U42 Preview 1: Loot

[korgzz_bloodaxe]

It's been interesting reading these threads and seeing people make complaints that are similar to mine but for so many such different builds.

It reinforces my belief that there is a widespread problem with gear building for characters at cap, rather than it just being due to a bit of bad luck for the one build I mostly play.

Thanks for your comments.

I kind of agree. I think perhaps a better solution would be if they had named items that had 2/4 slots prefilled with effects that thematically fit the named item in question and then players could fill the remaining 2 slots with effects they desire similar to slavers works (except perhaps without the same amount of grind). Or maybe an alternative to this would be the empty slots had 6-7 possible effects would you could customise by slotting gems which also drop in the same chest as the named item drops from. So rather than having to have a vast number of each item per slot they could just have a couple i.e. one melee, one range, and one caster - and the different builds would be covered by slotting the gems with different effects (like dragon touched, except you would be able to remove and replace gems depending on your current build).

[whoolsey]

First, you state her barbarian is unplayable and then you state you are playing r8+....really? I can only think your definition of unplayable is much different than most people

Secondly, if she has 2900hp and is dying in 2-3 hits on r2 as a barb then something is seriously bugged out with her character. With triple everything and over 50+ reaper points you should be well over 3k hp in reaper and mobs should be doing minimal damage in r3. And she is dying in 2-3 hits on r2?!?! That is nonsense. You should be getting hit for around 300-400 tops per hit if you are duoing except on certain quests maybe 600 a hit. I facetank groups of 10+ mobs on r3 with my barb who only has a fraction of the past lives and reaper points as you. In a full group of 6 mobs start to do solid damage in r3 but as a duo with your HP/PPR I truely cannot understand why you would be having problems.



Barbs are immune to most knockdowns and why no freedom of movement? The only thing that occasionally catches me is stuns. Maybe 1-2 times a week I would get held and then would only be if I haven't prepped right. I also can't understand why she would be having trouble landing DC with the stats you are talking about having.

The hp is pre reaper.
Yeah, it's really strange, it gets hit overly hard, i don_ understand it myself.
Barbs immune to knockdown? Only in a tier 5 enh, wich she doesn't use.
If i recal it's fb and occult slayer ( since the dr changes)
Her str is well over a 100 and she uses gear to boost her dc's (twists too) but it looks like she doesn't connect.
She is usually the first one to get hit with dispell, protection from evil is gone in no time.

Btw, thanks for the help

[Cookiegum]

I'm probably missing something but these raid weapons looks a bit underwhelming, not really an upgrade from RL. Maybe having all info would give a complete picture but right now just look a pointless grind.

[Claver]

[*]Throwing Dagger: The Wide Open Sky - good, light damage, Material: Cold Iron - Upgrade: Aligned

The throwing dagger is my least favorite weapon from the raid set. Perhaps because I've been spoiled with more interesting throwing daggers as of late such as bug killer, fate, return to sender, spectral dagger.

The light damage is nice but light damage already appears on sunslice and some of the shields

If you want to stick with light damage make it a bit more descriptive and exciting

Apply a legendary version of "A Thousand Suns" suffix using Radiant Blast, Fiery Detonation, and Greater Sunburst..all scaled up to legendary damage levels

What do other people think? I haven't noticed anyone else commenting on this weapon in particular.

To me, the throwing dagger falls short.

[Claver]

I want to throw my support behind Platinum Knuckles

Set 2 (Melee DPS) - Part of the Family:

Set Bonus: +10/15% Doublestrike, +10/25 Melee Power, +5/15% Helpless Dmg, +2/5 All Saves

Hammerfist Gloves
Minimum Level: 15/29

• Doublestrike +9/+23
• Threat Reduction +25/+62
• Seeker +8/+21
• Insightful Deadly ???/???

Platinum Knuckles Handwraps
Minimum Level: 15/29

• Precludes Gloves Slot (while this is equipped, you can not have any Gloves equipped, and vice versa)
• Impact I/V
• Spiked (breaks piercing DR)
• Enchanted Platinum Crowd Control
• Doublestrike +9/+23

The way I see it, you are not giving up the the glove slot per se; you are giving up the Hammer Fist gloves specifically, to qualify for +15% helpless damage, +25 melee power, and +5 to saves

If you want the set bonus, you can either go with double strike, threat reduction, seeker and deadly via Hammerfist OR you can smash things with your fists and turn them into Platinum and deal an additional +15% helpless damage to your immobilized foe.

If you have a better set of hand wraps...wear them...but now you MUST wear the Hammerfist gloves if you want the set bonus.

