Alchemists and hoping to finally get my ban

[redoubt]

20 points in dragonborn (wings + 3 dcs) + 41 in bombadier + 23 in falconry (helpless), fire (though there's a case for going frost/ice)

What is the falconry thing?

[Morroiel]

Acid lets you use conjuration dc for dragon breath. Itemization is a little weird because Acid has no main hand weapon in Wild Flame’s class but that’s +lots on the breath DC

DC on dragon breath and eburst doesn't matter as much as your cc's. Once a mob is helpless, reflex saves of mobs are tanked.

Acid struggles in gearing for a few reasons. No Wild Flame equivalent, but also can't make effective use of ash LGS offhand weapon. Fire gets ASH as an offhand and doesn't have to wear the burnscar sash. Acid has to choose between wearing the burnscar sash or losing ASH as an offhand effect. That's one less LGS equipment item for less crit multi.

Cold suffers from much the same problems but benefits from making more effective use of BoGW (potentially) as well as improving damage of vein freeze which will already be in your rotation. As well as having a better mainhand weapon than acid.

Fire also benefits from gold breath (poison breath is comparable but loses out because of dragonborn and energy crit not having a poison / negative option).

Fire is the best, though cold might be better in some niche situations. Regardless, poison is definitively the worst choice by a significant margin.

[Morroiel]

What cc do sorcs have to ever possibly compete with alch? Alchs have multiple 2+ minute ccs, Flash Freeze duration doesn't even seem to be affected by reaper reduction, not sure about Flesh to Gold or Vein Freeze and not sure of vein freeze's duration to begin with. Sorcs have what, web? Maybe I am forgetting some cc spell sorcs have, but I'm pretty sure nothing can even remotely compete with alch cc atm on any difficulty.

Web, symbol of stunning, and ottos sphere are all effectively worthless in r10 due to cc duration reduction. These spells provide persistent cc whereas alch spells tend to be instantaneous cc with long durations. Different niches, and I'd argue that sorcs win in some situations.

Sorcs also have ottos irresistable dance + mass hold, but those are still useful in r10. Just in r10, they lose out compared to alchs because they lack the cc spells you mention.

[Morroiel]

What is the falconry thing?

Falconry 23 is enough to take 3 points in no mercy, for 30% extra helpless damage. Given alch's have a triple tap for helpless damage that works on pretty much everything, its basically 30% extra damage on everything besides red names/purple names. Ideally you take 25 points in falconry to get the int +1 4th core as well, but minimum you want 23.

[redoubt]

Falconry 23 is enough to take 3 points in no mercy, for 30% extra helpless damage. Given alch's have a triple tap for helpless damage that works on pretty much everything, its basically 30% extra damage on everything besides red names/purple names. Ideally you take 25 points in falconry to get the int +1 4th core as well, but minimum you want 23.

Thank you.

Follow up:

1. what are you using to create a helpless state? Flash freeze, flesh to gold. Any others?

2. Does sense weakness from Fury of the wild work with spells? Does it stack with No Mercy?

3. Why doesn't fire have to wear the burnscar sash?

[PeWBOOMPeW]

Thank you.

Follow up:

1. what are you using to create a helpless state? Flash freeze, flesh to gold. Any others?

2. Does sense weakness from Fury of the wild work with spells? Does it stack with No Mercy?

3. Why doesn't fire have to wear the burnscar sash?

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...XsxMLnDf01qYxQ

[Morroiel]

Thank you.

Follow up:

1. what are you using to create a helpless state? Flash freeze, flesh to gold. Any others?

2. Does sense weakness from Fury of the wild work with spells? Does it stack with No Mercy?

3. Why doesn't fire have to wear the burnscar sash?

1. Flash freeze, vein freeze, mass flesh to gold, and potentially Burst of Glacial Wrath (if ice or if you value having an extra hard cc option before jumping into a pile of mobs if glue bomb messes up which happens a lot)

2. Yes, no mercy stacks. It is worth it to take in some content, but usually not. Its a pretty expensive twist and generally overkill if you have everything else

3. fire doesn't have to wear burnscar sash because the Ash weapon can have +150 enhancement fire spell power, which while 52 less spellpower than burnscar sash offers (it has +202 enhancement fire and acid) is high enough to make a lgs crit item worth more

[Morroiel]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...XsxMLnDf01qYxQ

This is a really good guide from a player that has a lot of achievements with this toon.

On the other hand, it does have some flaws imo. Namely in advocating for taking away points from dragonborn first if you lack racial AP. Personally, I think you need 20 min points in dragonborn to make the build work - having wings and the +3 dc is more important than vistani deflect arrows or the +1 int stat from falconry. Imo I'd pull the strip the stat away from falconry first (23 min points spent), then take dragonborn to 20, and if you are still short strip vistani. I wouldn't try to play an alchemist in high reaper without access to 84 total ap minimum - the wings and conj/evoc +3 dc are just too important.

Additionally, I'd mess with the gearing a little bit personally, but that's probably a preference thing.

