) would be a gate that is realistic for the general populace.


Note that this is not a personal "I can't afford it" whine. I'm a hoarder and have years worth of gear that I could crunch, and my main toons have access. At "true end game" there comes a point where you'll pay any price for even a miniscule power increase, but leave that for remnant tomes or something. I appreciate the addition of purchasable Reaper boosts, especially as one that loaths RNG only systems. But please don't make precious reaper and mythic gear into a hyper high cost greed system.

[DarkSkysz]

does anyone know if reaper bonus can be added to helms for the ability bonus?

Yes you can add any bonus (old and new) to any item if you pay the huge price for it.

If a lot of Reaper stuff is 5 frags, it seems a bit more reasonable? Not sure what decides if stuff is 1 or 5 though given this thread. Also being able to crunch Mythic bonus items will surely help a bunch

So far only helms are worth 5 frags, every thing else I tried was 1.

[Blerk]

Do we know if adding a reaper bonus to an item scrubs any mythic bonus already on it?

Would be nice to get clarification on this before paying the huge cost for an upgrade.

[erethizon]

So I was told there would be a reaper crafting system added to this update. Where is it? I went to the reaper trainer and couldn't find it. All he said was this funny joke about grinding literally 6000 quests for a chance to get a single upgrade.

So when is the reaper upgrade system being added? Next update?

I really hope we can create enough of a backlash to get them to change this. We do NOT need more motivation to destroy gear that other members of the party need. The sentient experience system is already a big problem but this makes it that much worse because now ONLY good gear is targeted for destruction.

This needs to be scrapped and replaced with either an item drop (reapers can drop reaper remnants when killed) or chest loot. If they can add copper/silver/gold coins to every chest in the game at the flick of a switch they can do the same thing with reaper tokens.

[SpartanKiller13]

So far only helms are worth 5 frags, every thing else I tried was 1.

I'm hoping there's more than just that, maybe new reaper bonus items or stuff that drops post-update is worth more (to reduce hoarding value)? Gonna be rough if it's 100 per lmao.

[red_kain]

I'd love to see these reaper fragments purchasable by twists of fate. I like the addition but the costs/materials for crafting could be improved.

[slarden]

I would think getting the items necessary to upgrade an item would require close to 2.5MM RXP so I don't think it's an issue for most people. It is definitely an issue for people with many alts in the stable that have accumulated more than 2.5MM rxp in total, but not on a single character. I don't know how common that fact pattern is since most people gave up on alts.

I think I've pulled seven reaper stat helms now and given away three of them to people I thought would make better use of them. Under this system it's very unlikely I'd want to be that helpful again.

Agree, when grouping I've mostly passed items with good reaper bonuses unless it's something I needed. That won't happen in the future because of the frequency of gear changes and the low drop rate of reaper ability bonuses on helms. Although there are several new abilities on different items and I assume all those better items can be crunched for 5 instead of 1.

Many systems like remnants people complained about the cost/drop rates when new and years later people have 100k in their account bank.

[Assassination]

This may be the most stupid system ever created. Congratulations SSG, in a year full of stupidity, you have managed to one up yourself with this new system. I have over 100 reaper pts and do not have enough items to craft one reaper stat item.

Absolute garbage system. Who is this for?????

[Blerk]

This may be the most stupid system ever created. Congratulations SSG, in a year full of stupidity, you have managed to one up yourself with this new system. I have over 100 reaper pts and do not have enough items to craft one reaper stat item.

Absolute garbage system. Who is this for?????

Well, it's the same company if not the very same people who initially thought using raid loot in cannith crafting would be a good idea. Sure, farming Titan for Chattering Rings so I can craft some ammunition sounds like a GREAT IDEA.

Mercifully that stupidity was shouted down at the time as I hope this will be too. Adding reaper bonuses to items is something the community has wanted for a while, but this implementation takes corrupt-a-wish to a staggering new level of awfulness.

[CeltEireson]

I would think getting the items necessary to upgrade an item would require close to 2.5MM RXP so I don't think it's an issue for most people. It is definitely an issue for people with many alts in the stable that have accumulated more than 2.5MM rxp in total, but not on a single character. I don't know how common that fact pattern is since most people gave up on alts.

Well some of us still like to run alts so yeah its something that people with more than a few characters that they play are going to be locked out of generally (though Im sure there are a few who've got numerous alts AND high level reaper experience on some of them). Wish there was some way they could reward playing alts like a bonus to exp/rexp for a shortish duration per week per character or something. Having said that even if they did there still be plenty of 'elite' players who will always be way out in front in terms of character development no matter what.

[Oxarhamar]

And with that U51 is forgotten

[Ulfo]

This may be the most stupid system ever created. Congratulations SSG, in a year full of stupidity, you have managed to one up yourself with this new system. I have over 100 reaper pts and do not have enough items to craft one reaper stat item.

Absolute garbage system. Who is this for?????

Lol, my situation is diametrically opposite - my most advanced toon has about 22-23 reaper points (because it's my way to play), but as a dedicated trader I already have enough items with mythic/reaper bonuses on all my twinks (include 7 ability helmets) to create at least one, maybe two items right now.

So it's really imbecile crafting system: who have points, not have enough mats, and vv. Really, i wanna know designer who count this system as good and implement it into live. It need be heavily adjusted with both issues - too high entry threshold one hand and absolutely ridiculous mats requirements - other.

[Cernunan]

Maybe a solution is to allow mythic bonus items to be used for trade in, as they have a much higher drop rate.

[slarden]

1) Returning weapons don't work with the vendor.
2) Be careful when batch processing a bunch of items. Once you get over 100 if you accidently put in an item without a reaper bonus you may spend the 100 shards in your bank if you aren't paying close attention. I may or may not know someone that did this whose forum name rhymes with flarden - or at least that is my working assumption since all I know is I am about 100 short. A warning message for crafting might be helpful.

[Marshal_Lannes]

This is actually a great thing for those with under 50 reaper points. Why? Because remember those R10s are too easy posts you were starting to see? The top 1% of reaper players were getting bored/antsy/annoyed that R4 had become the new R1. They were soon going to start demanding harder reaper. Now that really would hurt someone with 10 reaper points. But now? Now they can chase the 100 items they need. They don't want a harder difficulty to do that. They want to zerg through reaper dungeons as fast as possible. So now there will be no cries for tougher reaper and, since R4 is the new R1, anyone under the threshold of 50 reaper points will hit the mark in relatively short order.

A sneaky great compromise has been established.