Page 4 of 9 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 80 of 177
  1. #61
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    723

    Default NOW YOU ARE ADDING MORE “ON-HIT” effects

    Confused………

    Update 49 includes significant adjustments to melee and missile combat to address long term concerns about game performance.
    One of the most frequent causes of lag happens when an Effects Queue forms, which means that players have applied a ton of on-hit effects to a monster and the game has reached a buffer and must clear its queue in order to continue processing new information.
    We are specifically targeting Server-based lag with this change.
    Behind the scenes, the server crunches damage, effects, and debuffs in a big queue.
    We can measure how efficient the server is at processing this queue by measuring the server frames.
    To begin researching and addressing the root cause we put together simulations of a standard large group and their on-hit profiles.
    What we found was that the amount of damage dealt didn't matter; it was about the frequency that effects were being applied.
    It didn't matter if a simulation was against one target or many - if the effects queue was in trouble the rest of the instance had its performance significantly impacted.
    That means lag for not just you and your group but for other people on the server.


    NOW YOU ARE ADDING MORE “ON-HIT” effects ? ? ? ? ?


    Highlights....

    T4 Whirling Chain
    In addition, when you Vorpal with this attack, you knock enemies down with no save for 6 seconds.
    Every 2 seconds, they make a Balance save of (17 + DEX Mod + Trip DCs) to get up again. (18 second cooldown)

    T4: Assassin's Mark
    Spiked Chain Attacks have a 33% gain a stack of Dizzying Spiked Chain on each of the three hits
    Only a 33% chance of each hit applying a stack

    It's longer than Cleave, but also hits three times!

    perform 3 AOE melee attacks

    Vicious Chain giving a 33% chance to Bleed on each hit of the Spiked Chain.

    Forceful Chain a 5% chance to knock non-boss enemies down with no save for 6 seconds.
    Every 2 seconds, they make a Balance save of (17 + DEX Mod + Trip DCs) to get up again.


    What am I missing here ????

    Would these attacks not hinder Game performance for others on my server?

    Also Spiked Chain is now a Light Melee Weapon…. thus any “on-hit” effects on that light weapon are now also added to this queue along with the Chain Attacks of 3 AoE melee attacks.

    I would have thought / hoped that the DEV’s would be limiting things that add to the “effects queue” not adding to them.

    But again... I could be missing something.... please explain.
    Last edited by Vyrzain; 06-03-2021 at 09:57 PM.

  2. #62
    Community Member Artos_Fabril's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,681

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by LurkingVeteran View Post
    My main point still stands about a long-duration attack that breaks on movement being unfun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Importantly, you can now move while using it, and cancel out of it early by tumbling. You won't get the remaining hits, and the attack will be on cooldown, but you can bail out that way.
    Problem solved?

  3. #63
    Ultimate Completionist
    2014 DDO Players Council
    Open Guild for All Founder - Hardcore

    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Like we've said, this is early, we're still tweaking numbers and playtesting internally, and you'll see it on Lamannia before it goes Live, but we wanted to show these off and see your thoughts! Let us know what you think!
    I like these changes.

    This fills a niche often asked for by players: "Can we have new weapon types added to ddo?"
    Well done.
    Welcome, proper Spike Chains to the game.

    [Polearms added to next expansion iconic, perhaps?]

    I trust you to twiddle the math for balance.

    I have no qualms about giving out a displacement SLA, it seems appropriate given their iconic PL toggle, which I tend to use the most.

  4. #64
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    6,035

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Light melee kinda limits your synergy: Swash, Assassin.
    - Tempest is kinda redundant...they already get plenty of good AoE in DoD, and all their good stuff is locked into T5 and deep cores, so there's not much point in trying to T4 Tempest/T5 something else.
    - Since SDKs have no option for Favored Light Melee, that kinda leaves Paladins and FvS out of the equation.
    - Druid depends entirely on if it works with Animal Form.
    - SWF EK (or VC Alch), maybe, since that lets you use Orbs, and pairs your Chain with your EK Cleaves for more sustained AOE.
    - Maybe a SWF Kensei, as a flavor build.
    - Ninja on paper, but nothing in that tree is really worth using.
    - SWF ES is really the only "creative" build I can think of, since they really lack AOE (their Bursts just suck). That might be a useful debuffing build, between Chain and the various Warlock debuffs, and again can make use of a good Orb.
    - Maybe a non-caster caster lol....FI for Shadowblades, EK for Fan of Blades, and two Chains. Summoned Shadowblade makes your Chain do pure Force damage.
    Add all Vistani Knife Fighters of any class.

