Newbie Looking for a S&B Fighter Vanguard Build

[bookmarked]

I'm probably making a dumb newbie mistake, but I was looking for a current free-to-play first life Fighter build that focused on the Vanguard tree with sword & board. I like the idea of using the shield as another weapon. I've stumbled across a few builds in the repository and elsewhere that are sort of in the direction I was thinking, but they're more focused on the two-handed or two-weapon fighting styles instead of sword and shield. Either that or they're heavily multi-classed while I'm looking for something a little simpler. Also I think one or two of the builds I came across are a little outdated with some of the recommendations.

I was thinking human with a bastard sword for the preferred weapon (because of the glancing blow) along with the shield. I don't mind switching to THF or TWF when needed, but I don't want to focus on that. It wouldn't even be a bad idea to add a bow or some other ranged capability for occasional use. It's nice to be able to get in a hit before closing to melee range or to be able to hit back with a ranged opponent that you can't immediately close with. But I don't want to pull too far away from the basic concept, either with skills & feats or by a lot of multiclassing.

One variation that I thought of would be making it a dragonborn (I picked up the $10 Starter Bundle). The breath weapon would be fun, but I read a post somewhere that it's kind of useless without a couple of wizard (or other caster?) levels to boost it. I probably wouldn't mind that even at the cost of the fighter capstone later on.

Can someone point me to any builds like what I'm describing or can I not find one because it's just not feasible? Or should I ask in the Custom Character Builds thread to see if someone would like to take a stab at this?

Thanks!

[Coffey]

Del

[bookmarked]

Thanks for the reply. I like the build.

A few questions, if you don't mind.

Why so many skill points into Intimidate & Jump? If I understand correctly, Intimidate is useful for tanks to take the aggro away from others in the party. Are you mostly tanking with this character? And Jump is useful, but 23 points?

Also, it looks like you're going with much more into the Kensei tree than Vanguard and Two Handed Fighting. Are you fighting two-handed most of the time?

Drat! I also just realized that I forgot to mention in my original post that I'm probably going to be solo mostly rather than with a group.

Thanks!

[Coffey]

Thanks for the reply. I like the build.

A few questions, if you don't mind.

Why so many skill points into Intimidate & Jump? If I understand correctly, Intimidate is useful for tanks to take the aggro away from others in the party. Are you mostly tanking with this character? And Jump is useful, but 23 points?

Also, it looks like you're going with much more into the Kensei tree than Vanguard and Two Handed Fighting. Are you fighting two-handed most of the time?

Drat! I also just realized that I forgot to mention in my original post that I'm probably going to be solo mostly rather than with a group.

Thanks!

I deleted the build above. I will put something together more appropriate for you later when i have time.

[Pandjed]

Though I don't know the build that was posted, I can answer several of these questions aside from that.

Why so many skill points into Intimidate & Jump? If I understand correctly, Intimidate is useful for tanks to take the aggro away from others in the party. Are you mostly tanking with this character? And Jump is useful, but 23 points?

Intimidate is a solid option to get a social skill in certain quests into your build, and even offensive vanguards can often act as off-tanks in groups. Having a social skill can often open up dialog options to either circumvent fights and/or get optional XP. If you solo, getting aggro off your healing hireling will be key, as potions and such just don't cut it as self-heal as a fighter.

Jump is just very useful, and you cap your jumping height at a total value of 40. If you plan to play a character at 30 for a while, you can do the math to get there with as little skill points as possible, but especially as a new player, I'd just max this skill, with the lack of tomes, past lives, and named items with which you can plan ahead a lot more.
If you can constantly jump over your enemies when they surround you, you have also a much easier time to position yourself better to make most of your strikethrough.

Also, it looks like you're going with much more into the Kensei tree than Vanguard and Two Handed Fighting. Are you fighting two-handed most of the time?

Bastard Swords (and Dwarven Waraxes) work with the Two-Handed Fighting feat line--even with a shield equipped--increasing their strikethrough (a very powerful mechanic, as dealing with several foes at once is better which has replaced glancing blows) and their damage.

Kensei is overall a better offensive tree (at least at higher tiers), which makes especially soloing much easier. I personally favor to use Kensei's Tier 5 and Vanguard's capstone, but for most of the leveling experience, it just makes more sense to drop enemies fast.

[Enderoc]

You know Dwarven Axes use two handed feat even if you are holding one...so you can switch out Dwarven axe and shield for great axe ,Falchion, Maul whenever you want to speed up attacks sacrificing defense...
Same for Bastard Sword.
As a fighter you can take one or both of these exotic weapons feats and should.
Weapon versatility and strategy of offense and defense is where fighters get past the point and click.
Casters don't go the entire game with one spell except maybe warlock but even then they have different forms for their blasts.
A fighter is definitely a man of arms.
Some people just want that plus one to something to specialize in just one weapon when being more adaptable is the key to survival imo.
Why not take feats for improved critical on both bludgeon and slash? No one said you couldn't...but people want that maxed out weapon while they nerf themselves everywhere else.

[unbongwah]

Welcome to DDO, OP.

Disclaimer: I'll forewarn you that Vanguard is a backloaded tree IMO. A Kensei-focused build using 2H weapons will out-DPS it by quite a bit, especially early on. That said, you can certainly run a S&B fighter from level 1 if you want.

