First Look: Favored Soul Beacon of Hope

[simo0208]

You only get one 6th level spell at 12. If you're taking Heal, then you're not taking Blade Barrier or even Cometfall.

Neither of which are needed. I rarely bother with blade barrier because I don't take maximize or empower. Without them, the spell is laughable. Even with them, it requires kiting enemies repeatedly through the blades.

Cometfall I do take, but heightened, quickened soundburst and greater command both work just as well at level 12, especially because I could care less about the damage that cometfall gives. It's all about the CC.

Of course, your mileage may vary. I'm talking specifically on reaper (low skulls and up). In reaper, heal as a spell greatly exceeds heal as a scroll. And I don't mind the heal SLA as long as the cooldown is not shared with the heal spell. In reaper at 12, I'm often needing to heal multiple targets that are not close by and I have very little access to mass cures at that point.

Regardless of whether you play a FVS to heal or not (my FVS build is not a healer), there are some must grab spells regardless of what your goal is. Heal is one. I don't think the Heal SLA would replace me grabbing Heal. First, I can't see my build taking T5 in this tree. Second, if I was going to go that route, then I want to maximize the number of healing options on different timers as possible. Thus, I'd still take the heal spell AND the heal SLA as level 12.

[GotSomeQuestions]

I like the overall approach of this tree quite a bit! I have a Favored Soul who sits at cap to help out with raids and reaper questing, and I can see myself getting a lot of mileage out of this tree (and hopefully out of the new AoV tree--I don't have to heal anyone if all the enemies sit down and shut up).

But even with now-useful enhancements, Favored Souls still lag behind Clerics when it comes to spell choice. It would be nice to get the faster cooldowns that Sorcerers have (faster casting would be nice too, but would be too powerful). With shorter cooldowns, Favored Souls could spam their 1-2 mass cures more readily, or whatever other single spell they have that applies in a particular situation. Clerics are the toolbox caster for divines, and they get domains for even more flexibility. Instead of trying to let Favored Souls match that, let us spam our few spells more often.

For the enhancements, as others have said, reapplying a host of 12 second buffs 10 times a minute is not a good mechanic. I understand that you want the buffs to give the players "something to do" while waiting around to heal, and I appreciate that game play goal, but please, don't make us spam these boosts so aggressively. They need longer durations.

I'm really excited for all the other new mechanics and abilities in this tree, though.

[Niminae]

I can certainly say that I would never take a true res SLA if I had any other/better option on a dedicated healer.

I hear you. All I'm saying is that you don't have a better option and that applying quicken to a SLA is better than a scroll... So, I like this capstone better than a kick in the nuts? It didn't even exist before, so I guess it is better than nothing...

1) Make it AoE and not require a target. (Potentially useful for raising multiple people or raising if they're about to bounce)
2) Make it bypass part of death timers.
3) Make it not apply and/or remove death penalties. (And prevent/repair gear damage?)
4) Make it apply buffs to the target immediately when they're raised.
5) Make it cast able on undead as an instakill

All of that requires work, since none of it exists in any way that could be cut and pasted from other effects. Think about that for a bit.

[SirValentine]

FVS get Heal access at level 12. I take it and Quicken together at 12 every single time I play FVS. And I've done 30+ lives of FVS.

Heal isn't my first or even second choice at level 12 or 13. But then I play more as an offensive caster than a hjealbot.

Cometfall I do take, but heightened, quickened soundburst and greater command both work just as well at level 12, especially because I could care less about the damage that cometfall gives. It's all about the CC.

Soundburst & G. Command attack Fort & Will, respectively. They can't replace Cometfall, which goes against Reflex.

Regardless of whether you play a FVS to heal or not (my FVS build is not a healer), there are some must grab spells regardless of what your goal is. Heal is one.

Sure, tank-healing in raids, et cetera. I'd also call it a must-have...eventually. But with so many other good spells, it doesn't make the cut to be taken earlier than the very last 6th level spell slot received. Most situations it's just not needed, and other options are better. 6th-level spell is the toughest level, with too many desirable options and not enough slots to take them.

[SirValentine]

Clerics are the toolbox caster for divines, and they get domains for even more flexibility.

Ideally, yes. Now if only they had that in DDO.

[lLockehart]

I hear you. All I'm saying is that you don't have a better option and that applying quicken to a SLA is better than a scroll... So, I like this capstone better than a kick in the nuts? It didn't even exist before, so I guess it is better than nothing...



All of that requires work, since none of it exists in any way that could be cut and pasted from other effects. Think about that for a bit.