  5. #65
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    9,633

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cru121 View Post
    Add all Vistani Knife Fighters of any class.
    Which didn't I cover already? VKF is really a supplemental tree - it supports many builds, but doesn't define one of its own.

  6. #66
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    6,035

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    Which didn't I cover already? VKF is really a supplemental tree - it supports many builds, but doesn't define one of its own.
    I see various classes using Vistani. For example, quite a lot of FvS.

  7. #67
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by cru121 View Post
    I see various classes using Vistani. For example, quite a lot of FvS.
    The end-game R10 fighter (ofc) build Cetus posted not so long ago also uses VKF. Its definitely a strong tree already.
    Member of Spellswords on Ghallanda

  8. #68
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2013
    Posts
    1,622

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    2) The big issue with Qstaff is that Chain is a bona fide weapon attack now...so it gets 2.5x stat to dmg with a Qstaff (or 3.0x if you have a Trance), while SWF is stuck at 1.75x (2.25x, or 2.5x with empty offhand, and 30% faster) and TWF at 1.0 (1.5). That's a pretty big disparity.

    3) Much like Swash, Assassin is a single-target build that would benefit a lot from some meaningful AOE to use as needed. It would be a big accelerator for trash-clearing, and then you would have your single-target toolkit still for bosses.
    2) The big issue with "Chain being a bona fide weapon attack now" is that it doesn't need to be. Therefore eliminating the issues of having super-buffed weapons that lead to super-buffed chain AOE and the issues of two-handed fighting and whatnot.

    3) Again, my point is that an assassin would only use chain for the occasional trash-clearing which does not happen very often when playing an assassin (do you really jump into huge monster groups to swing your knives?) while Thief Acrobat is always in the thick of it. And besides, I'm not arguing to remove the ability from either one of them. I'm arguing for both of them to have it...

    To be clear: I'm now playing a Thief-Acrobat Shadar-Kai. I've spent a lot of points in the racial tree to get the DEX bonuses, dodge, guile, and all the upgrades to the main chain attack. This means I don't have enough points to spend on Assassin tree goodies. When this update hits, I'm going to remove all the points I've spent on the shadar-kai chain and get those Assassin tree goodies. The shadar-kai tree will only be worth to me for the DEX, dodge, which I can get from other better races.
    When I roll a Shadar-kai Assassin, I'm not going to bother with the Shadar-kai tree. Unless I have racial AP to spare because of past lives (which I don't have), then I'm not going to waste points on a situational attack that puts me in danger. I'll instead spend most of my points in Assassin and Harper agent (or Vistani if I had the tree) for the INT and the damage. This means that for me (and more like me), this change is making the tree even worse than it is now for ANY character that I play as this race.
    Last edited by Faltout; 06-04-2021 at 03:23 AM.
    My main server is Khyber. Have toons in almost every server for favor purposes. The Faltouts

  9. #69
    Community Member MacDubh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    310

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cernunan View Post
    Absolutely agree with this. The charges are great to make SK an iconic rouge race. One of the basic playstyles of the rouge class is a thief acrobat.
    Excluding the icon from using its class iconic ability while using one of the three class icon abilities seems a mistake
    Tbf, chain attack is the iconic signature attack of the Shadar Kai Assassin. Not Shadar Kai Blackguard or Shadar Kai Night Acrobat.
    Think they are more into tattoos/piercings than rouging their faces ...

  10. #70
    Community Member MacDubh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    310

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    2) The big issue with Qstaff is that Chain is a bona fide weapon attack now...so it gets 2.5x stat to dmg with a Qstaff (or 3.0x if you have a Trance), while SWF is stuck at 1.75x (2.25x, or 2.5x with empty offhand, and 30% faster) and TWF at 1.0 (1.5). That's a pretty big disparity.

