Why PVP is dead?

[Inanout]

I would buy a pvp pit for my ship.

Also killing an iron defender in public is easy.

[Knobull]

False.

As someone who has never had a VIP subscription, I have no difficulty posting in any areas of the forums.

Not false.

Perhaps it is different for you since you were on the 2014 DDO Players Council?

My account is premium (has never been VIP) and for example I cannot post in the Classes section of the forum:



Note the lack of a "Post New Thread" button, also:

You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may edit your posts

Also see: http://ddowiki.com/page/Account_Comparisons under "Official forums" in the table, though it is not exactly correct, Premium (like this account) does not have full access to the forums. I suspect it works like support, where you have to have spent money in the last 30 days or whatever it was. (See a little further down on the ddowiki Account Comparisons page.)

Also note the section group title on the forum index - Free Discussion Forums, implying all the others are not:



So my guess either this rule was overridden on your account when you were a member of the PC or it works like support access? (even though nobody really gets support anymore)

I have not bought points on this account for adventure packs for ages. When was the last time you bought points?

So remember, keep your mind limber, be relaxed in your interactions with people and always abide.

Oh, and always post in General DDO Discussion regardless of what the subject is, so that others may participate in the discussion! (I never even read any of the other forum sections, since there is no point.)

[Wonedream]

False.

As someone who has never had a VIP subscription, I have no difficulty posting in any areas of the forums.

Well that is just plain comforting to know that a free player is saying PvP isn't worth it while a paying customer is saying it is...

[Wonedream]

Do your own research.

I have, it is shows a split community on the topic, with a majority and a minority.

Actually, yes, you do. That's not my opinion, that's the stated policy of SSG & Turbine before them.

Ok, aside from not insulting others, showing porn, trying to spam, or other obviously hideous stuff, I did not read anywhere "Players must strictly adhere to preferring PvE or they will be found guilty of anti-social fetishes"

Haven't done that. I've never called for it to be nerfed or removed from the game entirely. I've never denied it existed.

But it (literally!) has it's place, and this isn't it.

Well, if that place does work for anyone then I was misinformed. As to some of the things I say, I am not personally say you do, I am saying that it happens and I have seen it happen.

I was trying to touch on a bigger broader topic, that of how I have seen on many occasions people claim this is their safe haven from other games that appear to be more universal somehow in gathering a population... probably because anyone can enjoy the game for any reason.. such as PvP or PvE. Some of the things I have seen stated is that everyone in this community thinks the same way, and when someone shows up proving contrary, they say 1% or less and exxagerrate to manipulate perception and try to keep the game the way they like it. And despite this, the game never stays the way they like it, and every big update sees another mass protest from certain peoples.

3 lame rumors I hear (not from you, just that I hear them) "DDO is PvE and not for PvP" "DDO is about TRing" "Paper and Pen Core mechanics aren't really important"
DDO is whatever people make it to be. The developers did not make clear statements that they intend to add more PLs, or stray away from PnP further, or permanently abandon PvP so a few people who really care about seeing it destroyed can celebrate.

If I really were what you're accusing me of, I'd have joined the voices calling for the complete removal of PvP, instead of being in the, "Fine, let them have their fun, as long as they leave the rest of us out of it"-crowd.



I call'em like I see'em.

You may have taking the context out of place, a lot of what I said had nothing to do with accusing you and was referring to a plural generalized group. If you feel you are a part of that group (that says PvP has no place in DDO) then perhaps you feel the words describing you and don't like em without sugar? Sorry, the only way I think we can make this game great is if we can objectively look at it, and then ask if we are going for a narrow niche or a broad one? Do we want a game is gonna end up universally appealing to a broad audience, or a game that fits only a tiny fragment of society?

I want DDO to be as much fun as possible for ANYONE who plays it, not just those that like a particular aspect or two.

Do not under estimate the value of PvP, you (plural) could be KILLING the development of this game by doing so. And yes, now is not the time to update PvP, but I would strongly recommend considering a little and easy to do fix to at least add some balance to the place to see if perhaps it could find its own niche.

[SirValentine]

Not false.

Still false.

Perhaps it is different for you since you were on the 2014 DDO Players Council?

