Prowess Nerf

[FuryFlash]

Hello DDO players,

The most recent update brings with it a change to the Filigree set, Prowess:

Prowess' 5 Piece Set is now: Whenever you activate an Action Boost, gain +50 Melee Power for 10 seconds.

This is a nerf from the previous value, +75 Melee Power. Note that this filigree set also originally provided +100 Melee Power, although that was not intended by the developers.


Poll Question: Do you support the change to Prowess?

[Knightrose]

In my opinion melee should be the highest DPS over any ranged in just about every situation. You give up all ground and positioning in order to constantly get wacked or one shot. So, no, in general I do not support nerfs to Melee.

[Sam-u-r-eye]

While I agree that melee should be top DPS, I think that prowess is degenerate.
It has been BIS for too long!
All hail the new filigrees if someone can find a combo that works better than prowess. Am not sure they can though. Prowess is only losing 12 melee power on average, and it's giving 25 melee power on average for 5 filigrees if you're in LD.

[Frogger1234]

The last Prowess-related "fix" nerfed my Kensai Power Surge. I'd rather they just deleted this Prowess feature entirely and changed Power Surge back to how it used to be.

[Domince]

Well considering it requires 5 peices of prowess, a 5 slot sentient jewel it really isnt that biggest deal, yes melee will do a bit less damage for ten seconds at cap only for the people that have it.

[Emerge2012]

Prowess is exceptionally strong compared to everything else and this is why everyone uses it, understandably. The problem isn't so much the amount damage it gives so much as the synergy it has with Dreadnought and it's nearly unlimited action boosts and 50% prowess uptime.

Basically this nerf hurts the other destinies because LD is really strong. Destinies that are already unused (Fury/GMoF/SD/Shiradi) because they were so grossly inferior to begin with. So in the end I don't mind a small prowess nerf but they really need to make the other melee destinies better. For instance overwhelming critical and headman's chop should have been in Fury right from the get go, Shadowdancer should have a useful instakill attack (not a low % based chance), GMoF ki attacks need their damage multiplied by 300% melee/ranged power, and Shiradi needs a melee power boost plus a nice attack clickie - or at least let the shiradi procs use spellpower with weapons.

[RevCo]

Reason I'm PO'd is due to the amount of work making 5 sentient weapons with prowess, 4 of which have 5 slots and one is almost there as well. And no I don't use LD for my only toon I use, currently working on divine and next the bard ED. And this company wants my money, ya right.

IF a dev had the courtesy to offer an explanation, and even a mild apology, that would go far in my books but hey, I don't see that happening... Prove me wrong!

/rant off

[Saekee]

I am against.

Note: I do not have the set nor did I ever have any intention of making it.

My issue is dev communication.

[askrj1]

Doughnut.

It was already nerfed once, if they felt the balance was necessary I guess that's fine, but maybe you know, show us a sign somewhere this was going to happen before it actually does?

[acemonkey]

LD+Prowess is too easy, too lazy, too obvious.

That said, what's gonna kill SSG in the long run is not making ****y options better. It's fairly obvious this has to go, and in fact never should have gone live, but the fact that casters and ranged have 100% **** choices and soon melee will as well is what should be condemned, not bringing Prowess in line with the rest.

And this nerf doesn't even do that, every single melee will still be LD+Prowess, because 50 mp 50% of the time is about 150% better than all the other options.

[GramercyRiff]

Silent Avenger set bonus is next.

[RavenNight91]

LD+Prowess is too easy, too lazy, too obvious.

That said, what's gonna kill SSG in the long run is not making ****y options better. It's fairly obvious this has to go, and in fact never should have gone live, but the fact that casters and ranged have 100% **** choices and soon melee will as well is what should be condemned, not bringing Prowess in line with the rest.

And this nerf doesn't even do that, every single melee will still be LD+Prowess, because 50 mp 50% of the time is about 150% better than all the other options.