    3) Much like Swash, Assassin is a single-target build that would benefit a lot from some meaningful AOE to use as needed. It would be a big accelerator for trash-clearing, and then you would have your single-target toolkit still for bosses.
    Indeed, if staff users could use the ability, then it would have to be pared back to stop it being too powerful when mixed with strikethrough, cleaves, stat damage, etc, and paring it back would make it usless for light melee.

  11. #71
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyrzain View Post
    Confused………

    NOW YOU ARE ADDING MORE “ON-HIT” effects ? ? ? ? ?

    please explain.
    A most valid comment. I second the request for an explanation.
    Member of Spellswords on Ghallanda

  12. #72
    Community Member HuneyMunster's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    1,149

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MacDubh View Post
    Tbf, chain attack is the iconic signature attack of the Shadar Kai Assassin. Not Shadar Kai Blackguard or Shadar Kai Night Acrobat.
    Think they are more into tattoos/piercings than rouging their faces ...
    Did you seriously reinvent rick rolling acrobat?

  13. #73
    Developer Steelstar's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Pandjed View Post
    First, great riddance! Updating some older content hits me in all the right places, especially with the Shadar-kai, which are one of the more uniquely themed parts of the game.



    Would it be possible to add the quarterstaff into it? Maybe as part of the enhancements? As Shadar-Kai is a rogue iconic and rogues support three types of melee weapons (dagger, kukri, and quarterstaffs) it'd be great to have all the bases covered. I know, TA gives some really neat options for increased attack speed and such, but would be great to at least look into it or put it on the list of things that may be done in a less quick manner.
    Quote Originally Posted by Aelonwy View Post
    To be fair I never said Shadar-kai must have support for TA nor that their chain must work with Qstaff, I said they're a dex based rogue-ish race that has just been denied synergy between their most unique racial feature and TA. I then asked point-blank which race the devs see as having the most synergy or support for the dex-based TA tree.

    Because the only race that seems to be any real assistance to the playstyle is half-orc (not dex based and not my first choice for a rogue.) NO race gets bonus to hit/dmg with Qstaff. What I am saying is the the rogue ICONIC that is actually dex based is a poor choice for the most dex based rogue tree. So the next most rogue-ish race, Halfling also dex based but only has bonuses for throwing weapons and with a penalty to strength makes getting the THF line more difficult. After that we have various flavors of elf, none of which have any bonuses to fighting with quarterstaff and only Wood Elf has anything for THF in Tier4. So which is it? What is a TA most likely to be?

    It sounds like from what you said above you want instead to strengthen Shadar-kai's synergy with Assassin. I don't deny the lore mostly supports that but do we want an Iconic that is so heavily pigeon-holed not only to one class but to one tree of said class? instead of being a good fit for that entire class?
    Quote Originally Posted by Aelonwy View Post
    This looks great Steelstar. I too would make the Displacement have a sp pt cost or charges. Getting sp pts from gear isn't that difficult anymore.

    Owing to a thread I started earlier this morning (https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...f-Acrobat-Race) I have a question... what dex based race would you use for a Thief Acrobat build? There doesn't seem to be any quarterstaff support in any racial tree, except perhaps Half orc because it supports 2HF but is the opposite of Dex based.

    And here we have a dex based rogue-ish race and its primary uniqueness (chain attack) disallows quarterstaff because of the light melee wpn requirement. So where would you go for TA?
    We talked about adding Quarterstaff to this internally, and landed on "No, because it would make for odd balance situations, and doesn't match with the theme of what this ability is now suggesting you do - whirl your mainhand weapon around on a chain." While this does mean the Iconic doesn't necessarily have innate synergy with one of the trees in its paired class, this isn't that far removed from other Iconics. Razorclaw primarily uses Handwraps, giving it little synergy with the Strikethrough bonuses in Frenzied Berserker; Aasimar Scourge starts as a Ranger, but its tree only supports Melee directly, leading to little synergy with Arcane Archer. We feel comfortable leaving this as Light Weapons only.

    The question of "Well, what race SHOULD Thief-Acrobats be" is a good one though; I don't have an obvious answer, but it's something to consider when we get around to making new Races.

    Quote Originally Posted by Arkat View Post
    Displacement? Nobody cares all that much about Displacement. Why? Because too often in end-game content, it seems like most of the mobs have true seeing anyway making displacement useless.

