U45 Paladin Bug List

[tqniner]

I put in a ticket as well but here are the bugs I've found with paladin so far

Divine sacrifice wasn't updated to have passions effects
Improved turning wasn't updated to have the light damage
Divine retribution isn't taking in sunder bonuses and is still a channel Divinity
Glorious stand icon is whacky, mixed between passive border and active icon, also doesn't give 10% sacred hp
Righteous command is a sacred bonus and not morale
Stalwart pact wasn't updated
Exalted smite wasn't updated to have empowered smite's effects

Additional concerns:
Wow lot of SP drain between divine might 15sp/2min, Angelskin 15sp/2.5min, righteous command 25sp/2min, Prayer 20sp/2min and then potentially stalwart pact 25sp per encounter if it gets fixed. If divine sacrifice gets fixed, the passion portion can alleviate some sp concerns when the temp sp can proc but still, pallys are going to need a lot more SP with this update.
With divine retributions increase in cooldown, pallys will have about a quarter of the smite regeneration they used to have, for a 6AP enhancement and hallmark ability of a paladin that's a tough pill to swallow.
Still no support for bastard swords as a favored weapon outside of PDK/SDK/DG and Scourge, not even via Aasimar's t4 celestial tutelage or DC's t4 Book of War, there are literally paladin specific bastard swords and even then they're not going to compete with daxes anyways....

As an aside, angelskin has a max caster level of 20 so divine destinys will not benefit their buffs

Any other bugs I missed?

Edit: Actually seems there was a tooltip issue for the angelskin/righteous command durations. 1 min/Level with righteous commands max CL 15 limiting it to 15 mins

[Palna]

Any other bugs I missed?

Only logger in to redo my enhancement and spent 5 minutes in the Cogs, so I might be wrong but sanctified fervor (which was partially bugged befor) did not activate at all now ising exalted smite.

In general the update feels like the release notes, completely lacking in quality control.

[tqniner]

From what I remember from old testing, sanctified fervor took a few seconds after your smite to actually apply the buff but during those seconds if you take any actions like attacking or using abilities it would interrupt and cancel the buff, making that filigree set fairly useless.

[palladin9479]

Yeah Holy Retribution's not using any form of tactics DC's, not sunder, not fighter feats, not ancient tactics, not combat mastery, not even the +sunder inside the KoTC tree.

Several of the spells aren't updated, it feels like they forgot to patch in code from the preview servers?

Well we all submit bug reports and they might get around to fixing it after Hard Core Season II.

Also is it me or does it look like the bonus damage for "favored weapons" isn't being added? I had the same +damage for a Great Sword as I did for a Falchion and Falchions aren't listed as favored weapons.

[Palna]

From what I remember from old testing, sanctified fervor took a few seconds after your smite to actually apply the buff but during those seconds if you take any actions like attacking or using abilities it would interrupt and cancel the buff, making that filigree set fairly useless.

Yes, and now it did nothing at all

Actually, scratch that. Logged in to test a bit more and it seems the issue is with Exalted Smite which does not proc SF at all, whilst normal Smite seems to be fixed!!

Exalted does not grant the MP boost from Empowered though...

[syrion52]

Original Poster's quote edited below

Additional concerns:

Still no support for bastard swords as a favored weapon; there are literally paladin specific bastard swords and even then they're not going to compete with daxes anyways ---> THIS is a tough pill to swallow....

DEVS: should at least consider adding in Bastard Sword to the Holy Combatant Enhancement IF the Paladin in question has taken the exotic proficiency: bastard sword feat....

just my 2 coppers

[palladin9479]

Yes, and now it did nothing at all

Actually, scratch that. Logged in to test a bit more and it seems the issue is with Exalted Smite which does not proc SF at all, whilst normal Smite seems to be fixed!!

Exalted does not grant the MP boost from Empowered though...

No surprise there, smites always been bad and exalted smite was a waste of 11AP. Nothing they did this update changed that. Still they should at least fix it for those wanting to mess around.

I've submitted bug reports for what I found. If everyone does the same they might fix it sometime in the next six months, maybe... if their feeling generous.

