On player consolidation

[mikarddo]

In my opinion DDO has a significant issue with not funneling a high enough concentration of the small(er) playerbase into being ready to play the same content at the same time.

- Players come from different timezones
- Several servers
- Having alts is rather inefficient with the many ways of earning past lives, making playing more than 1 or a few characters much less likely to happen
- Thus players are spread out in level (and need/want to be approximately the same level to play together)
- Many difficulties (hard, elite, reaper 1-10)

Wrt consolidation I think the single most elegant solution would be pretty controversial but fairly effective.
* Make past lives of all kinds as well as reaper xp account shared on all characters *

With such a change I could have a sizeable stable of alts ready to play at just about any level at just about any time without feeling inefficient. Whenever I logged in I could check if friends were online doing something and join them nomatter the level. I could also check the LFM for raids or other interesting groups going on and join - again regardless of level. If nothing was going on I could start something at any level knowing that pretty mucn anyone online would infact be able to join in should they want to - not just the few people within level range. Concerning BtC raid loot I could and would simply use the same "main" character at level 30 running raids where I care about the loot.

I could see myself having 10-15 characters that I would be playing actively. Maybe 2-3 placed at level 30 for high end play with the rest being spread out in levels, classes, races and iconics effectively earning towards reaper xp and/or past lives on my "main(s)" nomatter which one I did play on. Compare with today where I have 1-2 characters - one in the TR hamster wheel earning past lives and one is semi-active at level 29 (should be 30 soon).

I would certainly play more, have more fun doing so, and would expect more chances of someone to group with (friends or pugs) from such a change. I guess monetization could be an issue as it would reduce the value to Ottos boxes and to a degreee xp pots as the need to get back to 30 fast again would be gone/lessened. I am certain that could be figured out though and that the increase of being able to find groups would go a good way towards compensating financially as well as more people would be playing more often. Also, the people who want many past lives fast would still need boxes and pots to do so.

I sincerely believe that such a change would be very beneficial to DDO by making grouping more viable.

[OfElectricMen]

Hi!

I have 28 alts and feel very efficient.

Are you sure this isn't a "you" problem and not a "DDO" problem?

[Thrudh]

I have 28 alts and feel very efficient.

You're not efficient. You might have convinced me with 5 alts, maybe even 10 alts, but 28 alts? 1 day a month per character.

[Ralmeth]

I think there are multiple issues in DDO that prevent people from grouping, when they feel inclined to group up. The issue is that there are too many systems in place that limit what quests you might want to run.

• Bravery Bonus
• Favor
• XP penalties from not being at the optimal level of the quest
• Etc.

As the developers think about their plans for the upcoming year, I hope one of the things they decide to work on is a serious review of all of these systems, to see what would make sense to update in order tear down the walls of limiting what quests people want to run. I won't rehash these yet again, because that's already been done, but in an ideal world we should be able to look at the LFM panel and want to run in any quest on the LFM panel within a particular level range.

[Memnir]

* Make past lives of all kinds as well as reaper xp account shared on all characters *

No.

[Mofus]

I would rather see them have a way to do cross server lfm's and grouping. That would allow players from all servers to join any lfm and be instanced together for the quest duration. Not sure if this is possible or not, but just a thought.

[Uska]

I would rather see them have a way to do cross server lfm's and grouping. That would allow players from all servers to join any lfm and be instanced together for the quest duration. Not sure if this is possible or not, but just a thought.

I don’t see it being possible there is lots of issues when they do character transfers now

[Matuse]

Players being spread out is an unavoidable consequence of gearing the game towards mass repeated reincarnations.

But sharing past lives is a terrible idea.

[mikarddo]

Players being spread out is an unavoidable consequence of gearing the game towards mass repeated reincarnations.

But sharing past lives is a terrible idea.

I obviously respect that your opinion differs from mine. Seeing I posted the reasons why I think the idea would good - might you post your reasoning why it would not?

[erethizon]

Players being spread out is an unavoidable consequence of gearing the game towards mass repeated reincarnations.

But sharing past lives is a terrible idea.

The main issue is grouping mechanics. They got one single thing right when they made it so that a level 20 and a level 30 could group together in epic quests with no penalty, but they still only got it half right because the level 30 will prevent Bravery Bonus unless the quest is level 26 or higher so you still have to avoid higher level people when running most of the content the first time.

And then they added reaper. This took everything they had done to make grouping possible and made it so much worse. We now have more restrictive level enforcement in groups than ever before and it is the reason why most LFM's I see for reaper have only 2 people in them. Widening the level range that is allow to group with each other without hurting experience (or reaper experience) would be of huge help in allowing people to play together.

[SirValentine]

I would rather see them have a way to do cross server lfm's and grouping. That would allow players from all servers to join any lfm and be instanced together for the quest duration.

Yes, that.

Avoids the various issues from actually "merging servers" that people always talk about whenever the topic is raised, and actually addresses the lack of population on any given server in a way sharing PLs can't.

[Uska]

No.

I agree with you

[Pyed-Pyper]

....
Wrt consolidation I think the single most elegant solution would be pretty controversial but fairly effective.
* Make past lives of all kinds as well as reaper xp account shared on all characters *
.....
I sincerely believe that such a change would be very beneficial to DDO by making grouping more viable.

Power creep is (part of) the problem you are describing. Piling on more power creep is not the solution to power creep.

The power creep, from PLs, from p2w, from everywhere, needs to be addressed. For that to happen, there needs to be a strong sense of PvE balance, so that a well-built first-life character has a reasonable chance of success in quests.

