U51 Preview 3: Feat Changes and New Feats

[Lynnabel]

Disclaimer

Everything seen on the preview server, Lamannia, is not final and is subject to change or removal before live release.

In this new framework we are moving some specific power out of the ED trees and into the into the Epic and Destiny feats to help reduce the power spike in the Destinies themselves while still retaining original player power. This also let us boost feats that are currently underperforming. Our other goal with this pass was to spread out power that is currently concentrated in the upper end of the game and bring it lower so that players can access it sooner. So, we've both added power to epic/destiny feats and made them available at lower levels.

We also wanted to make the Legendary "Scion of" Feats provide more of a competitive choice, which meant boosting the non-Fire feats considerably in the spellcasting department. Finally, we are removing the Epic Skill feats from the game, which will cut down on feat clutter considerably.

Changes in Teal

Epic Feats
Epic Power (autogranted feat)
+6 Melee Power, +6 Ranged Power, +6 Universal Spell Power and -1% to the Spell Point cost of all spells.

Epic Knowledge (autogranted feat at level 22, 24, 26, 28, and 30) (new!)
+1 caster level and max caster level with all spells (for a total of +5 to all casting classes at level 30)

Epic Reputation
Now grants +5 to its listed skills instead of +3

Expanded Clip (new!)
Requires 12 Artificer, level 21. Your repeating crossbows have 1 extra shot in their clips. (Note: Not currently functional in this preview)

Epic Barbarian Damage Reduction (new!)
Requires 12 Barbarian, level 21. Your Barbarian Damage Reduction is increased by 1%. You also gain +5 Physical and Magical Resistance Rating

Destiny Feats:
ALL DESTINY FEATS NO LONGER CONTAIN SPHERE REQUIREMENTS

Epic Spellpower (all types)
Provides +20 Spellpower with the associated elemental type
Now also provides +15% spell critical damage with the appropriate elemental type and +5% all other spell critical damage

Epic Skill Focus (all skills)
Removed from the game!

Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting (new!)
Requires Two Weapon Fighting, level 22. Your offhand attacks now doublestrike at 65% of the rate of your main hand, versus the base 50%, up to a maximum of 65%.

Doublestrike (sorta new!)
+5% Doublestrike. (note that this is the old Perfect TWF feat. If you had that before, you have this now.)

Crush Weakness (new!)
Requires level 25. +15% damage versus the Helpless

Destiny Feats with NO MIN LEVEL
Now have Min Level 22

Destiny Feats with Min Level 28
Now have Min Level 25

Destiny Feats with min Level 29
Now have Min Level 28

Legendary Feats
Scion of Earth

• +4 to the DCs of Conjuration and Transmutation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 PRR
• +10 Acid and Poison Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Acid and Poison Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Acid damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Air

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +4% Dodge, +4 to Dodge Cap
• +10 Electric Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Electric Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Electric damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Fire

• No longer grants +25% Spell Critical Damage with all spells
• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +10 PRR, +10 MRR
• +10 Fire Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Fire Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Fire damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Water

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 MRR, +200 Maximum Spell Points
• +10 Cold Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Cold Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Cold damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Feywild

• +10 Sonic and Force Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Sonic and Force Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +4 to the DCs of Enchantment and Illusion spells, +2 to DCs of other spells
• Add 2d20 Sonic damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)
• +20 Healing Amp

Scion of Shadowfell

• +4 to the DCs of Necromancy spells, +2 to DCs of other spells
• +10 Negative Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Negative Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage. (note that the Poison Spellpower moved to the Scion of Earth feat)
• +20 Negative Amp (assuming you take healing from Negative)
• Weapon and Unarmed attacks heal you for 1d6 Positive damage, or 1d6 Negative damage if you are Undead.

Scion of Mechanus

• +20 Repair & Rust Spell Power, +20 Universal Spell Power, +25% Repair and Rust Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +20 Repair Amplification (assuming you take healing from Repair)
• +10% Fortification Bypass on weapon and unarmed attacks
• Gain: Master Reconstruction, shares cooldown with Communion of Scribing

Scion of Celestia

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 Positive, Light, & Alignment Spell Power, +20 Universal Spell Power
• +25% Positive, Light, and Alignment Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +150 Maximum Hit Points
• +4 to Will Saves

As a reminder, there are no more Sphere requirements (because there are no more Spheres), and any character may choose any feat from the Destiny feat list assuming they meet the other prerequisites (if any). This is incredibly important because it means that even characters who are brand new to Epics can choose from the same pool of Feats that an established player can without needing to grind out Epic Destiny XP.

We think these changes in combination with the Epic/Destiny Feat Tie-Ins in the trees themselves will create a far more compelling level-up flow for Epic play, and allow players to explore new and exciting combinations and builds without worrying about Destiny XP requirements.

[Wanker]

Disclaimer

Everything seen on the preview server, Lamannia, is not final and is subject to change or removal before live release.

In this new framework we are moving some specific power out of the ED trees and into the into the Epic and Destiny feats to help reduce the power spike in the Destinies themselves while still retaining original player power. This also let us boost feats that are currently underperforming. Our other goal with this pass was to spread out power that is currently concentrated in the upper end of the game and bring it lower so that players can access it sooner. So, we've both added power to epic/destiny feats and made them available at lower levels.

We also wanted to make the Legendary "Scion of" Feats provide more of a competitive choice, which meant boosting the non-Fire feats considerably in the spellcasting department. Finally, we are removing the Epic Skill feats from the game, which will cut down on feat clutter considerably.

Changes in Teal

Epic Feats
Epic Power (autogranted feat)
+6 Melee Power, +6 Ranged Power, +6 Universal Spell Power and -1% to the Spell Point cost of all spells.

Epic Knowledge (autogranted feat at level 22, 24, 26, 28, and 30) (new!)
+1 caster level and max caster level with all spells (for a total of +5 to all casting classes at level 30)

Epic Reputation
Now grants +5 to its listed skills instead of +3

Expanded Clip (new!)
Requires 12 Artificer, level 21. Your repeating crossbows have 1 extra shot in their clips. (Note: Not currently functional in this preview)

Epic Barbarian Damage Reduction (new!)
Requires 12 Barbarian, level 21. Your Barbarian Damage Reduction is increased by 1%. You also gain +5 Physical and Magical Resistance Rating

Destiny Feats:
ALL DESTINY FEATS NO LONGER CONTAIN SPHERE REQUIREMENTS

Epic Spellpower (all types)
Provides +20 Spellpower with the associated elemental type
Now also provides +15% spell critical damage with the appropriate elemental type and +5% all other spell critical damage

Epic Skill Focus (all skills)
Removed from the game!

Perfect Two-Weapon Fighting (new!)
Requires Two Weapon Fighting, level 22. Your offhand attacks now doublestrike at 65% of the rate of your main hand, versus the base 50%, up to a maximum of 65%.

Doublestrike (sorta new!)
+5% Doublestrike. (note that this is the old Perfect TWF feat. If you had that before, you have this now.)

Crush Weakness (new!)
Requires level 25. +15% damage versus the Helpless

Destiny Feats with NO MIN LEVEL
Now have Min Level 22

Destiny Feats with Min Level 28
Now have Min Level 25

Destiny Feats with min Level 29
Now have Min Level 28

Legendary Feats
Scion of Earth

• +4 to the DCs of Conjuration and Transmutation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 PRR
• +10 Acid and Poison Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Acid and Poison Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Acid damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Air

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +4% Dodge, +4 to Dodge Cap
• +10 Electric Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Electric Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Electric damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Fire

• No longer grants +25% Spell Critical Damage with all spells
• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +10 PRR, +10 MRR
• +10 Fire Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Fire Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Fire damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Water

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 MRR, +200 Maximum Spell Points
• +10 Cold Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Cold Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• Add 2d20 Cold damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)

Scion of Feywild

• +10 Sonic and Force Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Sonic and Force Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +4 to the DCs of Enchantment and Illusion spells, +2 to DCs of other spells
• Add 2d20 Sonic damage to weapon and unarmed attacks (Scales with Spell Power)
• +20 Healing Amp

Scion of Shadowfell

• +4 to the DCs of Necromancy spells, +2 to DCs of other spells
• +10 Negative Spell Power, +30 Universal Spell Power, +25% Negative Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage. (note that the Poison Spellpower moved to the Scion of Earth feat)
• +20 Negative Amp (assuming you take healing from Negative)
• Weapon and Unarmed attacks heal you for 1d6 Positive damage, or 1d6 Negative damage if you are Undead.

Scion of Mechanus

• +20 Repair & Rust Spell Power, +20 Universal Spell Power, +25% Repair and Rust Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +20 Repair Amplification (assuming you take healing from Repair)
• +10% Fortification Bypass on weapon and unarmed attacks
• Gain: Master Reconstruction, shares cooldown with Communion of Scribing

Scion of Celestia

• +4 to the DCs of Evocation spells, +2 to the DCs of other spells
• +20 Positive, Light, & Alignment Spell Power, +20 Universal Spell Power
• +25% Positive, Light, and Alignment Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +150 Maximum Hit Points
• +4 to Will Saves

As a reminder, there are no more Sphere requirements (because there are no more Spheres), and any character may choose any feat from the Destiny feat list assuming they meet the other prerequisites (if any). This is incredibly important because it means that even characters who are brand new to Epics can choose from the same pool of Feats that an established player can without needing to grind out Epic Destiny XP.

We think these changes in combination with the Epic/Destiny Feat Tie-Ins in the trees themselves will create a far more compelling level-up flow for Epic play, and allow players to explore new and exciting combinations and builds without worrying about Destiny XP requirements.

Thank you for these. With the changes to Scion of Fire's +25% crit damage to all spells will there be a feat for Force crit power? It looks like there is coverage for all the other types or did I miss Force's callout?

[Lynnabel]

Thank you for these. With the changes to Scion of Fire's +25% crit damage to all spells will there be a feat for Force crit power? It looks like there is coverage for all the other types or did I miss Force's callout?

With confidence I can finally say, yes, we actually remembered to put it in the notes this time and it's in the Feywild Scion feat.

[Wanker]

With confidence I can finally say, yes, we actually remembered to put it in the notes this time and it's in the Feywild Scion feat.

ha; thank you!

[Iriale]

So, not force support in shadowfell, even though you are putting a nerf with this update. *sighs*. Disappointing.

[Seph1roth5]

Confused, most (if not ALL) of the teal changes were the new changes from preview 2.

[TPICKRELL]

Crush Weakness (new!)
Requires level 25. +15% damage versus the Helpless

Stealing 15% helpless from Fury so it can be sold back for a feat is a cheap trick.

[Hawkwier]

Crush Weakness (new!)
Requires level 25. +15% damage versus the Helpless

Stealing 15% helpless from Fury so it can be sold back for a feat is a cheap trick.

+1

Bin this feat. Put it back in Fury.

[slarden]

With confidence I can finally say, yes, we actually remembered to put it in the notes this time and it's in the Feywild Scion feat.

Thanks for this

[Mindos]

What is the reasoning behind splitting poison and negative in the Scion feats? The entire game, poison and negative are together, then at the end, they are not?

[SpardaX]

I put this reply in the other thread, but it was only a day or two ago, and it may have been too late in that thread to really be seen. I'm going to put it in again here, but if no replies or comments come from it I'll just assume the suggestion has been seen but no one wants it.

Epic Skill Focus

I don't know how easy this would be to implement in DDO, but in Pathfinder, and Pathfinder's video games, Skill Focus works slightly differently (better) than 3.5's skill focus. It works as follows:

+3 to the skill. (That much is the same)
But
If you get to having 10 ranks in the skill, Skill Focus automatically doubles to +6.

I was thinking what if instead of just flatly removing the Epic Skill Focus feats, you did the same? So remove the epic skill focus feats, and replace / update all existing regular skill focus feats to be as follows:

Skill Focus (Skill)
Gain +3 to (Skill)
If you have 20 or more ranks in (Skill), this benefit increases to +8. (You could maybe make this also require level 21 or higher but I don't know how possible that would be with the current system)

(+8 coming from: Base +3 +5 from epic)


You could even maybe split the difference and learn from Pathfinder to instead have:

Skill Focus (Skill)
Gain +3 to (Skill)
If you have 10 or more ranks in (Skill), this benefit increases to (+5 or +6, which ever you the devs feel is fairer)
If you have 20 or more ranks in (Skill), this benefit increases to +8.

Same total bonus, still requires a feat, but can be taken in heroic, and gets enough power over time that someone who wants the skill, which if they're taking skill focus hopefully they WANT the skill, would see a worthy improvement out of it. This would also work towards your stated goal of reclaiming feats no one wants.

Or perhaps, since the system knows what rank we are in skills, since it needs to know that to even offer us Epic Skill Focus, what if you made heroic Skill Focus a prerequisite of Epic Skill Focus, and then every epic level the system checks if the player qualifies for an Epic Skill Focus feat (IE: Do they have both 20 in the skill, and the skill focus feat), and then just auto grant all applicable Epic Skill Focus feats that player qualifies for along with their Epic Power feats for that epic level?

[blarhblarhblarh]

[/QUOTE]
We think these changes in combination with the Epic/Destiny Feat Tie-Ins in the trees themselves will create a far more compelling level-up flow for Epic play, and allow players to explore new and exciting combinations and builds without worrying about Destiny XP requirements.[/QUOTE]

If ddo needed this there would be no players in epics, people would stay in 20 or reincarnate to 1. You guys know that the player base don´t need this changes and that you will be limiting party roles making everyone generic.


But ok, why does doublestrike and doubleshot still called doublestrike and doubleshot if it doesn´t do any doublestrike and doubleshot??? Just call damage multiplier melee / ranged. If you say you are fixing the game do it right instead of creating more problems and a higher difficulty curve for beginners. People don´t have to guess what does a name means. Or simple use D&D3.5 rules when in doubt, it would be way better, faster and simple to adapt.

[Atremus]

Crush Weakness (new!)
Requires level 25. +15% damage versus the Helpless

Was unable to to take this on a FVS - is it restricted?

[Nickodeamous]

Was unable to to take this on a FVS - is it restricted?

+1 unable to take this on my monk. getting the error: "Invalid Advancement Data"

[Nickodeamous]

I am seeing some of the reaper enhancements stacking while in the test dojo. like melee power and ability scores and PRR, etc...i'm guessing everything. kinda hard to test when this is happening

Thanks,
Nico

edit: doesn't appear to include HPs.

[SerPounce]

Scion of Mechanus

• +20 Repair & Rust Spell Power, +20 Universal Spell Power, +25% Repair and Rust Spell Critical Damage, +10% all other spell critical damage
• +20 Repair Amplification (assuming you take healing from Repair)
• +10% Fortification Bypass on weapon and unarmed attacks
• Gain: Master Reconstruction, shares cooldown with Communion of Scribing

Does the SLA work on character levels or just epic levels like does on live?

Still think this should get +2 DCs like the other casting scion feats do. Without that the opportunity cost is too high to really consider.

[Nickodeamous]

I took this so I get 75% of my doublestrike with my offhand, but I cant see this in the character sheet.

Can you please update the note to say whether its half your doublestrike (50%), or it is 75% of your doublestrike?

Thanks!
Nico

[droid327]

Expanded Clip (new!)
Requires 12 Artificer, level 21. Your repeating crossbows have 1 extra shot in their clips. (Note: Not currently functional in this preview)

I wish we could test this. As an Artificer expat currently living in Inquiland, I'm extremely gratified to see you finally giving some (non-nerf-related) attention to RXBs, so thanks for that.

However, I just have to say this is basically lipstick on a pig as long as the major systemic issues regarding RXB scaling, relative to other ranged weapons, remain...

The 66% Dshot penalty is mathematically unnecessary. Dshot is just a straight multiplicative scalar for ranged damage, so there's no reason it needs to be less than 100% for any ranged weapon. Ranged weapons should be balanced relative to each other at 0% Dshot, which means they'll remain balanced relative to each other at any other % of Dshot. At any rate, RXB is not so OP that it needs to be mitigated with a scaling penalty...if anything, the opposite, RXB needs to be buffed, not restricted.

RXBs also dont scale from Attack Speed, of course, since that stat doesnt affect reload times, and RXB attack animations are majority reloading. That's a good 30-45% bonus DPS which RXBs lack and every other ranged weapon benefits from. That's probably unfixable, so its something that'd need to be mitigated with something else. Expanded Clip basically gives you +33% DPS, which more or less makes up that difference, but A) only in Epic, and B) still doesnt cover the scaling gap from the Dshot penalty.

RXBs also have an implicit tactical penalty from their slow ROF. They only get a volley off every 1.2 secs. That means they're extremely sluggish at changing targets, and makes it more difficult to make skillshots like lining up a good IPS angle on moving targets, which is a big part of high-tier ranged combat. That's something else that should be mitigated/taken into consideration when adjusting relative power levels between RXB and other ranged weapons. Also they're an Exotic, so that's another opportunity cost that needs to be validated.

[Stormraiser]

[QUOTE=Lynnabel;6471062]Disclaimer [INDENT][I]
Epic Feats
Epic Power (autogranted feat)
+6 Melee Power, +6 Ranged Power, +6 Universal Spell Power and -1% to the Spell Point cost of all spells. Will be interesting to see the power shift from this. 15 extra mp will hit different melee classes very differently.

Epic Knowledge (autogranted feat at level 22, 24, 26, 28, and 30) (new!)
+1 caster level and max caster level with all spells (for a total of +5 to all casting classes at level 30) this will likely unearth some unforeseen damage boosts.

Epic Reputation
Now grants +5 to its listed skills instead of +3 Good change.

Expanded Clip (new!)
Requires 12 Artificer, level 21. Your repeating crossbows have 1 extra shot in their clips. (Note: Not currently functional in this preview) Very tasty change.

Epic Barbarian Damage Reduction (new!)
Requires 12 Barbarian, level 21. Your Barbarian Damage Reduction is increased by 1%. You also gain +5 Physical and Magical Resistance Rating - what is this, a feat for barbarians who can't read good?

[Zhyano]

However, I just have to say this is basically lipstick on a pig as long as the major systemic issues regarding RXB scaling, relative to other ranged weapons, remain...

The 66% Dshot penalty is mathematically unnecessary. Dshot is just a straight multiplicative scalar for ranged damage, so there's no reason it needs to be less than 100% for any ranged weapon. Ranged weapons should be balanced relative to each other at 0% Dshot, which means they'll remain balanced relative to each other at any other % of Dshot. At any rate, RXB is not so OP that it needs to be mitigated with a scaling penalty...if anything, the opposite, RXB needs to be buffed, not restricted.

RXBs also dont scale from Attack Speed, of course, since that stat doesnt affect reload times, and RXB attack animations are majority reloading. That's a good 30-45% bonus DPS which RXBs lack and every other ranged weapon benefits from. That's probably unfixable, so its something that'd need to be mitigated with something else. Expanded Clip basically gives you +33% DPS, which more or less makes up that difference, but A) only in Epic, and B) still doesnt cover the scaling gap from the Dshot penalty.

RXBs also have an implicit tactical penalty from their slow ROF. They only get a volley off every 1.2 secs. That means they're extremely sluggish at changing targets, and makes it more difficult to make skillshots like lining up a good IPS angle on moving targets, which is a big part of high-tier ranged combat. That's something else that should be mitigated/taken into consideration when adjusting relative power levels between RXB and other ranged weapons. Also they're an Exotic, so that's another opportunity cost that needs to be validated.

I dont quite understand what your problem with RXB scaling is. Theyre top tier early game, ok midgame, bad lategame. SWF is horrible early game, meh midgame and pops the **** off at 26.

It doesnt all have to be the same, choosing different combat styles needs to have tradeoffs. And for Repeaters the tradeoff for 3 shots at lvl 1 is bad scaling.

Differences are fun, as long as theyre fair.