Re: u41 Release notes goes live 12-5-18 Proposed U41 Melee Non-Prowess Optimal Set

1. Spines of the Manticore/The Wreath of Flame, raid filigree: +6 Melee Power (Rare: +4 Melee Power)
2. Spines of the Manticore: Attack and Damage: +1 to hit and damage with all weapons (Rare: +2 PRR)
3. Sucker Punch/One Against Many, raid filigree: +2 Strength (Rare: +4 Melee Power)
4. Sucker Punch, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
5. Sucker Punch, Attack and Damage: +1 to hit and damage (Rare: +2 PRR)
6. One Against Many, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
7. Treachery, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
8. Treachery, Critical Confirmation and Damage: +2 to critical confirmation rolls and damage (Rare +2 PRR)

Spines of the Manticore 2 Pieces: +2 Damage
Sucker Punch 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power
Sucker Punch 3 pieces: +1d6 sneak attack damage
One Against Many 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power
Treachery 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power

Total
44 Melee Power
2 Strength
1 to hit
3 to damage
2 to critical confirmation rolls and damage
3.5 Sneak attack Damage

I hope you are happy now ?

[CaptainPurge]

I am against.

Note: I do not have the ser nor did I ever have any intention of making it.

My issue is dev communication.

Yes. Why are they afraid of warning players ahead of time? You know there are players trying to complete their prowess set by trading or AH farming, whatever, and now someone just yesterday finally completed their set. Now would they re-think it?

Of course, they could've just stealth nerfed it and sat back and laughed at the forum butthurtrage to come.

[CaptainPurge]

Silent Avenger set bonus is next.

That is an equipment set bonus, not filigree. How often have they nerfed set bonuses?

[blerkington]

That is an equipment set bonus, not filigree. How often have they nerfed set bonuses?

I don't think that set bonus is anywhere near as egregious as Prowess was. It's pretty good, but not in the same league.

It also ties up three slots with items that otherwise aren't optimal for many melee builds, as opposed to Prowess which takes one slot and has no real opportunity cost. If we get a couple new well-designed gear items in Sharn that combine some of the more important SA set effects with others that are better for STR based melees we will see people moving on without a second thought.

But SSG had people warning them from day one that Prowess was way too strong. It's astonishing that they didn't see a problem with creating a set which offered so much more power than all the other set options for melees and also was by far the most advantageous for the strongest melee ED.

Again, incidents like this really make me wonder about how carefully feedback about obvious outliers like this is considered, and what if any DPS testing is done before finalising these items. It also makes me wish SSG was doing more to offer filigree sets that work better with the other EDs so we had more choices.

Thanks.

[mikarddo]

About time. Should have been done long ago.

[Mandelia]

I have no strong feeling for or against this, just make the next weeks free giveaway 5 sentient toolkits so we can wipe our weapons without wasting points on this late breaking indian-giving nonsense.

[Sebastrd]

If anything, the nerf doesn't go far enough. They should have dropped it to 25.

[Shadow_Jumper]

Re: u41 Release notes goes live 12-5-18 Proposed U41 Melee Non-Prowess Optimal Set

1. Spines of the Manticore/The Wreath of Flame, raid filigree: +6 Melee Power (Rare: +4 Melee Power)
2. Spines of the Manticore: Attack and Damage: +1 to hit and damage with all weapons (Rare: +2 PRR)
3. Sucker Punch/One Against Many, raid filigree: +2 Strength (Rare: +4 Melee Power)
4. Sucker Punch, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
5. Sucker Punch, Attack and Damage: +1 to hit and damage (Rare: +2 PRR)
6. One Against Many, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
7. Treachery, Melee Power: +3 Melee Power (Rare: +2 Melee Power)
8. Treachery, Critical Confirmation and Damage: +2 to critical confirmation rolls and damage (Rare +2 PRR)

Spines of the Manticore 2 Pieces: +2 Damage
Sucker Punch 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power
Sucker Punch 3 pieces: +1d6 sneak attack damage
One Against Many 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power
Treachery 2 Pieces: +5 Melee Power

Total
44 Melee Power
2 Strength
1 to hit
3 to damage
2 to critical confirmation rolls and damage
3.5 Sneak attack Damage

I hope you are happy now ?

Prowess is still the BiS. That's the Non-Prowess optimal setup for those that want to not use it. On average it simply cuts out 12.5 MP from the prowess setup.

As was pointed out by a few players though, these nerfs always hit those late to the party the hardest. Usually those are the new players. For the players who are unsure if their recently slotted prowess filigreed are worth it, the answer is yes. It is still on average giving you +15 MP, +11 PRR and +2 AB over anything else you could slot for melee.

[korgzz_bloodaxe]

As someone who has multiple 5 piece prowess sets I knew it was going to be nerfed one day but that doesn't reduce the pain. However I do think it is best for the game as it makes it harder to balance melee when such outliers exist. Hopefully they give some melee classes (Pure single class Fighters and paladins a bit of love soon though).