Think about that for a bit.... as opposed to what, accepting that the development team isn't working pro bono and we should expect at least some level of reasonable changes instead of copy pasting - this *has* been in the works for some months right? Seriously, what are you suggesting, that there should be little to no work involved? I've never understood some standards that get as low as this. Like, even by copy pasting you'd have better options than what's presented which is more of a reflection of the team's misunderstanding of their game. I really don't think things get playtested or brainstormed for too long.

/shrug.

[Niminae]

Think about that for a bit.... as opposed to what, accepting that the development team isn't working pro bono and we should expect at least some level of reasonable changes instead of copy pasting - this *has* been in the works for some months right? Seriously, what are you suggesting, that there should be little to no work involved? I've never understood some standards that get as low as this. Like, even by copy pasting you'd have better options than what's presented which is more of a reflection of the team's misunderstanding of their game. I really don't think things get playtested or brainstormed for too long.

/shrug.

Hey relax, you seem to be on my same page. Steelstar was all up in arms claiming that there had been years of thought put into this tree. I'm just stating the obvious that cut and paste effects are easier than new effects. We welcome our new Wall of Healing overlords.

[lLockehart]

Hey relax, you seem to be on my same page. Steelstar was all up in arms claiming that there had been years of thought put into this tree. I'm just stating the obvious that cut and paste effects are easier than new effects. We welcome our new Wall of Healing overlords.

Apologies for the quarrelsome reply, it's just... we shouldn't really normalize these practices ;c!. I refuse to believe this has been in the works for at least a year, what I think happens is that we've settled in the idea of having a 3rd "bad" tree that serves mostly for splashing 6 PMRR with a couple borderline useless Sla's to keep our playerbase satisfied and leave it at that - I think they finished this draft and left it hanging until AoV and War soul revamps were finished or at least drafted so they could release them together, which would be alright and coherent if actual effort was invested in them. I'd much rather things take their time and we're delivered durable content that feels optimized to play with than rushing things for content's sake. Something even indie companies are capable of doing.

It's just really strange to me that this has seen 0 playtesting along with some very dubious choices, I mean, how's the process of creating content like this is, don't they brainstorm or test things before and after coding is done? And when they hit lama land, it's just to fix *some* bugs. I don't know, I shouldn't get too salty at this point but I do enjoy this game very much and it really saddens me to see so much potential down the drain. Especially with Fvs, a class that's been long due for an update - I've been asked so many times "why would I want to play Fvs, a paid class?" and I'm like /shrug.

[btolson]

The only reason to have buff SLA's is to use the spell slot for something else. If you have X level 4 spells and you want X+1 level 4 spells, then this SLA is a godsend. If you don't care all that much about level 4 spells and it's the level 5 and level 6 spells that you're short on, then this doesn't do a lot.

Eh, that can certainly make sense for some buffs, but re: Death Ward specifically... I and pretty much everybody else has a million bta clickies of that (usable at level 5 even, whereas this SLA requires 6+), plus you can get it from hirelings (mass version too). Overall I don't see it as saving a slot since I wouldn't slot it anyway, just wasting AP. If it combined a bunch of standard buffs into 1 click, then I would put 1 AP in it, because I haaaaate buffing tedium.

I don't really wanna beat this horse to death though, as if it's the largest or most glaring problem with this tree.

[Qhualor]

I have been biting my tongue since this discussion started. I have little experience with FVS and only plan on doing 3x past lives on my ranger when he does his last Iconic past life sometime in the future since there are no other relevant class past lives left to combine. I don't think I would be too far off though when I say, why would anyone spend AP on something you can get as a spell slot or wand/scroll it? to go even further, why would you use a spell slot for raise dead? that's just as bad as spending AP for something you can just buy from a vendor. both raise dead and DW slas look to be a waste of AP, especially with them so high in the tree.

[Silverleafeon]

Generally speaking (at least I make it my practice), when a Cleric, Druid, or Favor Soul is in a party its good policy for said toon to always provide Death Ward, Freedom of Movement, and a 3rd buff of choice (such as True Seeing, Spider Skin, Mass Shield of Faith, etc...) to all the party members when entering a dungeon and resting at shrines (or after a party members death {which occurs much more often in reaper} excluding party members that dash off into the distance without waiting.

Playing a Cleric/Favored Soul/Druid a lot, there are many calls for DW and Fom buffs.
These are major important buffs.

A good divine player will respond by granting the melee pack proper buffs.

Yes, it is quite possible for a veteran player to have plenty of DW clickies for heroic play and even an eternal potion of FoM, but for every well prepared player such as thus there are plenty of others who lack thus.