My account is premium (has never been VIP) and for example I cannot post in the Classes section of the forum

Nothing to do with it. I've been able to post just fine since I went from F2P to Premium in 2010.

If your account is bugged, you should put in a ticket.

...always post in General DDO Discussion regardless of what the subject is...

Worse idea ever. Why do you think they created all those other sections?

[SirValentine]

I have, it is shows a split community on the topic, with a majority and a minority.

So what's the problem then? Why is the minority trying to force itself on the majority? Go do your PvP and leave us out of it. There's a dedicated forum section for discussing it.

If you feel you are a part of that group (that says PvP has no place in DDO)...

Why do you keep implying this? PvP's places are very well defined, both in-game and on the forums, and those places are not under attack from me.

Unlike the General Forums, which now seems to be under attack from a couple of wanna-be player killers who don't seem to like any disagreement with their anti-social behavior.

[Wonedream]

So what's the problem then? Why is the minority trying to force itself on the majority? Go do your PvP and leave us out of it. There's a dedicated forum section for discussing it.

I started a thread about PvP, it got moved. I am sure this one will be moved too, though I didn't start it. I do not equate the minority wanting to talk about this and have a feature that makes the game more interesting for them while simultaneously not effecting the majorities game one bit (other then chat and that can be controlled easily). I play mostly PvE BTW, I wouldn't mind jumping in for some gladiator fun, but right now PvP is not remotely interesting. I like to do different things, not the same thing all the time.

Why do you keep implying this? PvP's places are very well defined, both in-game and on the forums, and those places are not under attack from me.

Ok, you are part of the "let them do their own thing" group. Got it. Sometimes I refer to you individually or plural.. might make communication confusing.

PvP is well defined on the forums, I agree, it has its own place.

In the game, no, it has barely been defined. It has no incentive, no reason to play it, and is imbalanced to make matters worse. It is dead, as this thread perceives, which means in game it is NOT well defined. I will start a thread in PvP with ideas and thoughts on what is possible, but I started a thread first to gather information to better understand it. I saw this thread on the same topic and decided to add to it, because it also is helping to gather better awareness about PvP.

Unlike the General Forums, which now seems to be under attack from a couple of wanna-be player killers who don't seem to like any disagreement with their anti-social behavior.

See, it is when you refer to players who enjoy PvP or even prefer it as "player killers" or "anti-social fetish" I end up confused. It doesn't sound neutral on the topic, it sounds dismissive.

And who are they attacking might I ask? Who is under attack? Who is in danger? All they want to do is discuss it, and now you are saying they are attacking? You did say SEEMS, so hopefully it seems a bit more like they just want to talk now that I pointed that out. No one is here to attack anyone, we just want to discuss DDO and how to make it the best game possible for everyone!

[TacoBob33]

Ok bullet points time

-As a free account you can post anywhere on the forums, maybe you did something naughty to get banned from a section of the forums if this isn't the case for you, I'm a f2p player and can assure you I haven't bought anything in the last 3 months and I can still post anywhere on the forums.

-PvP needs a careful balancing act to be viable in a game. Guild Wars, one of my personal favorites for PvP, used to do almost weekly balancing of abilities to keep PvP areas from being dominated by any particular Flavor Of The Month build.

-PvP in DDO always brought in a negative influence to the game such as arguing in public places and tells being sent that were less than palatable. It's a good thing that it's died down.

-Remaking the PvE environment to fit into a PvP style would take much more time than it's worth at current. That means less content for everybody in hopes to catch a market share of the rise of PvP style games which DDO is too old for.

PvP is dead in DDO because there wasn't anything incentivizing it and that was a good thing for the niche that this game fills. Trying to make it something that it's not in the hopes of getting players that we don't want at the cost of content that we do want is just silly bad math.

[silinteresting]

pvp is dead because pvp never was.

your friend sil

[Knobull]

Wow. I guess the DDO Community Forums is gaslighting me. Far out man.

I guess someone needs to update the DDOWiki page on Account comparisons then:

ddowiki.com/page/Account_Comparisons

I don't have an editor account there. Someone want to take care of it, please? (Or am I seeing a copy of that page generated just for me?)