F2P Vanguard
Fighter 20
Human




Stats
               28pt     32pt     Level Up
               ----     ----     --------
Strength        17       18       4: STR
Dexterity       13       13       8: STR
Constitution    13       14      12: STR
Intelligence    13       13      16: STR
Wisdom           8        8      20: STR
Charisma         8        8      24: STR
                                 28: STR


Skills
          1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
         ------------------------------------------------------------
Intim     4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
Jump      4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
Balance   1  1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1  11
UMD       2     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     11
Tumble    1                                                            1
         ------------------------------------------------------------
         16  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4




Feats


 1        : Exotic Weapon: Bastard Sword
 1 Human  : Improved Shield Bash
 1 Fighter: Two Handed Fighting
 2 Fighter: Precision
 3        : Combat Expertise
 4 Fighter: Improved Trip
 6        : Stunning Blow
 6 Fighter: Improved Two Handed Fighting
 8 Fighter: Improved Critical: Slashing
 9        : Shield Mastery
10 Fighter: Improved Shield Mastery
12        : Tactical Mastery
12 Fighter: Greater Two Handed Fighting
14 Fighter: Heavy Armor Champion
15        : Greater Shield Mastery
16 Fighter: Tactical Supremacy
18        : Weapon Focus: Slashing
18 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
20 Fighter: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing OR Heavy Armor Master OR Shield Deflection
21 Epic   : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic   : Bulwark of Defense
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
27 Epic   : Epic Damage Reduction
28 Destiny: Perfect Shield Mastery
29 Destiny: Dire Charge OR Deific Warding
30 Epic   : Epic Fortitude
30 Legend : Scion of: Arborea




Enhancements (Spent: 77+0r +0u / Max: 80+0r +0u AP)


Vanguard (44 AP)
To the Fore!, Shield Combat I, Vicious Shield I, Shield Combat II, Vicious Shield II, Shield Champion
Shield Specialization, Shield Smash III, Unbalancing Shove I
Shield Specialization, Stunning Shield III, Missile Shield III, Melee Power Boost III
Shield Specialization, Follow Up III, Fatal Bulwark
Shield Specialization
Shield Specialization, Disorienting Smash III, Shield Rush III, Armored Strength, Brutal Impact

Stalwart Defender (14 AP)
Toughness, Stalwart Defense, Overbalance
Item Defense I, Improved Stalwart Defense: Durable Defense III
Improved Stalwart Defense: Resilient Defense III, Instinctive Defense I
Greater Stalwart Defense: Strong Defense III

Kensei (11 AP)
Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades, Spiritual Bond, Strike With No Thought
Extra Action Boost I, Action Boost: Haste Boost III
Ascetic Training: Conditioning III

Human (8 AP)
Damage Boost, Strength
Improved Recovery
Great Weapon Aptitude III

Leveling Guide
Ken0 Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades; Ken1 Action Boost: Haste Boost I, II, III
Van0 To the Fore!; Van1 Shield Smash I, II, III
Van1 Unbalancing Shove I; Van0 Shield Combat I; Van1 Shield Specialization
Hum0 Damage Boost; Van2 Stunning Shield I, II, III
Ken1 Extra Action Boost I; Ken0 Spiritual Bond; Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning I
Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning II, III; Ken0 Strike With No Thought; Van0 Vicious Shield I
Van3 Fatal Bulwark; Van2 Melee Power Boost I, II
Van2 Melee Power Boost III; Van3 Follow Up I, II, III
Van2 Shield Specialization; Van3 Shield Specialization
Van4 Shield Specialization; Van2 Missile Shield I, II
Van2 Missile Shield III; (Bank 3 AP)
Van0 Shield Combat II; Van5 Brutal Impact; Van5 Armored Strength; SD0 Toughness; SD1 Item Defense I
SD1 Improved Stalwart Defense: Durable Defense I, II, III; SD0 Stalwart Defense
Van5 Shield Rush I, II, III; Van5 Disorienting Smash I
Van5 Disorienting Smash II, III; Van5 Shield Specialization
SD2 Instinctive Defense I; SD2 Improved Stalwart Defense: Resilient Defense I, II, III
SD0 Overbalance; SD3 Greater Stalwart Defense: Strong Defense I, II, III
Hum1 Improved Recovery; Hum0 Strength
Van0 Vicious Shield II; Hum2 Great Weapon Aptitude I, II, III
Van0 Shield Champion

Skills:

• Intimidate is important for tanking by boosting threat.
• Balance is what helps you get up quicker from knockdowns.
• Use Magic Device (UMD) lets you use scrolls & wands as well as bypass gear restrictions (e.g., racial or alignment).
• Jump is self-explanatory.
• Tumble enables dodge-rolling.

[bookmarked]

Though I don't know the build that was posted, I can answer several of these questions aside from that.



Intimidate is a solid option to get a social skill in certain quests into your build, and even offensive vanguards can often act as off-tanks in groups. Having a social skill can often open up dialog options to either circumvent fights and/or get optional XP. If you solo, getting aggro off your healing hireling will be key, as potions and such just don't cut it as self-heal as a fighter.

