Arcanotechnician and Inquisitive?

[Marshal_Lannes]

I'm pulling together some ideas for an artificer PL and was wondering if anyone had tried running one using both the inquisitive tree and arcanotechnician giving you access to both strong spellcasting and ranged DPS? You'd want at least 30 APs in each tree and both the T5s are good so you're forced to make a difficult choice. AT gives Lightning Motes SLA, 20 electric spell power, +3 evo DCs, and charged recoil. All are fairly essential for an arty caster. T5 Inq gives No Holds Barred, 10 ranged power, and 30% alacrity. Those take your xbows to submachine gun level. Still, I would lean toward AT. Pick up INT to hit from Harper and that's about all your APs.

In comparison, if I went pure AT I'd splash in Feydark so I'd have greater color spray but then you're sitting around with a lot of excess APs with not much to spend them on. Pure Inquisitive I'd go Battle Engineer and that does increase your xbow DPS but for the price of giving up all your viable casting? Doesn't seem worth it to me.

Feats might get a bit compressed. Having to fit in both casting and xbow feats might be tough. For those used to building artys, could they be squeezed in?

In terms of gear, obviously, both hands are taken up by xbows but the Ravenloft belt comes in handy here giving you electric spell power and lore. I'm sure this hybrid would work just fine in heroics but I'm uncertain what would happen in epics. What ED would I run in? Epics tend to reward an all-or-nothing approach and would I have spread myself a bit too thin?

[cru121]

I like pure Arcanotechnician with caster stick and shield; with AP in Feydark (for force SLAs) and Renegade Mastermaker (for cure SLAs and some tankiness); kinda wannabe tanky DC caster / healer.
I don't like crossbows on my arcanotechnicians, except in the first few levels. Later, it's Color Spray > Blast Rod and move to next group.
I've also done one life with 41 AP in Feydark Illusionist.. not great, but you have pink BB so that's something. For novelty.. Can splash barb for run speed.

[hit_fido]

I see minimal, if any, benefit from arcanotech + inquisitive.

Using repeaters from 1 through 6-8 is stronger than Inquisitive + dual crossbow at those levels.

After the spell adjustments many of the AOE SLA are super good and much faster than plinking away with a ranged weapon one mob at a time in the mid levels. Once you can get SLA blast rod and plain blast rod you can combine them to clear groups of mobs. You'll want to spend feats on metamagic to max out the SLA effectiveness instead of stuff like rapid shot which is a comparatively much weaker increase to your ranged DPS than adding maximize or empower is for your SLA spell DPS. So about the time you might have switched to dual crossbows at level 8, you could start using your meta'd SLA's instead.

For a pure artificer you could have gotten IPS at level 15 which is the same level you could take a 6th level spell like tactical detonation. Are you going to waste time fiddling around with packs of mobs trying to line up IPS to hit 2-3 targets at a time at a -20% damage penalty or just group them, knock them over with tac det and mop up with a couple blast rods? Way faster with AOE spells.

I really really enjoy the artificer play style but repeaters are almost the worst ranged weapon choice past the early levels (worse now even than bows, but better than throwing hammers and throwing axes at least), IPS was weakened across all ranged options, and things have just swung back far enough that I don't think repeaters make any sense if you have a build with meta'd SLA AOE damage options like a pure or almost pure artificer could have. That said, I could see maybe spending only 24 points in battle engineer to unlock endless fusilade and using it with a great crossbow for certain encounters.

[Marshal_Lannes]

I guess the reason I'm considering dabbling into xbow use is for red names. You are correct SLA AOE clears out rooms but they really struggle against red names in higher heroic reaper and epics. I was thinking maybe an xbow would at least alleviate some of the pain casters run into facing red names.

[hit_fido]

I guess the reason I'm considering dabbling into xbow use is for red names. You are correct SLA AOE clears out rooms but they really struggle against red names in higher heroic reaper and epics. I was thinking maybe an xbow would at least alleviate some of the pain casters run into facing red names.

If you go pure or mostly pure you'll always be able to use deadly weapons, insightful damage spell and respec enhancements for 24 BE to get endless fusillade if you feel like that is necessary to help beat down bags of hp. Personally I don't think you'll need it at least for heroics. But I would definitely pass on investment into inquisitive for that purpose.