{If said well prepared player was in a party with a good divine player, the well prepared player might very likely save said clickies until an untimely death where said divine player would be stressed for time to heal/raise/buff players?}

[Silverleafeon]

Considering that the tree is a buff & healing tree, its hard to find good SLA replacements.

Looking like everyone (or almost everyone) agrees with you on the tier 5 raise dead SLA?
Anything would be an improvement there.

The capstone is fairly good, of course it mostly makes room for Energy Drain which a Heal & Buff toon is not likely to be using.
If one replaced True Resurrection with MCMW or the like that would be acceptable.
{Would love to see something like Blade Barrier SLA, but we know that is not about to happen in a healing tree.}

Good Hope is +2 damage which is why Bards value thus.
For a Tier One SLA that is quite good.

Close Wounds has a 1 second cooldown for 2 spell points.
For a Tier Two SLA that is incredible.
Put a strong Positive Spellpower and some Metas behind it and its almost too good to be true.

Deathward SLA seems a little blah, but DW buffs are essential to typical party buffs.
Its expected for Divine to Buff this spell and its really hard to slot thus a mid heroics.
One could move thus to Tier 3 and replace with something more grand (not sure what since a MCLW is certainly not going into tier four.)
Its a good sla all in all.

Raise Dead needs replacing, might be good to rally towards MCLW or the like,
especially with a reduction of the Heal SLA to 30 sp?


I am worried that the healing cone spells will not be strong enough to be worthwhile, time will tell.


One poster suggested Hope Buffs be treated like Crown of Summer, which sounds reasonable alternative among others.


There is a very real and present danger of losing line of sight constantly (and being constantly consumed) by the 12 second Hope rebuffing.

[Silverleafeon]

Hoping the AoV tree has at least improvements of adding/improving SLAs to Tier 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, Capstone.

Which is where the offensive SLAs that Favored Souls desperately need should reside.

[Hobgoblin]

I have been biting my tongue since this discussion started. I have little experience with FVS and only plan on doing 3x past lives on my ranger when he does his last Iconic past life sometime in the future since there are no other relevant class past lives left to combine. I don't think I would be too far off though when I say, why would anyone spend AP on something you can get as a spell slot or wand/scroll it? to go even further, why would you use a spell slot for raise dead? that's just as bad as spending AP for something you can just buy from a vendor. both raise dead and DW slas look to be a waste of AP, especially with them so high in the tree.

it comes down to spell slots really.

its why i dont always take gh on a sorc, as i can scroll it.

for example - for a level 20 fvs you have 3 level six spells - a common mix is heal bb comet fall (not arguing if thats good or not just using as an example)

since you have a heal sla - now you dont take that and you can take others - ie undeath to death for insta kills, mass cure for more healing, harm for damage/healing pm's etc

it gives you more versatility

and when the stuff hits the fan, sometimes its nice to be able to scroll someone up, raise dead from spell and cast true res on someone else from a sla

and just as another note - can we get more spells in the 7/8 range? not much worth it there

[PsychoBlonde]

To be honest, I'd rather they just gave FvS Sacred Defender, fixed up War Soul and Angel of Vengeance, and called it a day. But I've never really liked FvS very much. They're terribly generic. Either you play melee, in which case you're basically identical to any other melee toon evarr, or you're literally the most boring caster build in the game. Don't see anything here that would make me want to play one.

Heh, it kinda feels like it desperately wants to be a pet or summons buffer, and run around with a stable of critters, but no, you're pretty much Girlfriend Healer.

[PsychoBlonde]

and when the stuff hits the fan, sometimes its nice to be able to scroll someone up, raise dead from spell and cast true res on someone else from a sla

A capstone shouldn't be described as "sometimes it's nice". It should have a large functional effect on the character. It doesn't have to be the most powerful thing in the tree, but it should be good enough to make you seriously consider whether it's worth taking a level or two of something else that provides a major low-hanging-fruit boost, like:

Would I rather have a Resurrection SLA or . . .

Be able to use a Runearm, be proficient in repeaters, and get a bonus feat.

or . . .

Would I rather have some bonus fighter feats . . .

or . . .

Would I rather have paladin saving throws and far better melee stuff . . .

or . . .

would I rather have Wizard for some DC boosts and a spellcasting feat . . .

or . . .

do I want to swashbuckle?

Those choices are build-defining, not "sometimes nice".

[Hobgoblin]

A capstone shouldn't be described as "sometimes it's nice". It should have a large functional effect on the character. It doesn't have to be the most powerful thing in the tree, but it should be good enough to make you seriously consider whether it's worth taking a level or two of something else that provides a major low-hanging-fruit boost, like:

Would I rather have a Resurrection SLA or . . .