Jump is just very useful, and you cap your jumping height at a total value of 40. If you plan to play a character at 30 for a while, you can do the math to get there with as little skill points as possible, but especially as a new player, I'd just max this skill, with the lack of tomes, past lives, and named items with which you can plan ahead a lot more.
If you can constantly jump over your enemies when they surround you, you have also a much easier time to position yourself better to make most of your strikethrough.




Bastard Swords (and Dwarven Waraxes) work with the Two-Handed Fighting feat line--even with a shield equipped--increasing their strikethrough (a very powerful mechanic, as dealing with several foes at once is better which has replaced glancing blows) and their damage.

Kensei is overall a better offensive tree (at least at higher tiers), which makes especially soloing much easier. I personally favor to use Kensei's Tier 5 and Vanguard's capstone, but for most of the leveling experience, it just makes more sense to drop enemies fast.

For intimidate, you're right. I was forgetting about the need to pull aggro away from hirelings. I'm still not used to thinking of hirelings.

Jump is certainly useful. I was just wondering, with so many other skills available, why so much into that and intimidate and so little into anything else.

It seems like most of the builds here are either kensei/offense focused or stalwart defender/defense focused. I just wanted to try something that was vanguard/balanced in focus and not sure how to go about it.

Thanks!

[bookmarked]

You know Dwarven Axes use two handed feat even if you are holding one...so you can switch out Dwarven axe and shield for great axe ,Falchion, Maul whenever you want to speed up attacks sacrificing defense...
Same for Bastard Sword.
As a fighter you can take one or both of these exotic weapons feats and should.
Weapon versatility and strategy of offense and defense is where fighters get past the point and click.
Casters don't go the entire game with one spell except maybe warlock but even then they have different forms for their blasts.
A fighter is definitely a man of arms.
Some people just want that plus one to something to specialize in just one weapon when being more adaptable is the key to survival imo.
Why not take feats for improved critical on both bludgeon and slash? No one said you couldn't...but people want that maxed out weapon while they nerf themselves everywhere else.

You're right, that's why I proposed bastard sword as my primary weapon along with the shield for defense & bashing. I also proposed THF or TWF as a secondary tactic when needed, or even the occasional bow/ranged attack when appropriate. Adding a bludgeoning weapon to the mix is also a good idea. I'm not trying to go 100% bastard sword + shield, just trying to make that the preferred approach.

[Coffey]

Vanguard is not a defensive tree as one might expect. Its all about the Attack Speed adds and Shield Bash component.

The attack speed starts out very slow and the shield bashing chance is capped at 60Att/Min. https://ddowiki.com/page/Shield_bashing.

Attack Speed is spread through the cores 20% at level 20. Haste Potions will help in big fights along with your Haste Boost for a total of 45% attack speed burst.

Stat Points
STR 18 + Level Ups at 4, 8, 12, 16, 20
DEX 8
CON 14
INT 14
WiS 8
CHA 8

Skills: Jump *(STR), Heal (WIS), Intimidate *(CHA), Search *(INT), Use Magic Device *(CHA)
1st level Tumble 2 point (.5+.5=1) Steal 2 points from Heal.

You can swap items with bonuses to boost the skills when necessary. Use Intm to draw mobs to you and protect your Cleric. HP potions can be used while under water if necessary. I think the use of Intimidate is important to learn if you want to play with a group eventually. I suggest using a cleric hireling to heal yourself along with HP potions.

As Pandjed said Intimidate is a Social skill that can be used in quests on NPCs to get your way as well as draw mobs to you so you can kill them faster.

Trip and Stunning Blow are the meat and potatoes of the build as they will work on more than one target. Shield Bash was not given Strike Through ability see https://ddowiki.com/page/Strikethrough for complete info on it.

Because Hand and a Half (Bastard Sword Dwarven War Axe) weapons use the Two Handed Fighting feats they receive Strike Through bonuses as well.

The best DPS builds dont use Stalwart Defender at all and focus on Kensei and Vanguard enhancement trees exclusively. This version is a DPS build that eventually gets *Epic Defensive Fighting for up to 30% HP increase.

Tactical DCs are derived from Strength (2 Strengrh = 1 DC), Fighter Tactical Feats: Tactical Training (4), Tactical Combatant (8), Tactical Mastery (12), Tactical Supremacy (16). On a new character you will want at least the last three of these. Due to the enormous amount of feats i didnt include Tactical Training (2 DCs). You can also add equiptment bonuses Combat Mastery, Vertigo, Stunning.

You were saying you want to use as much of the VanGuard tree as possible. A Fighter typically uses Kensei 39 AP for Tier 5 (foregoing the capstone) and 41 AP in Vanguard Tier 4 plus the capstone (Core 6). So there isnt a lot of defense on this DPS build and i usually stear new players away from Vanguard altogether. Since THF allows for much better defense as well as great DPS. A Paladin has a much better option if you want to play Tier 5 Vanguard as they get Holysword Spell to cover both the Critical Threat and Multiplier. Kensei Tier 5 is the only place to get +1 Critical Threat for a Fighter outside of using universal trees. Its not to say you cant go without the critical threat of Kensei though. You just wont Crit quite as often % wise.

