First Look: Radiant Servant Adjustments

[scut207]

If it’s spell point cost that is the issue with a true resurrection SLA- then just have it cost the same as the spell. Would rather have another true resurrection on a separate cool down than a raise dead SLA.

Many other options listed would be great too- mass resist, mass protection, any cure serious or above SLA.

Thanks-

Kell

I think the whole idea of a buff SLA is a mistake. unless it is a short term powerful one. or they do something like wards 300 pts of damage.

Other classes SLA in T5 is something powerful that can be meta-d that is used in almost every battle, that closely matches the whole theme of the tree.

Shouldn't be a buff, shouldn’t be raise dead.

1) Should be a heal of some sort. Even if it’s a new one.
2) Generally a t5 SLA has a level 24? counter part Master of _______ that MCL get a boost as well

if not

Make it passive that as suggested makes turning based on WIS or extremely increases the HD to make it viable in Epics

[Kelledren]

I think the whole idea of a buff SLA is a mistake. unless it is a short term powerful one. or they do something like wards 300 pts of damage.

Other classes SLA in T5 is something powerful that can be meta-d that is used in almost every battle, that closely matches the whole theme of the tree.

Shouldn't be a buff, shouldn’t be raise dead.

1) Should be a heal of some sort. Even if it’s a new one.
2) Generally a t5 SLA has a level 24? counter part Master of _______ that MCL get a boost as well

if not

Make it passive that as suggested makes turning based on WIS or extremely increases the HD to make it viable in Epics

Let me first say I 100% agree with everything you said. Do I think a mass resist is great for T5 ability… no not at all. It’s just better than a raise dead. The issue is that this is a quick fix so likely nothing new or exciting will be developed at this time. It’s great things cost less- but we have to spend 30 points regardless and will not be able to move any extra AP into FI for example. So just trying to pack anything that will at least be useable into those 30 points. That said these T5 abilities are only if you are trying to reach new capstone.
I appreciate that this is on the radar- but sounds like still will have the same issues as before. Just a little more flexibility.

[karatemack]

Turns work great in low level content with appropriate investments, by the time we hit epics it all falls apart and becomes effectively worthless.

at level 20 I shift tracks... dump everything to do with turns and refocus on DC's as spells scale appropriately into epics, Turns don't.

I use Turn Undead all the time in R10 content at cap. Hit me up on Discord and we can compare notes if you want.

[Ausdoerrt]

Something to consider:

1) Need more ways to get positive spell power.
2) Raise Dead SLA is pretty pointless
3) Maybe close wounds SLA instead of cure mod?

[Coffey]

Something to consider:

1) Need more ways to get positive spell power.
2) Raise Dead SLA is pretty pointless
3) Maybe close wounds SLA instead of cure mod?

Was it the Close Wounds SLA that is over performing on the Beacon of Hope tree for FVS? Close Wounds spell for Cleric WAI but useless.
Can Clerics have the over performing version of it too if so? And put it conveniently low on the tree like FVS beacon.

So AP costs are less but it still costs 32 AP to get the Aura in tier 5 at level 12. A negative self healing Wizard gets two Auras and a Burst by level 7 from their spell book.

I will continue using a fully meta 11 AP RS Burst on my Cleric. Nothing changes for me.

An increase of the Restoration on RS Burst would be great!

[lumpilein1973]

Thank you for all your hard work! As someone who has been playing a cleric for years, here are my thoughts:

Please do NOT remove any sources of positive spell power or spell crit chance. Tanks with 7k-10k HP are hard enough to heal as is in high reaper content. Adding more sources of positive spell power would actually be welcome. With Silverthread Belt gone, any cleric that isn't a pure healbot (yawn) will struggle to get to 1300 positive. That number may seem high as a benchmark, but it barely cuts it when trying to heal and fill up said tanks with around 250 HA (as an average HA number).

Added spell crit dmg--thank you!

New T5 Radiance--sounds good. Add an HP refill to it and increase CD?

Mass Freedom of Movement--yessssss!!!

AP reduction is much appreciated, but give players more useful stuff on which to spend the 'leftover' points!

Turning changes make no relevant difference at higher levels or difficulties. Even doubling values would make little difference, in part because of relevant gear missing at higher levels. No suggestions there, I am afraid.

New T5 Raise Dead SLA--verifiably pointless. But the idea of Deathpact castable on an ally as a new T5 would be fabulous if implemented.

Would be it be possible/feasible to decrease mass heal casting animation/time? The spell is rarely used (part 4 Shroud on higher reaper non 1-rounders, Invitation to Dinner Miser-Golem endfight) at endgame, but when we need it, it is too darn slow, even quickened.

Yum, Synergia, Argo

[Ausdoerrt]

Was it the Close Wounds SLA that is over performing on the Beacon of Hope tree for FVS? Close Wounds spell for Cleric WAI but useless.
Can Clerics have the over performing version of it too if so? And put it conveniently low on the tree like FVS beacon.

