Grappling with Jumping: A Puzzle

[Kinerd]

Sometimes we're in parties with the one person who isn't great at jumping, which can make some encounters extremely frustrating for them and the group.

What if we had a new autogranted feat that let a party member teleport line of sight to another party member?

Presenting Use Rope!

Target, use the feat, and there you are!

I think we can for ease-of-use and realism reasons do away with the DC checks, as the only use in this case will be when there's someone else helping to situate the grappling hook - a ledge that catches back, if you will. I also don't know what kind of range it should have but I don't see why not just c/p the standard (non-ray) spell casting range.

[GeneralDiomedes]

Just add a follow command with distance parameter would help db too.

[Enoach]

I'm actually not in favor of a "follow" command myself. I think it would add something to the game that would not be good for its future.

However, I'm not convinced there needs to be a "rope" feat.

I don't think there are many "all party" required to move forward jumping skill in DDO and think it would be better to handle each individually vs trying to make a universal fix.

In fact the only one that comes to my mind is in the raid Temple of the Deathwyrm. Currently there is a way to bypass this by diving into the light and having a fellow party member carry you to the top. I have wondered if this would be better served if they added a feature similar to what is found in The Archons' Trial - "Pass the Trial of Agility" which allows you to teleport to the top once the party has completed the trial.

[SirValentine]

In terms of climbing, I like it, but I see some issues.

Would this let, say, a Monk with Evasion run through traps, then teleport the rest of the party past the traps?

[Kinerd]

I'm actually not in favor of a "follow" command myself. I think it would add something to the game that would not be good for its future.

However, I'm not convinced there needs to be a "rope" feat.

I don't think there are many "all party" required to move forward jumping skill in DDO and think it would be better to handle each individually vs trying to make a universal fix.

In fact the only one that comes to my mind is in the raid Temple of the Deathwyrm. Currently there is a way to bypass this by diving into the light and having a fellow party member carry you to the top. I have wondered if this would be better served if they added a feature similar to what is found in The Archons' Trial - "Pass the Trial of Agility" which allows you to teleport to the top once the party has completed the trial.

the notorious one in my old guild was Rainbow in the Dark. we had a member who was a good player but for the life of him couldn't get past the pillars in less than ten minutes.

while i certainly agree the 'one has surpassed, all may pass' mechanic solves the fundamental problem too, i feel like this would give more agency to the players being carried and not require as many in-universe mental gymnastics - again returning to Rainbow in the Dark, a random npc or air jet makes no sense there, but throwing a rope over works just fine. plus it gives developers way more leeway in making jumping puzzles going forward (for better or for worse) without having to worry about including a new version of that same mechanic every time

[Kinerd]

In terms of climbing, I like it, but I see some issues.

Would this let, say, a Monk with Evasion run through traps, then teleport the rest of the party past the traps?

yes

to my mind this is more a feature than a bug - in the same way that some players can twitch through traps already, we're just letting them help other players out.

[Discpsycho]

yes

to my mind this is more a feature than a bug - in the same way that some players can twitch through traps already, we're just letting them help other players out.

Signed, but only if it also works in tandem with charge and dash attacks. Lasso + Abundant Step + Dire Charge = Zoom!

[C-Dog]

Nope.

The "one player can't deal" is a problem, but there are hundreds of problems that each player has to overcome. That's why it's a challenge, that's part of "the game".

[ValariusK]

Nope.

The "one player can't deal" is a problem, but there are hundreds of problems that each player has to overcome. That's why it's a challenge, that's part of "the game".

The thing is, there are ways around the 'one player can't deal', but they're horribly immersion breaking, breaking in a way that 'lowering a rope' is not. (I speak, of course, of the soulstone carry). If you're not going to get rid of the immersion breaking ways, you really ought to put in some non-immersion breaking ways.

[Kinerd]

Nope.

The "one player can't deal" is a problem, but there are hundreds of problems that each player has to overcome. That's why it's a challenge, that's part of "the game".

To me what sets this particular problem apart is it is a strongly OOC challenge - I can get through jumping puzzles with 0 Jump, my guildie could have 40 Jump and feather fall and still struggle. This is not how for example spellcasting works - there's no player skill that can make a 10 DC spell work better than a 50 one. Additionally it is entirely a solo challenge in a way very few challenges in the game are: my character can draw aggro, buff and debuff, heal, murmur the solution to a riddle, but has absolutely no way of helping another character span a six foot gap. Isn't that weird? Doesn't that feel wrong somehow?

In the broadest sense, challenges are rated for their difficulty to a party of adventurers. I just feel like when there's a party-based solution that's plausible, in-character, and has source backing to boot, it makes sense to consider implementing it.

[Wizard1406]

To me what sets this particular problem apart is it is a strongly OOC challenge - I can get through jumping puzzles with 0 Jump, my guildie could have 40 Jump and feather fall and still struggle. This is not how for example spellcasting works - there's no player skill that can make a 10 DC spell work better than a 50 one

Agree... jump should be based a bit more on character skill , not just player skill.

How about grappling hook and you can place it it on surfaces like an AOE placement, then a dice roll wether your character makes the jump or not. Manually jumping would much faster so that player skills retains value.

[Kinerd]

Agree... jump should be based a bit more on character skill , not just player skill.

How about grappling hook and you can place it it on surfaces like an AOE placement, then a dice roll wether your character makes the jump or not. Manually jumping would much faster so that player skills retains value.

That's an interesting take on it too. I prefer the party idea but wouldn't be upset with this implementation.