collection

[Valerianus]

(heavily edited and expanded, feb 25th 2021)


idea: a bank that is not a bank and does not occupy space, expandable as needed when new content is released, you put something in your collection, this destroys it, but now you can summon copies back, something for free and something for a shard fee. possibly hundreds or thousands of inventory\bank slots that occupy zero inventory\bank slots. details below.

a collection feature, free for all but to have all the features you have to pay the collection unlock \ be vip, accessible via a button in your inventory that replaces the pet. the button open up the collection interface, it loads on demand only. disabled in non-public areas except for the pet tab and the barracks (so the actual functions\uses don't change, just migrated).

you are not interested to buy? no problem, your game doesn't change. the idea is to use this system alongside existing inventory system to unclog it, not replace it.


let's imagine a left panel with tabs, each tab has expand\collapse lists and sub-lists of categories\adventure packs\where the items belong, and a right panel with slots to fit in\retrieve\activate if pet.

*** THE TABS: pets (free feature) \ wardrobe (free) \ btc gear (paid) \ bta gear (paid) \ stable (paid \ barracks (paid) \ old curiosity shop (paid)

* PETS
no changes in how this works, just migrated into collections. can also stay where it is now and excluded from collection, just thinking at a cleaner inventory interface

* WARDROBE
yes, i'm proposing free cosmetic closet. the idea is also to let the players use the system, see what's it about and it self-advertise. debatable detail. for the idea, it's critical that all cosmetics are made bta. you put a cosmetic into the collection, it populates into it. this destroys your cosmetic. but now you can retrieve a copy of it free of charge account wide. even if wardrobe is made as a paid feture, retrieve a copy must be free of charge. another idea about free cosmetic closet, is using the collection to preview them, an option to summon in inventory a copy of a store cosmetic you don't own, that will self-destruct after 1 minute. well weird idea but if there is no better system to preview cosmetics in store it may help the sales. another factor, no one will care about free cosmetics at festivals, event, free givaways that occupy inventory\bank space, just drop it in collection and done. all the expansions cosmetics, drop em into collection and just delete them from your inventories, all the festival cosmetics, the givaways, all you paid from the store, yours forever always available account wide stored in a non-bank in a non-space. and this solves the problem of cosmetics being items, it summons copies in your inventory to use.

* BTC GEAR
your btc gear. as said, you drop a piece into collection, it is destroyed, but you can retrieve a copy when you need. for a shards fee. like, half the ml of the item rounded down. will it do? less? more? about mythic\reaper bonus, it must be possible to overwrite your previous collected item. i mean, you store an item. later you find the same item but with mythic +2. you overwrite it with the better piece and now have it available. the collection doesn't accept gear with slotted augments\jewels. we can press further and include a hybrid section btc\wardrobe for reaper cosmetics. copies free of charge. buy once, yours forever. you already earned it. btc. what about it?

* BTA GEAR
same, but for bound to account gear and account shared via collection. all your characters can tranfer gear in it and retrieve gear from it for a shard fee. note: turn all bount to char on equip into bta. or unbound. normalize everything in btc or bta or unbound is good for the game anyway.

* STABLE
for mounts, all of them bta. like cosmetic, retrieve a mount added to collection must be free of charge.

* BARRACKS
for hires contracts. this is for permanent hires you got from expansions (all of them bta), copies free of charge, you own them already. you need one of them? you summon a copy. don't need anymore? trash the copy. the source is safely stored into the collection account-wide. and the idea to expand the list and sell permanent hires from the ddo store paid unlock\shard unlock. let's say you want to glorify byron and bring him along all the time. you pay for a permanent byron in your collection, you can have a copy of the contract wherever whenever, also in quest. pretty much like buying a gold seal from the store. this can be turned into a hire store too. i'm personally not interested in this but maybe some players would buy. just not to have to fill the hire folder if they use some hire a lot, a regular one, just summon an unlocked contract from collection. like gold seals? i don't know. ideas?

