Nerf and bug fix Dire Charge

[Qhualor]

Or perhaps there is virtually no other competent alternative... there are so few epic feats at 29 that help melee at all that can't be replicated through either a buff (like haste) or simply having appropriate gear (ie, silver, byshek, etc). Further, many of the feats don't even work properly, and neither does dire charge (as the DC is higher than what the tooltip says it should be). It's just that dire charge is one of the few that still actually works at all that it gets chosen. I like it for soloing and for dropping that little bit of CC in reaper when either mobs break or they roll high on saves. Other than that, it's hardly OP.

But Tilomere has said that Sane Asylum is the high skull reaper that his server plays on, so perhaps it outperforms lots of stuff there. On G-land, it's a nice to have but not a must have.

While I might agree there are limiting options for a melee, I find it very hard to believe its why its very often suggested in most build discussion threads to choose Dire Charge regardless of melee class. I think rogue is the only one I haven't seen suggested, but very shocked to see suggested for likes of a melee ranger. There was even a thread not long ago expressing my surprise. If no other viable option is the actual reason than it would have been said in those threads and none did until this one.

[xveganrox]

If it’s so OP, why would you be complaining that it’s OP for melee? Nothing stopping your CC caster from taking it, and if they’re built well they’ll have a higher Dire Charge DC than most melees. If it was really OP compared to CC casting I’m sure all the casters would be taking it at 29, not just warlocks.

[Arkat]

It is very simple. Melee should not have 4x the dps of a dps caster while also having the AoE CC utility of a dps caster.

Not only is it very simple, the ability itself is bugged, and the DC is too high by 10, causing it to succeed 50% more of the time than intended, which is throwing epic feat selection and the power between melees (such as monks) and every other source of dps in the game out of whack. As stated by Steelstar:



If this is something you would like to fix, just leave the class level 29-30 part, and add a -9 modifier at the end and make it close enough.

This is causing nerfs to be directed at melee classes such as monks, which is ruining heroic class balance, which was already dominated by warlocks. The problem is high level melee, and as such, bug fixes and nerfs should be directed where they belong.

It will also fix all the melee complaints about a lack of CC against undead and other targets if it is converted to a non-helpless 3 second knockdown. Reaper mode is supposed to be about teamwork, not someone using bugged dire charge to solo R7 to replace CC classes with a higher dps melee class, countering the reaper mob saves increase by the bug, and using bugged self-healing that also isn't supposed to bypass the reaper penalty.

So?

Someone you don't know solos content you probably don't run on a server where you probably don't play.

That affects you negatively how?

If it doesn't, why do you care?

Seriously...WHY DO YOU CARE??

Let Symb play the way he wants to play and you can play the way you want to play.

[GramercyRiff]

R7 get wrecked.

I want my Barbarian to be this good, but I bet it has a lot do with the player playing that Barbarian.

Also Dire Charge is a great and yes powerful level 29 feat. Not only don't nerf, but make more level 29 feats this good.

[LT218]

Wait, I'm confused.

I thought it was Warlocks that were OP'd and could solo everything while poor melee were extinct, marginalized, flavor-build dinosaurs? This build isn't a Warlock?!?

Oh wait, that's right. It was thrower builds that were game-breakingly overpowered, dirty kill-stealers. What's that? This build isn't a warlock or a thrower you say?

Ok then. It must be a DC-based instakiller then because I heard those were overpowered, too. No? It's not a DC caster?

Well then, it's obviously a handwraps monk if it's that strong. I mean monks are so boss that they leave dinosaur sized footprints everywhere they walk and people 100 years from now will whisper of the legends, right?

It's not a monk?!? So you're saying a non-monk, non-caster melee toon is steamrolling mid to high skull reaper missions solo at level? Well, that's impossible. There is page after page of founders, multi-year veterans and DDO pros telling us that it is 100%, anecdotally impossible for a non-pure tank melee build to do top tier DPS and survive in high skull reaper. Clearly it can't be done and, as such, that video is faked.

Jeez, next thing you know, bards are going to be overpowered.

[Mindos]

Jeez, next thing you know, bards are going to be overpowered.

The first rule of Bard club...

[Odysseus2011]

Someone you don't know solos content you probably don't run on a server where you probably don't play.

This was done on Lamannia.

[Odysseus2011]

Good melee player solos easy quest on moderate difficulty. NERF HIM!!!!!!!

[Chai]

So you solve that by being one of the few people filibustering that endgame dire charge is OP and that isn’t EXACTLY THE SAME THING? Let’s nerf an epic issue and hope thqt helps heroics.

Never said that at all actually. Your attacking a position that doesnt exist.

The fallacy of “your argument is invalid but when I make the same argument it is valid” is strong here.

Not a fallacy this time. The argument of nerfing monks 1-30 because of being OP 29-30 is indeed invalid, rebutted, and rebuked. This logic is countered by precisely and exactly zero belief systems.

I’m guessing people arguing for Dire Charge to be nerfed don’t even play mid to high skull end game and just see something that they can’t do and instead of getting better they insist that everyone must be terrible like them.

Its not like mid-high skull endgame is hard when the entire trash killing meta is leaning on CCs heavily, and the same CC ability very heavily - while beating down bags of HP. Its like you all fell asleep and woke up in 2009 epics. The strawman argument of "must be bad players" doesnt apply here, because even the good players gravitate to a two-button-push-cheese-meta if and when it gets them what they want more quickly. Going from 12 APM to 14 APM is not raising the skill floor here. The bads, with their potatoes for hands, still succeed at the formulaic CC+DPS fest just fine.

