How is Thief-Acrobat?

[Hipparan]

So I have some quarterstaves left over from a couple of Henshin Mystic lives on another character and I have a character I'm thinking of TRing to Rogue to have some sneaky fun in Sharn. I can't decide though if I want to stick with Assassin like I have always done in the past or if I want to try something new with this Rogue. I'd like to give Thief-Acrobat a try, but I feel like they are pretty underused in DDO. Has anyone tried playing as a Thief-Acrobat and how is it? I know weapon damage can be an issue but I'm hoping the Falconry tree can help with that.

P.S. I'm not interested in making a Mechanic.

[Discpsycho]

My last life was as a pure TA. Aside from difficulties self-healing, I have no complaints.

THF chain, PA/Cleave/GC, IC. Dex-based for absurd evasion, reasonable AC and decent Sweeping Strikes. You can go Str-based if you want better synergy with LD in epics, but it'll make you a bit squishier through heroics. I don't have Falconry so I can't claim to understand the synergy, but I would personally go with Harper over Falconry

[Elfishski]

So I have some quarterstaves left over from a couple of Henshin Mystic lives on another character and I have a character I'm thinking of TRing to Rogue to have some sneaky fun in Sharn. I can't decide though if I want to stick with Assassin like I have always done in the past or if I want to try something new with this Rogue. I'd like to give Thief-Acrobat a try, but I feel like they are pretty underused in DDO. Has anyone tried playing as a Thief-Acrobat and how is it? I know weapon damage can be an issue but I'm hoping the Falconry tree can help with that.

P.S. I'm not interested in making a Mechanic.

I found Thief-Acrobat to be a lot of fun. Assuming you have a few good quarterstaves at least, ideally with backups for when they break.

It's very squishy when it gets hit (as appropriate), but if you focus on upping your standing dodge/max dodge and make liberal use of Uncanny Dodge (and in epics also Meld into Shadows), make sure you have a deception item (to get sneak attack and also make monsters spin around and not hit you), and always keep moving, then you shouldn't be getting hit. Also Sweeping Strikes is one of those abilities that seems to work way more reliably than you'd think based on the DC, and tripping all the monsters near you is another great way to not get hit while you kill them all.

Solo you have to be on your toes all the time, in a group with a tank and a healer it really shines and has plenty of DPS including AOE cleaves and multiple targets with the capstone, all of which get huge amounts of sneak attack and helpless damage multipliers. I'm not sure if that DPS really compares to e.g. Assassin (I assume not that favourably given that none of the meta-gamers seem to play Thief-Acrobats), but it was very solid when I tried it.

[NemesisAlien]

I also thinking of doing acrobat next life, parking here for info.

[Emerge2012]

So I have some quarterstaves left over from a couple of Henshin Mystic lives on another character and I have a character I'm thinking of TRing to Rogue to have some sneaky fun in Sharn. I can't decide though if I want to stick with Assassin like I have always done in the past or if I want to try something new with this Rogue. I'd like to give Thief-Acrobat a try, but I feel like they are pretty underused in DDO. Has anyone tried playing as a Thief-Acrobat and how is it? I know weapon damage can be an issue but I'm hoping the Falconry tree can help with that.

P.S. I'm not interested in making a Mechanic.

Acrobat is a VERY solid tree on it's own! However the reason you don't see many is that it has terrible synergy with everything else if you're a pure rogue. For instance the other rogue trees don't offer you a whole lot as secondary trees and Acrobat itself really wants you to be str or dex based which makes Harper/Falconry harder to invest in to keep the damage/tactics high. Assassin/Mechanic are generally easier with higher ceiling due to the ease of being Int based.

Could you easily do a wisdom based aasimar acrobat? Sure! Spend 16 or so in Aasimar, capstone in acrobat, then get yourself some tier 4 goodies from the bird tree. Would be nice self healing that recharges, some on hit vulnerable, and good tactics DC's - at the expense of maybe struggling to do traps on the top end without excessive gear swaps. If I were to build one this is probably the route I'd take as the good gearsets really support dex as a secondary stat anyways.