It seems to me, the hand wraps were designed with the set bonus in mind rather than as a stand alone power item for monks and I'm fine with that. I'm happy that we have one more hand wrap than we otherwise would have had courtesy of this set bonus

Turning stuff into platinum sounds like fun to me. I'm glad to have the flexibility to qualify for the set bonus via the hand wraps rather than being forced to wear the Hammerfist gloves

Keep this item please

[SerPounce]

IMO the loot is already too hand- holdy, and is just going to get less interesting as people make “suggested changes” so they can do 1:1 pereto optimal upgrades to their current setups. I like that it’s a challenge to figure out what to wear with ravenloft loot as opposed to “this is the arcane caster set. It has everything an arcane caster wants and every arcane cast will farm it and wear it until the next arcane caster set is released.” But I guess that kind of mindless gearing is what the most vocal of the forums wants so it’s what we’re moving towards.

[Madja]

While you have the Platinum Knuckles in your main hand slot, you can not have Gloves equipped. If you equip Gloves, your Handwraps will become unequipped. If they are currently not strong enough to mitigate that loss of an item slot, we will swing upwards to get them closer to parity I want them to be niche and interesting mechanically, not useless, and there's still time to make sure of it.

I really like the idea of this. I'm always a big fan of unique effects as I feel the loot in the game became a bit generic with the various loot passes.
What does Enchanted platinum do? Is it like Transmuted Platinum from the Crushing Capital morningstar? I won't claim to be knowledgable on loot balance at all, but the handwraps currently seem a bit weak to me.
If you wanted to use other wraps you could get the +9% doublestrike on your gloves and something like Scraps of Enlightenment (which are ML13) would give you Impact III instead of Impact I, plus holy and light damage and reinforced fists.

I don't know if the piercing damage is worth it and maybe the wraps have a good crit profile or additional die step, but on paper I would find it hard to justify losing the gloves slot for them.
It depends on what the proc actually does, though.

[Madja]

IMO the loot is already too hand- holdy, and is just going to get less interesting as people make “suggested changes” so they can do 1:1 pereto optimal upgrades to their current setups. I like that it’s a challenge to figure out what to wear with ravenloft loot as opposed to “this is the arcane caster set. It has everything an arcane caster wants and every arcane cast will farm it and wear it until the next arcane caster set is released.” But I guess that kind of mindless gearing is what the most vocal of the forums wants so it’s what we’re moving towards.

I agree with this. While it feels satisfying at first to be able to easily get every stat you need, it does take away some of what makes this game special. Some choice and sacrifices to be made is always nice in the long run.

[janave]

Crystalline Gloves Raid Gloves

I feel like this item will actually penalize the intended builds, unlikely for getting it for roll in raids, being so universally useful as a swap in item.

[apep1412]

That there is a pair of heroic and epic Syranian (suite) Handwraps and a pair of Raid Handwraps already in Sharn and I wanted to see if I could make something fun and flavorful given that if someone was looking for high power and utility they'd just use the Raid Handwraps anyway? That this is a Lamannia preview so there's still a lot of time to change things and make thing better, so if players don't think they're fun I can make them more exciting? That in large item suites sometimes it's more important to try fun things, especially in previews, just because having items being all stats all the time doesn't lend a lot of creativity to the playerbase?

I mean, it's the first preview. Things are always rough in the first preview. That's why we do them. If you have any constructive criticism and would like to contribute, please feel free - I've been able to make a ton of great changes from this thread already and I'm excited to listen

Would it be reasonable to approach them the same way that caster quarterstaves are - giving them 2 extra effects because they prevent the user from using another slot?

Seeker and Insightful Deadly would replace most of the value in the gloves in the same set, though weapon-specific effects might be better since monks are already are in the strange twf-with-one-weapon state. I don't personally play a wraps-using monk, so someone else is likely better suited to suggest two more effects.

Even without any changes, the piercing DR bypass should make them usable in some cases.

[ThreadNecromancer]

That this is a Lamannia preview so there's still a lot of time to change things and make thing better, so if players don't think they're fun I can make them more exciting? That in large item suites sometimes it's more important to try fun things, especially in previews, just because having items being all stats all the time doesn't lend a lot of creativity to the playerbase?

Thematically they're very interesting, I'm curious if something like this would lead to more options like it for other builds (e.g. super-hyper-mega-tank armor that prevents you from using heavy two handers or big shields, a longbow so large it requires gloves and removes the option of a cloak but has a huge crit range & multiplier, a cloak that prevents you from using a helmet because its cosmetic has a hood already, etc.).

As long as the loss in power (from the missing gear slot) is compensated in the item that takes two gear slots to equip. This is what everyone complaining seems to be up about. The potential upside of using this sort of equipment needs to be dramatically powerful.

(Just an FYI/PSA: my main has been a monk since Dance of the Water Strider, and I'm curious about how these wraps turn out. Some people still have the nerve to play glass cannons.)

(Oh, how I miss Water Strider.)