* OLD CURIOSITY SHOP
this is for general stuff i did not include or came not to mind. do you have any ideas? like empty sentient jewels. it would be nice to collect them, they are sort of cosmetics for your account. we can fit here also the fast travel items. what do you think? before tr you trash them, when you need them again summon a copy. or use them from collection interface without having them,as pets, not inventory item but they work...??? also boots of anchoring, necro4 sigil, restless isle sigil, stuff like that. copies free of charge.



less mules, less stuff in tr cache, you have the shared bank anyway and you need it anyway, if you often use some gear, you just keep them in regular inventory, but you can free up a lot of space and you can enjoy the paid QoL of paying for a copy instead of refarm something you already have for alts. your collection of artifacts. those old s\s\s items you don't want to trash. stuff you hold just in case. if you want to pay you can even delete almost all your mules! you don't need this and doing just fine, well, don't buy this. your game doesn't change.


anyway the idea is to have a growing storage that is not a storage cause the game grows in time, so you act on a virtual on-demand list instead of on limited physical space. so to say. does this make sense? it came out of my head like that but i know nothing about the tech. zero. is this doable?


it would be also possible, hoarder achievement reward, if you fill the named gear collection of an adventure pack, for example, something like the monster manual, same concept. maybe some unique cosmetics? unique mounts? loot boost consumables? an unbreakable\non-consumable thieves tool? :P if an adventure pack has one or more raids, it will also take time and a lot of runs, it will be quite a task. will this create more raid runs? even forgotten raids? maybe yes or maybe no, but i find this interesting.


as previously said, any kind of comment, constructive or destructive, is totally welcome. thanks.


have a nice game!


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(original post, may 10th 2020)

a collection feature, free to vips and to be unlocked with ddo points for others, like shared bank

you don't want it? no problem, your inventory system goes on as is (shared bank, tr cache, etc)

you buy it? now you have a collection tab, actually 2, bta items (per account) and btc items (per char). with items i mean named gear, raid gear also, cosmetics (the wardrobe a lot of players want), mounts. pets already are shared, and this is the base idea.

if you add an item to your collection it will be destroyed, but a copy may be recalled anytime by paying a small astral shards fee. the copy will be flagged as non-sentient food and will be bta if originally bta, and btc if btc (like raid gear) of course. reaper\mythic bonuses variants will be saved and be summonable if you copy such an item in your collection.

no cost will be applied to cosmetics since the purpose of including cosmetics in this idea is the wardrobe concept and intended use.

less mules (if any), almost non-existent tr cache (thus no need to rework it), you have the shared bank anyway. happy players. sure the need for more space will be no more, thus less inventory management related purchases, and less chest rerolls, and that's why i said that the copy should cost a shard fee. moreover, not everyone create mules and not everyone reroll. but they may interested in such a system, thus they are spending in something they were not spending before. it may work business-wise. maybe. no idea, i admit it.


any kind of comment, constructive or destructive, is totally welcome. thanks.


have a nice game!


edit 05-11-2020: talking about this in the comments gave me the idea of a hoarder achievement reward, if you fill the named gear collection of an adventure pack, for example. nothing flashy, something like the monster manual, same concept. maybe some unique cosmetics? treasure hunter elixirs? jewels of fortune? an unbreakable\non-consumable thieves tool? :P if an adventure pack has one or more raids, it will also take time and a lot of runs, it will be quite a task. will this create more raid runs? even forgotten raids? maybe yes or maybe no, but i find this interesting.

[Wizard1406]

Yes, good idea, but don't make it cost shards to retrieve. Just make a count how many you have deposited so people with alts can't put 1 item in and have multiple alts pull one out each.

[Valerianus]

forgot to specify that retrieving cosmetics should not cost or the wardrobe purpose and intended use will be negated. editing above.

Yes, good idea, but don't make it cost shards to retrieve. Just make a count how many you have deposited so people with alts can't put 1 item in and have multiple alts pull one out each.

i was thinking about from a single piece of gear --> multiple copies, but with a cost. ssg is a business and they should monetize something. also, you are saving time farming a second copy and paying QoL cost. but your idea is really nice too, also having no shard cost and instead be able to retrieve only the number of copies you actually put in. yeah this would be fitting with the concept really well anyway. thanks.

[droid327]

If an item is BTA, what's the harm in letting you copy it? Its the same as just muling it back and forth, just without the hassle. Its not giving you any extra power, just extra convenience. And it's lighter server load without all the login switching, and less inventory load because you're not storing multiple copies of an item "just in case" an alt needs it.

