U50 Comprehensive Assassin Guide

[Willan]

SWF is 3.3% behind TWF, not including the loss of Ooze.

Edit: Originally forgot to include the 20 MP from VKF T4 Single Dagger enhancement.

How do you do the calculation for that? I want to figure out if SWF or TWF is better for other class splits w/ 5 ranger and without.

[Carpone]

Calculate average non-boosted damage from one TWF attack. Multiply by the number of attacks/min, then divide by 60 to obtain damage per second (DPS). Do the same with SWF, then compare. TWF is by far the most involved to calculate due to offhand doublestrike, offhand attacks, and offhand attribute dmg.

The real work is in capturing all of the underlying components like attacks/min based on BAB, damage of all types, melee power, crit profile, etc. You also have to be realistic about what counts as standing damage/MP/dstrike vs boosted.

Generally speaking, SWF is going to pull ahead of TWF when you're in Fury. More than likely you're going to be STR based in that case, and then it comes down to maximizing strikethrough for clearing trash using THF or focusing on beating down red names using SWF. STR-based Fighter 20 (or Fighter 18/Cleric 1/Monk 1) SWF using Dwarven Axe or Bastard Sword in Fury is where I would look for SWF to shine.

[Stormraiser]

Complete write up is available in Google Docs because it is too long for the forum software to handle. It includes two gear sets (Assassinate vs Boss Max DPS), frequently asked questions, and a breakdown of all important stats.

Strong suggestion for one of these for each class

[Hobgoblin]

Strong suggestion for one of these for each class

while that would be instructive - I doubt they will do that. I seem to remember (and am too lazy to look for it to be sure) that carpone has stated that he loves both assassins and bow users. this is a work of love and if they did say a druid caster breakdown it wouldnt be as good because he doesnt have that same drive to test and refine like he has done here.

for example - in this thread you could ask how The Labrythine Edge fares against his goldcursed dagger. chances are he has both and has tested them and will be able to tell you that the dagger is 1000% better then the kukri, but only 500% against red/purple names.

in druid, he doesnt have that same desire and might say something like ok ice flowers kills faster then body of the sun, but doesnt have the percentages to clarify this.

its just the drive and the love for the classes that brings so much depth and precision to this thread. its kinda unfair to expect this in all classes from anyone

sorry about the derail on this

[Carpone]

Strong suggestion for one of these for each class

I encourage people to deep dive into the archetypes they enjoy playing and create their own guide. Feel free to use the same format and number breakdowns.

can this be run as a shadar-kai? what are the pros/cons? would shadar-kai be much worse?

If you need a Shadar Kai past life, sure.

[PrinceOfAsphodel]

SWF is 3.3% behind TWF, not including the loss of Ooze.

Why Ooze over Dust? Is it because of the proc rate? Or is it because someone in your party is more likely to have LGS Dust already?

[Carpone]

Why Ooze over Dust? Is it because of the proc rate? Or is it because someone in your party is more likely to have LGS Dust already?

Because Pain and Suffering is still the best single target dagger setup.

TWF allows you to keep up both Dust and Ooze through swaps. SWF makes you dependent upon other players for them, otherwise you're sacrificing your own DPS. And if you're depending on another player to get it done, it's unlikely to happen.

[Carpone]

Updated the quest/trash weapon setup to use Dust instead of Salt if you've got an instakiller or other caster crowd control in your group.

Also added an important detail about Vistani Knife Training 1 to the FAQ. You don't take this enhancement because the animations associated with it reduce your attacks per minute.

[tigglenorrifis]

Thank you soooo much for this! Honestly, it helped me a lot and nothing feels better then having a good and complete build. Must feel nice. Anyways why don't you use the https://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Outfit...stial_Guardian body?

EDIT: That also might open up a ring slot if you don't need insightful accuracy. You could wear the https://ddowiki.com/page/Item:Legendary_Lionheart_Ring (instead of band of insightful commands) and that opens up your previous +14 stunning augment, and the insight con augment. (just dont forget to slot profane well rounded). Also with the new body it frees up the 100% fort augment. Now you can get more ac from augments and stuff for min maxing
EDIT: Also if I went with this gear set what should I use for spell absorb?

[igotamike]

So I haven't completely thought this through.

But what if you went 18rogue/2monk.

41 Vistani Knife Ftr
31 Assassin.

You would lose the insta kill & 4 sneak attack dice, but gain 10 melee power and 5% attack speed. As well get a burst crit multiplier 15s out of the 60s. If you took the feats you'd get an additional x1crit on 19-20 from Fire Stance. Could switch to ocean stance if you wanted better dodge/saves situationally.

Any thoughts?

[Mystickal]

I ran some tests a couple years ago with an 18 rogue/1 monk/1 ranger.

The tests were against the DPS Kobold, I tested Tier 5 Vistani vs Tier 5 Assassin, and Vistani Fighting Style vs Normal Fighting Style:

Assassin Tier 5 / Normal Style Knife Fighting Average kill time 23.03

Assassin Tier 5 / Vistani Style Knife Fighting Average kill time 25.56

Vistani Tier 5 / Normal Style Knife Fighting Average kill time 22.2

Vistani Tier 5 / Vistani Style Knife Fighting Average kill time 24.35

Weapons used were Pain and Suffering. Each kobold was beat down 3 times. I messed up on the second attack of the Assassin Tier 5 / Normal Style knife fighting and that messed up it's average time, but without that error it would have won hands down.

I don't think that much has changed since I ran these tests that would change the outcome.

[Saekee]

Is the gold paralysis from the dagger a helpless condition or is it like normal paralysis?