[Hipparan]

Acrobat is a VERY solid tree on it's own! However the reason you don't see many is that it has terrible synergy with everything else if you're a pure rogue. For instance the other rogue trees don't offer you a whole lot as secondary trees and Acrobat itself really wants you to be str or dex based which makes Harper/Falconry harder to invest in to keep the damage/tactics high. Assassin/Mechanic are generally easier with higher ceiling due to the ease of being Int based.

Could you easily do a wisdom based aasimar acrobat? Sure! Spend 16 or so in Aasimar, capstone in acrobat, then get yourself some tier 4 goodies from the bird tree. Would be nice self healing that recharges, some on hit vulnerable, and good tactics DC's - at the expense of maybe struggling to do traps on the top end without excessive gear swaps. If I were to build one this is probably the route I'd take as the good gearsets really support dex as a secondary stat anyways.

Wisdom Acrobat build sounds interesting, but I was thinking more along the lines of spending just enough points to get Meticulous Weaponry. The negative thing I've heard the most about Thief-Acrobats and other staff builds is the staves breaking so that should help. Getting some extra PRR/Healing Amp can't hurt a Rogue either.

[Emerge2012]

Wisdom Acrobat build sounds interesting, but I was thinking more along the lines of spending just enough points to get Meticulous Weaponry. The negative thing I've heard the most about Thief-Acrobats and other staff builds is the staves breaking so that should help. Getting some extra PRR/Healing Amp can't hurt a Rogue either.

Definitely has a problem with staves breaking. The best staff is a lvl 7 until epics and it's not exactly durable. Last time I ran a staff build I no joke had 3 Elemental Blooms in my inventory the whole time and got to use them all more much more often than I ever thought I would.

[NemesisAlien]

Definitely has a problem with staves breaking. The best staff is a lvl 7 until epics and it's not exactly durable. Last time I ran a staff build I no joke had 3 Elemental Blooms in my inventory the whole time and got to use them all more much more often than I ever thought I would.

Till now i cant figure out which is better, densewood or darkwood staves, whats the difference anyway

Lev 1 staff of nothing with meteoric star ruby pwns everything between 1 - 5. Except the pit maybe, because **** ooze noms even wood...

[C-Dog]

Till now i cant figure out which is better, densewood or darkwood staves, whats the difference anyway

If you're crafting, Steel. Seriously.

But to answer your question, in D&D Darkwood is supposed to be +1 point harder than wood (and half the weight), and Densewood is supposed to be +2 points harder. But in DDO, both hardness and durability scale some when Cannith Crafted, so the actual values vary.

So Densewood is better - just not as good as steel.

[Arkat]

The Staff of Shadow is literally indestructible and really lets me enjoy my TA Q-Staff toon. I TRed him from a Henshin Mystic and the TA is DEFINITELY better.

[C-Dog]

Btw, I ran this build and enjoyed it. Didn't take it to Epic so can't speak there, but using the AoE trip and watching that gang of mobs who were surrounding you drop like bowling pins is very satisfying.

o https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post5344638

Here are some others: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...=1#post5759362

[Hipparan]

I haven't run a Rogue since before the update with Epic Defensive Fighting. Does that help at all with Rogue survivability? Even if it doesn't I'm set on building a Thief-Acrobat now. Just wondering.

[adrian69]

I haven't run a Rogue since before the update with Epic Defensive Fighting. Does that help at all with Rogue survivability? Even if it doesn't I'm set on building a Thief-Acrobat now. Just wondering.

EDF gave new life to rogues, rangers, and barbarians. Just don't expect scroll heal someone across the room.

[Arkat]

EDF gave new life to rogues, rangers, and barbarians. Just don't expect scroll heal someone across the room.

And Monks.

[askrj1]

Running pure rogue TA on dex, skipped PA/cleave line and in its place have precision and full dodge line. Even though I run in LD, cleaves have poor synergy with the attack speed and doublestrike of TAs (cleaves don't doublestrike). Precision fort pierce is nice though honestly now I'm overflowing, but every bit of accuracy helps.

High ref saves and generally higher HP nowadays means your Improved Defensive Roll will work more consistently. Helpless damage in-tree is always good, threat reduction in-tree is also nice.