I'm pretty sure that isn't going to happen. I'm pretty sure the game-plan is something along the lines of what we've seen pushed in the recent past (e.g. the jacked-up plans for TU) - convert everything to a scalable DPS equivalent, and use power creep to drive store sales.

[Enerdhil]

Power creep is (part of) the problem you are describing. Piling on more power creep is not the solution to power creep.

The power creep, from PLs, from p2w, from everywhere, needs to be addressed. For that to happen, there needs to be a strong sense of PvE balance, so that a well-built first-life character has a reasonable chance of success in quests.

I'm pretty sure that isn't going to happen. I'm pretty sure the game-plan is something along the lines of what we've seen pushed in the recent past (e.g. the jacked-up plans for TU) - convert everything to a scalable DPS equivalent, and use power creep to drive store sales.

This. My personal experience tells me that many of my friends left the game not because they couldn't grind stuff for all their alts, but because even their main characters had to grind perks for a few years before they could catch up with top players. Thats why i'm against sharing PLs/rxp etc. I can understand point of view of people who would like to play efficiently with multiple characters/playing styles, but i think reducing distance between new characters and characters with all past lifes/eds/items/tomes etc. is a better solution than forcing new players to long grind to catch up with playerbase, no matter how many characters they could use for that grind. Call me a noob, but it took me 6 years to finish gathering all heroic past lifes and i consider myself as a player who is playing a lot and almost only with main char (though i must admit i never spend tp on xp boost or duped xp potions).

[Iriale]

This. My personal experience tells me that many of my friends left the game not because they couldn't grind stuff for all their alts, but because even their main characters had to grind perks for a few years before they could catch up with top players. Thats why i'm against sharing PLs/rxp etc. I can understand point of view of people who would like to play efficiently with multiple characters/playing styles, but i think reducing distance between new characters and characters with all past lifes/eds/items/tomes etc. is a better solution than forcing new players to long grind to catch up with playerbase, no matter how many characters they could use for that grind. Call me a noob, but it took me 6 years to finish gathering all heroic past lifes and i consider myself as a player who is playing a lot and almost only with main char (though i must admit i never spend tp on xp boost or duped xp potions).

But having several capable alts helps not to burn you so soon. Being all the time in reincarnations without seeing the end is incredibly boring and many people burn. On the other hand, when you have several characters, the game is much more varied. There is a raid, you change an epic character and you do it. There is a group of some quests that you like, you change to another character and you do it. Your guild wants to play anything, you join. A friends needs help, you change to an alt and help him. And when there's nothing like that, you change into the character in which you're making heroic lives, and you enjoy the change of pace and perspective.

I've been doing this for years, and it really helped that the game did not feel repetitive. But since the introduction of the rxp trees (god, how I hate them, but at this point is impossible to remove them) and the racial grind, everything has changed. The alts are getting weaker and it is impossible to keep them up to date. It also did not help that the slavers crafting was so grindy; oh, it's bta, but different classes need different statistics, so I could not farm for all my alts without feeling my head explode in the process. Oh, I do not doubt that a few players have been able to make racials with two characters, but for most mortals, this grind is too much, simply too much, and more in addition to everything that there was before.

Yes, a big part of the problem is that lately all we have obtained from the designers is grind, grind, grind. And it has been a bad thing for the game. But there is still a serious problem for the alts. At least the last two systems, which should never have been created as such, should be account-based. For the sake of our sanity. Because although I would love that those systems were eliminated, devs can not do it at this point. It's too late.

And I sincerely hope that designers do not create more grind in the game in the short term!! No more past lives, please, no more systems designed for a single character like RPX, please. Players have a tolerance limit!

[mikarddo]

But having several capable alts helps not to burn you so soon. Being all the time in reincarnations without seeing the end is incredibly boring and many people burn. On the other hand, when you have several characters, the game is much more varied. There is a raid, you change an epic character and you do it. There is a group of some quests that you like, you change to another character and you do it. Your guild wants to play anything, you join. A friends needs help, you change to an alt and help him. And when there's nothing like that, you change into the character in which you're making heroic lives, and you enjoy the change of pace and perspective.

I've been doing this for years, and it really helped that the game did not feel repetitive. But since the introduction of the rxp trees (god, how I hate them, but at this point is impossible to remove them) and the racial grind, everything has changed. The alts are getting weaker and it is impossible to keep them up to date.

So very well put. I really think the current state where keeping even one alt let alone several up to date has become a lost cause is quite detrimental to the game.

If the suggestion to make all PL and RXP account shared is too much - and it might be - then please consider this:
- Heroic, Iconic and Epic past lives are not shared
- Racial past lives and reaper xp is shared by characters on the same account that have each bought and used a "Stone of linked memories: 4995 ddo points". By using such a tome all current and future racial PL and rxp on those characters are shared fully.

By doing it this way keeping an alt up to date is still a commitment both in time as you might want heroic/iconic/epic past lives and in money as you need to buy the stone for that alt. I believe this would keep a reasonable balance between cost, convinience and commitment. Thus alts would be viable without being automatically so and hence still have their unique feel.

Further, it would add sales of these stones and still sell Ottos boxes for heroic lives for alts. So my guess is it would be an increase in income initially and not a loss in the longer term.

[the_one_dwarfforged]

grouping should be incentivized by giving people what they want: xp.

xp bonus for party members other than yourself already exists in game, just needs to be permanent and magnitude increased to make it worthwhile to sometimes wait for a group to fill or to have 5 randoms who die constantly and dont actually help complete the quest.

15-20% xp bonus per person seem like itd encourage grouping pretty handily.