Static party/raid member XP bonus - pros and cons?

[gravisrs]

I've asked around many ppl at Argo about what they think about per-party-member bonus and mostly everyone was happy with that.

This particular bonus encourages veterans to play with newbies and is the main reason why number of LFM's are doubled during those weekends.

I'd like to officially ask SSG what they think about introducing static bonus per party member at some low level (like 1-2%) and just keep 5%/10% for special weekends only.

[Feal]

1 or 2 % might be not solve lfm problem.

I understand 5% static might be too much.. maybe 3% static?

[gravisrs]

Numbers to be adjusted. Just general idea.

[Yamani]

Numbers to be adjusted. Just general idea.

Iirc they said they wont make it permanent due to the xp increase and something like the system not able to handle it.
IMO they could take out 10% xp from the streak and put it back in via group party xp of 2% per party member (10% for full group). This way it would incentivize full groups more often without changing the xp to much.

[gravisrs]

Iirc they said they wont make it permanent due to the xp increase

Yet another source of (very low number) xp boost won't make a difference. Static veteran groups will ofc also benefit from it - but so do newb groups. As a vet player this would make me (my guildies, many friends from Argo I've talked with) actually posting an LFM.

Maybe not include this bonus in reaper mode (to avoid "scare" gap parties).

and something like the system not able to handle it.

Most likely BS. Weekends are crowded more than weekdays. With this bonus running on - even more. I'd say they afraid of crowd servers couldn't handle - not a one math rule - but that's a good sign actually

IMO they could take out 10% xp from the streak and put it back in via group party xp of 2% per party member (10% for full group). This way it would incentivize full groups more often without changing the xp to much.

Or that - but there will be too many voices against lowering streak xp bonus to make this shift happen.

[Qhualor]

Yet another source of (very low number) xp boost won't make a difference. Static veteran groups will ofc also benefit from it - but so do newb groups. As a vet player this would make me (my guildies, many friends from Argo I've talked with) actually posting an LFM.

Your response here adds to the point I keep saying. You and others would post lfms and group if it meant getting more xp. Obviously not doing it because of challenge or because you enjoy playing with others.

[FuryFlash]

Your response here adds to the point I keep saying. You and others would post lfms and group if it meant getting more xp. Obviously not doing it because of challenge or because you enjoy playing with others.

It's a win-win. The people who just want to maximize XP would be able to do so by grouping, and those who just enjoy running with others would have people to play with.

[Lonnbeimnech]

I think they could make it a permanent bonus for VIPs, give people a reason to go VIP.

[Qhualor]

It's a win-win. The people who just want to maximize XP would be able to do so by grouping, and those who just enjoy running with others would have people to play with.

A win for players who only group for more xp because it allows them to progress faster. Biggest carrot in the game.

A lose for players who get to group more often, but are slower/weaker or whatever lagging behind those other players.

Before Reaper, elite was considered "too easy". This started the whole fragmenting of the player base. It was common for players to fall behind and feel weak. Balance discussions were pretty high during this era which led to class passes, Champions and Reaper. If players now aren't grouping because they are above the challenge level to want more players or feel the need, than nothing would change with adding a permanent grouping xp of any kind.

I know some praise the grouping bonus because it means more grouping potential, but its just cover up to the real issue. It's like ignoring the actual problem.

[FuryFlash]

A win for players who only group for more xp because it allows them to progress faster. Biggest carrot in the game.

A lose for players who get to group more often, but are slower/weaker or whatever lagging behind those other players.

Before Reaper, elite was considered "too easy". This started the whole fragmenting of the player base. It was common for players to fall behind and feel weak. Balance discussions were pretty high during this era which led to class passes, Champions and Reaper. If players now aren't grouping because they are above the challenge level to want more players or feel the need, than nothing would change with adding a permanent grouping xp of any kind.

I know some praise the grouping bonus because it means more grouping potential, but its just cover up to the real issue. It's like ignoring the actual problem.

