Possible changes and upgrades for Archmage

[Aelonwy]

Goal: To give each Archmage specialty its own unique usefulness. To make Archmage live up to its title, not Mediocre-mage.

Abjuration School changes: This is the worst school by a wide margin
Shield SLA, can be cast on self and others (to indicate the Abjuration specialist's mastery of their chosen school)
Change Protection from Elements to Glyph of Warding (I realize this is a divine spell but it seems so much better than the same level Fire Trap)
Change Dismissal to Banishment (Banishment has limited usefulness, especially with the inflated HD issues of DDO, but its the best Abjuration gets)

Conjuration School changes:
Change Cloudkill to Everard's Black Tentacles
This has always been a wiz/sorc spell but I understand the devs wanting to keep some uniqueness to the warlock spell list.
So this is a compromise that only Conjuration specialized Archmage would have access. Cloudkill is a terrible spell in DDO because its determined by the target's HD and as we all know enemy HD go off the charts eventually. Speaking of which epic ward prevents or severely curtails ability score damage also neutering Cloudkill's usefulness. Finally, web looses much of its viability as CC when enemies as well as teammates spew fire on the battlefield so Tentacles would give this school a late game CC.

Enchantment School changes:
Change Resistable Dance to either Charm Person or Touch of Idiocy
(I know most people don't use ToI but I like to use it in the early game to prep a target for Charm or Hold and a cheaper version of this could be useful to an enchantment specced Archmage even at higher levels.)
Change Hold Monster to Mind Fog
(Same reason really, in later gameplay I rarely if ever used the single target SLA versions of Hold/Charm but Mind Fog was useful to blanket an area and reduce enemy saves.)

Evocation:
Evocation is what it is, the only possible change I might make to it would be Fire Shield to Force Missiles but some people really like their constant up Fireshield so...? Up to popular opinion I guess.

Illusion School changes:
Alright Illusion has the least number of spells but is in a decent place right now however these are the changes I would make...
Displacement self only version same as now AND a 2nd friendly version that can't be extended (to indicate the Illusion specialist's mastery of their chosen school)
Change Shadow Walk to NEW Weird (Should work very similar to Phantasmal Killer but instead of single target it should affect multiple targets, still has all the saves, SR and limitations of PK and likely a longer cooldown.)

Necromancy School changes:
Possibly change Halt Undead to Ray of Exhaustion. (Reason is Halt Undead has limited usefulness when it only works on undead and no more than 3 at a time. Basically would rather use a web in most cases for the same purpose.)
Possibly change Waves of Fatigue to either Negative Energy Burst or Death Aura. (Reason is - I think either would be more useful to a late game Necromancy specced wizard than Waves of Fatigue which will soon be replaced entirely with Waves of Exhaustion when that type of effect is needed.)

Transmutation School changes:
This one is very difficult. Most of its best spells or rather just most of its spells are 6th level spells. Perhaps the ability to cast Tensor's on party members unextended (to indicate the Transmutation specialist's mastery of their chosen school) would give this more niche.

[Aelonwy]

Other Core changes:
Master of Magic is a little underwhelming in comparison to more recent Capstone enhancements. It could use an additional +2 Int or instead perhaps +2 to Spell Pen.

Speaking of which if the spell schools got a final SLA in the capstone or exclusive school ability that would be great.
Abjuration - Permanent Freedom of Movement? This is a really crummy spell school to specialize in.
Conjuration - Augment Summoning Feat ?
Enchantment - Mass Suggestion or Symbol of Persuasion SLA
Evocation - +10% chance to crit with spells
Illusion - ? Permanent displacement? Illusion options are very limited.
Necromancy - Could be either of the SLAs not chosen to replace Waves of Fatigue or maybe the better choices of Circle of Death/Necrotic Ray
Transmutation - Good place for the friendly version of Tensor's or possibly Disintegrate or Reconstruction

[Aelonwy]

Changes to Tier 1
Energy of the Scholar changed to match costs/benefits in Spellsinger 1 AP per rank, 30/60/100 Spell points
Superior Wand and Scroll Mastery (You are an Archmage after all, the ultimate studious mage) 25%/50%/100% and 1/2/4 DCs of wands/scrolls

Changes to Tier 2
Efficient Metamagics need to somehow become more efficient. That's part of a much larger discussion however.