Never played Bacon fvs, can't confirm. Close Wounds works great on a RS cleric in conjunction with Cure Focus T5. However, free metas would be nice as a way to conserve SP.

[Coffey]

Never played Bacon fvs, can't confirm. Close Wounds works great on a RS cleric in conjunction with Cure Focus T5. However, free metas would be nice as a way to conserve SP.

Makes sense that it is better purely because it is an SLA. I may have misunderstood what i heard thanks for clarifying it for me

[Antheal]

Reducing AP cost is great, but as you still need to spend 30 points to get the T5 ability, it really depends on if the other stuff in the tree are things you actually want, or if it's just garbage filler to waste AP on so you can unlock Tier 5.

[Targal]

Never played Bacon fvs, can't confirm. Close Wounds works great on a RS cleric in conjunction with Cure Focus T5. However, free metas would be nice as a way to conserve SP.

Makes sense that it is better purely because it is an SLA. I may have misunderstood what i heard thanks for clarifying it for me

FvS one is SLA and costs 2 SP. quite overpowered when compared to the normal spell version of Cleric since it is spammable and no penalty for applying full of metamagics. (although it is less effective at epics)
I don't want to use Close Wounds spell as normal version as it is rather better to cast ordinary cure spells because 8 SP cost is not something to let you spam it, especially when you are a cleric with a poor SP pool.


and I don't think Close Wounds with Cure Focus is WAI - which means you misunderstood or it's working but with a weird code - because Cure Focus is only applied to Cure spells, not to all healing spells, according to the description.

[rabidfox]

Trying to think of things that I'd want instead of t5 raise dead and run speed came to mind. +1% run speed per Religious Lore feat (or cleric level). Being able to quickly close the gap between myself and the person getting beat on would be nice QoL on a healer.

[NabeGewell]

AltruisimT1: t3 doesn't actually give +10pos spellpower, fix that.

PacifismC2: why not leave it as an option along with the cure wounds sla? +25pos spellpower isn't a bad boost if you're playing combat passive anyway. To make it more universal add extra heal amp and maybe up the sp number to 35 or smtg.

MartydromT3: never took it, never understood why invest points in to smtg that's going to give a mild healing ONLY if I die and ONLY near me... Make it something useful like the self raise dead ability from Reborn to Light, if it's sounds op make it cost 5ap or smtg.

Incredible healingT4: t3 doesn't give 3lvls, just total of 1, fix that.

You're frowned upon if you're using Raise dead in high levels lol. Not worth T5 imo.

Nobody uses stuff like Channel Divinity, Divine Health, Divine Healing, Positive Energy Shield. Since you made the current game all bout zerging R11, replace them with aoe ally buffs like healing amp, mrr, energy/poison absorbtion etc.

Boost Divine Disciple tree too while you're at it.

C6 getting 4 Wisdom and merging Turnings is a welcome and long waited addition, ty.

[Hulligan]

Understanding the current problems

1. Radiant Servant is still looked upon as a healbot, because frankly that's the only option she's good at. If you want to go melee, you'll probably mix with auralock and warpriest, if you go caster, then divine disciple or just go fvs because it's overall better choice for divine caster.
2. This concludes, if you want a healbot, RS will underperform compared to a Bard, because cheap spot heals (renewal and cocoon) are mostly enough all the times, but bard gets mass cures too if needed, and on lower difficulties even the bard song alone may be enough to keep the party on full health, all the time while it also fills SP (!!!!!), and gives a huge kick to everyone in the party, all the while you (as a bard) don't even need to be there with the party (can go afk or even die) and not worry about any of the buffs being dispelled or expired...
Meanwhile a cleric need to stay with the party (aura or being in range), risking dying.
3. That being said, a cleric on epics will 99% of time will chose Unyielding Sentinel as destiny only to ensure her own survival further limiting the usefulness of a cleric (a dead cleric can't heal ... while a dead bard's song still heals!).
In Unyielding, the cleric gets Resurrection SLA too.

Comment on current changes
Making overall enhancements cheaper is a nice boost for sure, makes freedom to put points elsewhere but I'd rather see some improvement in the abilities.
Also one will gladly invest points in a tree if the investments worth it.

