Build help for an unarmed DC build

[Hiro_Nogano]

So I have been working with a guild mate to plan out my Monk life. (Life #6 - Cleric, Bard, Sorcerer, Rogue, and Barbarian previous.) I think I want to do a DC focused unarmed monk. My thoughts were to build it 12/6/2 monk/fighter/warlock. Warlock for the quality of life that having access to shield and UMD brings (plus some light synergy), fighter for access to the Kensai tree, and monk for obvious reasons. I was also thinking about going Dwarf for their racial Tactics options. My stat block would look something like this:
Str 8
Dex 16
Con 16
Int 14
Wis 18
Cha 6

My problem is that I suck at doing the best breakdown of when to take what class levels. I am pretty sure that I want my first 3 levels to be monk, so that I can get access to PoHB: Fists of Light ASAP. After that, I was thinking of taking warlock and then fighter, but I am not sure how to optimize my build. Feat wise, I was planning to take the following in my first few levels:
Two Weapon Fighting
Stunning Fist
Precision
PoHB:FoL

After that, i am at a loss. I can wing it, but I would appreciate some help maximizing/streamlining the build. Basically, I don't want to ever have to worry about my DCs of my special attacks not being good enough. I would like to work ITWF, WF, and IC in if possible. Maybe Shuriken Expertise. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

[Vish]

So I have been working with a guild mate to plan out my Monk life. (Life #6 - Cleric, Bard, Sorcerer, Rogue, and Barbarian previous.) I think I want to do a DC focused unarmed monk. My thoughts were to build it 12/6/2 monk/fighter/warlock. Warlock for the quality of life that having access to shield and UMD brings (plus some light synergy), fighter for access to the Kensai tree, and monk for obvious reasons. I was also thinking about going Dwarf for their racial Tactics options. My stat block would look something like this:
Str 8
Dex 16
Con 16
Int 14
Wis 18
Cha 6

My problem is that I suck at doing the best breakdown of when to take what class levels. I am pretty sure that I want my first 3 levels to be monk, so that I can get access to PoHB: Fists of Light ASAP. After that, I was thinking of taking warlock and then fighter, but I am not sure how to optimize my build. Feat wise, I was planning to take the following in my first few levels:
Two Weapon Fighting
Stunning Fist
Precision
PoHB:FoL

After that, i am at a loss. I can wing it, but I would appreciate some help maximizing/streamlining the build. Basically, I don't want to ever have to worry about my DCs of my special attacks not being good enough. I would like to work ITWF, WF, and IC in if possible. Maybe Shuriken Expertise. Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks in advance.

If this is a heroic build, if epic go pure,
I would go warlock at 1 to get Umd as class skill
Then 6 monk
Stats are good.
You need something like this
1 warlock CE
2 monk dodge
3 monk stunning fist
Feat mobility
4 fighter twf
5-6 monk spring attack
7-8 monk whirlwind
9 ftr ic blunt

Not sure spring attack check bab on that
Same for ic blunt
Depends on tomes
But that kind of progression
15 and 18 for itwf and gtwf
Leaves 12 open
And whatever for other ftr levels
Maybe go cleaves, but str too low for pa, so...

Wraps max wis all points into wisdom will have good DCs
Go tier 5 Shintao

[peng]

The starter guide to unarmed monks: https://www.ddo.com/forums/showthrea...nk-build-guide

Whirlwind attack is pretty awesome unarmed, as it hits all around you twice, once with offhand/doublestrike chances, once without. A pure monk or a monk/fighter split can get twf at level 1 and whirlwind at lvl 6.

I'm partial to pure monk unless going for other past lives, but fighter can complement monk pretty well. You might want to consider a fvs splash instead of warlock, as it's about to get a version of divine might that gives half wisdom bonus to damage and tactics DCs. You'd get nightshield instead of shield, and no umd boost, but your DCs would improve.

The big decision on a multiclass unarmed, is whether to go for t5 in shintao or kensei. Kensei keen edge was still bugged to not work with wraps last time I checked, so shintao t5 has a better crit profile, but kensei has more melee power. My vote would be shintao. However, if you have 12 fighter levels, then kensei is probably better for power surge.