So you're saying the power gap is the reason people don't group? I see where you're coming from. There is a massive difference between a vet who has gear, pastlives and quest knowledge versus someone who has a weaker character and doesn't know the fastest way to run each quest.

That being said, I think the problem you're talking about is those players being left in the dust and feeling like they aren't even contributing. Frankly, that's just a matter of people being rude or impatient, and leaving others behind, which can't be fixed by any game development.

I think that players in your "lose" category would have that experience only if the people in the group were disrespectful people, not due to any game mechanics. Sure, they might be weaker no matter what. But *especially* thanks to Reaper mode, anyone can contribute in a group.

[Cantor]

Your response here adds to the point I keep saying. You and others would post lfms and group if it meant getting more xp. Obviously not doing it because of challenge or because you enjoy playing with others.

You know how grouping provides more xp/min? when the quest is hard enough that grouping is the best option.

[Feal]

I think they could make it a permanent bonus for VIPs, give people a reason to go VIP.

This is another viable option. Cash for SSG, faster TR for grinders, more possibility for occasional/new player to get a party.. everyone's happy

[gravisrs]

Your response here adds to the point I keep saying. You and others would post lfms and group if it meant getting more xp. Obviously not doing it because of challenge or because you enjoy playing with others.

Rather other way around. Dungeon scaling makes expectation that you contribute at least in that (pro)portion dungeon has scaled. If partying with others was just a social thing it would flourish, but it's not, it's penalised.

If we can't get rid of dungeons scaling (discussed many times) - we should consider some kind of compensation to have a neutral outcome of partying with different levels of experience players.

[Selvera]

As we mentioned in the general discussion thread about this; a bonus like this would most benefit static groups and give relatively little benefit to PUGs.

For veterans; we get significantly better XP by soloing then putting up an lfg; and this is a problem mostly with how dis-incentivized grouping is in the game and not with the XP and XP bonuses that a group can bring. For a 'jerk' veteran who puts up an LFM (the guy who doesn't slow down at all no matter how lost or dead their party memebers are), the lower XP comes mostly from dungeon scaling and the terrible LFG setup where you can't search for a quest and have to manually scroll through a huge list to find the quest to post the lfm. For the 'nice' veteran, it slows their XP even more to make sure everyone can find the quest, can keep up, stays alive or gets raised, etc etc.

There are already xp incentives to group; even new players can increase kills and maybe hit a new conquest breakpoint, or break breakables and get ransack bonus. Bonus points if they can get traps and doors or heal. But these incentives do not outweigh how much a veteran has to slow down to "be nice" to the group; and "being nice" in itself isn't incentivized.

But the biggest roadblock between players and grouping is how hard it is to actually form the group in the first place. A +150% xp incentive won't make that level 20 veteran warlock want to join your "In the Demon's Den" group.

I wrote a lengthy article about the subject but, and this is not an exhaustive list by any means, here are just a few issues standing in the way of getting groups:

1 - You need people who own the content
2 - You need them to be looking at the LFM within ~4 minutes of you posting it
3 - They need to not have already done it
4 - They need to be within 0~1 levels (if doing reaper) or 0~2 if doing elite
5 - They need to want to even do the quest (Ugh...a Threnal LFM?)
6 - They need to have the time to do it
7 - They need to know how to get there
8 - They need to get there before you finish otherwise it's basically just lfpikers
9 - They need to be appropriately geared for the dungeon (Hi2u 200 hp rogues in my R5 LFM's)
10 - You need to be on the right part of the chain

I mean...that's a pretty huge barrier to entry. And that's if someone even -posts- an LFM in the first place. A lot of people who play video games, especially DnD ones (and I apologize in advance for the stereotype) are people looking for an escape from real life. These are the kinds of people loaded up with all kinds of social anxiety and thus aren't willing to post an LFM on their own.