You can talk about "jealous bad players who cant do the thing that completes the thing on a higher thing like other players" when playing a character reaches a 200 APM threshold. Until then, its a hilarious strawman farce of an argument.

And for the record, I dont even want it nerfed. I'm just calling a spade a spade. Being from Wisconsin, I recognize cheese when I see it.

[goodspeed]

lol ya they should nerf it. Take out the caster stats as an option. And con. Now it's fixed and 100% for melee lol.

Been awhile for me but melee must of gotten a huge defensive boost outside of the max out trees to be needing a reaper nerf. Did we finally get some form of CC that doesn't outright suck and take forever in a day to recharge early on? Besides monk fistn

[Shadow_Jumper]

Once again Tilomere finds a build and player that show how little he actually knows about how the endgame meta is structured. Unless you're a Kensei caster hitting mobs with soundburst, you should be nerfed. Just ignore the actual reasons why DPS casting is useless in high skull reaper and ask for someone else's build to be nerfed instead because your builds can't compare. Genius.

[Bacab]

And for the record, I dont even want it nerfed. I'm just calling a spade a spade. Being from Wisconsin, I recognize cheese when I see it.

That made me chuckle.

[lyrecono]

It is very simple. Melee should not have 4x the dps of a dps caster while also having the AoE CC utility of a dps caster.

Not only is it very simple, the ability itself is bugged, and the DC is too high by 10, causing it to succeed 50% more of the time than intended, which is throwing epic feat selection and the power between melees (such as monks) and every other source of dps in the game out of whack. As stated by Steelstar:



If this is something you would like to fix, just leave the class level 29-30 part, and add a -9 modifier at the end and make it close enough.

This is causing nerfs to be directed at melee classes such as monks, which is ruining heroic class balance, which was already dominated by warlocks. The problem is high level melee, and as such, bug fixes and nerfs should be directed where they belong.

It will also fix all the melee complaints about a lack of CC against undead and other targets if it is converted to a non-helpless 3 second knockdown. Reaper mode is supposed to be about teamwork, not someone using bugged dire charge to solo R7 to replace CC classes with a higher dps melee class, countering the reaper mob saves increase by the bug, and using bugged self-healing that also isn't supposed to bypass the reaper penalty.

A good player with a good build(and what looks like good gear and plenty of past lives) completes a short an easy quest on a mere r7? A quest we so often farm for reaper exp on r8+ that many of us can find our way blindfolded by now?
And this after how many tries? Looking at his hp, that's easilly a 40+ reaper points, prob more.
He has worked hard for this, he earned it.

This after a near decade of caster dominance? Ever since the lv went up to 20 casters had the best cc, damage avoidence (by being ranged), had the best buffs, were more likely / able to use scrolls for what they didn't/wouldn't want to cast themselves., Had the best trash killing abilities in the game, could farm epic scrolls solo (back then, that was currency with rds and lds instead of plat or shards), do i need to go on?

Get of your high horse, instead of having the barb be an example to wich others can pull themselves up to, you have to get all negative and divert dev attention to melee nerfs? No thank you, they already have a hard time making new content and ballancing it.

[Dnarth]

Absolutely the worst idea of the day. No

[Niminae]

Stuff

Don't use the capabilities of the 1% to suggest nerfs for the 99%. Or really, for anyone. Dire Charge is just a tiny part of the character's build on the video you posted.

[AbyssalMage]

Why?

Developers, please add "Nerf" to your restricted list. I want to see "Nerf" as "****" from now on.

Thanks, and that is an easy fix.

[Niminae]

The "better argument" for a nerf for monks in heroics needed to come from examples of how they were OP in heroics.

Don't hold your breath looking for an effect which fits the cause. Stated intentions are coded vastly differently all the time by this dev team. Warlocks were said to be OP in Heroics. All the dev discussion prior to Update 36 specifically called out Warlock Heroic performance. Which they nerfed. And then went on to throw in nerfs to Epic Eldritch Blast and Epic Arcane Eldritch Blast because of nothing at all that was mentioned in the design discussion.

[Alled78]

It is very simple. Melee should not have 4x the dps of a dps caster while also having the AoE CC utility of a dps caster.

Not only is it very simple, the ability itself is bugged, and the DC is too high by 10, causing it to succeed 50% more of the time than intended, which is throwing epic feat selection and the power between melees (such as monks) and every other source of dps in the game out of whack. As stated by Steelstar:



If this is something you would like to fix, just leave the class level 29-30 part, and add a -9 modifier at the end and make it close enough.

This is causing nerfs to be directed at melee classes such as monks, which is ruining heroic class balance, which was already dominated by warlocks. The problem is high level melee, and as such, bug fixes and nerfs should be directed where they belong.

It will also fix all the melee complaints about a lack of CC against undead and other targets if it is converted to a non-helpless 3 second knockdown. Reaper mode is supposed to be about teamwork, not someone using bugged dire charge to solo R7 to replace CC classes with a higher dps melee class, countering the reaper mob saves increase by the bug, and using bugged self-healing that also isn't supposed to bypass the reaper penalty.

COMPLETELY DISAGREE WITH YOU

ARE you joking Tilo I know

U asking for nerf Dire Charge because one of the best player in the server is able soloing ONE R7 quest, where all mobs are stunnable/holdable???

There are some caster able to do it in R10 probably

then u publish images u are able to do R10 using soundburst?? https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...urst-(Paladin)


STOP "Call for NERF" instead or this game will soon shut down, pls

[CaptainPurge]

This entire thread is a troll by Tilo, he told me in person at a Starbucks after I offered to buy him a naked vanilla latte.

[Vish]

Ass ass in