Plus, I assume that Collection-generated items will never have Mythic/Reaper bonuses, so ultimately you're still going to want to farm native-dropped versions for your high-end alts. Also if you want to Augment it, same deal, or Sentience for weapons.

You'd have to address things like pseudo-named items, though...TF and LGS and Cormyrian weapons, e.g., that had some aspect of randomization or crafting/customization. But even if you just disallowed those entirely, I think it'd be a good system.

I'd go so far to say that account-level collection access should just be part of Shared Bank, too, and base collection should be free to all. The goal is to reduce inventory load on the server, but you cant do that if a large portion of the playerbase cant use it.

[Igognito]

I think that you only need an enormous shared bank.
I get what you are describing but going for a huge shared bank would work more or less the same way without introducing any programming overhead.

Actually, it would be nice for players to be able to convert character slot to shared bank space and vice versa.

I have an open character slot (625 DDOs)
I have any size shared bank.
Convert character slot to +160 shared bank space (16* 995 DDOs).

Well the DDOs do not really match but would solve the mule problem.

It is silly how expensive 10 shared bank slots cost.
I would always prefer another character slot!

If it was +80 for 995 DDOs I think I would consider it. As a character starts with 80 inv. spots more or less.

Anyhow, SSG knows better what people buy and what they dont... I just would not buy the +10 inv slots for that price.

To conclude the real problem we all experience is the price of the shared bank!
+10 for 995 DDOs... I think it should either drop to 95 DDOs!

What happens with all the ones they already bought 1 or more? return them DDO points perhaps? Or maybe give them up to the max Shared bank space depending what they spend and if it is not enough then return them DDO points or give them missing crafting bank, platinum vault etc...

Cheerios

[droid327]

I think that you only need an enormous shared bank.
I get what you are describing but going for a huge shared bank would work more or less the same way without introducing any programming overhead.

They cant just increase storage capacity without bound. Its technically unfeasible - the devs posted about this just two days ago:

It's sadly 98% a technical issue that requires a lot of careful, meticulous and talented work to chip away at. If we could collectively snap our fingers and double everyone's storage, we would. We'd be hiring professional finger snappers to augment our meagre by comparison snapping powers.

[Valerianus]

I think that you only need an enormous shared bank.
I get what you are describing but going for a huge shared bank would work more or less the same way without introducing any programming overhead.

Actually, it would be nice for players to be able to convert character slot to shared bank space and vice versa.

I have an open character slot (625 DDOs)
I have any size shared bank.
Convert character slot to +160 shared bank space (16* 995 DDOs).

Well the DDOs do not really match but would solve the mule problem.

It is silly how expensive 10 shared bank slots cost.
I would always prefer another character slot!

If it was +80 for 995 DDOs I think I would consider it. As a character starts with 80 inv. spots more or less.

Anyhow, SSG knows better what people buy and what they dont... I just would not buy the +10 inv slots for that price.

To conclude the real problem we all experience is the price of the shared bank!
+10 for 995 DDOs... I think it should either drop to 95 DDOs!

What happens with all the ones they already bought 1 or more? return them DDO points perhaps? Or maybe give them up to the max Shared bank space depending what they spend and if it is not enough then return them DDO points or give them missing crafting bank, platinum vault etc...

Cheerios

it seems the game has limits and cannot add more space, so dev said, that's why i am suggesting a bank...without the bank. with QoL on top.

[Valerianus]

If an item is BTA, what's the harm in letting you copy it? Its the same as just muling it back and forth, just without the hassle. Its not giving you any extra power, just extra convenience. And it's lighter server load without all the login switching, and less inventory load because you're not storing multiple copies of an item "just in case" an alt needs it.

Plus, I assume that Collection-generated items will never have Mythic/Reaper bonuses, so ultimately you're still going to want to farm native-dropped versions for your high-end alts. Also if you want to Augment it, same deal, or Sentience for weapons.

You'd have to address things like pseudo-named items, though...TF and LGS and Cormyrian weapons, e.g., that had some aspect of randomization or crafting/customization. But even if you just disallowed those entirely, I think it'd be a good system.