Found out ascendancy isn't working on lawful evil or neutral evil targets like reapers and mephets.

[guzzlr]

Glad I found this list. There are so many things wrong with KotC it feels worse than my old pally builds. Girlfriend and I both decided to grab a pally past life since they were updating the class, and meh. It is very clear that exalted smite is not working as intended at all (aside from the shortened cooldown). No added damage, and no strike through, so we've removed those enhancement points and just use smite until this is fixed.

And the kicker for us is the limited nature of Holy Retribution. We've just come out of lives as and Eldritch Knight duo, and frankly the 5(w) +100 holy 200% scaling damage and a chance of killing evil baddies at what appears to be a more limited AOE channel divinity attack does not stack up well against the Eldritch Tempest. We just seem to like EK's better hitbox 5(w), knockdown/slow, +10 threat range/+3 multiplier, scaling force burst for 15sp far more. We don't lose any melee power, gain blur and displacement, and almost break even on HPs for those 5 wizard levels. I admit we do lose some benefits from the other T5 options in KotC, but it seems a fair tradeoff to us.

All in all, it just feels like a big swing and mostly a miss on the tree. We'll continue to play through and test as we go, but I hope the fixes happen soon, and some more tweaking happens.

Oh yeah, the Knight's Charge is pretty **** neat, but I wish it had a ghostly Paladin Warhorse effect and did a little more damage. I do understand it's intended to just get ya into battle faster, but still...

Can anybody shed some insight to what I am missing regarding Holy Retribution? I was planning on going 20 pally until I tested this and decided to multiclass...again (sometimes I feel like leveling to capstone should give you a past life XP benefit for your next life if they aren't going to make them worth a T5 in another class).

[liston33]

There is a constant spamming of a spell.. Might be Protection from evil..?? About every 5 seconds it plays a sound bite and a pinkish shield appears in front of my character... Very annoying..

[Drakanizzle]

Doesn't look like Glorious Stand gave any extra HP since patch, I'm guess it's not fixed.

[rayworks]

Anyone else having problems with exalted smite? I'm using a greatsword and every time I use smite evil or exalted smite it completely stops the attack chain and I have to hit the attack button twice to get attacks going again.

[justagame]

Anyone else having problems with exalted smite? I'm using a greatsword and every time I use smite evil or exalted smite it completely stops the attack chain and I have to hit the attack button twice to get attacks going again.

Absolutely, I started another thread on this. I've seen 2 big problems with smites:

1. The aforementioned pause in the attack sequence
2. Smites now have zero chance of double strike. While the update mentioned that smites had been automatically been striking 2 times, the fix eliminated ANY chance of DS, which is counter to how it worked in the past. Since smites had been a normal attack animation, they had always been eligible for DS in the past.

The stop in the attack chain makes smites annoying and unpleasant to use. The combined effect of losing attacks due to the pause, plus 0% doublestrike, means that using smites is actually a dps loss. They have gone from what was once an iconic, high impact paladin ability, then over time to one that merely didn't scale well, to now, post-update, one that is not worth spending AP on as they hurt your dps to even use them. Losing post-smite attacks AND losing DS is a big deal.

I would love a comment from Devs on this -- were these changes intentional?
Thanks

[palladin9479]

Smite / Exalted smite has never been good, ever. It's a huge noob trap that had people throwing away 11AP for something that won't help them. All this update did was make the noob trap 9AP. There is plenty of good stuff inside the KoTC and Sacred Defender tree then to waste AP on smite. The only use for smites is for getting +25 Melee Power from the five piece filigree set, and that works with just regular smites, or a tank with Unyielding Sentinel using Intolerant Blows, which again works without any AP being spent in exalted. Divine Sacrifice does much of the same, but doesn't interrupt your attack chain has no charges, costs 1SP per use, has a 3s cooldown and costs 1~3 AP depending on if you like the light damage.

They really should of made exalted smite a 3 x 1AP or just a single 2AP enhancement. We want to spend at least 31 points in defender for the HP and wonderful defense bonus's, leaving 49 for KoTC and any extras someone wants.