Another thing to consider is that ap can be pretty tight. 30+ ap in your t5 tree, 11 recommended in both ninja spy (25% incorp) and henshin (30 melee power, 9 prr), 6 in stalwart (25 prr), 8 in harper for know the angles (or 4 in the new war soul tree for divine will), 8 in dwarf for +3 tactics. That's 70-74 ap before spending any on t5 enhancements, and only including 1 of either shintao OR kensei.

Here's a potential build. Note there weren't enough ap to get all the tactics from both dwarf and kensei, so I went human for an extra feat and skill points. And it only takes 2 enhancements from shintao t5.

unarmed multiclass
13/6/1 Monk/Fighter/Favored Soul
Lawful Neutral Human


Level Order

1. Monk . . . . . .6. Fighter . . . .11. Fighter. . . . 16. Monk
2. Monk . . . . . .7. Favored Soul. .12. Monk. . . . . .17. Monk
3. Monk . . . . . .8. Monk . . . . . 13. Monk . . . . . 18. Monk
4. Fighter . . . . 9. Monk. . . . . .14. Monk. . . . . .19. Fighter
5. Monk . . . . . 10. Fighter . . . .15. Fighter. . . . 20. Monk


Stats
. . . . . . . .36pt . . Tome . . Level Up
. . . . . . . .---- . . ---- . . --------
Strength. . . . .8. . . .+4. . . .4: WIS
Dexterity . . . 16. . . .+4. . . .8: WIS
Constitution. . 14. . . .+4. . . 12: WIS
Intelligence. . 12. . . .+4. . . 16: WIS
Wisdom. . . . . 18. . . .+4. . . 20: WIS
Charisma. . . . .8. . . .+4. . . 24: WIS
. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28: WIS

Skills
. . . . .Mo Mo Mo Fi Mo Fi Fv Mo Mo Fi Fi Mo Mo Mo Fi Mo Mo Mo Fi Mo
. . . . . 1. 2. 3. 4 .5 .6. 7 .8 .9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
Concent . 4. 1. 1. . .2 . . . .3 .1 . . . .3 .1 .1 . . 2. 1. 1. . .2 .23
Heal. . . 2. . .1 .½. . .1. 5 .1½ ½. 1 .1½ 1 .1 . . 2 .1 .1 . . 2 .1 .23
Balance . 4. 1. 1. . .2 . . . .1 .3 . . . .2 .2 .1 . . 2. 1. 1. . .2 .23
Hide. . . 4. 1. 1. . .2 . . . . . 2. . . . . . . 5. . .2 .2 .2 . . 2. 23
UMD . . . 2. . . . 1½. . 1 . . . . . 1½ 1 . . 1. . .1. . .1 . . 1 . . 11
Move Si . 3. 2. 1. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 4. . . . 10
Swim. . . . .1 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1
Tumble. . 1. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1
. . . . .------------------------------------------------------------
. . . . .24. 6. 6. 4 .6 .4. 5 .7 .7 .5. 5 .7 .7 .7 .6. 8. 8. 8. 6 .8


Feats

.1. . . . : Two Weapon Fighting
.1 Human. : Dodge
.1 Monk . : Mobility
.2 Monk . : Stunning Fist
.3. . . . : Precision
.3 Monk . : Path of Harmonious Balance
.4 Fighter: Combat Expertise
.6. . . . : Spring Attack
.6 Fighter: Whirlwind Attack
.7 Deity. :
.9. . . . : Improved Two Weapon Fighting
.9 Monk . : Ten Thousand Stars
11 Fighter: Improved Critical: Bludgeoning
12. . . . : Shuriken Expertise
15. . . . : Greater Two Weapon Fighting
18. . . . : Grandmaster of Forms
19 Fighter: Tactical Training
21 Epic . : Overwhelming Critical
24 Epic . : Improved Martial Arts
26 Destiny: Perfect Two Weapon Fighting
27 Epic . : Vorpal Strikes
28 Destiny: Tactician
29 Destiny: Dire Charge
30 Epic . : Epic Damage Reduction
30 Legend : Scion of: Astral Plane