The high amount of Feats you have to put into this build to make it function well leaves little room for added Heavy Armor Feats for PRR and MRR adds until later heroic levels. The Shield Mastery line adds a total 15 PRR.

Some people would suggest going right through to level 30 Epics as a new player. I dont. I would learn the game a bit first.
You will need to purchase Epic Destinies when you decide to advance to endgame.

Feats at level ups:

1 Weapon Focus Slash
1 (Human) Exotic Weapon Bastard Sword
1 (Fighter) Two Handed Fighting
2 Improved Shield Bash 20%
3 Stunning Blow
4 Power Attack
6 Improved Two Handed Fighting
6 Shield Mastery
8 IC Slashing
9 Tactical Combatant +4 DCs
10 Weapon Specialization Slashing
12 Greater Two Handed Fighting
12 Tactical Mastery +6 DCs
14 Greater Weapon Focus Slashing
15 Improved Shield Mastery
16 Tactical Supremacy +8 DCs
18 Greater Shield Mastery
18 Heavy Armor Champion
20 Heavy Armor Master

You receive Fighter Bonus Feats at level 1 +all Even Number Feats along the way to level 20 for a total of 11.

Enhancement Trees

Kensei 39 Action Points Tier 5
Cores
1 Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades, 3 Spiritual Bond, 6 Strike With No Thought, 12 Power Surge, 18 One Cut
Tier I
Extra Action Boost: +1/+2/+3, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Exotic Weapon Mastery, Haste Boost: Activate to gain +10%/+20%/+30%
Tier II
Tactics: +1/2/3 to the DC's of your Tactical abilities, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades,
Tier III
Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Shattering Strike,
Tier IV
Opportunity Attack, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Liquid Courage, Strike at the Heart
Tier V
A Good Death (Melee), Weapon Master, One With The Blade, Deadly Strike, Keen Edge: You gain a +1 Competence bonus to Critical Threat Range

Vanguard 41 Action Points Tier 4
Cores
1 To the Fore!, 3 Shield Combat I, 6 Vicious Shield I, 12 Shield Combat II, 18 Vicious Shield II, Shield Champion
Tier I
Shield Specialization I, No Weakness
Tier II
Shield Specialization II, Brutality: [+1/+2/+3] to the DC of Stunning abilities, Stunning Shield, Missile Shield, Action Boost: Melee Power: [+10/+20/+30]
Tier III
Shield Specialization III, Follow Up (3), Fatal Bulwark, +1 Strength
Tier IV
Shield Specialization IV, Vanguard Armor Mastery, Shield Charge (3), Myrmidon's Edge (2), +1 Strength

You can try Tier 5 Vanguard with a quick reset of your enhancement trees. It costs more plat the next time you reset which sucks when you dont have a lot of Plat.

Good Luck!

[bookmarked]

Welcome to DDO, OP.

Disclaimer: I'll forewarn you that Vanguard is a backloaded tree IMO. A Kensei-focused build using 2H weapons will out-DPS it by quite a bit, especially early on. That said, you can certainly run a S&B fighter from level 1 if you want.

F2P Vanguard
Fighter 20
Human




Stats
               28pt     32pt     Level Up
               ----     ----     --------
Strength        17       18       4: STR
Dexterity       13       13       8: STR
Constitution    13       14      12: STR
Intelligence    13       13      16: STR
Wisdom           8        8      20: STR
Charisma         8        8      24: STR
                                 28: STR


Skills
          1  2  3  4  5  6  7  8  9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
         ------------------------------------------------------------
Intim     4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
Jump      4  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  1  23
Balance   1  1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1  11
UMD       2     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     1     11
Tumble    1                                                            1
         ------------------------------------------------------------
         16  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4  4




Feats


 1        : Exotic Weapon: Bastard Sword
 1 Human  : Improved Shield Bash
 1 Fighter: Two Handed Fighting
 2 Fighter: Precision
 3        : Combat Expertise
 4 Fighter: Improved Trip
 6        : Stunning Blow
 6 Fighter: Improved Two Handed Fighting
 8 Fighter: Improved Critical: Slashing
 9        : Shield Mastery
10 Fighter: Improved Shield Mastery
12        : Tactical Mastery
12 Fighter: Greater Two Handed Fighting
14 Fighter: Heavy Armor Champion
15        : Greater Shield Mastery
16 Fighter: Tactical Supremacy
18        : Weapon Focus: Slashing
18 Fighter: Weapon Specialization: Slashing
20 Fighter: Greater Weapon Specialization: Slashing OR Heavy Armor Master
21 Epic   : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic   : Bulwark of Defense
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Handed Fighting
27 Epic   : Epic Damage Reduction
28 Destiny: Perfect Shield Mastery
29 Destiny: Dire Charge OR Deific Warding
30 Epic   : Epic Fortitude
30 Legend : Scion of: Arborea




Enhancements (Spent: 77+0r +0u / Max: 80+0r +0u AP)


Vanguard (44 AP)
To the Fore!, Shield Combat I, Vicious Shield I, Shield Combat II, Vicious Shield II, Shield Champion
Shield Specialization, Shield Smash III, Unbalancing Shove I
Shield Specialization, Stunning Shield III, Missile Shield III, Melee Power Boost III
Shield Specialization, Follow Up III, Fatal Bulwark
Shield Specialization
Shield Specialization, Disorienting Smash III, Shield Rush III, Armored Strength, Brutal Impact