I'd go so far to say that account-level collection access should just be part of Shared Bank, too, and base collection should be free to all. The goal is to reduce inventory load on the server, but you cant do that if a large portion of the playerbase cant use it.

the idea what indeed about relieving the hassle via QoL cost, with no muling and without eventually re-farming the same item in an alt need. you farm it once, you destroy it, added to collection, you pay, it pops on demand how many times you wish. if you need just one of that now, well, you just keep in regular storage. you have the choice. exactly, it's not extra power, if you farmed it once you can farm it twice, it's all about convenience. and it's about deleting mules and do less logging, and that's about having them to sell us the tr cache not-a-fix but a workaround, like they did with dimensional bag and not-stacking filigree. but no matter, i'll buy my collection workaround. after a hotfix and a patch. with this system your tr cache will be so small it can stay as it is now. and you'll need less mules\shared bank slots. and if you fill it again, your problem. we can jump from "we have far too little space" to "we have far too much space now that we dumped everything in collection"

players are asking for more storage badly, this system is giving a real lot of storage without being a storage. this system is "fixing" the tr cache, all your btc items you want to keep\hoard\reasons or eventually useful for later raid gear you don't want to trash. you ravenloft\sharn set are there without organizing mules and logging and sorting and moving. also, it's a cosmetic wardrobe (this must not charge you for getting copies). player are also asking a wardrobe badly. you like\need just a single copy of gear? you already trashed everything? well, you just go on as it is now. no problem.

in my idea the mythic\reaper bonuses variants should be saved and be able to be copied. like, let's say if you get a vanilla piece of gear and later you find another one with some mythic, you can "overwrite" it and keep the better one and copy it.

the pseudo named, well, they would probably stay in the regular storage, they are Tricky. i would stick to cosmetics, mounts, zero exp sentient jewels, bta named, btc named. all flagged as "non-sentient-food copy".



you can even go wild and taunt the achievers and hoarders into having the collection as the monster manual. you win a little something if you fill the named gear collection of an adventure pack. quite a feat if it has raid(s) in it. someone could open lfm like "vod elite for collection". hehehehehe.


edit: this last achievement idea i got talking about this with you, i like it. i'll edit it in the OP.

[Igognito]

Dear all,

while tbh I do not like the collection "repository" idea you have presented. As for me it makes no sense whatsoever, I do like the idea of having an Named Items Compendium (which I will call Collection for the rest of my message).

Like the Monster Manuals, we can have a part of the game that keeps track what items have been found (character/account) wise. The collection only marks that you found it and how many items. Possibly also the different variants you have found.

You can not take an item out of the collection, but there can be rewards similar with monster manual entries.
Clearly, we are only talking for non random items and not items that are semi random or crafted/upgraded.

Destroying/selling or any other means of losing an item does not affect the collection.
Transferring around items does not affect the collection.

In practice only Acquiring an item from a CHEST or as a quest reward affects the Collection counting.
Thus very little book keeping indeed.

Cheerios

ps: Clearly this might not appear as an inventory solution but it does help a bit. I personally keep a horde :-P I keep items that I know that I will not use just because I found them :-/
If I would have a Collection that kept track what I found then I would not need to keep some of the items :-)

Now that I'm mentioning this I also want to point out the following thread: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...esktop-Utility

[Valerianus]

Dear all,

while tbh I do not like the collection "repository" idea you have presented. As for me it makes no sense whatsoever, I do like the idea of having an Named Items Compendium (which I will call Collection for the rest of my message).

Like the Monster Manuals, we can have a part of the game that keeps track what items have been found (character/account) wise. The collection only marks that you found it and how many items. Possibly also the different variants you have found.

You can not take an item out of the collection, but there can be rewards similar with monster manual entries.
Clearly, we are only talking for non random items and not items that are semi random or crafted/upgraded.

Destroying/selling or any other means of losing an item does not affect the collection.
Transferring around items does not affect the collection.

In practice only Acquiring an item from a CHEST or as a quest reward affects the Collection counting.
Thus very little book keeping indeed.