[ilhares]

There is a constant spamming of a spell.. Might be Protection from evil..?? About every 5 seconds it plays a sound bite and a pinkish shield appears in front of my character... Very annoying..

I can make this happen on my main, and it has nothing to do with the class or its spells, it was being caused by multiple pieces of equipment. The most frequent is my gold skull helm (with an alchemical defense ritual applied) and a trinket that provides a similar effect. I have to manually swap to one of my Ioun stones and back for it to stop the auto-cycling loop. I'm not sure why it does it, and thankfully I've left that gear back in my heroic pile of loot, but I'm sure I'll be seeing it again next life.

I think my biggest Paladin-linked gripe is after U45, either as a result of the new animals or something else, Smite Evil (exalted smite, whichever) now seems to have a large delay factored into it. Pre-45 I was swinging merrily away on my enemy racking up stacks of damage and I could casually tap my smite and it blended seamlessly into the fight. Now it triggers its own attack swing animation and everything comes to a halt briefly, and I stop dealing damage until the regular attack animations are allowed to resume.

[SirValentine]

Other bugs:

- New version of Stalwart Pact got nerfed to self-only.
- Several duration descriptions don't match actual spell duration; it's hard to say which is supposed to be correct.
- Divine Favor got made useless somehow? Prayer used to be a nice buff/debuff for my allies/enemies, but Divine Favor was better for myself. No longer. Not a implementation bug so much as bad design.

Anyone else having problems with exalted smite? I'm using a greatsword and every time I use smite evil or exalted smite it completely stops the attack chain and I have to hit the attack button twice to get attacks going again.

Not just you. It makes smiting kind of pointless, when you have to give up 2 or 3 normal attacks due to the huge animation pause.

[Komradkillingmachine]

I LR'd my Paladin at cap yesterday and all new spells like Angelskin and Righteous Command got broken.
Their duration is only 30 seconds and 60 seconds respectively, they only grant +1 PRR/MRR for Angelskin and +1 MP/RP for Righteous Command.
Duration in the descriptions keep jumping up and down but do not match the actual values.

Frustratingly, all were working fine before performing LR. What kind of a bug is this?

Lynn, if you read this, please take a look into it.

[saw0452]

Holy Combatant 2 doesn't add the Favored Weapon to FVS Grace of Battle.

[Matthey]

Found out ascendancy isn't working on lawful evil or neutral evil targets like reapers and mephets.

Ascendancy still doesn't work for reapers. This really hurts KotC Paladins in higher skull reaper quests where reapers are common. Mephits are usually true neutral but there are a few that are evil.

Remaining Paladin bugs:

1) Ascendancy does not work for some evil outsiders including reapers.
2) KotC 3% damage aura looks like it only applies to one ally, the first to come into range of the aura.
3) KotC Avenging Cleave vulnerability never applies more than one stack as the duration of vulnerability is shorter than the cool down. Surely this was meant to build stacks like destruction on Epic Sworn Borderlands weapons.
4) Buff bar Holy Sword indicator persists often when the buff is gone.

The KotC Paladin update is certainly lacking. Paladins in PnP were among the top 50% of classes for dps and after the update they are probably still the worst class for dps in DDO. KotC paladins can now do some damage against evil outsiders and undead but they are further pidgeonholed with weapon limitations which didn't exist in any edition of PnP. 3.5E Players Handbook says, "Paladins need not devote themselves to a single deity devotion to righteousness is enough." 5E Players Handbook says, "Although many paladins are devoted to gods of good, a paladin’s power comes as much from a commitment to justice itself as it does from a god." Paladins do *not* have the restrictions priests have with weapons! Paladin spells do *not* have weapon restrictions including PnP Holy Sword which works with any weapon. Weapon selection should be based on what they are trained in like a fighter. I challenge the devs to find one limitation of weapons for paladins in any edition of DnD PnP. Stop changing the PnP lore! A KotC Paladins in DDO fighting with a cursespewing longsword of assasinate does more damage against evil outsiders than using the Celestia short sword. A KotC THF Paladin ignores the Absolute Judgement maul he is carrying against evil outsiders and continues to use his 2 handed sword against skeletons for the same reason. Deity restrictions between Eberron and Forgotten Realms makes the situation worse but the devs care about lore here! Also making the situation worse is that the best Paladin holy weapons (Divine Vengeance used to be the best but is a joke now) have not been updated or are now worthless because of weapon type (Divinity Bastard Sword). I suggest allowing KotC ascendancy to work with any weapon. The max stacks of ascendancy could be lowered but I doubt KoTC Paladins will be in the upper half for dps classes. With this change and bug fixes, maybe they would get a few kills from something other than Holy Retribution.