Be able to use a Runearm, be proficient in repeaters, and get a bonus feat.

or . . .

Would I rather have some bonus fighter feats . . .

or . . .

Would I rather have paladin saving throws and far better melee stuff . . .

or . . .

would I rather have Wizard for some DC boosts and a spellcasting feat . . .

or . . .

do I want to swashbuckle?

Those choices are build-defining, not "sometimes nice".

all true, and i wouldnt go pure on a fvs just for the res sla. just saying its nice to have

[moo_cow]

Because otherwise you wouldn't access to have Good Hope at all?

And, as said above, DW & Raise mean you don't have to slot them, so you can slot something else.



Wow. And if it wasn't Tier 5, I'd have been calling it out as OP. You're suddenly getting Heal at level 12 instead of level 15, and permanently getting an extra 6th-level-spell of your choice by not having to spend one of your 3 slot on Heal. How is that not great?

I'm actually surprised at some of these responses. Usually I'm the one calling out SLAs as being dumb & useless. But these, granting way more (and earlier) options to spell-slot-starved FvS, for some reason other people think are bad.

You don't ever need to take raise dead because there are better raises. No noob would ever use spell points on raise dead especially when you can scroll it before you even get the spell. You never needed to slot dw, only mass. Not only that but everyone has dw clickies, including mass ones. And no heal doesn't come at level 15.

Not even a good try..... The only thing I'd give you there is the extra level 6 spell. But let's be real, late game cometfall kinda sucks, late game blade barrier kinda sucks and cure moderate wounds mass is meh. Undeath to death is good. That's it.

Most trees being revamped turn out fairly powerful. This isn't a revamp but this is a really weak tree power wise. It is a buff and heal tree. It's buffs are subpar and the healing seems pretty decent but could use more. I think you really need to compare this tree with others that have been revamped. Its just not powerful.

[Silverleafeon]

and when the stuff hits the fan, sometimes its nice to be able to scroll someone up, raise dead from spell and cast true res on someone else from a sla

Excellent point.
Been there, during a potential raid wipe, its the Rez cooldown timers that become much more difficult than players realize.

True Resurrection has a 13 second cooldown.
Resurrection has a 11 second cooldown.

Due to spell slot shortages, most favored souls do not slot both, although a cleric could swap out such easily favored souls are stuck with what they have chosen.


For a true healbot player, a 2nd Full Rez could be significantly nice.


Again, those looking for a battle caster Favored Soul, the big soup is what will AoV improvements be?

[karatemack]

My thoughts are below in blue:

• Core 1: For each Core ability you gain, +1% Positive Spell Critical Chance, +10 Healing Amp, and +5 Positive Spell Power.
• Core 2: Beacon of Grace: Cost: 2 SP: You and allies ahead of you* heal for 1 point of Positive Energy per Favored Soul level. This scales with your Positive Spell Power. 6 second cooldown.
• Core 3: Shining Light: Whenever you cast one of your Beacons or use Flight of Glory, you and affected allies gain a Sacred bonus to Healing Amplification equal to your Favored Soul level for 12 seconds. Enemies in the zone of effect are dazzled and take a -1 penalty to attack, spot, and search. These enemies are illuminated by Shining Light, dispelling stealth, invisibility, blur, and displacement, for 10 seconds, and giving a -40 penalty to hide. Sightless enemies are immune to the dazzle effect.
• Core 4: Beacon of Hope: Cost: 15 SP: You and allies ahead of you* take the effects of a Panacea and a Restoration spell, and heal for 5 points of Positive Energy per Favored Soul level. This scales with 100% Positive Spell Power. 30 second cooldown.
• Core 5: Flight of Glory: When you use your Leap of Faith, nearby allies gain Temporary Hit Points equal to twice your character level, plus an additional 25.
• Core 6: True Resurrection SLA: 25 SP. 10 second cooldown. Multiselector:
  
  • Passive:+4 WIS. You gain +3 Maximum Caster Level with all Positive spells. Your Hope and Beacon abilities that scale with Favored Soul level now add Epic Levels as well.
  • Passive: +4 CHA. You gain +3 Maximum Caster Level with all Positive spells. Your Hope and Beacon abilities that scale with Favored Soul level now add Epic Levels as well.