Cheerios

ps: Clearly this might not appear as an inventory solution but it does help a bit. I personally keep a horde :-P I keep items that I know that I will not use just because I found them :-/
If I would have a Collection that kept track what I found then I would not need to keep some of the items :-)

Now that I'm mentioning this I also want to point out the following thread: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...esktop-Utility

i will surely check your utility, thank you.

if i got it right you like my idea but without the possibilty to copy the items.

may i ask why the "repository" part makes no sense? i was thinking that a hoarder would be pleased to have the possibility to have a copy of the item back. i too have some items i would put into my collection, never to be copied. but the idea alone that i have not trashed them, i "can" have them back, it's cool. they may be there. but they are not there. also, don't underestimate the mirror of glamering potential of keeping a lot of named and be able to physically copy them out

is the Whole paying feature the problem? well, i give for granted that my suggestion or something similar would be implemented with a cost, a QoL cost, or anyway a paid feature. it was an inventory solution, with stuff like the "gear monster manual" that may interest ppl who couldn't care less about the rest.

[Igognito]

i will surely check your utility, thank you.

if i got it right you like my idea but without the possibilty to copy the items.

may i ask why the "repository" part makes no sense? i was thinking that a hoarder would be pleased to have the possibility to have a copy of the item back. i too have some items i would put into my collection, never to be copied. but the idea alone that i have not trashed them, i "can" have them back, it's cool. they may be there. but they are not there. also, don't underestimate the mirror of glamering potential of keeping a lot of named and be able to physically copy them out

is the Whole paying feature the problem? well, i give for granted that my suggestion or something similar would be implemented with a cost, a QoL cost, or anyway a paid feature. it was an inventory solution, with stuff like the "gear monster manual" that may interest ppl who couldn't care less about the rest.

Great, would be happy to get some comments and suggestions.
I don't like the repository part because it assumes that you somewhere physically stored the item and literally make for unlimited inventory space... Paying for it, is like you made a vendor (perhaps a wizard that recalls your item from your storing extra dimensional repository). How you explain duplicates? Maybe a solution is that items you recall would be temporary! Like last a few hours. Like being a shadow (quasi real) version of the real one. Now we are talking!

Perhaps like that I would like! You can recall any item by making a quasi-real version of the item! Such an item has a a duration and 50% hp. When it is destroyed it disappears and you can't repair it. Furthermore, if it is w weapon and the opponent has true seeing it causes hand damage. Now we got a d&d feeling out of it.

[Valerianus]

Great, would be happy to get some comments and suggestions.
I don't like the repository part because it assumes that you somewhere physically stored the item and literally make for unlimited inventory space... Paying for it, is like you made a vendor (perhaps a wizard that recalls your item from your storing extra dimensional repository). How you explain duplicates? Maybe a solution is that items you recall would be temporary! Like last a few hours. Like being a shadow (quasi real) version of the real one. Now we are talking!

Perhaps like that I would like! You can recall any item by making a quasi-real version of the item! Such an item has a a duration and 50% hp. When it is destroyed it disappears and you can't repair it. Furthermore, if it is w weapon and the opponent has true seeing it causes hand damage. Now we got a d&d feeling out of it.

it would be nice indeed to give a realistic explanation, fantasy-like speaking. i never considered this.

i was more focused in a "be all and end all" solution to storage. exactly what you noticed, potentially unlimited. a game interface. pretty cold, i admit, you are right. but if you can use time saving store solutions\shard costing, like, skip a quest in sagas, reroll chests, raid timer bypasses, and the like, just UI interactions, you can also summon gear, no? hehehe it would also be really alt friendly. less farm, less hitting ransack wall, easier alt gearing. a temporary piece of gear would defeat this purpose, even if your quasi-real idea is lovely, really d&d-ish.

[Igognito]

it would be nice indeed to give a realistic explanation, fantasy-like speaking. i never considered this.

i was more focused in a "be all and end all" solution to storage. exactly what you noticed, potentially unlimited. a game interface. pretty cold, i admit, you are right. but if you can use time saving store solutions\shard costing, like, skip a quest in sagas, reroll chests, raid timer bypasses, and the like, just UI interactions, you can also summon gear, no? hehehe it would also be really alt friendly. less farm, less hitting ransack wall, easier alt gearing. a temporary piece of gear would defeat this purpose, even if your quasi-real idea is lovely, really d&d-ish.