Wis-mod stick is nice because it helps solve rogue's weak will saves, but it has poor synergy with the dex mod abilities in TA. Would be something I'll consider for a max dodge build with monk levels perhaps.

While E.Bloom is the "best" staff out there up until Shadow and the heroic counterpart performs well, they're both a PITA to farm up and there are a number of decent ones along the way that people overlook:

Nicked Staff ML2, Sharn - Easy to get, nice additional damage for first few levels
Cheftain's Spear ML4, 3BC - Expanded crit, dice 1d8
Broken Oar ML4+, Cove - Damage procs good for low levels
Nat Gann ML4, Chronoscope - Early 4dex, sneak bonus
Theurgic Stave ML8, Threnal - Expanded crit, dice 2d4, adamantine good for hitting constructs
Light Unending ML13, Archon's Trial - Universal breaker with banishing, works wonders in Vale
Breeze ML14, Black Abbot - Expanded crit, dice 1d10 and some other neat mods, if you ever pulled one from the raid
Dreamspitter ML14, Reaver's Fate - Doesn't break on oozes(!)
Stonework Beam ML15, Mines of T - If you want a para stick still but do not have Bloom
Bone Crusher ML18, Palace of Stone - Expanded crit, dice 1d10, heroic version bugged and can carry sentience (for now), neat damage procs

Side note, The Staff of Shadow is not actually indestructible, just very, VERY hard to break. It also doesn't seem to take additional damage or get worn when used to beat on oozes and rusties despite being adamantine. It still loses durability, even though very slowly, and it would seem the repair price is also steep in comparison, but nothing unaffordable like the old dragonscales.

PS: Current build stands on 145PRR + 30Blitz, 130AC and 44dodge (cloth), 1.8khp (with EDF), 80-ish MP before blitz. Weapon is 5-slot Prowess + 3-slot Zephyr Staff of Shadow.

[Illiamfryn]

Running pure rogue TA on dex, skipped PA/cleave line and in its place have precision and full dodge line. Even though I run in LD, cleaves have poor synergy with the attack speed and doublestrike of TAs (cleaves don't doublestrike). Precision fort pierce is nice though honestly now I'm overflowing, but every bit of accuracy helps.

High ref saves and generally higher HP nowadays means your Improved Defensive Roll will work more consistently. Helpless damage in-tree is always good, threat reduction in-tree is also nice.

Wis-mod stick is nice because it helps solve rogue's weak will saves, but it has poor synergy with the dex mod abilities in TA. Would be something I'll consider for a max dodge build with monk levels perhaps.

While E.Bloom is the "best" staff out there up until Shadow and the heroic counterpart performs well, they're both a PITA to farm up and there are a number of decent ones along the way that people overlook:

Nicked Staff ML2, Sharn - Easy to get, nice additional damage for first few levels
Cheftain's Spear ML4, 3BC - Expanded crit, dice 1d8
Broken Oar ML4+, Cove - Damage procs good for low levels
Nat Gann ML4, Chronoscope - Early 4dex, sneak bonus
Theurgic Stave ML8, Threnal - Expanded crit, dice 2d4, adamantine good for hitting constructs
Light Unending ML13, Archon's Trial - Universal breaker with banishing, works wonders in Vale
Breeze ML14, Black Abbot - Expanded crit, dice 1d10 and some other neat mods, if you ever pulled one from the raid
Dreamspitter ML14, Reaver's Fate - Doesn't break on oozes(!)
Stonework Beam ML15, Mines of T - If you want a para stick still but do not have Bloom
Bone Crusher ML18, Palace of Stone - Expanded crit, dice 1d10, heroic version bugged and can carry sentience (for now), neat damage procs

Side note, The Staff of Shadow is not actually indestructible, just very, VERY hard to break. It also doesn't seem to take additional damage or get worn when used to beat on oozes and rusties despite being adamantine. It still loses durability, even though very slowly, and it would seem the repair price is also steep in comparison, but nothing unaffordable like the old dragonscales.

I agree with you at every point here concerning both build ways and the staff list..