[blerkington]

IMO the loot is already too hand- holdy, and is just going to get less interesting as people make “suggested changes” so they can do 1:1 pereto optimal upgrades to their current setups. I like that it’s a challenge to figure out what to wear with ravenloft loot as opposed to “this is the arcane caster set. It has everything an arcane caster wants and every arcane cast will farm it and wear it until the next arcane caster set is released.” But I guess that kind of mindless gearing is what the most vocal of the forums wants so it’s what we’re moving towards.

I agree with this. While it feels satisfying at first to be able to easily get every stat you need, it does take away some of what makes this game special. Some choice and sacrifices to be made is always nice in the long run.

The problem is, these posts of yours are not accurate characterisations of recent gearing issues for some common builds. The examples provided literally just a few posts before were by people who found it very problematic to fit in a BiS bonus for their character's main stat along with other very important effects for those builds.

Let that sink in for a moment and then see how it contrasts with your attempts to dismiss this problem. As I said before, this is not people complaining about not being allowed to have everything served up to them with no effort, no trade-offs and no decision-making. We are well past that.

There are serious problems with endgame itemisation for some popular and common builds so these attempts to wave that away as if it didn't exist aren't doing us any favours.

Thanks.

[Aelonwy]

You may ask to make gear more condensed
By pleading with no recompense
but at the end of the day
if your suggestions all say
"make it stronger!!!" I'll argue against

Easy choice is a mere gilded cage
It does nothing to inspire or engage
Restrictions make you wonder
And experiment longer
For your plan on DDO's stage

I don't know about everyone but what I said was make it numerically lower but more convenient by combining effects... especially those effects that were combined in the past such as resistance and sheltering. Your last stanza indicates you and I play in completely different ways. I don't see gearing as inspirational, creative, fun or anything I really want to occupy my leisure time with... I see it as a headache and an organizational aggravation to overcome. Its just another way that DDO and PnP differ.

Sorry, I'm with the devs on this one.

Tough choices makes for a good game.

You don't get to be max DPS AND have all the defensive stuff too... Make a choice.

This will continue to be a point of contention. People liked having the saves be one stat, you still have to gear with at least two effects though resistance +parrying, and possibly a third with spell saves. People liked having a sheltering effect that covered both but there is still insightful and quality versions. Most non-min-maxers will take a numerically lower sheltering stat over trying to slot separate Prr, Mrr, insightful of both, possibly Quality of their lowest, and separate Will/Fort/Ref + parrying or individual ins svs, + spell saves. I mean where does it end?! This should be obviously ludicrous at this point. There is tough choices and then there's OMG i give up... I'm going to go play something that actually lets me play instead of spending hours trying to get my equipment right so I don't die if something looks at me cross-eyed. There's a reason most people parrot to ignore AC and just go for as high a PRR/MRR/Spell Abs as you can get because at some point with all these various stackable bonuses you went so far off the DnD chart you're making up a new one as you go.

[blerkington]

I kind of agree. I think perhaps a better solution would be if they had named items that had 2/4 slots prefilled with effects that thematically fit the named item in question and then players could fill the remaining 2 slots with effects they desire similar to slavers works (except perhaps without the same amount of grind). Or maybe an alternative to this would be the empty slots had 6-7 possible effects would you could customise by slotting gems which also drop in the same chest as the named item drops from. So rather than having to have a vast number of each item per slot they could just have a couple i.e. one melee, one range, and one caster - and the different builds would be covered by slotting the gems with different effects (like dragon touched, except you would be able to remove and replace gems depending on your current build).

Yes, something like this could be good. I'd like to see some more effort to solve this problem and there are probably a few different ways to address it.

The problem would not be nearly as acute if we had less needless splitting of effects like resistance and sheltering, not proliferating stacking bonus types and then sprinkling them apparently at random across different items, not mixing general effects such as ability score bonuses that might be required by a variety of builds with effects for particular combat styles that don't necessarily match, avoiding redundancy, avoiding junk effects, trying to concentrate effects for particular combat styles into certain slots or at least onto single items, and not confining us to four effects per item might all really help.

It would also not be so bad if effect bonuses were capped, at least for a while, and we had consolidation phases where we had more options for how to gear our most important effects. Items don't always have to have a better bonus than the last bit of comparable gear to be an improvement. Better organisation of effects and/or a tick-tock of more effects then better effects then more effects again might help to slow down power creep.

Like you said, increased customisability could play a big role in solving these problems. In my view it should be extended to maintaining endgame systems like slaver items and greensteel, as well as updating and improving the augment system so it is more useful in epic levels. At the moment augments are really being half-assed in this game; practically all of our named loot keeps on getting augment slots but what we have to put in them seems to be getting less useful all the time.

Thanks.

