Scratch Pad for Build-fu

[SerPounce]

[deleted]

[SerPounce]

[FONT=verdana]Nature's Warrior capstone is...okay (+10% doublestrike),

+10 doublestrike, +10 PRR, +1d6 SA, +8 HP, +2 STR/WIS, +1 damage, +1 tactics for animal attacks (from durid levels so in addition to the str/wis), and reduced cooldowns (mass regenerate).

[unbongwah]

That last minute alteration of wolf attack speed gives one pondering:

Winter Wolf Speed increased to 10% + 1% per druid level, max 30% at level 20 druid.

I believe that refers to their movement speed bonus; winter wolf attack speed appears to still be fixed at 30%.

3. Wolf form attack animations and movement speed has been adjusted.

We are reducing the Basic Wolf Form attack speed bonus to 15%. Winter wolf remains about the same speed at 30%. We are also fixing some flaky behavior in the attack chain.

All Wolf Speed increases now stacks with haste and other speed effects

Winter Wolf Speed increased to 10% + 1% per druid level, max 30% at level 20 druid.

So the first point is about attack speed while the last line is about movement speed...I think. It is a bit confusingly worded. You would think SSG had learned their lesson by now!

[If anyone's wondering: no, I will never get tired of reposting that comic. ]

[edrein]

That last minute alteration of wolf attack speed gives one pondering:

Winter Wolf Speed increased to 10% + 1% per druid level, max 30% at level 20 druid.

However, I would expect a typical melee build to consider multi-classing as Caster Levels are far less important to that type of build.

I read that as move speed, given the line previous stated that they retained the same 30% attack speed boost while regular wolves went down to 15%.

[Sormiron]

Tested a few things.

Orcish Rage action boost works with Bear enhancements. 75 meleepower boost is kinda sweet.

Jaws of winter does not seem to work propperly (from strength and or items or just in general?), It just didnt work most of the time while stunning blow (wai?)m trip feat and greater maul did. I was using strength as mainstat.

Tremmor seems to work as a cleave attack dealing weapon damage and knocking things down for a few seconds. I do not know if that is what it was intended to be but I like it.

relentless onslaugt is awsome. but I might drop it and go for less druid levels if I play one on my main.

Harrowing pack still doesnt seem to knock down on a natural 20.

Savage roar with the stun effect is very neat and a fun mechanic using shred and maul/great maul. there isnt too much required to make it work.

Greater maul seem to cause an aoe stun but only damages the target. I am not sure how it is supposed to work

The bear is where I am at atm with all the aoe damage and cc, but then I do tend to multiclass and I have not tested snow slide.
I am unsure of if I will ever use the raging unless I am an orc and even then I would probably think about it a bit. I do not realy like not being able to heal up in a fight.

I think I will end up with some cleric in the strength domain for strength to reflex, Divine might and possible some fighter levels for feats. that is how it looks like right now.
The top tier cores are not that great. Lower spell cooldown sure, but then you want me to be enraged and not cast? make up your mind and do not leave me in the middle

[Silverleafeon]

Hmm...well that makes wolves = a form of choice when trying to get somewhere faster or make incredible jumps...

[SerPounce]

Max Tactics hybrid bear (easily switched to wolf)

PDK Druid 18/FVS 1/FTR 1 (sadly I think you will still need a +1 heart due to feats)

CON 16
WIS 18 +lvl ups
CHA 16

Feats:
Quicken, NFx3, PA, Cleave, G. Cleave, SF: evocation (or replace PA+ cleaves with precision, competionist, one other)

Enhancements
PDK: 3: Cormyrean Knight Training (1/3 CHA to tactics)

Warsoul: 4: Divine Will

Bear: ~35 (T+core 5)

Wolf: ~25 (core 4 for +1 multiplier, T4)

Total tactics: (base) + 9 [.5 druid levels] + 1.5 WIS [basic +divine will] + .33 CHA + Tactics

You also have wis focus so you can throw the occasional earthquake against low reflex mobs. Some legendary melee mobs have amazingly bad reflex saves.