Stalwart Defender (14 AP)
Toughness, Stalwart Defense, Overbalance
Item Defense I, Improved Stalwart Defense: Durable Defense III
Improved Stalwart Defense: Resilient Defense III, Instinctive Defense I
Greater Stalwart Defense: Strong Defense III

Kensei (11 AP)
Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades, Spiritual Bond, Strike With No Thought
Extra Action Boost I, Action Boost: Haste Boost III
Ascetic Training: Conditioning III

Human (8 AP)
Damage Boost, Strength
Improved Recovery
Great Weapon Aptitude III

Leveling Guide
Ken0 Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades; Ken1 Action Boost: Haste Boost I, II, III
Van0 To the Fore!; Van1 Shield Smash I, II, III
Van1 Unbalancing Shove I; Van0 Shield Combat I; Van1 Shield Specialization
Hum0 Damage Boost; Van2 Stunning Shield I, II, III
Ken1 Extra Action Boost I; Ken0 Spiritual Bond; Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning I
Ken2 Ascetic Training: Conditioning II, III; Ken0 Strike With No Thought; Van0 Vicious Shield I
Van3 Fatal Bulwark; Van2 Melee Power Boost I, II
Van2 Melee Power Boost III; Van3 Follow Up I, II, III
Van2 Shield Specialization; Van3 Shield Specialization
Van4 Shield Specialization; Van2 Missile Shield I, II
Van2 Missile Shield III; (Bank 3 AP)
Van0 Shield Combat II; Van5 Brutal Impact; Van5 Armored Strength; SD0 Toughness; SD1 Item Defense I
SD1 Improved Stalwart Defense: Durable Defense I, II, III; SD0 Stalwart Defense
Van5 Shield Rush I, II, III; Van5 Disorienting Smash I
Van5 Disorienting Smash II, III; Van5 Shield Specialization
SD2 Instinctive Defense I; SD2 Improved Stalwart Defense: Resilient Defense I, II, III
SD0 Overbalance; SD3 Greater Stalwart Defense: Strong Defense I, II, III
Hum1 Improved Recovery; Hum0 Strength
Van0 Vicious Shield II; Hum2 Great Weapon Aptitude I, II, III
Van0 Shield Champion

Skills:

• Intimidate is important for tanking by boosting threat.
• Balance is what helps you get up quicker from knockdowns.
• Use Magic Device (UMD) lets you use scrolls & wands as well as bypass gear restrictions (e.g., racial or alignment).
• Jump is self-explanatory.
• Tumble enables dodge-rolling.

I think that's what I was looking for.

My (probably flawed) understanding is that Stalwart Defender is all about defense, Kensei is all about offense, while Vanguard is supposed to be a balance between the two. I certainly don't mind investing in StDef or Kensei to achieve that balance - that's smart. Trying to achieve a balanced fighter may not be - I don't know.

It seems like most of the builds here are at one end of the spectrum or the other. I was looking for something somewhere between the 2 extremes, though it's certainly possibly that the way the game is currently structured that a character trying a balanced approach isn't really viable.

Thank you very much for making the build for me!

[bookmarked]

Vanguard is not a defensive tree as one might expect. Its all about the Attack Speed adds and Shield Bash component.

The attack speed starts out very slow and the shield bashing chance is capped at 60Att/Min. https://ddowiki.com/page/Shield_bashing.

Attack Speed is spread through the cores 20% at level 20. Haste Potions will help in big fights along with your Haste Boost for a total of 45% attack speed burst.

Skills: Jump *(STR), Heal (WIS), Intimidate *(CHA), Search *(INT), Use Magic Device *(CHA)
1st level Tumble 2 point (.5+.5=1) Steal 2 points from Heal.

You can swap items with bonuses to boost the skills when necessary. Use Intm to draw mobs to you and protect your Cleric. HP potions can be used while under water if necessary. I think the use of Intimidate is important to learn if you want to play with a group eventually. I suggest using a cleric hireling to heal yourself along with HP potions.

As Panjed said Intimidate is a Social skill that can be used in quests on NPCs to get your way as well as draw mobs to you so you can kill them faster.

Trip and Stunning Blow are the meat and potatoes of the build as they will work on more than one target. Shield Bash was not given Strike Through ability see https://ddowiki.com/page/Strikethrough for complete info on it.

Because Hand and a Half (Bastard Sword Dwarven War Axe) weapons use the Two Handed Fighting feats they receive Strike Through bonuses as well.

The best DPS builds dont use Stalwart Defender at all and focus on Kensei and Vanguard enhancement trees exclusively. This version is a DPS build that eventually gets *Epic Defensive Fighting for up to 30% HP increase.

Tactical DCs are derived from Strength (2 Strengrh = 1 DC), Fighter Tactical Feats: Tactical Training (4), Tactical Combatant (8), Tactical Mastery (12), Tactical Supremacy (16). On a mew character you will want at least the last three of these. Due to the enormous amount of feats i didnt include Tactical Training (2 DCs).