Smiting is the most dissed on ability of Paladins in this thread. The KotC update removed turning ability enhancements in the first tier of the KotC tree before they could turn undead but added Shieldbreaker Sunder DCs which are only used by the 5th tier Holy Retribution when the small bonuses which scale poorly will be mostly outdated. I suggest adding sundering bonuses to smites to bring the smite damage up some and better make use of early sunder bonuses already in the KotC tree.

Smite Evil suggested damage
3 * Paladin level + 7 + Sunder Bonus

The Paladin Sacred Defender tree added Sacred Shield which only seems to protect against magic missiles and *not* chain missiles (Epic No Refunds for an example of where it is worthless). This is almost worthless as by the time a paladin gets 5th tier enhancements, chain missiles are more common than magic missiles and a defensive paladin still needs to carry a shield clicky or wand of shield. KotC Paladins have significantly less HP and undead and evil outsiders commonly use magic missiles. Paladins are also feat starved. I suggest replacing the 5th tier Sacred Shield magic missile protection with tower shield proficiency and give all Paladins access to the 1st level Nightshield spell, perhaps renamed to Knightshield for paladins.

Restore the melee power that was nerfed in the Unyielding Sentinel and Legendary Dreadnought Epic Destinies. These were mistakes. Unyielding is worse for dps of the (paladin) class it is for compared to any other ED and the enhancement costs are expensive compared to more recently updated trees. Optimize Light the Dark and have it heal from the caster outward (reverse of current order) as it slows down horribly with lag even when quickened (out of combat quickened LtD nearly instantaneously heals the party while in combat it often takes several seconds and it is not uncommon that I die while waiting for the heal that has long since healed my allies). Lower Divine Energy Resist SP costs. Give Commanding Presence some command (plus to charisma based skills). Renewal needs help. Purify Weapon and Annoint Weapon should cost 1 EDP each with all the restrictions they have. Nerf blitz some for Dreadnought as the ED shouldn't be defined by one annoying enhancement. Don't treat paladins and fighters like they are always tanks but even tanks should do more damage.

When logging on, Sacred Defense should be in the state it was in when logging off. The same applies for Power Attack and any stances. Making the game less annoying, less buggy and more polished would go a long way to retaining users.

Block Elements on shields like the Mirrorplate Tower Shield and the Purple Dragon Tower Shield should never lower elemental absorptions when blocking! They will currently lower elemental absorptions to 15% if they are higher. If the bug is difficult to fix then consider making it a stacking elemental absorption, even if you feel it necessary to lower the 15% absorption. Devs add all this elemental damage in KT, RTSO and THTH raids and then sabotage us with bugs. There is a shortage of tanks as nobody wants to deal with the pitiful damage of tanks and bugs.

Consider allowing bastard swords and dwarven axes to be wielded 2 handed as a martial weapon which the 3.5E PnP describes. It should be easy enough to add a single/two handed toggle button on the inventory screen.

[Komradkillingmachine]

1) Ascendancy does not work for some evil outsiders including reapers.
2) KotC 3% damage aura looks like it only applies to one ally, the first to come into range of the aura.
3) KotC Avenging Cleave vulnerability never applies more than one stack as the duration of vulnerability is shorter than the cool down. Surely this was meant to build stacks like destruction on Epic Sworn Borderlands weapons.
4) Buff bar Holy Sword indicator persists often when the buff is gone.

Seriously, can we get an official Dev reply to these? It's been almost 9 months since the tree rework.

1 and 2 are really annoying and ruin damage output in content like Sharn, Soul splitter, etc., especially in high skull reaper.