Suggetsions
1.a. Divine healing should be affected by positive spellpower (currently it's not) and ... 2 seconds? The duration could see some extension.
1.b. Other variant could be scaling with heal skill but have a duration of [minutes x caster level] to be similar to the bard sustaining song (I'd like this one better).
2. Bliss: This one's completely useless, I'd replace it with Close wounds SLA with all metamegics applying. (and keeping on tier 1)
3. Divine health: Pull down to tier 2 or 3 max
4. Martyrdom: It's usually the healer to die last, meaning currently healing everyone else (who are already dead) make no sense. IT could be changed to: Cast Resurrection on every dead party member, regardless of location in the dungeon. 1 use per rest.
5. Intense Healing: It should also give +15/+30/+50 positive energy spell power (RS surprisingly doesn't get any positive spell power)
6. Unyielding Sovereignty: Change from 2 AP / 1 rank --> 1 AP / 3 rank (decreasing cooldown to 3.5 min / 2min)
7. Replace planned Raise Dead SLA with Resurrection SLA
8. Positive Energy Aura: Make it a permanent aura (toggle) and if possible with a bit enlarged radius
9. Reactive Heal: The 3 min cooldown alone makes it usesless, but 250 healing unaffected by spellpower also a lackluster. Just remove / replace with something more useful.
10. New ability: Frog SLA (like Mass Frog, but single target) (Tier 4, rank 1, cost 2)
11. New ability: Begone! (multiselector: Your Turn undead also affects [Elementals/ Animals/ Aberrations/ Outsiders/ Plants / Fey/ Ooze]) Could place to tier 2 and tier 4 as well (rank 1, AP cost 2)
12. New ability: Greater Death Pact SLA: Same as Death Pact, but works on any selected ally. (Tier 5, rank 1, AP cost 2)
13. Mass heal is not used at all, because the animation is so long even with quicken. If the animation could be replaced with that of mass cures (or made a lot faster) it would make sense to use.
14. New ability: Far Healing. Toggle. Healing Spells and Spell Like abilities have their range doubled. This stacks with the enlarge spell (Tier 4, rank1, cost 2)

++Boosting turn undead efficiency would also be necessary (and not necessarily on enhancement side as there's no turning isssues on heroics) as on high levels you end up turning mobs only 1 at a time because of their insanely high CR. In the past ~10 years only a handful (<5) of items were made to support turning. That should be improved as well...

[Shadowperson]

All 3 Cleric trees should be scrapped completely and reimagined from the ground up. The biggest challenge in playing a cleric is finding enhancements I actually want to spend my points in. Leveling is just a bore with them since there is nothing fun or interesting in their trees.

[Marshal_Lannes]

Removing pacifism is a huge quality of life improvement. Thank you!

[Merlocke]

The reduced AP cost is good.
The SLA's are hot garbage.
Losing the crit chance from pacifism sucks for healbots.
Positive Energy Burst needs to be stronger.
Positive Energy Aura: Make it a permanent.

[NabeGewell]

Removing pacifism is a huge quality of life improvement. Thank you!

How so? It's a toggle that you're not forced to use it. In fact this thread is seen as overall cleric positive spellpower nerf lmao. I'd like to see fvs and cler excel at different playstyles of healing, but so far we just seeing how little they give a hoot about cleric making it look like a further fvs promotion.

[Ausdoerrt]

How so? It's a toggle that you're not forced to use it. In fact this thread is seen as overall cleric positive spellpower nerf lmao. I'd like to see fvs and cler excel at different playstyles of healing, but so far we just seeing how little they give a hoot about cleric making it look like a further fvs promotion.

Yeeeah, I don't see what "quality of life" this brings either. Prior content is basically balanced around healbots having it always on. The loss just forces clerics to spend more SP to keep up the party out of the already low SP pool.

I'm not saying Pacifism is great (it isn't), but you can't just remove it either. They need to give back that positive spellpower elsewhere in the tree or they're basically nerfing cleric compared to BoH FvS.

Cleric is in a really weird spot right now where it's used mostly for splashes and hybrid builds, while FvS is the top divine healer, caster and / or melee.

[SWCarter]

This looks like a great pass, but I would also cast my vote that a Raise Dead SLA is highly unappealing for a Cleric.

I also would recommend adding some Positive spell power in here, as this tree should really be the best way for any character to gain Positive spell power - even above Beacon of Hope - and you are actually taking spell power away from it. Just because there are now more points to be used elsewhere doesn't mean the character can achieve the same amount of Positive spell power by reallocating them to other trees.

It's already unfortunate that Fatesinger is the best way for a Cleric to maximize Positive spell power in epics. Inhibiting their ability to gain it in their core trees worsens the blow. Even if it's just something like +10/20/30 Positive spell power in T2 (perhaps doubled for those who have chosen Healing domain?), that would be a nice addition.

[rabidfox]

Removing pacifism is a huge quality of life improvement. Thank you!

How so? It's a toggle that you're not forced to use it. In fact this thread is seen as overall cleric positive spellpower nerf lmao...

Yeeeah, I don't see what "quality of life" this brings either. Prior content is basically balanced around healbots having it always on....

It's QoL in the sense that having cleric heals balanced around it meant effective healers did less caster damage. Do they need to offer more positive spellpower/other balance changes to go along with the removal of pacifism? Sure, but it's a major step in the right direction to not make healbots take extra dps hits and being able to bring the pain in between heals. Healers only being good at heals (by nerfing other spell damage) is an old forced role mechanic that really feels dated with the way the game plays these days. The only issue now is finding the right buffs to offset it the change to keep heals good (and update some of the other weaksauce stuff in the tree).