You were saying you want to use as much of the VanGuard tree as possible. A Fighter typically uses Kensei 39 AP for Tier 5 (forefoing the capstone) and 41 AP in Vanguard Tier 4 plus the capstone (Core 6). Kensei So their isnt a lot of defense on this DPS build and i usually stear new players away from Vanguard altogether. Since THF allows for much better defense as well as great DPS. A Paladin has a much better options if you want to play Tier 5 Vanguard as they get Holysword Spell to cover both the Critical Threat and Multiplier. Kensei Tier 5 is the only place to get +1 Critical Threat for a Fighter outside of using universal trees. Its not to say you cant go without the critical threat of Kensie though. You just wont Crit quite as often % wise.

The high amount of Feats you have to put into this build to make it function well leaves little room for added Heavy Armor Feats for PRR and MRR adds until later heroic levels. The Shield Mastery line adds a total 15 PRR.

Some people would suggest going right through to level 30 Epics as a new player. I dont. I would learn the game a bit first.
You will need to purchase Epic Destinies when you decide to advance to endgame.

Feats at level ups:

1 Weapon Focus Slash
1 (Human) Exotic Weapon Bastard Sword
1 (Fighter) Two Handed Fighting
2 Improved Shield Bash 20%
3 Stunning Blow
4 Power Attack
6 Improved Two Handed Fighting
6 Tactical Combatant +4 DCs
8 IC Slashing
9 Shield Mastery
10 Weapon Specialization Slashing
12 Greater Two Handed Fighting
12 Tactical Mastery +6 DCs
14 Greater Weapon Focus Slashing
15 Improved Shield Mastery
16 Tactical Supremacy +8 DCs
18 Greater Shield Mastery
18 Heavy Armor Champion
20 Heavy Armor Master

You receive Fighter Bonus Feats at level 1 +all Even Number Feats along the way to level 20 for a total of 11.

Enhancement Trees

Kensei 39 Action Points Tier 5
Cores
1 Kensei Focus: Heavy Blades, 3 Spiritual Bond, 6 Strike With No Thought, 12 Power Surge, 18 One Cut
Tier I
Extra Action Boost: +1/+2/+3, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Exotic Weapon Mastery, Haste Boost: Activate to gain +10%/+20%/+30%
Tier II
Tactics: +1/2/3 to the DC's of your Tactical abilities, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades,
Tier III
Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Shattering Strike,
Tier IV
Opportunity Attack, Weapon Group Specialization Heavy Blades, Liquid Courage, Strike at the Heart
Tier V
A Good Death (Melee), Weapon Master, One With The Blade, Deadly Strike, Keen Edge: You gain a +1 Competence bonus to Critical Threat Range

Vanguard 41 Action Points Tier 4
Cores
1 To the Fore!, 3 Shield Combat I, 6 Vicious Shield I, 12 Shield Combat II, 18 Vicious Shield II, Shield Champion
Tier I
Shield Specialization I, No Weakness
Tier II
Shield Specialization II, Brutality: [+1/+2/+3] to the DC of Stunning abilities, Stunning Shield, Missile Shield, Action Boost: Melee Power: [+10/+20/+30]
Tier III
Shield Specialization III, Follow Up (3), Fatal Bulwark, +1 Strength
Tier IV
Shield Specialization IV, Vanguard Armor Mastery, Shield Charge (3), Myrmidon's Edge (2), +1 Strength

You can try Tier 5 Vanguard with a quick reset of your enhancement trees. It costs more plat the next time you reset which sucks when you dont have a lot of Plat.

Good Luck!

I probably explained what I was trying to do badly by concentrating on the Vanguard tree. What I'm trying to achieve is a S&B fighter that normally uses a fighting style balanced between offense & defense (thus I looked to Vanguard but am okay with drawing from both Kensei for offense and StDef for defense in order to achieve that balanced approach), and is able to switch to other techniques (THF or TWF, or even something like a ranged attack) when needed.

Thanks for all of the help!

[Coffey]

I think that's what I was looking for.

My (probably flawed) understanding is that Stalwart Defender is all about defense, Kensei is all about offense, while Vanguard is supposed to be a balance between the two. I certainly don't mind investing in StDef or Kensei to achieve that balance - that's smart. Trying to achieve a balanced fighter may not be - I don't know.

It seems like most of the builds here are at one end of the spectrum or the other. I was looking for something somewhere between the 2 extremes, though it's certainly possibly that the way the game is currently structured that a character trying a balanced approach isn't really viable.

Thank you very much for making the build for me!

Something similar to this?

Rage against the Machine

[bookmarked]

Something similar to this?

Rage against the Machine

The "Build Goals" seem to be along the lines of what I was looking for, but I have a few problems with the build. First, it's a 36 point build and I'm not there yet. Then there's all of those tomes and other items - if they're absolutely needed then I'm out of luck for the foreseeable future. Also, there's the khopesh proficiency. If I understand correctly, that's not currently an optimal main weapon, which makes me wonder if there are other things that a are outdated (6 Swim?). But the concept looks good.

Also, I wasn't dismissing or criticizing the build you provided in Post #10 https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6437896
. I'm still studying it. I was just trying to do a better job of explaining what I was looking for than I did originally.

Thanks!

[unbongwah]

My (probably flawed) understanding is that Stalwart Defender is all about defense, Kensei is all about offense, while Vanguard is supposed to be a balance between the two.