+60 heal amp just for having all 6 cores. Then +30(?) when you use Shining Light. (assuming this ability is affected by the capstone? if not it's still +80 which is nothing to scoff at)

Tier 1:

• Good Hope SLA 10/5/2 SP. (3 second cooldown)
• Confidence: +1/+2/+3 Concentration, Diplomacy and Heal. Rank 3: You also gain +10 Positive Energy Spell Power.
• Divine Durability: +2/4/6 Competence Bonus to PRR.
• Spell Critical Chance: Positive: +2%
• Spell Points: 30/60/90 Spell Points

If you're going to stack heal amp, why not go all the way? Make Divine Durability 3/7/10 heal amp bonus? Good Hope is interesting here, especially at lower levels.

Tier 2:

• Close Wounds SLA: (6/4/2 Spell Points) (3/2/1 second cooldown)
• Hope for Inspiration: Target ally gains a Sacred bonus to all Skills equal to 1/4 your Favored Soul level for 12 seconds. 6 second cooldown.
• Divine Durability II: +2/4/6 Competence bonus to MRR.
• Spell Critical Chance: Positive: +2%
• Might's Reward: Multiselector (Shares a cooldown and same SP cost as Divine Might).
  
  • You gain an Sacred bonus to Positive Spell Power equal to your Strength modifier for 30/60/120 seconds.
  • You gain an Sacred bonus to Positive Spell Power equal to your Wisdom modifier for 30/60/120 seconds.
  • You gain an Sacred bonus to Positive Spell Power equal to your Charisma modifier for 30/60/120 seconds.

Hope for Inspiration seems weaksauce. A +5 bonus is something, but I would prefer to see this boosted. Maybe multiple tiers for a 3/7/10 bonus instead? I would prefer to see PRR/MRR bonuses in the War Soul tree. I would change Divine Durability II out to something like Divine Vitality, to allow FVS to refill someone else's blue bar. Close Wounds doesn't feel OP outside of low level heroics. Might be too little to be useful later in the game?

Tier 3:

• Hope for Protection: Target ally gains a Sacred bonus to PRR and MRR equal to your Favored Soul level for 12 seconds. 6 second cooldown.
• Efficient Empower Healing
• Spell Critical Chance: Positive: +2%
• WIS/CHA

Tier 4:

Hope for Protection is woefully under-powered compared to the bonus granted by the Protection Domain. Protection Domain is twice the level and lasts for 20 seconds. Also, do those stack? If so... parties with a cleric and a FvS can boost PRR/MRR by 60.

• Death Ward SLA: 10/8/5 SP (4 second cooldown)
• Hope for Victory: Target ally gains a Sacred Bonus to Melee Power and Ranged Power equal to half your Favored Soul level, and Universal Spell Power equal to your Favored Soul level. This lasts for 12 seconds. 6 second cooldown.
• Optimism: Every time you cast one of your Hope abilities, you gain a stack of Rising Beacon, giving yourself +2 PRR, +2 MRR, and +1 AC. This stacks up to 10 times, and stacks fade once every 12 seconds. Hope for Success grants 3 stacks.
• Spell Critical Chance: Positive: +2%
• WIS/CHA

Tier 5:

Hope for Victory... another thing which should be in the War Soul tree and self-only. Optimism is more PRR/MRR...

• Raise Dead SLA: 15 SP, 9 second cooldown
• Hope for Success: Target ally gains +1 to Critical Threat Range and Multiplier with weapons for 12 seconds. 60 second cooldown.
• Heal SLA: 40 SP, 6 second cooldown
• Undying Beacon: Allies affected by your Beacons gain Unconsciousness Range equal to 10x your Favored Soul level. This effect lasts for 12 seconds, and is refreshed if the target is affected by another Beacon spell.
• Wall of Healing: Cost: 30 Spell Points. Create a wall that persists for 30 seconds. Allies and Undead in the wall take a Cure Moderate Wounds spell every few seconds. 60 second cooldown.

Raise Dead SLA could at least be Resurrection IMO. Hope for Success doesn't belong here. It belongs in War Soul... and it should be a +2 bonus... and should be restricted to the favored weapon only. Heal SLA... hmmm... it really feels like what you are creating here is a tree to make self-healing in Reaper viable for the "healer". While I don't necessarily hate the tree... I am incredibly disappointed in the direction the game development seems to be headed. This is at least the second time this year that things appear to be in development in order to "counter" or "get around" the limitations of Reaper mode (the arti tree discussion was the first time this approach was admitted by the dev team). I would love to see more OUTWARD development. New classes, new races, new abilities and monsters which have spells/affects we have to learn new ways to counter... This endless progression to the latest layer of powercreep is dull and uninteresting. If I could play through the entire game as a Psionic or Summoner or Shaman or Avenger... then I could experience the entire game again in new ways. Give us new things to play with... but please make them lateral to the toys we already have in the box.