Spells

Favored Soul

1. Nightshield, Divine Favor

Enhancements (80 AP)

Shintao (34 AP)

• Bastion of Purity, Protection from Tainted Creatures, Iron Hand, Argent Fist
  1. Difficulty at the Beginning, Deft Strikes III
  2. Restoring the Balance, Smite Tainted Creature, Iron Skin III, Unbalancing Strike, Conditioning II
  3. Lifting the Veil, Jade Strike, Dismissing Strike, Wisdom
  4. The Receptive Earth, Tomb of Jade, Wisdom
  5. Empty Hand Mastery, Kukan-Do

Kensei (11 AP)

• Kensei Focus: Martial Arts
  1. Extra Action Boost II
  2. Tactics III

Ninja Spy (11 AP)

• Basic Ninja Training, Advanced Ninja Training, Shadow Veil
  1. Stealthy III, Sneak Attack Training
  2. Melee/Ranged Power Boost III

Henshin Mystic (11 AP)

• Riddle of Fire, Ki Bolt, Sounding Staff
  1. All-Consuming Flame, Negotiator I, Way of the: Patient Tortoise
  2. Winter's Touch, Knock on the Sky, Contemplation I

Stalwart Defender (6 AP)

• Toughness, Stalwart Defense
  1. Item Defense I, Durable Defense III

Warpriest (4 AP)

• Smite Foe
  1. Divine Might III

Human (3 AP)

• Damage Boost
  1. Improved Recovery

Destiny (24 AP)

Legendary Dreadnought

1. Legendary Tactics III, Extra Action Boost III, Constitution
2. Imp. Combat Expertise
3. Critical Damage III, Haste Boost III
4. (none)
5. Advancing Blows, Devastating Critical
6. Master's Blitz, Pulverizer

Twists of Fate (31 fate points)

1. Sense Weakness (Tier 4 Fury)
2. Balanced Attacks (Tier 3 Primal)
3. Dance of Flowers (Tier 1 Flowers)
4. Rejuvenation Cocoon (Tier 1 Primal)
5. Purge the Wicked (Tier 1 Crusader)

[AzureDragonas]

Can post breakdown feats/skills/gear later today.

[Vish]

Peng,
Why do you go fvs and take divine might,
On a str dump stat build?
Or I guess you might take the new wisdom enh...
Divine will
Does that work on less than half level fvs??

He wanted Umd. Warlock at 1.

[DrawingGuy]

Vish, Divine Will indeed has no FvS check just like Divine Might never did. This makes a 1 FvS splash the highest potential for Monk DCs. However on a level split that does not get Quivering Palm, the DC bonus is overkill and is more for the WIS bonus to Damage.

Personally going for a max DC unarmed Monk, I'd do 18 Monk (so you can still get the 10 MP/+1[W] core along with max run speed bonus and all bypasses) / 1 FvS / 1 Fighter or 1 Wizard or 1 Rogue. 1 Fighter gives the feat and cheap access to Haste boost. 1 Wizard gives +10% AC and shield spell for tank builds. 1 Rogue would give the UMD you are looking for along with trapping. While Divine Will would more than makes up for the 2[W] and +4 WIS loss from the capstone, it would not make up for the 25MP loss nor Meditation of War bonuses, so would be a DPS loss.

[Dalsheel]

OP, whatever build you choose to do, do not go for maxWIS when creating the character and do not put your level ups in WIS either. At least not all of them. Monks are melee characters and they need a good damaging stat.

On heroics your DCs will be just fine if you start with 16 Wis and put 2 level ups in it.

Boost your damaging stat with the rest of your build points at character creation and the rest of your level ups. You won't regret it.
Stunning an enemy means nothing if you can't kill him in the process. And you will be able to stun everything anyway.

Just the 2 cents of a long time monk enthusiast.

[JoeShmo]

OP, whatever build you choose to do, do not go for maxWIS when creating the character and do not put your level ups in WIS either. At least not all of them. Monks are melee characters and they need a good damaging stat.

On heroics your DCs will be just fine if you start with 16 Wis and put 2 level ups in it.