Another place to put spare AP is into warforged or dragonborn trees which to me are the two best choices for picking up an arcanotech based artificer class past life...

[unbongwah]

I guess the reason I'm considering dabbling into xbow use is for red names. You are correct SLA AOE clears out rooms but they really struggle against red names in higher heroic reaper and epics. I was thinking maybe an xbow would at least alleviate some of the pain casters run into facing red names.

I mean if you really want to give it a shot (haha) you could try something like 41 AT / 31 Inq / 8 Harper; the upside being Inq crit bonus is in the level 12 core not tier-5+capstone like BE. But it seems like without tier-5s + capstone, Inq loses a lot of its epic juice. So maybe reverse that as 41 Inq / 31 AT / 8 Harper. But then the question becomes: does the caster DPS you gain from AT make up for the ranged DPS you're losing from not having e.g. tier-4 BE + more Harper?

Also even with Arty bonus feats, you're a bit feat-constrained if going for ranged + caster DPS. One of the main downsides to Arty SLAs is their low MCL, so it seems like you pretty much have to take Master of Artifice if you want to continue using them in epics. But then you also want Combat Archery + Overwhelming Critical for ranged DPS, so now you're down to one epic feat to spare.

I like hybrid builds but I feel like the meta pushes you into specializing, especially if high Reapers or endgame is your focus.

[hit_fido]

I like hybrid builds but I feel like the meta pushes you into specializing, especially if high Reapers or endgame is your focus.

This is a good way to put it.

If your goal was to play a hybrid arcanotech / crossbow character and actively switch between spellcasting and ranged because you think that would make the game play fun and interesting (I do), go for it. The thing with DDO difficulty settings is you can use them to get the play experience you want with almost any kind of build. If your build is unoptimized or unspecialized or gimp as some might say and you can't run higher settings, who cares, run at the difficulty that keeps your build and the gameplay mechanics you want to experience feeling balanced against the challenge.

But if your goal is specifically to run the toughest content then you really have to make build choices that cater to that goal.

[Marshal_Lannes]

Also even with Arty bonus feats, you're a bit feat-constrained if going for ranged + caster DPS. One of the main downsides to Arty SLAs is their low MCL, so it seems like you pretty much have to take Master of Artifice if you want to continue using them in epics. But then you also want Combat Archery + Overwhelming Critical for ranged DPS, so now you're down to one epic feat to spare.

I like hybrid builds but I feel like the meta pushes you into specializing, especially if high Reapers or endgame is your focus.

Yes, it would be a tight fit. I'm playing a spellsinger now and I suspect the AT will run into the same issues from 20-23 that I did before I got Master of Music. SS DPS is night and day before MoM and after in epics. Of course, I can be a buffbot from 20-23 and no one cares while an AT doesn't have quite that same luxury. So I'm thinking Inquisitive carries me through the first 5 or 6 heroic levels (although a solid point was made about repeaters here) and the first three epic levels. I'm not going to be spending months with the build but I will be doing a round of R6+ Legendaries at cap. I'll have to map out feats since those are the hard things to change. Enhancements are easy I could always dump trees if they aren't working out.

If you go pure or mostly pure you'll always be able to use deadly weapons, insightful damage spell and respec enhancements for 24 BE to get endless fusillade if you feel like that is necessary to help beat down bags of hp. Personally I don't think you'll need it at least for heroics. But I would definitely pass on investment into inquisitive for that purpose.

Another place to put spare AP is into warforged or dragonborn trees which to me are the two best choices for picking up an arcanotech based artificer class past life...

I'm going Half-Elf with warlock dilettante. Maybe the 24 into BE is the way to go. Could always fall back onto something like Epic Fatal Flaw then. Might also allow me to skip the IC feats.

If my feat breakdown looks like this - what am I missing?

1 - Rapid reload
3 - Maximize
4 - Point blank shot
6 - Spell Focus Evocation
8 - Construct Essence
12 - Empower
12 - Quicken
15 - Precise shot
16 - Improved Construct Essence
18 - IPS
20 - Shot on the Run? (Rapid Shot seems bugged with xbows)

[Caarb]

Rapid Reload is an Arti Freebie

[Marshal_Lannes]

Right you are! I can then move Maximize up to 1 and now have semi-open feat slots at 3 and 20.