    Now, if Steelstar were to offer 25% Etherealness, THAT would be MUCH better. Not all that many mobs have ghost touch.
    It's a level 3 racial enhancement, it doesn't need to be the shining star of endgame. That said, a lot of people can and do use Displacement throughout the game, and if you find yourself not needing it as you hit higher levels, it's fairly trivial to reset the tree and spend those points elsewhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faltout View Post
    Since I'm playing a shadar-kai thief-acrobat right now, I'll second that concern. Not as much because I can't find another race for a thief-acrobat, but because now the shadar-kai race shoehorns the rogue into being an assassin. Besides, the theme for shadar-kai goes hand in hand with thief-acrobat.
    I'll point out that the name of the Iconic has, and always has been, "Shadar-kai Assassin"

    Quote Originally Posted by Faltout View Post
    Also, someone using a light melee weapon is usually single target and don't find themselves in situations with a lot of monsters around to use the chain attack. On the other hand, thief-acrobats try to be at the center of the action to make use of strikethrough and cleave trip attacks (which do not account for bonuses to trip btw, perhaps fix that?)
    Fair, but one of our primary design goals in designing abilities for Iconics is to give players build options for a class that let them play that class differently - A Paladin with Repair, a Charisma-based Fighter, a Barbarian with Handwraps, an Assassin with good AOE options.

    Quote Originally Posted by Faltout View Post
    Finally, I have another comment. While Shadar-kai do not any extra feats (because they are human), they do get a bonus to DEX which humans do not get. So, all in all, shadar-kai are about equal to humans and do not need to have extra innate feats. Besides, with all the racial AP that you get from racial TRs, getting stuff from the racial tree is not such a big deal.
    I think a better analogy is to other non-Human races, like Elf:

    Elf: +2 Dex, -2 Con, Immunity to Sleep, +2 Saves vs. Enchantment, +2 Listen, Search, and Spot, Proficiency with Longsword, Rapier, Longbow, and Shortbow.
    Shadar-kai: +2 Dex, -2 Cha, and... nothing.

    The chain attack feat here is meant to fill in for that bucket of other things that most other non-human races get.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xgemina View Post
    Since the new chain attack is using your weapon stats, does that mean your weapon will now take damage from oozes/slime/rust monsters when using the attack? One of the benefits of the current attack is no weapon damage against those monsters.
    Yes. Sorry.

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    This looks great - giving some meaningful AOE to light melee weapon builds, which usually mean SWF and obligate single-target (outside of Cleaves, which are woefully inadequate by themselves right now, especially for 1h melee where the range is short and the damage low). I foresee SDK Swash bringing about a resurgence of Shortswords.

    Just too bad that none of the FR deities have Light Melee favored weapons...kinda leaves a lot of potential Divine builds out of the mix. I imagine making Shar an actual deity for them to follow (like how MLord is locked into Amaunator) is outside the scope of the update, though. Maybe give them a racial Favored Weapon similar to Dwarf? Shar's lore FW is the chakram - which doesnt exist in DDO (maybe Shuriken, but that doesnt help with 1h melee anyway). Wiki says Shar's traditional worshippers include miners...maybe make Light Pick a Favored Weapon? That'd create some rolespace for what's currently a totally ignored weapon, and preserves overlap with Swash as well.

    If you're going to give them Displacement SLA with zero cost...why not just give them perma-Displacement? Why make them push the button every couple minutes? Extra arbitrary button pushes (ie there's no reason not to push the button as soon as you're able) are something the game should be looking to remove, not create.

    About Thief-Acrobat...I kinda think that SDK are specifically assassins in the lore, and if you're going to support TA, then what about Mechanic? They're Rogues too. Should they be able to Chain Attack using their GXB stats? I'm fine with it staying a Light Melee attack. I think trying to support Qstaves would open too many cans of worms regarding interactions with, e.g. Staff Barb THF or Staff EK/PM. Plus, balance-wise, THF doesnt nearly need the extra AOE as much as SWF does. I think that the Chain Attack Trip DC should maybe be changed to Assassinate DC, though, considering Trip bonuses are largely in the TA tree...and maybe make them DEX/INT since INT is also a supported stat for Assassins, and being DEX based currently has more downside in the "current meta" that you're trying to improve SDK for.
    I agree that it's kind of unfortunate that we don't have any light-weapon Forgotten Realms deities to choose from. That's not something we can fix quickly (deities have a lot of restrictions around them on our end), but it's possible we could find a place to add a light melee weapon as a Favored Weapon in some of the Divine trees down the line.