Kensei is certainly focused on DPS, but there are a few (modest) defensive boosts in the tree, such as Conditioning: +15 HPs and +15% Fortification.

Likewise Stalwart Defender is focused on defensive buffs (+PRR/MRR, CON, HPs, etc.) but also some offensive perks like Strong Defense (+6 STR) and Overbalance (knockdown enemies on vorpal strikes with shield bashes).

Vanguard is (almost) exclusively for S&B builds; there are generic bonuses like Melee Power Boost but most of the tree requires having a shield equipped. Some Enhancements boost your DPS (like attack speed bonuses and higher shield-bashing chance) while others boost your defenses (+AC etc.). I focused on DPS buffs.

Finally the human tree rounds things out with Damage Boost, +1 STR, one rank of healing amplification, and Great Weapon Aptitude (+20 Strikethrough).

I What I'm trying to achieve is a S&B fighter that normally uses a fighting style balanced between offense & defense (thus I looked to Vanguard but am okay with drawing from both Kensei for offense and StDef for defense in order to achieve that balanced approach), and is able to switch to other techniques (THF or TWF, or even something like a ranged attack) when needed.

The build I posted is focused on S&B DPS (Vanguard + Kensei) + tactical abilities (Improved Trip, Shield Rush, Stunning Blow, Stunning Shield); but with enough invested in Stalwart Defender to take advantage of some defensive stance bonuses (+25 PRR/MRR, +3 saves) as well as Strong Defense + Overbalance.

While you can switch to 2H weapons, there's no need to do so; or rather, I've invested so many feats & Enhancements into S&B, your 2H DPS would be sub-par compared to a dedicated 2H Kensei build.

Passive shield-bashing works like dual-wielding (i.e., it happens automatically during regular attacks), but has an internal cooldown of 1 second, so there's a hard cap on how often your shield will hit while attacking. Thus you want to take advantage of proc-on-hit effects for shields like Overbalance, Unbalancing Shove, Disorienting Smash, and the Vanguard capstone (10% chance of any shield bash proccing a free stun attempt).

Enhancements are flexible. You could certainly reconfigure them to be more tanking-oriented: e.g., 42 Vanguard / 24 Defender (add Stand Fast and Hardy Defense) / 11 Kensei / 3 human (Damage Boost, heal amp). I took the Combat Expertise feat partly because it's a pre-req for Improved Trip but also to give the option of switching to a more AC-focused build. Otherwise leave Precision active.

[Coffey]

The "Build Goals" seem to be along the lines of what I was looking for, but I have a few problems with the build. First, it's a 36 point build and I'm not there yet. Then there's all of those tomes and other items - if they're absolutely needed then I'm out of luck for the foreseeable future. Also, there's the khopesh proficiency. If I understand correctly, that's not currently an optimal main weapon, which makes me wonder if there are other things that a are outdated (6 Swim?). But the concept looks good.

Also, I wasn't dismissing or criticizing the build you provided in Post #10 https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post6437896
. I'm still studying it. I was just trying to do a better job of explaining what I was looking for than I did originally.

Thanks!

Its all cool

I enjoyed building it.

The build i linked is from the Build Repository and it is dated. Never to say that it cant be updated or tweaked for a new player in todays game but it wouldnt be a META build and instead a flavor build for someone that doesnt run reaper at their highest capable level always on the edge.

The build i listed was just to show you how hard it would be to to put together the Feats to make a ranged option work and i think you can see that now. Manyshot was changed recently making it much less powerful for switching to Bow and picking off perched trash etc. I think Dagger builds using the Vistani Knife Fighter universal tree would be your best bet for a Melee / Thrower build that could be reasonably strong in both fighting styles.

Horizon Wanker Bow universal tree is slated to be released later this year. You should be able to better make a Bow / Melee character with that addition. The Vanguard Hand and a Half build is a very heavy Feated build to add Bow capabilities to so you may have to look at a different fighting style to combine.

And this is the best way to learn from different perspectives. unbongwah is a pro builder and his build offers more defensive options. Action Points in Enhancements are not set in stone so you can experiment with different AP distributions. Remember the Plat costs go up with level and times reset though. Feats are set in stone. You can swap out one Feat for free through the Hall of the Mark quest.

[unbongwah]

Enhancements are flexible. You could certainly reconfigure them to be more tanking-oriented

Here's an example of what it might look like in ULTIMATE TANK mode for epics.

Enhancements (Spent: 80+0r +0u / Max: 80+0r +0u AP)


Stalwart Defender (42 AP)
Toughness, Stalwart Defense, Overbalance, Stand Fast, Defensive Sweep, Last Stand
Improved Stalwart Defense: Durable Defense III, Stalwart Defensive Mastery III, Defense Boost III
Improved Stalwart Defense: Resilient Defense III, Stalwart Shield Mastery III, Armor Expertise III
Greater Stalwart Defense: Hardy Defense III, Shield Expertise III
Swift Defense, Reinforced Defense: Reinforced Armor III
The Thick of Battle, Block and Cut III, Reinforced Defense: Reinforced Shield III, Against All Odds