Well I'm all up to d&d-ish...
TBH I love DDO for the little bit of D&D feeling I get to have when I play it.
The more d&d-ish the game would be the more I would love it.

Including: Disabling chest rerolls and quest repeats (this though assumes though that u are actually playing on Elite+ difficulty)
It is not in the scope of this thread, but I would really like a D&D Difficulty where: You can only play 1 time the quest per life. If you Release the quest locks and you cant enter + marked as failed... (Some quests would block/fail chains, others if failed could be skipped for only losing the Saga rewards!)

At the end of your life you would get a % of success and until you actually get 100% success in a single life you have not made it yet!

I'm thinking that this kind of play (clearly only VIP) would be an interesting alternative compared with the Hard Core.
Something in the mid...

I was tempting to not post this... But I guess I will start a thread!


Back in topic... The quasi real items would still be very useful! You dont want to keep the best item for each Quest Boss... But if you could cast this ability as a spell it would be super useful!
Imagine you entered Von 3 with no anarchic weapon... just before the boss fight you quasi summon (pay astral) a suitable weapon you had found at some point!
Similarly, with a defensive weapon... Practically, it helps you for a short while. In this case I personally would say that the Shards are a spell component rather than a currency! Something like the diamonds in D&D, both currency and spell components.

[Valerianus]

Well I'm all up to d&d-ish...
TBH I love DDO for the little bit of D&D feeling I get to have when I play it.
The more d&d-ish the game would be the more I would love it.

Including: Disabling chest rerolls and quest repeats (this though assumes though that u are actually playing on Elite+ difficulty)
It is not in the scope of this thread, but I would really like a D&D Difficulty where: You can only play 1 time the quest per life. If you Release the quest locks and you cant enter + marked as failed... (Some quests would block/fail chains, others if failed could be skipped for only losing the Saga rewards!)

At the end of your life you would get a % of success and until you actually get 100% success in a single life you have not made it yet!

I'm thinking that this kind of play (clearly only VIP) would be an interesting alternative compared with the Hard Core.
Something in the mid...

I was tempting to not post this... But I guess I will start a thread!


Back in topic... The quasi real items would still be very useful! You dont want to keep the best item for each Quest Boss... But if you could cast this ability as a spell it would be super useful!
Imagine you entered Von 3 with no anarchic weapon... just before the boss fight you quasi summon (pay astral) a suitable weapon you had found at some point!
Similarly, with a defensive weapon... Practically, it helps you for a short while. In this case I personally would say that the Shards are a spell component rather than a currency! Something like the diamonds in D&D, both currency and spell components.

well i could say my collection idea is the new found Sharn City Planar Bank (SCPB), Planar solutions for Planar Travellers. and since the kundarak bank is failing to modernize their system, well, the adventures are turning to the SCPB. it works because the items you turned in for free, after paid access to the service, they are selling them to someone else

[neologia]

Great idea!

[Valerianus]

edited and expanded, see post #1

[Valerianus]

for the records, leaving this here with no further edit to timestamps references in the OP about edits, deleted the "copies flagged as non-sentient food" part. they are already selling sent exp via boxes, it would be useless and stupid to add a complication to block something that is already happening.

[Wolfgaar]

I like the idea.

I know that ESO have this system but it works a little different. For you to be able to make a copy of an item for free you need the full collection otherwise it costs a special currency to make a copy of an item.

In ESO their named sets are a bit different then here on DDO so not sure if it could be implemented fairly here since some sets might only be 3 items and some might have 10.

In ESO all sets are a full set (full armor - all pieces like helmet, boots etc and then we have the weapons that come in all forms too that all have the same set bonuses so you can mix your playstyle and still have a certain set bonus).

Here it would be different but possible if you say for example you can have the saltmarch gear and to be able to make copies free you need to have collected all of the named items once.

For crafted stuff it would be harder to implement since you can put different stuff on 2 different weapon blanks as example, so I would think that those should be excluded.

The copies you make should also imo be plain ones without mythical/reaper bonuses on them so there still is an incentive to farm for a "better" version.

And for those that are gonna say: Well that's ESO and not DDO, I'm only using it as an example to say that this idea have been implemented in another game so it might be possible to do here too.