[elvesunited]

[FONT=verdana]Nature's Warrior capstone is...okay (+10% doublestrike), but it's clear to me that devs intend pure wolf builds to be melee / caster hybrids. Otherwise why put so much emphasis on cold-spell boosts (Winter Hunt, Great White Wolf) and put the spell cooldown reductions in the cores? Which is how I wanted to play my wolf druid all along (I hated feeling like I needed to use the bug exploits to stay competitive), so I'm actually happy about that...at least in theory. We'll see how it works in practice. But if your focus is just on melee DPS, you're either gonna multiclass or use Vistani tree (or both).

Here are 4 pure Druid Wolf Builds that are not caster hybrids:

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Race: Half-Orc ( Max Str and put points in Con and Wis )
Enhancemnts : 41 N Warrior 11 N Protect 20 Half-Orc 8 Harper
Feats: Nat Fighting x3, Martial Weapons, Power Attack, Imp Critical, Quicken

Race and enhancement stats: +8 Str*, -2 Int, +2 Wis, -2 Cha

Weapon :Falchion ( Str +50% ) -3 to hit ( -2 vs evil ) +34 Damage
Critical: 15-20 x3 | Doublestrike:+10 | Melee Power: +21
Tactics:+3 (+6 Trip )

Max Armor: Heavy
Max Shield : None

Hp: +96 | PRR: 72 + shelter | MRR: 31 + shelter | Dodge:3 + items
+4 Spellpower

Specials: Half Orc Crushing Blow ( auto crit ), Orc Rage ( +46 Melee Power +2 Str )

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Race: Dragonborn or Human ( Max Str and put points in Con and Wis )
Enhancements: 41 N Warrior 28 VIstanti 11 Nature Protector
Dragon born Feats: Nat Fighting x3, Weap Focus, Power Attack, Imp Critical, Quicken
Human Feats: Nat Fighting x3, Cleave, Power Attack, Imp Critical, Quicken, Great Cleave

Dragonborn Race and enhancement stats: +8 Str, -2 Dex, +2 Wis, +2 Cha
Human Race and Enhancement stats: +6 Str, +2 Wis

Weapon : Dagger ( Str ) +1(0 human) to hit +22 Damage +1W (+2 more W with dethek )
Critical: 16-20 x3 | Doublestrike:+20 | Melee Power: +20(18 Human)
Tactics:+3 (+6 Trip )

Max Armor: Heavy
Max Shield : Tower ( with Master Scroll )

Hp:+86 | PRR:94 + shelter | MRR:53 + shelter | Dodge:3 + items

Specials: Immune to Fear and Energy Drain, Deflect Arrows, 25% Neg Absorb

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Race: Elf ( Max Dex and put points in Con and Wis )
Enhancements: 41 N Warrior 19 Elf VIstanti 6 N Protector 14 Harper
Feats: Nat Fighting x3, Weapon Finesse, Imp Critical, Power Attack, Quicken

Race and enhancement stats: +2 Str, +6 Dex, +4 Wis, -2 Con

Weapon : Rapier ( Dex ) +3(+6 Evil) to hit +19(+21 Evil) Damage
Critical: 15-20 x3 | Doublestrike:+13 | Melee Power: +22
Tactics(Wis):+3 (+6 Trip )

Max Armor: Light
Max Shield : Small

Hp:+81 | PRR:62 + shelter | MRR:31 + shelter | Dodge:6 + items
+9 Spellpower

Specials: Evasion

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Race: Gnome ( Max Int and put points in Con and Wis )
Enhancements: 41 N Warrior 31 Harper 7 N Protector 1 Gnome
Feats: Nat Fighting x3, Insightful Reflexes, Power Attack, Imp Critical, Quicken

Race and enhancement stats: +6 Int +4 Wis

Weapon : Scimitar ( Int ) -4(+2 Evil) to hit +15(+20 Evil) + Know Angles Damage
Critical: 15-20 x3 | Doublestrike:+10 | Melee Power: +27
Tactics(Wis): +3 (+6 Trip ) + Know Angles

Max Armor: Light
Max Shield : Small

Hp:+71 | PRR:62 + shelter | MRR:31 + shelter | Dodge:4 + items
+28 Spellpower ( +43 positive )

Specials: Evasion. +20% heal amp 10% neg absorb

[Tilomere]

You haven't tested them have you?

The descriptions are wrong.

So throat rip is WWA-ish, 1-3 hits, two seconds to use?

And so alpha is whatever it is.

I like my build even more now. 6 cleaves. I, uh, suppose that'll work!

[Des0xyn]

Have not been on Lammy yet, due time constraints =(

But some thoughts I had was towards a 17druid, 1fvs, 2 ranger (wolf form, dex to hit/dmg, tactics focused)

Nature warrior: 36-40 (tier 5s)
Nature Prot: 6+ (stance, excess aps here)
Season Herald: 4 (beguile)
Warsoul: 4 (divine will)
DWS: 6 (imp. weapon finesse)
HORC: 19 (orchish rage, brutality, raging crush, larger "size")

DWS would give some more animal empathy charges too, if some of the clickies need it for uses (seems to have been removed from the release notes in this sub forum). Larger range of weapons too if imp. weapon finesse works in animal form.

Gotta test on live I guess if the wolf can survive off temp hp alone while in orchish rage (or I could drop consecration I guess), and if you can still perform animal form "spell attacks" in orchish rage. Also if brutality is still recognized in animal form.

[Xyfiel]

Tried a few builds but didn't like them. Working on 14Ftr/5Bear/1Barb or 14/4/2 depending on which tier V I want. Not going to plan it out any further until a lot of the broken things are fixed. Likely in preview 2.

[unbongwah]

DWS: 6 (imp. weapon finesse)

Might as well pick up Melee Power Boost too for another 3 APs.

DWS would give some more animal empathy charges too, if some of the clickies need it for uses

Flight still uses Wild Empathy charges. I didn't check to see what else did.

Larger range of weapons too if imp. weapon finesse works in animal form.

IIUC, Improved Weapon Finesse will apply in animal form to any weapon which would normally get DEX to damage in humanoid form: i.e. light weapons (plus rapiers if you have Weapon Finesse feat). But that means it only works with 1H weapons, so your HO bonuses to 2H weapons would be wasted APs. But did not test rgr / drd yet.

[unbongwah]

Concept: TYWA bear pure druid
Issues: CON to dmg but to-hit still based on STR so will need at least a little STR (plus Power Atk pre-req)

Race: dwarf
Class: druid 20
Stats (36 pt): CON 20 / WIS 18 (+lvl ups) / STR 10 (+3 tome) / INT 10 (+3 tome)

• WIS for DCs, CON to dmg, STR to-hit - more MAD than I would like, tbh, but that's dwarf life for ya

Feats: Quicken (1), Power Atk (3), Cleave (6), Gt Cleave (9), Imp Crit (12), CE or NF (15), SF:Evo or NF (18), OC (21), Shield Deflection or NF (24), Epic DR or Emp Heal (27), NF or Epic Fortitude (30)

• Natural Fighting feats are even more weaksauce now than they were before, so I consider them optional. I'm presuming Shield Deflection still works in animal forms.
• Combat Expertise is for AC & PRR bonus in epics; due to extra spell CD penalty, only use it for serious tanking. Though TBH if you really want a high-AC bear build, you probably need to look into MCing for more AC (e.g., ftr, Protection domain cleric).

Enhancements: 18 dwarf (TYWA) / 41 NP (tier-5 + capstone) / 21 NW (+1 crit multiplier)

• extra racial APs would let you invest more into NW (Fatal Harry, 4LG) or SH (Beguile, caster bonuses)

Gameplay: focus on AoE melee, spamming bear attacks, CC spells like Sleet Storm & Earthquake, self-/AoE-heals

• Essence of the Turtle on live is not great, but on Lama bears have gone from having a poor temp-SP ability to having no temp-SP ability. That's uhh not an improvement. And more to the point, you have to be even more sparing with your spells than wolves.

Mainhand: has to be one of the TYWA-compatible weapons, of course. I was thinking Deathnip would be great for 14-20. Not sure what to use in epics.

Armor & shield: medium armor + heavy shield most of the time; heavy armor + tower shield for max defenses if they're druid-compatible. E.g., Shadow Guardian + Demonic Slab maybe?