Changes to Tier 3
Arcane Bolt needs to scale with more % to spellpower after level 20, maybe something like 125% at lvl 20, 150% at lvl 25, and 200% at lvl 30

Changes to Tier 4
*shrug*

Changes to Tier 5
Arcane Blast SLA needs similar changes to Arcane Bolt, scale with more % to spellpower after level 20. Additionally, changing this to an effective 6th level wizard spell instead of 4th level might help reduce saves versus the effect at least some. I suggest 6th level spell because its Tier 5, and you must be a 12th level character to access Tier 5s and a 12th level caster gets access to 6th level spells.

If possible I'd like to see the primary school DC bonus be +2 in Tier 5 (total of +3 with the +1 from Tier 4) for 3 AP similar to what Warlock gets in Tainted Scholar. And I wouldn't say no to having the secondary school changed from selecting a specific school to a +1 to all DCs or all DCs except the primary school similar Tainted Scholar... but if not I'm okay with the secondary school selection.

Arcane Supremacy. Arcane Supremacy annoys me. Its almost always triggered on the last spell used on a group of mobs such that the entire 12 second effect goes entirely to wasteas I'm running to find something else to take advantage of its benefits. About the only place I get the full benefit of this ability is ToEE and that's entirely due to the proximity and density of mob clusters. I would very much prefer this changed to something I can choose when it goes off, even if that means it has a much longer cooldown and limited charges.

[Xgya]

I gotta say I can support most of the suggested changes, except the following:

Transmutation School changes:
This one is very difficult. Most of its best spells or rather just most of its spells are 6th level spells. Perhaps the ability to cast Tensor's on party members unextended (to indicate the Transmutation specialist's mastery of their chosen school) would give this more niche.

Tenser's, while a fantastic buff when you welcome it, is also a very short buff with a rather hefty downside.
Since this could be potentially used to troll people (increasing someone's cooldowns will do that), I'd recommend against it.

GIMME BALEFUL POLYMORPH! We have the technology! We can already turn people into frogs. Give me a single-target heroic version, please?
Alternatively, instead, Disintegrate? It's a quintessential and well-known Transmutation spell, after all, and while Flesh-to-Stone (and inversion thereof) can be useful in some limited instances, turning things to dust is a go-to solution in DDO.

[Domince]

Maybe some spell critical % in the higher cores and SP.

[Aelonwy]

Tenser's, while a fantastic buff when you welcome it, is also a very short buff with a rather hefty downside.
Since this could be potentially used to troll people (increasing someone's cooldowns will do that), I'd recommend against it.

You're right of course. I was thinking it might be a nice buff to pass out for teamwork purposes but forgot about the dark side. Those dark side bad apples have a way of misusing things.

Oh well Disintegrate or Reconstruct would be better suited then.

Baleful Polymorph...hmmm... well if we ever get a single target Frog spell it ought to go in a Druid tree. But Baleful Polymorph, I vaguely remember someone using that in PnP to turn someone else into a mini-beholder... except the guy didn't get any of it's powers so he wiggled around on the ground like a beach ball until an ogre kicked him at us. Good times.

[Hipparan]

I like a lot of the changes listed, but I want to focus on what is by far the weakest line.

Abjuration School changes: This is the worst school by a wide margin
Shield SLA, can be cast on self and others (to indicate the Abjuration specialist's mastery of their chosen school)
Change Protection from Elements to Glyph of Warding (I realize this is a divine spell but it seems so much better than the same level Fire Trap)
Change Dismissal to Banishment (Banishment has limited usefulness, especially with the inflated HD issues of DDO, but its the best Abjuration gets)

Currently the line of SLAs is:

1. Shield - This is boring and you can get a better version from Eldritch Knight. Even before the EK changes it was better.
2. Resist Energy - This is very slow progression. I'd put this on Tier 1.
3. Protection from Energy - I understand it's an SLA, but having to pick one energy type at a time is annoying and is a lot to cast.
4. Stoneskin - Do many people use this spell at higher levels? Can always get it on Gnome
5. Dismissal - Instakills are nice, but this one is pretty restricted.