[hit_fido]

I'm going Half-Elf with warlock dilettante. Maybe the 24 into BE is the way to go. Could always fall back onto something like Epic Fatal Flaw then. Might also allow me to skip the IC feats.

If my feat breakdown looks like this - what am I missing?

I'd try something more like this with the belief that you'll end up finding that the SLA AOE damage approach is superior for clearing mobs and progressing the quest quickly:

.1. . . . : Point Blank Shot
.3. . . . : Precise Shot
.4 Arti . : Maximize Spell
.6. . . . : Empower Spell
.8 Arti . : Quicken Spell
.9. . . . : Spell Focus: Evocation
12. . . . : Construct Essence
12 Arti . : Improved Construct Essence
15. . . . : Improved Critical: Ranged
16 Arti . : Heighten (or Rapid Shot)
18. . . . : Greater Spell Focus: Evocation (or Precision)
20 Arti . : Enlarge or Empower Healing (or Improved Precise Shot)

That way you get your full construct essence all at level 12; for me point blank shot and precise shot are the two most important early ranged feats - if you're playing reaper you definitely want to be able to hard target and hit the biggest threat even if it's behind other mobs. So you'll have a pleasant ranged experience up until your dual blast rods kick in and by then you'll have the SLAs max/empowered. By level 15 you can decide for yourself whether you need more ranged feats like rapid shot and IPS, vs more spell feats...

By the way I hope you know the warlock dilettante was "fixed" so it now only applies the advertised +1d4 fire damage instead of the +1d4 per caster level scaling with spell power. It still only applies to one target for your AOE spells too, not all of them in the area of effect.

[Marshal_Lannes]

By the way I hope you know the warlock dilettante was "fixed" so it now only applies the advertised +1d4 fire damage instead of the +1d4 per caster level scaling with spell power. It still only applies to one target for your AOE spells too, not all of them in the area of effect.

This was working as of April. It has changed in the last month? Where are you getting your source for that?

[hit_fido]

This was working as of April. It has changed in the last month? Where are you getting your source for that?

For example: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...stealth-nerfed

[Marshal_Lannes]

Hmm, that doesn't seem definitive without actual Dev citation. I will likely try it for myself at some point. Although might be leaning toward Drow since they get +2 in the 3 main arty areas Dex (ranged), INT (spells), and CHA (UMD)

[Caarb]

Hmm, that doesn't seem definitive without actual Dev citation. I will likely try it for myself at some point. Although might be leaning toward Drow since they get +2 in the 3 main arty areas Dex (ranged), INT (spells), and CHA (UMD)

I believe it was stealth nerfed with this 48.5 change:

Enhancements
Half Elf Warlock Dilettante can no longer sometimes erroneously kill allies.

But I havent tested it myself

[unbongwah]

Hmm, that doesn't seem definitive without actual Dev citation.

You mean this dev confirmation?

Apologies; that bugfix was meant for a future patch, and got brought along with Update 48 Patch 5's "Half Elf Warlock Dilettante can no longer sometimes erroneously kill allies" change. Will see about getting it added to that patch's release notes.

[Marshal_Lannes]

You mean this dev confirmation?

What bug fix? I don't understand the context from the snippet. And has anyone here actually tried it or is this all hearsay?

[Nugaot]

What bug fix? I don't understand the context from the snippet. And has anyone here actually tried it or is this all hearsay?

Protip: if you click the blue arrow button next to the name in a quote it will link directly to the thread and post for context.

[Marshal_Lannes]

Interesting thread on racials and half-elves. Well, looks like that buries them. Heavily leaning drow now. Maybe halfing. Being a cheeky halfing that shoots and blows up everything sounds sort of fun.

[kmoustakas]

Generally speaking, once you get blast rod SLA you don't need to ever fire a crossbow of any kind ever again. It does a ton of damage. Then you get lightning bolt SLA and it's all over. All this before the removal of lightning immunity and chain lightning being added to your spells not to mention now sphere and the tier1 SLA also do some damage as well.

I'm not saying you can't do arcanotechnician and inquisitive, I'm saying there is little point as the lightning damage was so strong and it got buffed now. Sharn might be a bit annoying with all the evasion but that's a DC issue.