    Sighhhhhhhh. Just like Swashbuckling, I may have to go disallow this one bad item specifically.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vyrzain View Post
    Confused………

    Update 49 includes significant adjustments to melee and missile combat to address long term concerns about game performance.
    One of the most frequent causes of lag happens when an Effects Queue forms, which means that players have applied a ton of on-hit effects to a monster and the game has reached a buffer and must clear its queue in order to continue processing new information.
    We are specifically targeting Server-based lag with this change.
    Behind the scenes, the server crunches damage, effects, and debuffs in a big queue.
    We can measure how efficient the server is at processing this queue by measuring the server frames.
    To begin researching and addressing the root cause we put together simulations of a standard large group and their on-hit profiles.
    What we found was that the amount of damage dealt didn't matter; it was about the frequency that effects were being applied.
    It didn't matter if a simulation was against one target or many - if the effects queue was in trouble the rest of the instance had its performance significantly impacted.
    That means lag for not just you and your group but for other people on the server.


    NOW YOU ARE ADDING MORE “ON-HIT” effects ? ? ? ? ?


    Highlights....
    T4 Whirling Chain
    In addition, when you Vorpal with this attack, you knock enemies down with no save for 6 seconds.
    Every 2 seconds, they make a Balance save of (17 + DEX Mod + Trip DCs) to get up again. (18 second cooldown)

    T4: Assassin's Mark
    Spiked Chain Attacks have a 33% gain a stack of Dizzying Spiked Chain on each of the three hits
    Only a 33% chance of each hit applying a stack

    It's longer than Cleave, but also hits three times!

    perform 3 AOE melee attacks

    Vicious Chain giving a 33% chance to Bleed on each hit of the Spiked Chain.

    Forceful Chain a 5% chance to knock non-boss enemies down with no save for 6 seconds.
    Every 2 seconds, they make a Balance save of (17 + DEX Mod + Trip DCs) to get up again.


    What am I missing here ????

    Would these attacks not hinder Game performance for others on my server?

    Also Spiked Chain is now a Light Melee Weapon…. thus any “on-hit” effects on that light weapon are now also added to this queue along with the Chain Attacks of 3 AoE melee attacks.

    I would have thought / hoped that the DEV’s would be limiting things that add to the “effects queue” not adding to them.

    But again... I could be missing something.... please explain.
    Sure!

    Attempting to reduce on-hit effects doesn't mean we'll never do on-hit effects again. It does, among other things, mean we're going to be mindful of the frequency of application of those effects, and try not to get into situations where you can do an extreme number per hit consistently over a long period of time. Let's say for the sake of example that your regular attack chain does 90 hits per minute, and let's compare the chain effects to a hypothetical on-hit effect that says "Every time you hit with your melee weapon, add 1 stack of Debuff".

    In 60 seconds of autoattacking an enemy, you'll hit them with that hypothetical on-hit effect 90 times. (This would have been more than 90 times before the recent performance changes).
    In 60 seconds of using the new Spiked Chain attacks every time they're on cooldown:
    • T4 Whirling Chain will apply its knockdown 0-9 times depending on whether you vorpal
    • T4 Assassin's Mark will apply a stack 0-24 times depending on how often that 33% comes up, trending toward 8 times
    • Vicious Chain will apply a stack 0-24 times depending on how often that 33% comes up, trending toward 8 times
    • Forceful Chain will apply 0-24 times depending on how often that 5% comes up, trending toward 1 time


    So while you could end up with 81 effects in that time on a single creature (lower than a standard on-hit effect even if you ace the odds), odds are very strong you won't - You'll trend toward 26. And yes, you're doing other effects in real scenarios because you have other onhit effects and you're probably attacking between each chain swing. But the low odds of these effects and the cooldowns between uses of the chain don't make us particularly worried about this set of effects at this time, though that could change as we look at it on Lamannia. (And yes, this hypothetical was against a single target and not AOE, but we're keeping eyes there too).