Here is what I would change it to:

1. Resist Energy - Buff spells like this aren't very attractive for SLAs, so dropping the level requirement is a boost.
2. Protection from Elements - Same reasoning as Resist Energy but also making it Elements so one cast per person rather than five.
3. Fire Trap - Fire Trap is actually pretty decent because it has a max caster level of 20. However, the damage dice are lousy compared to the upgraded fire spells from U41. Greater Glyph of Warding might be nice too, but I don't know how the Devs would feel about passing around Divine spells to Arcane casters.
4. Globe of Invulnerability - This can be useful but very situational. Most Abjuration spells are. Stoneskin would probably be more popular here still. How about Greater Glyph of Warding here to go along with damaging with Fire Trap?
5. Banishment - Still limited to outsiders but better than Dismissal.

[Enoach]

What I think would be a better approach longstanding would be...

1. Add more spells of each school so that they are more evenly represented over the 9 spell levels
2. Change all AM sla's to "Pick a Spell of that school from the designated spell level" - This will make these cores much more flexible and allow the player to pick their SLA

As a note I've come to enjoy picking the Abjuration Shield sla along with Wand and Scroll Mastery from the AM tree on my PM. Gives me a cheap defensive spell and doesn't take a spell slot . But that is all I spend in that tree.

[Aelonwy]

I like a lot of the changes listed, but I want to focus on what is by far the weakest line.
Here is what I would change it to:

1. Resist Energy - Buff spells like this aren't very attractive for SLAs, so dropping the level requirement is a boost.
2. Protection from Elements - Same reasoning as Resist Energy but also making it Elements so one cast per person rather than five.
3. Fire Trap - Fire Trap is actually pretty decent because it has a max caster level of 20. However, the damage dice are lousy compared to the upgraded fire spells from U41. Greater Glyph of Warding might be nice too, but I don't know how the Devs would feel about passing around Divine spells to Arcane casters.
4. Globe of Invulnerability - This can be useful but very situational. Most Abjuration spells are. Stoneskin would probably be more popular here still. How about Greater Glyph of Warding here to go along with damaging with Fire Trap?
5. Banishment - Still limited to outsiders but better than Dismissal.

Those are good options too. Not everyone spends points in EK, even for the better Shield. My reasoning for keeping Shield was to allow for an Abjuration specialist to be able to cast it on friendlies as a benefit to teamwork. It would be an exclusive benefit to selecting such a subpar school. I know its available on wands for those with UMD so it doesn't seem like much but this way it could be cast on pets, summons, hirelings, that barbarian in the party who's never heard of UMD, maybe even a charmed creature that's taking missile spam to the face.

Small options like this are subtle benefits but can still be worthwhile.

I've never played around much with the Globe's of Inv. they seem more hassle than they're worth. I spam stoneskin from wands though, before every big fight just for the extra cushion of damage absorption. I don't know how worthwhile it would be to have the spell as an SLA if you can just carry around a couple wands.

[Enoach]

...
I've never played around much with the Globe's of Inv. they seem more hassle than they're worth. I spam stoneskin from wands though, before every big fight just for the extra cushion of damage absorption. I don't know how worthwhile it would be to have the spell as an SLA if you can just carry around a couple wands.

These are often overlooked for that exact reason you state.

Some good uses:

1. Place to stand vs casters such as Lightning bolt spammers
2. Drag mobs that protected by level 4 or less spells into it - Deathward is a level 4 spell


If you use kiting, spells like this one can benefit you by debuffing. If you are one that likes to stand still and shoot back, then this spell can protect you from a number of low level spammed spells.

[Aelonwy]

2. Drag mobs that protected by level 4 or less spells into it - Deathward is a level 4 spell

I'll have to play around with it some. Deathward is nuisance to my PK.

[Aelonwy]

Any other ideas or alterations?

[Tuxedoman96]

I like a lot of the changes listed, but I want to focus on what is by far the weakest line.