[redoubt]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...XsxMLnDf01qYxQ

Read it. Its great! Thank you very much.

[Morroiel]

Read it. Its great! Thank you very much.

tier 1 lgs has the same spellpower type and offers +150, tier 3 also offers a net of +7 exceptional fire spell power (I don't believe expectional usp stacks with exceptional fire spell power but i could be wrong, and if it is, its likely a bug). Still when your spellpower is in the 1600-2000 range in total from everything, the extra lgs crit multi more than makes up for a loss of 52 (really net loss of 43 or 13 potentially if its bugged and stacking at the moment) spell power.

[LightBear]

Interesting, so the game finally has some ways for spell critical multipliers.

Going to dust off my Epic Red Dragon helmet and suit.

[AnarchyJesus]

Fire is the best, though cold might be better in some niche situations. Regardless, poison is definitively the worst choice by a significant margin.

can u break it down on what fire have over cold? i only see 10 sp from scion of fire

[Mindos]

actually. After careful testing. The 10% tier 2 from LGS does not apply to poison and only negative. so LGS is actually 25% not 35%.

Hmmm I wonder if this is an oversight. Probably got missed when poison power got added to negative. I wonder how things would change if this was fixed...

[A-O]

can u break it down on what fire have over cold? i only see 10 sp from scion of fire

Ash cannot have enhancement bonus to cold damage. So you need ravenloft belt. Which locks out an item slot.

[Pilgrim1]

Ash is great and all but its not as strong as everyone is hyping it to be. When you toss a multivial on a pack of mobs ash only applies to the first hit mob. Therefor ash is much better for single target (boss) dps then it is for trash. In addition ash off hand locks out golden orb of death/tomb of strahd for 5% insightful crit multiplier.

Has anyone managed to figure out a 4pc lgs set that doesn't gimp dc’s? Or some other aspect of the toon?

As for comparing between elements... Poison gets 84% crit chance (non teafling). How do others stack up?

5% base
31% item (deadkeeper bracers)
15 exceptional (deadkeeper robe)
10 artifact (set bonus)
18 insightful (off hand orb)
5 enhancments


Pro: no twists, no PL, no dc sacrifices.
Con: no ash, 25% crit dmg lgs, no synergy with blinding embers or vein freeze.

[PeWBOOMPeW]

Ash is great and all but its not as strong as everyone is hyping it to be. When you toss a multivial on a pack of mobs ash only applies to the first hit mob. Therefor ash is much better for single target (boss) dps then it is for trash. In addition ash off hand locks out golden orb of death/tomb of strahd for 5% insightful crit multiplier.

Has anyone managed to figure out a 4pc lgs set that doesn't gimp dc’s? Or some other aspect of the toon?

As for comparing between elements... Poison gets 84% crit chance (non teafling). How do others stack up?

5% base
31% item (deadkeeper bracers)
15 exceptional (deadkeeper robe)
10 artifact (set bonus)
18 insightful (off hand orb)
5 enhancments


Pro: no twists, no PL, no dc sacrifices.
Con: no ash, 25% crit dmg lgs, no synergy with blinding embers or vein freeze.

Ash absolutely is that strong. 5% crit chance doesn’t give even close to the same damage, especially if you consider that it allows you to free up the belt slot for material set. This is flat out a terrible idea.

The 4 piece LGS fits just fine with the gear set in the guide above. Every source of intelligence and every source of DC is present in the gear set listed.

[A-O]

Every source of intelligence and every source of DC is present in the gear set listed.

Only qual int 4, and only SF 7. So down 1 int and 2 dc. Potentially 3 DC. Not the end of the world, but it's not all there.

[Morroiel]

Only qual int 4, and only SF 7. So down 1 int and 2 dc. Potentially 3 DC. Not the end of the world, but it's not all there.

I agree it doesn't matter, however the person they were responding to claimed it would gimp dcs. As long as your DCs are in the 110-120 range, you are golden.

[Tsutti]

tier 1 lgs has the same spellpower type and offers +150, tier 3 also offers a net of +7 exceptional fire spell power (I don't believe expectional usp stacks with exceptional fire spell power but i could be wrong, and if it is, its likely a bug). Still when your spellpower is in the 1600-2000 range in total from everything, the extra lgs crit multi more than makes up for a loss of 52 (really net loss of 43 or 13 potentially if its bugged and stacking at the moment) spell power.

Universal and fire should stack and that wouldn't be bugged, potency and fire should not. Potency gives spellpower to each spellpower, like on morninglord's, universal is a separate spellpower that affects all your spellpowers. https://ddowiki.com/page/Universal_Spell_Power

Wow I didn't know lgs had that, as far as I knew burnscar and thrummingspark were the only enhancement spellpower items in the game lol... I really need to just look carefully at everything you can do with lgs sometime, and I should probably be farming ings and runes too lol.

[SiliconScout]

I and most other people dont speak gibberish so you may wish to clarify you *truth* and turn it into english... just a thought.

THIS.

Wow that OP was a masterstroke of ... well a stroke.