Vanguard (24 AP)
To the Fore!, Shield Combat I, Vicious Shield I, Shield Combat II
Shield Specialization, Shield Smash III
Shield Specialization, Stunning Shield III, Melee Power Boost III
Shield Specialization, Fatal Bulwark
Vanguard Armor Mastery III

Human (14 AP)
Defense Boost
Improved Recovery, Don't Count Me Out III
Shield Mastery III
Improved Recovery

Destiny (24 AP)


Unyielding Sentinel
Brace for Impact II, Shield Prowess III
Block Energy III, Legendary Shield Mastery III
(none)
Draw Them Out, Spark of Life
Hardened III, Strength of Vitality III
Undying Vanguard

Twists of Fate (8 fate points)
Imp. Combat Expertise (Tier 2 Dreadnought)
Extra Action Boost (Tier 1 Dreadnought)
Legendary Tactics (Tier 1 Dreadnought)

Normally you wouldn't want to give up so much DPS for high-AC tanking, but the point is that Enhancements are easy to redo so you can fine-tune your build for the specific role you want to play at any given time.

[bookmarked]

Its all cool

I enjoyed building it.

The build i linked is from the Build Repository and it is dated. Never to say that it cant be updated or tweaked for a new player in todays game but it wouldnt be a META build and instead a flavor build for someone that doesnt run reaper at their highest capable level always on the edge.

The build i listed was just to show you how hard it would be to to put together the Feats to make a ranged option work and i think you can see that now. Manyshot was changed recently making it much less powerful for switching to Bow and picking off perched trash etc. I think Dagger builds using the Vistani Knife Fighter universal tree would be your best bet for a Melee / Thrower build that could be reasonably strong in both fighting styles.

Horizon Wanker Bow universal tree is slated to be released later this year. You should be able to better make a Bow / Melee character with that addition. The Vanguard Hand and a Half build is a very heavy Feated build to add Bow capabilities to so you may have to look at a different fighting style to combine.

And this is the best way to learn from different perspectives. unbongwah is a pro builder and his build offers more defensive options. Action Points in Enhancements are not set in stone so you can experiment with different AP distributions. Remember the Plat costs go up with level and times reset though. Feats are set in stone. You can swap out one Feat for free through the Hall of the Mark quest.

I've really only just scratched the surface, but I think the pieces are starting to come together. Thanks!

[bookmarked]

Kensei is certainly focused on DPS, but there are a few (modest) defensive boosts in the tree, such as Conditioning: +15 HPs and +15% Fortification.

Likewise Stalwart Defender is focused on defensive buffs (+PRR/MRR, CON, HPs, etc.) but also some offensive perks like Strong Defense (+6 STR) and Overbalance (knockdown enemies on vorpal strikes with shield bashes).

Vanguard is (almost) exclusively for S&B builds; there are generic bonuses like Melee Power Boost but most of the tree requires having a shield equipped. Some Enhancements boost your DPS (like attack speed bonuses and higher shield-bashing chance) while others boost your defenses (+AC etc.). I focused on DPS buffs.

Finally the human tree rounds things out with Damage Boost, +1 STR, one rank of healing amplification, and Great Weapon Aptitude (+20 Strikethrough).

The build I posted is focused on S&B DPS (Vanguard + Kensei) + tactical abilities (Improved Trip, Shield Rush, Stunning Blow, Stunning Shield); but with enough invested in Stalwart Defender to take advantage of some defensive stance bonuses (+25 PRR/MRR, +3 saves) as well as Strong Defense + Overbalance.

While you can switch to 2H weapons, there's no need to do so; or rather, I've invested so many feats & Enhancements into S&B, your 2H DPS would be sub-par compared to a dedicated 2H Kensei build.

Passive shield-bashing works like dual-wielding (i.e., it happens automatically during regular attacks), but has an internal cooldown of 1 second, so there's a hard cap on how often your shield will hit while attacking. Thus you want to take advantage of proc-on-hit effects for shields like Overbalance, Unbalancing Shove, Disorienting Smash, and the Vanguard capstone (10% chance of any shield bash proccing a free stun attempt).

Enhancements are flexible. You could certainly reconfigure them to be more tanking-oriented: e.g., 42 Vanguard / 24 Defender (add Stand Fast and Hardy Defense) / 11 Kensei / 3 human (Damage Boost, heal amp). I took the Combat Expertise feat partly because it's a pre-req for Improved Trip but also to give the option of switching to a more AC-focused build. Otherwise leave Precision active.

I created a character based on the build you provided and I'm looking forward to playing it. Like I told Coffey, I think the pieces are starting to come together, though I still have a lot to learn. Thanks for all of the good information!

[Ganak]

A bit late to the party, and for the interest of anyone looking at Fighter Vanguard, some detailed (and wordy, sorry) commentary on how I built my DPS focused Fighter Vanguard:

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...irca-Late-2020


I've made a few tweaks I haven't documented since posting a year ago, such as some newer feat choices (Greater Shield Mastery, Perfect Shield Mastery).


Tier 5 Vanguard is inferior to Tier 5 Kensei still imho.


A vanguard will have superior single target damage vs THF, and less AoE (only 2 targets at once), but the best tactics.

Mine is dps, and a different lean is more towards tankish-ness into Stalwart Defender.


If you enjoy the crunch of orc nose from a shield smacking it, skip SD tree.