[janave]

This will continue to be a point of contention. People liked having the saves be one stat, you still have to gear with at least two effects though resistance +parrying, and possibly a third with spell saves. People liked having a sheltering effect that covered both but there is still insightful and quality versions. Most non-min-maxers will take a numerically lower sheltering stat over trying to slot separate Prr, Mrr, insightful of both, possibly Quality of their lowest, and separate Will/Fort/Ref + parrying or individual ins svs, + spell saves. I mean where does it end?! This should be obviously ludicrous at this point. There is tough choices and then there's OMG i give up... I'm going to go play something that actually lets me play instead of spending hours trying to get my equipment right so I don't die if something looks at me cross-eyed. There's a reason most people parrot to ignore AC and just go for as high a PRR/MRR/Spell Abs as you can get because at some point with all these various stackable bonuses you went so far off the DnD chart you're making up a new one as you go.

^This is the truth here, everything else is opinion so far.

And once we are done equipping all those saves gear, they add Kaza lightning strike, Strahd's grip and no-save Force damage all over the place.

[Feralthyrtiaq]

Yes, something like this could be good. I'd like to see some more effort to solve this problem and there are probably a few different ways to address it.

The problem would not be nearly as acute if we had less needless splitting of effects like resistance and sheltering, not proliferating stacking bonus types and then sprinkling them apparently at random across different items, not mixing general effects such as ability score bonuses that might be required by a variety of builds with effects for particular combat styles that don't necessarily match, avoiding redundancy, avoiding junk effects, trying to concentrate effects for particular combat styles into certain slots or at least onto single items, and not confining us to four effects per item might all really help.

It would also not be so bad if effect bonuses were capped, at least for a while, and we had consolidation phases where we had more options for how to gear our most important effects. Items don't always have to have a better bonus than the last bit of comparable gear to be an improvement. Better organisation of effects and/or a tick-tock of more effects then better effects then more effects again might help to slow down power creep.

Like you said, increased customisability could play a big role in solving these problems. In my view it should be extended to maintaining endgame systems like slaver items and greensteel, as well as updating and improving the augment system so it is more useful in epic levels. At the moment augments are really being half-assed in this game; practically all of our named loot keeps on getting augment slots but what we have to put in them seems to be getting less useful all the time.

Thanks.

At times I feel like you are a better spoken more considerate doppleganger version of myself LOL Seriously though you make a lot of great points. With a recent fix we now have a use for the Death Block augments we have saved..yay?

[ThreadNecromancer]

Like you said, increased customisability could play a big role in solving these problems. In my view it should be extended to maintaining endgame systems like slaver items and greensteel, as well as updating and improving the augment system so it is more useful in epic levels. At the moment augments are really being half-assed in this game; practically all of our named loot keeps on getting augment slots but what we have to put in them seems to be getting less useful all the time.

https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...55#post6198855

Shameless self promotion for some ideas that expand on customization.

[Feralthyrtiaq]

the availability of the set bonuses be spread out among more choices of gear? Instead of power creep give us more options to get sets but less of a bonus. Would promote character build diversity and choices that don't seem punitive or restrictive.

It IS nice having some flexibility adding Insightful Stat customization BUT by and large it *feels* like it was randomly generated and then tweaked (same for RL)

[kain741]

Set 7 (Spell DPS) - Esoteric Influence:

Set Bonus: +2/4 Artifact to Spell Focus Mastery, +20/50 Universal Spell Power, +2/3 to INT/WIS/CHA, +10/20 MRR Cap

Attunement's Gaze Raid Goggles
Minimum Level: 29

• Spell Focus Mastery +7
• Insightful Spell Focus Mastery +4
• Enhanced Metamagic - Empower
• Enhanced Metamagic - Maximize

Does this set bonus really only give +3 at cap to casting stat inconsistent with other sets or is this a typo?
Also, spell focus +7 isn't something special that it requires a raid item. You can find it on quest items or can just keep using your nightmothers. I'd suggest jazzing this up a little. My suggestion would be to make it craftable with your choice of spell school at a +9 bonus. I think that would make these goggles highly desirable where right now they're just meh.

[Edwardt]

Are stats like 21 and 22 really nessesary?

With Slavelords the stat-race went kinda insane and I was hoping it would slow down a little bit, but it didn't.
The Fall of Truth items have +8 stats on them at a min level of 25, sharn got some at level 15. Every raid before that just got loot not worth mentioning.. well, with some exceptions.
Ok, some will say that was 2013, we have 2019 now, deal with it. Fair enough, but do we need to kill all old content like this?
Overall it makes leveling in heroics pretty simple. Slavers, Ravenloft and Sharn up to 20, done. I woun't say no to that when the gear stays like this.

I like diversity on the loot to fill spots, or optimize builds, give some variations and so on, but I'm curious about fortification 94% at level 15 when almost everone has 100% slotted since level 8. Is it just a placeholder to get four effects so people don't complain about an item just having three effects on it?