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    I dont think, as long as its DEX based, the Trip feature is worth building for...not while DEX lacks a Trance or something comparable, anyway.
    Well, you're in luc-
    *gets dragged away for nearlty giving out spoilers*
    Last edited by Steelstar; 06-04-2021 at 06:33 AM.
    We don't only build for the builds that exist.
    We don't only build for the builds that are good right now.

    The fact that some changes are necessary is not diminished by the fact that other necessary changes have not happened yet.

  14. #74
    Community Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    378

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    I agree that it's kind of unfortunate that we don't have any light-weapon Forgotten Realms deities to choose from. That's not something we can fix quickly (deities have a lot of restrictions around them on our end), but it's possible we could find a place to add a light melee weapon as a Favored Weapon in some of the Divine trees down the line.
    What about tacking on a light weapon as a favored weapon to the tier four Shadar-Kai enhancement Winter Favored? It has favored in the name!

  15. #75
    Community Member FuzzyDuck81's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    2,786

    Default

    Looking over these again now I've got a bit more time... the thought of the new version of the chain attacks for AoE damage combined with my frenzied berserker swashbuckler build (I'll miss having ash imprisonment & the cool tail, admittedly) is giving me the happy giggles.
    I used to be with it, but then they changed what it was, now what's it is weird and scary to me.

  16. #76
    Community Member MacDubh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Posts
    310

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by FuzzyDuck81 View Post
    Looking over these again now I've got a bit more time... the thought of the new version of the chain attacks for AoE damage combined with my frenzied berserker swashbuckler build (I'll miss having ash imprisonment & the cool tail, admittedly) is giving me the happy giggles.
    muhahaha

  17. #77
    The Hatchery Cernunan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Will the chain work with handwraps?
    Quote Originally Posted by nobodynobody1426 View Post
    If you look across all the changes it's basically a giant nerf to all the stuff we used to use while trying to force folks into theme based playstyles.
    Quote Originally Posted by PermaBanned View Post
    Profit quantity has been prioritized above product quality. (Note: this quote was from 2013, things never change)

  18. #78
    Cosmetic Guru Aelonwy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    We talked about adding Quarterstaff to this internally, and landed on "No, because it would make for odd balance situations, and doesn't match with the theme of what this ability is now suggesting you do - whirl your mainhand weapon around on a chain." While this does mean the Iconic doesn't necessarily have innate synergy with one of the trees in its paired class, this isn't that far removed from other Iconics. Razorclaw primarily uses Handwraps, giving it little synergy with the Strikethrough bonuses in Frenzied Berserker; Aasimar Scourge starts as a Ranger, but its tree only supports Melee directly, leading to little synergy with Arcane Archer. We feel comfortable leaving this as Light Weapons only.
    Understood. Not sure about Razorclaw as an example I haven't played around with it. But Scourge can make excellent use of Tempest and pretty decent use of Deepwood (which has some melee effects), whereas Shadar-kai can't get full use from either Mechanic (crossbow) or TA (quarterstaff) while utilizing their iconic feature due to weapon restrictions making it very limited indeed. This makes Shadar-kai as a racial option less desirable for a multitude of builds (particularly rogue builds) than it otherwise would be, but as you said you are comfortable with that design. C'est la vie.

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    The question of "Well, what race SHOULD Thief-Acrobats be" is a good one though; I don't have an obvious answer, but it's something to consider when we get around to making new Races.
    Well that's something at least.
    Blood Scented Axe Body Spray (Thelanis)
    Aelonwy - Wydavir - Metaluscious - Aertimys - Phantastique - Kaelaria - Lunaura - Aelurawynn - Saurscha - Crystalorn - Aurvaeyn - Vaelyns - Wyllowynd

  19. #79
    Uber Completionist rabidfox's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    3,308

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by droid327 View Post
    I dont think, as long as its DEX based, the Trip feature is worth building for...not while DEX lacks a Trance or something comparable, anyway. DEX is only good for Throwers, and they cant use Chain
    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Well, you're in luc-
    *gets dragged away for nearlty giving out spoilers*
    Oooooooohhhhhh.

  20. #80
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    0

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steelstar View Post
    Well, you're in luc-
    *gets dragged away for nearlty giving out spoilers*
    So, a dex trance in the Horizon Walker tree. Hardly unexpected but looking forward to hearing more.
    Member of Spellswords on Ghallanda

Page 4 of 9 FirstFirst 12345678 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload