U51 Preview 3: Shiradi Champion

[Steelstar]

Disclaimer

Everything seen on the preview server, Lamannia, is not final and is subject to change or removal before live release.

Notes:
Preview 2's Shiradi landed in a good place for a lot of people, but was generally overtuned due to a scaling bug and rebalanced damage numbers working in tandem. In addition, the systems team had concerns about how Shiradi's procs balanced against other trees' mantle abilities. As a result, there are a few major Shiradi changes in this Preview:

• Prism, Stay Frosty, Stay Good, and the damage during Inexorable Advance now have short cooldowns. (0.1sec)
  
  • We don't necessarily expect this change to be popular, but we currently feel it necessary to hit several goals here, including retaining most of the damage and all of the proc chance from Preview 2, maintaining balance versus other Destinies, and (to a lesser extent) ensuring we don't encounter performance issues. We are aware of the impact this has on missile spam builds, but ultimately would rather have this tree land as beneficial to a lot of character types than need to nerf it heavily for most character types in service of supporting a single kind of build (missile spam).
    
    • Note also that Double Rainbow does not have this cooldown at the moment.
  
  
• Prism's damage is now 3d100+100 (was 3d100+200)
• Stay Good/Frosty's damage is now [1d100/2d100/3d100]+[60/120/180] (was [1d100/2d100/3d100]+[100/200/300])
• Inexorable Advance's damage is now 3d100+180 (was 3d100+300)
  
  • Again, we don't expect these to be popular shifts, but think they are important in this rebalance. We are open to feedback on these, though we will be taking feedback of actual-Lamannia-play into consideration much more strongly than anything else.

Overview:
Shiradi Champions are uniquely attuned to the magic and chaotic power of they Feywild. They can be uncanny hunters with ranged weaponry, mages who use spells to lure foes to their doom, or some of both. With Ranged weapons, they can command high damage and slow down foes; with Spells, they can take control of powerful enemies and turn them on their allies. Shiradi Champions are especially good at keeping large crowds of enemies at bay, while adding a touch of chaos to any fight.

Core Abilities:

• Core 20 (level 20): Fey Favor: You gain the Magical Training Feat. Each core ability including this one grants +4 Ranged power, +50 Spellpoints, and +5 Force and Universal Spell Power. Each core also grants a +1 Epic bonus to all Spell DCs. Only the highest Epic Bonus to Spell DCs you get from Destiny Cores applies.
• Core 23 (level 23): Vision: Your attacks have Ghost Touch and you bypass 5% dodge and fortification. If you have the Holy Strike feat, double the dodge and fort bypass.
• Core 26 (level 26): Audience with the Queen: Get some tea! When you Rest, you pop off for some tea, and randomly get one cool buff - no longer uses Diplomacy check to determine which buff. Buffs last for 10 minutes or until you die.

Tier 1 (req level 20):

• Prism: Shiradi Champion Destiny Mantle: Your ranged and thrown attacks have a 15% chance to deal 3d100+100 extra damage of a random type. This damage scales with 200% Ranged Power. Your offensive spells have a 30% chance to deal 3d100+200 extra damage of a random type. This damage scales with 100% of the type's Spell Power.
• Wild Magics: +30/60/100 SP. Rank 3: +5 Force and Universal Spell Power
• Good Luck: +1/2/3 Luck bonus to attack and saving throws. If you have the Luck of Heroes feat, double this bonus.
• Fey Strike: Multiselector:
  
  • Hunt's End: Epic Strike: Your next shot with a Ranged or Thrown weapon has +75% damage, and increases your Critical Threat Range by 16. (Cooldown: 8 seconds). 2AP.
  • Fey Lights: Epic Strike: Cone SLA. Enemies are sprayed with illusions of color, and must make a Will save or be Dazed, Blinded, and/or Silenced. The target must make a saving throw for each effect. (20 + Highest of INT/WIS/CHA + Highest of Enchantment or Illusion bonuses) Cooldown: 6 seconds. 10SP.
  
  
• Fey Sight: +2/4/6 Listen, Search, and Spot. Rank 3: You are immune to Blindness.

Tier 2 (req level 20):

• Stay: Multiselector:
  
  • Stay Good: While in your Prism stance, Ranged and thrown attacks have a 15% chance to deal 1d100+60/2d100+120/3d100+180 extra light damage. Your offensive spells have a 30% chance to proc this damage. This Light damage scales with 200% Ranged Power if from a Ranged attack, or 200% Light Spell Power if from a spell. Rank 3: Enemies hit by your ranged attacks have a 20% chance to be blinded for 10 seconds. Enemies hit by your offensive spells have a 30% chance to be blinded for 10 seconds.
  • Stay Frosty: While in your Prism stance, Ranged and thrown attacks have a 15% chance to deal 1d100+60/2d100+120/3d100+180 extra cold damage. Your offensive spells have a 30% chance to proc this damage. This Light damage scales with 200% Ranged Power if from a Ranged attack, or 200% Cold Spell Power if from a spell. Rank 3: Enemies hit by your ranged attacks have a 20% chance to be slowed for 10 seconds. Enemies hit by your offensive spells have a 30% chance to be slowed for 10 seconds.
  
  
• Phase Double: +2/4/6% Doubleshot.
• Multiselector: Fey Charms
  
  • Pin: Ranged Attack. +3[w]: If target is moving, they are Slowed for 12 seconds. Cooldown: 15 seconds
  • Beguiling Charm: Target must make a Will save versus (20 + Highest of INT/WIS/CHA + Enchantment bonuses) or be Charmed for 12 seconds. Cooldown 15 seconds. Cost: 10 SP.
  
  
• Healing Spring: (Cooldown: 30 seconds) SLA of Greater Vigor, Mass. Uses charges of Wild Empathy, +1 Max Wild Empathy charge.
• Empathetic Link: +1/2/3 charges of Wild Empathy.

Tier 3 (req level 23):

• Double Rainbow: While in your Prism Mantle, your ranged and thrown attacks have a 7% chance to inflict a random effect on your target. Your offensive spells have a 14% chance to proc these effects. These effects scale with various different things depending on their origins, including Melee, Ranged, and Spell Power.
• Pierce Deception: You gain the Watchful Eye feat. (If you pass within 5 feet of a trap, you make a Search check to notice it as if actively Searching. (You still need the Trapfinding feat to successfully Search for difficult traps.)) If you have the Watchful Eye feat, +5% Doubleshot.
• Greater Fey Charms:
  
  • Otto's Whistler: If enemies hit by Pin are not moving, they must make a Reflex save (20 + highest ability score + Spot bonus) or be Immobilized for 18 seconds. If enemies hit by Pin are moving, they must make a Will save (20 + highest ability score + Listen bonus) or Dance for 18 seconds.
  • Greater Beguiling Charm: Enemies Charmed by your Beguiling Charm deal double damage with attacks and spells while under the effects of Beguile.
  
  
• Fey Strike II: Multiselector:
  
  • Fey Force: Increases Hunt's End damage bonus by 75%.
  • Fey Flash: Fey Lights' Daze now additionally affects Undead, Plants, Constructs, and Oozes, who would normally be immune to such effects.
  
  
• Shiradi Magic: Multiselector:
  
  • +1/2/3 Illusion DC
  • +1/2/3 Enchantment DC
  • +1/2/3 Transmutation DC
  • +1/2/3 Conjuration DC

Tier 4 (req level 26):

• Fey Form: While in your Prism Mantle, gain 9% extra damage against Helpless targets, DR 10 Cold Iron, and +5 Force and Universal spell power.
• Track: Dealing damage to enemies reduces their AC by 1 and fortification by 2%. stacks 10 times.
• Enemy of my Own: You gain the Favored Enemy: Fey feat.
• Fey Strike III: Multiselector:
  
  • Overwhelming Force: Increases your Hunt's End effect by 75%. (Note: This shares a name right now with a Fury ability, will be renamed before Live).
  • Fey Flare: The Daze portion of Fey Lights is now a Stun instead. (This Stun applies to the additional creature types in Fey Flash, if you have that skill).
  
  
• Whirling Wrists: +10/20/30% Attack Speed with Thrown Weapons. You gain +2/4/6% stacking Incorporeality.

Tier 5 (req level 30):

• Still: Multiselector:
  
  • Stay Still: While in Prism stance, your ranged and thrown attacks and offensive spells have a 7% chance to paralyze living creatures for 6 seconds. Requires Stay Good.
  • Stay Frozen: While in Prism stance, your ranged and thrown attacks and offensive spells have a 7% chance to freeze living creatures for 6 seconds. Requires Stay Frosty.
  
  
• Control: +1/2/3 to all Spell DCs
• Lore of the Hunt: Ranged Weapons gain +1 Critical Damage Multiplier on rolls of 19-20.
• Feywild Attunement: Every 4 Wilderness Lore feats grant you +1% Dodge. You are always considered to be in Point Blank Shot range and have BAB equal to character level with Longbows and Shortbows. +10 Force and Universal Spell Power.
• Agent of the Court: Multiselector:
  
  • Inexorable Advance: Epic Moment: For 30 seconds, you gain +30 Ranged Power, can move while still gaining Archer's Focus stacks, and you do not take the normal 20% damage penalty while using Improved Precise Shot. You also gain 30% Action Boost bonus to Movement Speed for the duration. In addition, your Ranged attacks have a 100% chance to deal 3d100+180 Cold damage and 3d100+180 Light damage which scale with 200% Ranged Power in addition to Stay Good or Stay Frosty. Finally, your Ranged attacks in this state have a 100% chance to proc Double Rainbow effects. Cooldown: 5 minutes.
  • Mass Chaos: Epic Moment: Enemies in an area are Confused with no save for 30 seconds, gain a stack of Fey Chaos, and apply a stack of Fey Chaos on hitting non-Player, non-Hireling targets while Confused. 5 minute cooldown.
    
    • Fey Chaos: This creature takes 5% more damage from all sources for 10 seconds. This effect can stack up to 10 times, and all stacks expire after not gaining new ones for 10 seconds. This effect works on Bosses and Raid Bosses.

[Xgya]

Just making sure, this 0.1 second cooldown isn't meant to interfere with a double (triple) shot that just doubles (triples) the damage of a proc instead of activating it multiple times?

[Steelstar]

Just making sure, this 0.1 second cooldown isn't meant to interfere with a double (triple) shot that just doubles (triples) the damage of a proc instead of activating it multiple times?

You are correct: That isn't meant to interfere with double/triple shot, no.

[NightHiker]

Hey, Steelstar!

[*]Fey Lights: Epic Strike: Cone SLA. Enemies are sprayed with illusions of color, and must make a Will save or be Dazed, Blinded, and/or Silenced. The target must make a saving throw for each effect. (20 + Highest of INT/WIS/CHA + Highest of Enchantment or Illusion bonuses) Cooldown: 6 seconds. 10SP.

This is still not working in a cone shape. Seems to be a very small AOE centered on the char. It also seems to still have some legacy code from Preview 1, as it gives me a green builder charge when I cast it.

Cheers,
NH

[Steelstar]

Hey, Steelstar!



This is still not working in a cone shape. Seems to be a very small AOE centered on the char. It also seems to still have some legacy code from Preview 1, as it gives me a green builder charge when I cast it.

Cheers,
NH

Thanks for the reminder, this is still on my to-check list (didn't quite make it in time for the Preview).

[Stoner81]

Split Otto's Whistler from Pin for the love of god please! Pin should not be a SLOW! They are PINNED HENCE CAN'T FREAKING MOVE!

Stoner81.

[Seph1roth5]

Split Otto's Whistler from Pin for the love of god please! Pin should not be a SLOW! They are PINNED HENCE CAN'T FREAKING MOVE!

Stoner81.

For some reason the ED revamp really wants to kill our active attacks. That's why there's a bunch of multiselectors and everything's tied to epic strikes.

[Archfae]

The 0.1 second cooldown ONLY affects casters. It essentially gates the dps to once every second whereas non casters can proc multiple times per second (and get the nice fancy ultimate to boot).

In particular youve killed off MM and multiproc builds - i.e. the prototypical shiradi that's been in the game since MOTU came out. Now I don't want to play a MM spammer but I know people that do and have loved their characters. There is no way to salvage these builds (double rainbow is much weaker than it used to be and doesn't keep them viable).

As is, you are killing off their build (and breaking the promise of this pass as not being a nerf) on top of not giving them the means to fix their character (a +5 heart isnt going to fix deep splashed shiradi caster builds like 10 sorcerer / 6 wizard / 4 fvs).

I would urge you to reconsider this change or at the very least giving a +20 heart instead of a +5 to those players who are having yheir builds completely invalidated.

[Oliphant]

For some reason the ED revamp really wants to kill our active attacks. That's why there's a bunch of multiselectors and everything's tied to epic strikes.

I hate this, unless somehow U51 changes everything with how lag works. Active attacks for some reason actually work while just spamming normal attacks is completely exposed to whatever lame process is causing DDO lag. Active attacks always seem to work. Normal attacks seem to lag out 10% of the time.

[NightHiker]

Thanks for the reminder, this is still on my to-check list (didn't quite make it in time for the Preview).

No problem - since this didn't appear as a known issue I thought better check just in case. I look forward to experiment with the final version as this will allow me to drop Feydark Illusionist on my spellsinger bard (I absolutely love GCS, enough to go Illusion focus just because of it) and go Enchantment focus to get more CC options. So far a Shiradi + Fatesinger combo seems to be the best for caster bards - can't wait till this hits the live servers.

Cheers,
NH

[Monkey_Archer]

Notes:
Preview 2's Shiradi landed in a good place for a lot of people, but was generally overtuned due to a scaling bug and rebalanced damage numbers working in tandem. In addition, the systems team had concerns about how Shiradi's procs balanced against other trees' mantle abilities. As a result, there are a few major Shiradi changes in this Preview:

• Prism, Stay Frosty, Stay Good, and the damage during Inexorable Advance now have short cooldowns. (0.1sec)
  
  • We don't necessarily expect this change to be popular, but we currently feel it necessary to hit several goals here, including retaining most of the damage and all of the proc chance from Preview 2, maintaining balance versus other Destinies, and (to a lesser extent) ensuring we don't encounter performance issues. We are aware of the impact this has on missile spam builds, but ultimately would rather have this tree land as beneficial to a lot of character types than need to nerf it heavily for most character types in service of supporting a single kind of build (missile spam).
    
    • Note also that Double Rainbow does not have this cooldown at the moment.
  
  
• Prism's damage is now 3d100+100 (was 3d100+200)
• Stay Good/Frosty's damage is now [1d100/2d100/3d100]+[60/120/180] (was [1d100/2d100/3d100]+[100/200/300])
• Inexorable Advance's damage is now 3d100+180 (was 3d100+300)
  
  • Again, we don't expect these to be popular shifts, but think they are important in this rebalance. We are open to feedback on these, though we will be taking feedback of actual-Lamannia-play into consideration much more strongly than anything else.

At risk of sounding overly negative... I think this change is neither balanced, nor does it improve Prism's place against other mantles.

I'll try to explain as best I can...

There are basically 3 build archetypes that are looking at these mantles
1) Ranged builds
2) Basic nukers (ie roughly one hit per spell)
3) Players with nostalgia for the old shriadi missile spammer builds

1) Ranged builds have high base damage +hunts end and can attempt to proc Prism multiple times per second (depending on ranged style doubleshot, etc...) lets say 3+ per second.
2) Basic nukers can only attempt to proc this once per second
3) Missile spammers attempt to proc it 3-10 times per second depending on spell, but unlike ranged builds have essentially no base damage.

The problem here is 3 fold:
1) Ranged builds are not affected by the 0.1 second cooldown nerf, they attack faster than one spell per second and I assume doubleshot is still multiplying the proc damage? (refer to actual testing)
2) Basic nuker builds are unaffected by the 0.1 second nerf but get the least effective use of it. You would think this means they would consider other mantles, but Prism is still the strongest by far.
3) Missile spammers are now directly inferior to all ranged builds period.

If I'm going to build a charcter based on any of these archetypes and have to choose a mantle:
1) Ranged builds are using prism, obviously
2) Basic nukers are using prism, obviously (despite getting the least from it, its still the best)
3) Missile spammers are using none, as they are not viable anymore


IMO the issue is trying too hard to let the basic nuker archetype be a viable prism user. They have 2 other (currently inferior) mantles to choose from. Ranged and missile spammers only have prism. Ideally basic nukers should prefer the other mantles and there's nothing wrong with that.

I would much rather see the 0.1 cooldown removed and prism rebalanced for missile spammers/ranged instead. Something like going back to 7% proc for ranged and spells or lowering the base damage/scaling.

EDIT: Or, if Prism is currently where you want it balance wise, buff the draconic/primal mantles. Or, if Prism is intended to be the superior damage mantle add utility to the draconic/primal mantles.

[droid327]

Thoughts after playtesting on an Inqui...

- Great passive CC. The various Helpless states you can proc via Double Rainbow work nicely on orange names, and NHB applies them very effectively. The freeze from Stay Frozen didnt seem to proc as often as I expected, though. Is there a DC? There's not on Nerve Venom right now...

- Hunts End...doesnt seem like its doing enough? Maybe I'm just getting unlucky with high Fort mobs, but pairing it with Shoot Later, I should be guaranteed crit with a crazy high multiplier. I'm getting a whole lot of duds. Is the 75% damage from the various tiers of enhancements stacking? I took them all. Energy Burst still felt like it did more damage than a Hunts End-boosted shot, though, which is problematic.

- I paired Shiradi with Draconic, and that worked great. Energy Burst was both huge damage (EK/PM, so my Acid spellpower is over 500) and another effective layer of CC. Hunts End for single targets, Burst for packs. The mutually exclusive Epic Strikes do what they're supposed to here, I imagine.

- The Epic Moment is still really strong, especially paired with NHB. Not the instant mob-deletion button it was in Preview 2, but still feels very Epic. Enough to mow down even paired bosses like Sharn Welcome on R1.

- Feels like there's too much filler in the tree. I had to take junk to get to 30 points for the T5s.

-- Pin and Whistler arent worth taking...its a button tax, there's already plenty of CC in the tree, and they're too situational.
-- Likewise Charm is more trouble than its worth; make it a Confuse and its a lot more intriguing.
-- Healing Spring and its boosters are a joke - charge based Greater Vigor? For that opportunity cost, even Regenerate is kind of a joke. Needs to be like...Pos Energy Aura, something long-term so that a few charges will actually last you through a quest.
-- Can Pierce Deception grant Doublestrike with the other sources of auto-search too? I know they're not all exactly the same, but the enhancement is still made effectively redundant if you have them.
-- FE: Fey is OK if you're a HW, but its not really great for anyone else. This isnt a problem by itself, but as part of the pattern it becomes more troublesome.

- Whirling Wrists doesnt mention the Incorp in-game...was it removed, or is the tooltip wrong? Doesnt seem to be granting it either...my char sheet just shows 10% incorp from a Ghostly item

[Synthetic]

(Combat): Spell Crit! Your Hold Monster, Mass has greater effect!
(Combat): You hit Redcap Guard for 4,676 points of rust damage.

The mantle is still super strong compared to other ED strikes and mantles. The ED also gets a good strike for ranged. Over all one of the brokenly good ED again.

[Avocado]

Is there any chance you could consider making the tier 5 full bab and PBS range work with other ranged types too. Bow already can get this in deepwood stalker. No other ranged typ gets this option via there trees. Great crossbows can benefit from full bab and they need more help then longbows do. Inquisitive and greatcross bow are at the bottom of the range pole. They could greatly benefit from this tier 5 and would help them compete with other ranged options.

[Stoner81]

Is there any chance you could consider making the tier 5 full bab and PBS range work with other ranged types too. Bow already can get this in deepwood stalker. No other ranged typ gets this option via there trees. Great crossbows can benefit from full bab and they need more help then longbows do. Inquisitive and greatcross bow are at the bottom of the range pole. They could greatly benefit from this tier 5 and would help them compete with other ranged options.

I asked for this (mostly) in the last preview and it went unheard.

Stoner81.

[Firebreed]

-- Pin and Whistler arent worth taking...its a button tax, there's already plenty of CC in the tree, and they're too situational.
-- Likewise Charm is more trouble than its worth; make it a Confuse and its a lot more intriguing.
-- Healing Spring and its boosters are a joke - charge based Greater Vigor? For that opportunity cost, even Regenerate is kind of a joke. Needs to be like...Pos Energy Aura, something long-term so that a few charges will actually last you through a quest.
-- Can Pierce Deception grant Doublestrike with the other sources of auto-search too? I know they're not all exactly the same, but the enhancement is still made effectively redundant if you have them.
-- FE: Fey is OK if you're a HW, but its not really great for anyone else. This isnt a problem by itself, but as part of the pattern it becomes more troublesome.

- Whirling Wrists doesnt mention the Incorp in-game...was it removed, or is the tooltip wrong? Doesnt seem to be granting it either...my char sheet just shows 10% incorp from a Ghostly item

This guy speaks truth.

[Synthetic]

At risk of sounding overly negative... I think this change is neither balanced, nor does it improve Prism's place against other mantles.

I was curious about missile spammers in the ED and decided to play around with it.

So, first I went and checked out how fast a tenth of a second was for a person, and it's really really fast.

Second I created a missile spammer and shot chain missiles at kobolds. So, the tenth of second delay probably impacts some damage here, but not enough to not make missile/meteor spam very good dps for a caster in the preview. When testing with kobolds I could see the stay frosty affect on multiple kobolds - I was just using chain missile and noticed the debuff over the heads of the kobolds and then manually checked them. I was not seeing damage on all the kobolds that received the debuff. I did see multiple ticks of frost scrolling above their heads - Stay Frosty never showed in my combat log so confirming damage was very difficult(Previously I thought it was occasionally showing in the combat log but now I think this was simply prism causing cold damage). I could see multiple damage ticks of prism too which would show in the log. So, the cool-down is capping missile spam damage. Meteor Swarm appears to be better at triggering prism/frosty than chain missile when used against the 6 test kobolds(it has more chance to trigger and seems to have a long enough delay between the first and last meteor to pass the cool-down).

Now my analysis of the missile spam build is Missile spam builds have not been super high dps builds and the revamped doesn't change that. They will continue to be easy builds with good cc and good sustainable dps. I wouldn't expect them to take over like the old days, but that's mostly due to the second part. Meteor swarm builds will benefit from this change since the spell consistently triggers prism and stay frosty against groups and single targets.

I don't see another dps mantle coming close to this for a caster in the current preview.

[Monkey_Archer]

Now my analysis of the missile spam build is Missile spam builds have not been super high dps builds and the revamped doesn't change that. They will continue to be easy builds with good cc and nearly limitless dps. I wouldn't expect them to take over like the old days, but that's mostly due to the second part. Meteor swarm builds will benefit big time from this change. Single target damage will be higher than every other caster.

I don't see another dps mantle coming close to this for a caster in the current preview.

Interesting... so the main nerf is just to wizard PL/mm single target dps, whereas AOE still works? (I guess due to the slight delay between meteors landing)

I suppose my main concern now would just be that Prism is better than the other mantles, even for single hit spells, which shouldn't be the case.

[SpardaX]

3) Missile spammers are using none, as they are not viable anymore

Ok I must be a bit stupid, because personally I'm not really seeing the issue you guys must be seeing. So can someone please explain it to me.
Because the way I see it, yes preview 3 is obviously considerably worse to preview 2 for Missile Spam.

But

Live is: 7% chance to do 10d10 damage + 7% chance to deal 2d100 + 7% chance to deal 1d100.

Throwing a 5 missile spell, on average one of those above will proc. On a full 10 shot chain missile, you'd get on average 2 procs. But a 10~/6~/4~ (or whatever your personal split of missile spammer is, mine is 9/7/4) are only getting 5 or 6 base missiles even in chain missile. With the additional 10 for CM's explosion 2nd effect. So that's about 16 missiles, so on average you're going to proc 3 times. (3.36 times on average if my maths is correct)

Current Lam is: 30% chance to deal 3d100+100 + 30% chance to deal 3d100+180, but only once per cast.

As far as I can tell, base magic missile is still going to come out ahead of live by a large margin. Even chain missile, which as far as I can tell (on average) is the only spell that's going to come out worse, with only getting 2 procs instead of 3 (or heck, I'll be extra generous and say you got the unlikely .36 chance 4th proc), and I'll even be EXTRA generous and say you got 4 procs of 2d100 which is the best case scenario, well you just got 8d100 extra damage. On average, 404 damage.

On Lam, on chain missile, you're getting an almost guaranteed 6d100+280. On average 583. Still more damage than live. Chain missile is, as far as I can tell, on average ahead. And it's the worst case scenario most possible procs. Any other spell that throws less missiles or beams or rays, should be ahead even more.

So as far as I can tell, the only people who would be disappointed by this, are people who tested it in Preview 2. Anyone not watching Lam, who's just playing the game normally when U51 hits, would just see a buff. Which means if they're viable on live right now (Which, they exist, so I assume that means they are.) then they should still be viable after this update hits. Just less powerful than they could have been. And to be honest, i tested it on preview 2. It was silly. I liked it but it was silly.



Note: This is assuming Prism and Stay (F/G) both have a different 0.1s cooldown. If it's a cooldown they both share, that limits procs to 1 per cast fullstop, then yea that'd be bad. But I would assume it's not that.

[Tilomere]

This tree was screwed as soon as it had DCs and could act as the tree for a necro/illusionist PM, which are already so lethal as to top the kill meters without any DPS abilities.

There's no suggestion that will help under the current ED design.