If it is dropping a DC100 helpless condition on crit, that is nuts

[duffmaister]

I've some perplexities about this build:
- no true seeing? Really? You are casting yourself a scroll each time you enter a quest, after all shrine, everytime you get raised? Do-able maybe but you should mention it in the guide at least. Possible swap: pendant of warrior focus for family recrit sigil, lose 6% doublestrike, gain true seeing, relentless fury
- no FoM? Ok maybe not really needed, depends on content and playstyle I guess. I like to have it at all times.
- lvl 10 and lvl 30 feats: being a dex build your evasion will be great, what's the use of improved evasion? 5% (1 rolls on saves) you are going to get half damage (on R10 maybe still enough to kill you having a 100 mrr cap, depends on content) I suggest to swap improved evasion for skill mastery and weapon focus:slashing for epic reflexes, this way you can forget about bad rolls on dex saves while losing 2 melee power.
- no improved feint? It's a very good feat to take with this build, have you tried that? Much better than shiv (single target vs aoe) this also allow you to get better enhachements on assassin tree (e.g. venomed blades)
- 3 points on "no step missed" ? I can make it work with 1, am I that lucky to recharge it fast enough so that rarely empties charges? 2 is probabily foolproof but 3 is an overkill imho.
- Even with 3 x paladin PL and 53 competence heal amp from gear I prefer to use ancient blessing vs brace, is +3 to saves really better than 15 heal amp? Especially after U50.

Kudos on vistani animation vs twf animation, I was quite sure that when vkf was released it was faster.

[igotamike]

I probably can answer some of these:


- no true seeing? Really? You are casting yourself a scroll each time you enter a quest, after all shrine, everytime you get raised? Do-able maybe but you should mention it in the guide at least. Possible swap: pendant of warrior focus for family recrit sigil, lose 6% doublestrike, gain true seeing, relentless fury Most of the time you don't solo with end game builds, get it cast on you, use a scroll if need be or swap an item
- no FoM? Ok maybe not really needed, depends on content and playstyle I guess. I like to have it at all times.Same as above
- 3 points on "no step missed" ? I can make it work with 1, am I that lucky to recharge it fast enough so that rarely empties charges? 2 is probabily foolproof but 3 is an overkill imho. You use a maxed out dex sentient weapon, which you swap to then buff. With 1 pt the buff would only last 30s, not 2mins, so swapping more would result in less damage

[Zretch]

If I already have a capped character as Aasimar, and really don't want to restart at 1 to switch to halfling, would I be better off using the Keeper dagger + Suffering as the Fallen Bond will stack vulnerability ? Or does the -3 con, -10 PRR proc on Keeper not stack with the -10 PRR proc on Suffering?

Nevermind, just tried it, they don't stack.

[Quoivat]

Complete write up is available in Google Docs because it is too long for the forum software to handle. It includes two gear sets (Assassinate vs Boss Max DPS), frequently asked questions, and a breakdown of all important stats.

Any updates to the gear on this build or would you still run the same?
Also curious about how you did/would do Destinies with all the changes.

Thanks

[Carpone]

Just this week I dusted off my Assassin that's been sitting unplayed.

Halfling -> Shadar-Kai. Chain attack + Goldcursed Dagger is too fun with it. Also, Displacement SLA and Shadow Jaunt is great quality of life. This race change was suggested early on in this thread and I totally blew it off because I thought losing 1 SA dice was a ridiculous proposition. Oh well, live and learn.

Destinies:
Divine Crusade T5. Use the DC Mantle and take the Embodiment of Law feat. Cower is super useful in R10 RXP and high skull raids.
Shadowdancer T3, including Dark Imbuement and Shadowstriker.
Legendary dreadnought T3 for Action Boosts, Tactics and Doublestrike.

I'm hesitant to post this gearset, as it hinges on a double set bonus with Gem of Many Facets and requires the new Melee Power 10 augment. I've blown 5k+ threads so far on rerolls and still haven't gotten the gem. I just got an aug this week after a ton of farming.

Gear:
Helm: Aspect of the Wild Hunt (Cruel Cut, Melee Power 10)
Neck: Raptor Teeth (Perfect Silence)
Trinket: Gem of Many Facets with Doublestrike, Healing Amp, Insightful Assassinate, Windlasher set, Vulkoors Might set (Globe of True Imperial Blood)
Cloak: Sailcloth Cloak (Perfect Silence, Vitality 20)
Belt: Shadow's Embrace (Cruel Cut)
Ring: Bloodsigil (Dodge 12%, Festive Dex, Cruel Cut)
Gloves: Tinkerers Gloves (Cunning Impact, TBD)
Boots: Dustless Boots, (Insightful INT, Armored Agility +2)
Ring: Slavers Sheltering, Armor Piercing, Shatter, Q CON (Perfect Silence)
Bracers: Bracers of the Claw (Profane, Insightful DEX)
Armor: Red Dragon Armor (Cunning Impact, Festive CON)
Goggles: Precision Lenses (Cunning Impact)

Some of that gear is boosted. Specifically the goggles are there because they're Reaper 3 Mythic 1 power, and nothing else is really good in that slot.

[Quoivat]

Thanks for the update on gear and destinies.
Understand the hesitation towards the Gem, I've heard horror stories but, something to shoot for I suppose ????

Q

[Carpone]

I don't recommend trying to get a double set bonus on a Gem unless you have Threads to burn. Realistically, I need to remake the gearset with just 1 Gem set bonus instead of relying on RNG.

[Quoivat]

Getting the Gem with the sets you want is tough but, achievable. The toughest piece i've run into was the Bloodsigil ring!!
Between myself, friends, re-rolls, and other party members over 200+ chest pulls before I seen one. Luckily it was passed to me
by a friend. Great build, thanks for such an insightful post

Q