Currently the line of SLAs is:

1. Shield - This is boring and you can get a better version from Eldritch Knight. Even before the EK changes it was better.
2. Resist Energy - This is very slow progression. I'd put this on Tier 1.
3. Protection from Energy - I understand it's an SLA, but having to pick one energy type at a time is annoying and is a lot to cast.
4. Stoneskin - Do many people use this spell at higher levels? Can always get it on Gnome
5. Dismissal - Instakills are nice, but this one is pretty restricted.

Here is what I would change it to:

1. Resist Energy - Buff spells like this aren't very attractive for SLAs, so dropping the level requirement is a boost.
2. Protection from Elements - Same reasoning as Resist Energy but also making it Elements so one cast per person rather than five.
3. Fire Trap - Fire Trap is actually pretty decent because it has a max caster level of 20. However, the damage dice are lousy compared to the upgraded fire spells from U41. Greater Glyph of Warding might be nice too, but I don't know how the Devs would feel about passing around Divine spells to Arcane casters.
4. Globe of Invulnerability - This can be useful but very situational. Most Abjuration spells are. Stoneskin would probably be more popular here still. How about Greater Glyph of Warding here to go along with damaging with Fire Trap?
5. Banishment - Still limited to outsiders but better than Dismissal.

I'd suggest:

1. Resist Energy
2. Fire Trap
3. Stoneskin
4. FoM (or Banishment, which would be more appropriate for an arcane caster)
5. and NEW Greater Globe of Invulnerability - Suppresses lvl 5 and under non-friendly spells (dmg and CC) while inside the barrier and prevents such spells from targeting anyone in the barrier. Furthermore, friendly spells (i.e. buffs and heals) cast by you and your allies are remain unsuppressed inside this barrier. The idea is that you've such a mastery over abjuration that you can control which spells can pass through your barrier (similar to how SR works in tabletop).

As far as casting shield, etc. on other party members, I'd suggest making such an ability T5 and having it work based off of the specialty you've taken:

Imparting Knowledge: Self-only spells may be cast on allies if they are in your spell school specialty. (e.g. shield for abjuration, displacement for illusion, false life or death aura for necro, etc.) The spells this would affect would only be spells that wizards can get, either through the their class trees or their spellbook.

[droid327]

This thread is a necro, but since it is, let me add...at this point, I say wait and see what the Alchemist changes look like. With all the spells they're adding, there's apt to be a lot more that might be useful to import as Archmage spells. Similarly, the "mix and match" mechanic they've suggested for Alch might fit well thematically with an Archmage too, using their mastery of the weave to splice together spells on the fly. That'd make the tree a little more distinct than just incremental passive bonuses to your existing spellbook.

[Kutalp]

Lots of threads by fellow players in time, aswell as valuable critisation under original posts. The subject deserves a summary with today's spell/buff and character class mechanics.


Easiest would be

lvl 1 archmage you get permanent toggle jump and tumble effect. master's touch sla, hypnotism, charm person, ray of enfeeblement sla. summon monster 1 sla.

+1 dc to all spell schools every three wizard level up to lvl 12 archmage. lvl 12 to 15 +1 dc every two wizard levels if archmage. lvl 15-20 +1 dc to all spell scholls every wizard level if archmage.

-%1 spellpoints spent for each wizard level up to Archmage lvl 9. -%2 additional discount between 10-14. -%3 additional discount between 15-18. %4 additional discount for archmage level 19 and 20.

lvl 2 archmage you get shield, nightshield, protection from evil, obscuring mist as slas.

lvl 4 archmage you get permanent blur effect. glitterdust sla. summon monster 2 sla.

lvl 7 archmage you get permanent displacement effect. (similar for all archmage wizard levels.)

Some achievement higher at the tree may add extra ghostly like avoidance ability that would stack with all other Archmage wizard permanent buffs.

The Archmage enhancement tree should be able to pick favorite Slas regardless of school as if adding extra spell slot to their spell book aswell as permanent defensive buffs to ensure survival. Better DC, extra discount combined with Slas would be the only real set an Archmage would catch up with Palemaster or Eldricht Knight enhancement trees.


My humble pieces of eight.