[elvesunited]

I'm at a loss for bear

--- A short rage that doesn't have enough uses to viable in even short quests
--- A self heal ability ( Spirit Renewal ) that has a usage requirement that isn't practical.
--- A subpar glancing blow that requires turning off all benefits from Nature Defense and Ursa Protector first.
--- Stacking killer instinct requiring constant casting of low damage spells but no way to offset sp drain with temp sp.
--- No strength option iin Ursa Protector but an MRR option that pales in comparison to a tier 1 ability.
--- Weak damage that barely scales from Lightning strikes the mountain and Tremor.

[rant]
Bear is a tease! A fake out!
It give rage only to weaken it in a way to make it worthless.
It gives glancing blow only to nerf it and then cripple you when you use it.
It gives killer instinct only to then not provide the means to cast the spells needed to maintain it.

Over and over it gives some power only to do something else that renders that power impotent!

I've got no pure Bear Druid build. The best I can come up with is to Tier 5 in Kensei and Tier 4 in Stalwart Defender.
At least the fighter enhancements won't bleed you dry of sp!

But nature protector? It's a splash tree for elementals and wolves. and nothing else.
[/rant]

[Maelodic]

I haven't had much access to a decent computer - but did anybody test the Dragonborn breath augmentations with Cold Breath? Relentless Breath on the low cooldown no save cold spell that you can cast for free after a crit looks *really* tasty.

Also, still no idea on the DC calculation for Howl. It's such a good ability- and is always off cooldown.

It's also really tempting for that temp HP T5 in Herald to do a 41 NW / 39 SH caster using Essence as an SP battery; Howl, Glacial Wrath, and Earthquake for amazing CC; and have enemies sit your storm and beat the tar out of them with your "SLA" which is just flame blade in wolf form spamming cold breath when Essence pops.

Lots of ideas buzzing, really excited about this self-healing hybrid puppy. Hopefully I'll have my computer back up before the next lamannia test.

[unbongwah]

but did anybody test the Dragonborn breath augmentations with Cold Breath?

I did not, but I would be really surprised if it did, since Dragon Breath has always been its own thing and Augmented Breath is clearly meant to apply only to Dragon Breath attacks. Druid Cold Breath is still just a spell despite the word "breath" in the name.

Of course, how things ought to work and how they actually work ain't always the same thing in DDO so

It's also really tempting for that temp HP T5 in Herald to do a 41 NW / 39 SH caster using Essence as an SP battery

I considered this, but it meant no APs for NP. +20 PRR / +28 MRR for 6 APs on an otherwise squishy build is too good to pass up, IMO.

[Maelodic]

I did not, but I would be really surprised if it did, since Dragon Breath has always been its own thing and Augmented Breath is clearly meant to apply only to Dragon Breath attacks. Druid Cold Breath is still just a spell despite the word "breath" in the name.

Of course, how things ought to work and how they actually work ain't always the same thing in DDO so

IIRC it was catagorized as a breath attack previously and benefitted from bonuses to DC from breath attacks. I wasn't able to test the dragonborn enhancement but I was able to determine that the DC was being added so I'll have to test next run of previews.

I considered this, but it meant no APs for NP. +20 PRR / +28 MRR for 6 APs on an otherwise squishy build is too good to pass up, IMO.

Yeah... and having 200-300 extra temp HP is probably not worth it over the tankyness - the 300 temp HP from NW will probably go just as far with an extra bit of beefyness.

[Silverleafeon]

Added Aasimar / Scourge racial path
& option +2 Wis from Protector Tree path (which might suit Hybrid Builds)
enhancement trees

Added Season's Herald Enhancement choice picks with options.

[Silverleafeon]

IIRC it was catagorized as a breath attack previously and benefitted from bonuses to DC from breath attacks.

Yes.

Still prefer Aasimar Lay on Hands > Dragonborn breath extras for a Caster build, however a hybrid wolf build might prefer dragonborn.

[unbongwah]

IIRC it was catagorized as a breath attack previously and benefitted from bonuses to DC from breath attacks.

Really? Okay, that's surprising but it could be...cool.

Does Memory of Flight work in animal forms? I'm picturing a DB druid which flies around in doggo form breathing frost. Because we know wolves with wings are a thing amirite?