Boost your damaging stat with the rest of your build points at character creation and the rest of your level ups. You won't regret it.
Stunning an enemy means nothing if you can't kill him in the process. And you will be able to stun everything anyway.

Just the 2 cents of a long time monk enthusiast.

I have to respectfully disagree with this. As someone who has only played pure unarmed monk since 2009, the max WIS build with DEX as second highest, is most definitely the way to go. I am in no way a super geared/grinded out character (only have 2 TRs to get to 36 pt build) but I really have no problem killing mobs once they are stunned. At that point, if the gear is appropriate, and even more so if you're in Legendary Dreadnought, your damage on a helpless/stunned target explodes and they drop quick. I'm sure others may disagree, but I would have to say for an unarmed, pure monk build, that WIS > DEX is the way to go. Just my $0.02.

[Hiro_Nogano]

Thank you all for your input. I have a much better idea on how I will do this now. (I think)

[Amideus]

Can post breakdown feats/skills/gear later today.

I'd very much be interested in this. I'm also wondering if you think QP is worth consideration in maximizing the tactical DC's or not.

[DrawingGuy]

The effort it takes to get Quivering Palm to useful DCs will put your other DCs into no-fail range. It is indeed possible to get Quivering Palm into effective range, though it does take some sacrifice.

Taking a boost ability goes a long way to getting effective Quivering Palm. For that you have 3 options:

Cormyrean Knight Training: Apply 1/3 of your Charisma Modifier, but you must be using Short Sword or Long Sword to get this bonus while also having CHA be lower than STR. This option is not compatible with Unarmed Monks, and considering Monks have no abilities that utilize CHA that they care about (other than UMD, which you can get high enough with dump CHA), also does not play well with Monk. I consider this a dumb option since if you're going to make this much sacrifice to get an effective insta-kill, might as well play Bard.

Know the Angles: This is a great option to boost your DCs, and is a must for any pure monk building for an effective QP. However this does force a penalty of having yet another stat to care about, meaning you're spread thin and is difficult to get high. Even those that build INT secondary or main instead of DEX are still forced into DEX for feats, still making it tougher to invest. It does help that you don't need to keep your INT items equipped - swap them on and use KtA and then swap them back of for your optimal gear. Solid investment without making too crazy of a sacrifice should still net you 10-15 higher DCs (and bonus damage).

Divine Will: This ability is perfect for the fact that it uses your Wisdom, so requires no additional stat investment. Because of this, you can better min-max your WIS and achieve your highest DC potential. However it comes with a major caveat: you must splash FvS, which costs you capstone. There are other pros and cons, but for an unarmed build, it's a DPS loss no matter how you slice it. But you can indeed get more for that DPS loss than just DCs as it only takes 1 FvS: Feat + Haste Boost from 1 Fighter; Trapping, 1d6 SA, and UMD class stat from 1 Rogue; Trapping and lever puller from 1 Arti (very nice for soloers); 10% AC, meta, spells (shield, +10 jump, grease spell to annoy people with) from 1 Wiz. There are some pretty compelling splits out there.

[AzureDragonas]

I'd very much be interested in this. I'm also wondering if you think QP is worth consideration in maximizing the tactical DC's or not.

If you or anyone interested can PM with tome info, build is hard to make and hardly depends from tomes you got so I can make in charPlanner according to tomes you got all feat etc decisions, got +6 all tomes myself so can do hard invest in everything.

For palm, for me its beyond broken when used properly specially in heroics its no fail instakill with 6 sec CD and affect range so vast no assasin can compete.In epics I had base DC close to 90, which in high reaper R6+ legendary content worked pretty well. With so many no fail CC 120+ DC you just cc and cherry pick one by one.

edit: offnote just to mention how good DC monk can be, prior reincarnation with guildies we did chains on R4-5+, and best moment to show http://ddowiki.com/page/Subversion end boss we ranged boss to low hp from afar so as you know when boss hp lowers, mobs spawn, so moment DC was enough to clear entire room in one go, only couple mobs survived with DW, was hiting over 90 wisdom during moment.