That still leaves the question of the "Free Discussion Forums" section that this forum is in. Why is it called that? Or am I the only one that sees that? Has Turbine/SSG/Daybreak been running a separate copy of the forums just for me for the last five years?

All of this seems highly unlikely to me. But I guess it is possible.

Am I even real? The Simulation Hypothesis is pretty popular these days. Have I found a glitch in the matrix?

Well whatever. I'll still only read and post in the General DDO Discussion forum, since that is the only place I can post.

If all of you are a figment of my imagination, that would explain a lot!

Does this forum exist when I am not looking at it? Such deep philosophical questions, never expected that here, but that is cool man. We must keep our minds limber.

I shall abide, make some simulated ham sandwiches and go watch some simulated YouTube videos then.

I'll just be over here, takin' 'er easy for all us sinners.

[TacoBob33]

I'd say it's called a free discussion forum because there isn't a focus at all to the conversations had here. But that's just a theory.

[Knobull]

I have sent a PM to the simulated Cordovan to ask if he can clear this up for us. If he really exists, and this forum is real and we do not live in a simulation, that is.

[PermaBanned]

Also killing an iron defender in public is easy.

How so? I spent a couple hours watching people try, it was never even scratched.

Granted: that was several years ago. If things have changed, I'm interested in the details

[Inanout]

Take dog into danger room on ship.
You may reward any toon on Thelanis in the guild For fun.

[Wonedream]

I think PvP will be dead for the next year for sure. There is too much going on elsewhere appealing to a larger base that is active. My guess is somewhere within 2-5 years it will see interesting changes, but for now, whatever plans they got for it are on hold to focus on more important features within program range to not only settle things for unsettled players, but to open the menu up to new players better to help overall growth and development.

[TacoBob33]

PvP is dead and it's gonna stay dead.

[Wonedream]

PvP is dead and it's gonna stay dead.

By the power of Grayskull or by the power of TacoBob33?

Im gonna go gank someone foolish enough to PvP me! And in that single experience, I will enjoy it, and thus PvP will live on!

Will it be you I gank in the tavern? Are you noob material??? Mwahahahahahaaaaa

Well... maybe I will get ganked... Ill use a mule so it doesn't hurt if I lose :P

Pride you know...


Edit: Heading to tavern right now...

[TacoBob33]

By the power of pure apathy.

[PermaBanned]

Take dog into danger room on ship.
You may reward any toon on Thelanis in the guild For fun.

Ah, so indeed I'd chalk that up under the "if things have changed" category, as we didn't even have Druids yet; let alone ships with Danger Rooms

But thanks for the heads up just incase they ever return my favorite "feature!"

[Wonedream]

So I put PvP to the test on Thelanis just now. I logged into Kworr Stoned, my Half Orc Bezerker and went to the wayward lobster. I put an lfm up... beat up Kworr or get beat up by Kworr..

Someone PMd me telling me PvP is dead. I told them I was running a test.

3 minutes later someone showed up in tavern, then another, then another, then another... then there was a barfight. I got killed mostly, but got some kills in. Acidzap dominated the place, made up super power, acid clouds, and other druid madness. Someone tried to sneak kill me... someone shot me dead but I got them back next round... then I got turned into a zombie and managed to get 2 kills while being a zombie, my bezerker rage helping to keep me from rotten to death so fast. Then I died from Acidzaps super power aura by accident.. and got ressed by many considerate players that showed up for PvP fun. (20 people within 20 minutes)

Then some of the ones with res left... and my res screen bugged out, the release botton stayed grey and I was a ghost trapped in the tavern...

Then a Warlock 2 levels higher then me invited me to death match, I accepted. 45 minutes the timer was. We made it 15 minutes with 7 to 8, I was starting to catch up in Berzerker vs Warlock fun!

We both had fun and thanked each other for the time. It was not ganking vileness or whatever.


From this I would say that PvP is NOT dead, but lacking some kind of incentive grind that could be making this game more money.

On Thelanis there are lots of players who showed up, and obviously enjoyed it.

It needs some organizing, maybe a little balance, and or a good concept... I will begin a thread in the PvP topics forums trying my best to supply the extracted and compressed thoughts of others into a great idea, that is cheap, easy, and adds a lot of value for a little investment.


PvP isn't dead on Thelanis, Im guessing the other servers are the same.