Raid Flagging

[jskinner937]

Don't quote me on this and no promises but I'm probably going to just delete that entire flagging experience from DDO. Flagging for SoS is not fun and I hate players holding on to stuff that clutters their bags for no reason. I have a shelved experiment that just turns off the flagging (by breaking the quest flow in a bad way but it'll let you in) but if I get some more free time to make it less silly it's on my list of QOL I'd love to tackle. I'm glad people like the Litany change, btw

Just make it a feat granted upon flagging completion that persist through reincarnation.

[GotSomeQuestions]

Don't quote me on this and no promises but I'm probably going to just delete that entire flagging experience from DDO. Flagging for SoS is not fun and I hate players holding on to stuff that clutters their bags for no reason. I have a shelved experiment that just turns off the flagging (by breaking the quest flow in a bad way but it'll let you in) but if I get some more free time to make it less silly it's on my list of QOL I'd love to tackle. I'm glad people like the Litany change, btw

Do you mean the flagging mechanic (collecting Dragon Gems from various wilderness zones, one time) or the re-flagging mechanic (collecting Dragonshard Essences from Enter the Kobold, Monastery of the Scorpion and Prey on the Hunter, every time), or both?

I would not be surprised if most characters, and many players, have never set foot in the Eerie Forest. Just collecting the gems is a huge pain if you're in a hurry, since it relies on random wilderness rares. And saving them for later is an unpleasant inventory tax. But that has nothing on re-flagging for every run.

That whole flagging system is a huge pain, and re-flagging for every run makes it much much worse. If you do get a chance to fix it in basically any way, that would be a huge improvement.

[PsychoBlonde]

Those feats are recent. Tomes persisted at least since heroic cap was raised to 20 and I am fairly certain before then.

If tomes persisted through reincarnation before the cap was 20, that'd mean that the tomes persisted through reincarnation BEFORE REINCARNATION WAS A GAME FEATURE. Tomes were made to persist through reincarnation in Update 13, February 2012. The cap was raised to 20 in Module 9, August 2009. So, 2.5 YEARS after the cap was raised to 20, they made tomes persist through reincarnation.

Yeesh.

[PsychoBlonde]

People LOVE the litany change.

Removing or simplifying other quests with flagging (especially the 3 necro crypts) would get just as much love

I'd be happy if they'd just make them all work like Cursed Crypt so that you can repeat the last quest without re-doing the entire chain. I don't mind flagging for stuff every life, but I don't want to have to flag for it *every time I run it on the same life*. And window-farming or red-dooring stuff is a bunch of bleh.

Also, Lynnabel, if you ever do get SoS flagging fixed, maybe look at making Zawabi's Revenge be separate from Against the Demon Queen, so the quest acts like a quest and the raid acts like a raid? Those two being attached at the hip has been an irritation since I started playing.

Probably even more of a PITA than fixing SoS flagging, though.

And after THAT, you can do something about THRENAL!

[Sunnie]

Flagging itself is not a big deal to me, even if I have to do it once every life. Having to run some quests in order to run other quests or raids is fine and makes perfect sense, getting one item that you can immediately hand in to an NPC as with Zawabi is also fine, having to collect three soul gems and three essences as with Stealer of Souls is where it goes too far. Having to collect another three essences in order to run the last quest again takes it WAY too far.
It just makes no sense whatsoever to be able to run the Vault of Night raid without first having done the 4 quests, same thing with Caught in the Web, or Reaver's Fate/Fall of Truth. Keep that kind of flagging in the game. The Necropolis quest packs as well, the only change needed there is the re-flagging. Make it so you can run the crypts with the vampires any time you want after you've done the corresponding tombs with the mummies and it's perfect.
Flagging for a raid or quest because you've reincarnated: Fine. Re-flagging because you ran the quest or raid once: Not fine.

I think things like the Sigil of Dal'Quor and the Sigil of the Abbott are nice options to have. You can use one inventory slot and not have to run the quests, or you can free up the slot and run the quests the next life you want to do the raid. No need to have your cake and eat it too in my opinion. If the flagging in Necro 4 worked like Restless Isles it would be fine, you could either keep the completed sigil OR run all 4 quests once. Having to run the quests over and over looking for the last missing pieces is just not fun, however.

So in conclusion: most flagging is a great thing, some of it needs to be tweaked, though.

[kmoustakas]

Don't quote me on this and no promises but I'm probably going to just delete that entire flagging experience from DDO. Flagging for SoS is not fun and I hate players holding on to stuff that clutters their bags for no reason. I have a shelved experiment that just turns off the flagging (by breaking the quest flow in a bad way but it'll let you in) but if I get some more free time to make it less silly it's on my list of QOL I'd love to tackle. I'm glad people like the Litany change, btw

I would be against removing flagging all together. But, something like the litany flagging that if you do it once you're good to go is great. You have to go into a lot of trouble to fill your sigil but once you do, next times you run the quests you simply pass the sigils because you no longer need them.

[Dulcimerist]

I agree with these previous posts about not doing away with flagging altogether. Please don't completely eliminate it. If some of the raid flagging quests seem like more trouble than they're worth, how about making those quests more worthwhile to do?

The flagging quests for raids such as Vault of Night and Reaver's Fate/Fall of Truth have some decent XP, and are generally worth the time for the XP alone. The Gianthold quests have some decent named items as well, although I wonder if a few of those items could use an update. (Some of the VoN raid loot could use an update.)

Heroic Necro IV named items could probably use an update, and I do wish that running each of those first four quests once would grant access to Litany of the Dead. As for Litany, some players find it a pain to have to run it four times; but how about introducing a mechanic where every four runs of Litany gives you an end reward list filled with several of the items that can come from any of the Litany chests?

Caught in the Web flagging I really enjoy repeating for the story, and it's also worth running the entirety of the flagging quests multiple times for the saga reward.

In summary, please keep flagging for raids, but make the flagging process something that we would want to do, even if that process wasn't required.

[Dulcimerist]

Also, Lynnabel, if you ever do get SoS flagging fixed, maybe look at making Zawabi's Revenge be separate from Against the Demon Queen, so the quest acts like a quest and the raid acts like a raid? Those two being attached at the hip has been an irritation since I started playing.

I just got burned by this ADQ ridiculousness today, actually. This is more annoying than the Abbot stuff, since Abbot doesn't require a flagging quest before each time it gets rerun.