Why play a melee character at all?

[Rys]

I can see you're still deflecting. Scared of a little challenge? Come on, post us a nice video with your melee completing the same quests in the same time on the same difficulty level. Or tell us why you can't.

I am not really into this boo boo. Git gud or go home. I challenge you to post a video of you completing R10 on a caster.

[Forzah]

It might take longer, depending on your assumptions.

The only assumption you need is that there is a penalty to damage of charmed mobs. If at least one mob dealing damage for you deals less damage, then it will take at least as long as before to kill all mobs. This is an undeniable fact since the damage dealt per time unit decreases.

It will take longer in almost any scenario you can think of, though theoretical scenarios can be constructed where the time might be the same (when the damage penalty is small or when mobs can kill each other in one hit). Such scenarios are unlikely to occur in DDO since the damage penalty is significant and mobs can take a few hits.

This is narrowly correct and does not invalidate Chai's points.

When you reduce the damage of charmed mobs, it's true that the way you fight does not change. However, since fights will take longer, other abilities become relatively more efficient. People could have used the same charm tactics in heroics for years, but they didn't since it was too slow compared to other tactics.

[GroundhogDay]

I am not really into this boo boo. Git gud or go home. I challenge you to post a video of you completing R10 on a caster.

I'm not the one claiming melees are ok the way they are, am i? If melees are soooooo ok, then show me where i'm doing wrong, show me how a "competent" player runs r10 on a melee solo, or duo with another melee. Or else she woulnd't have said:

On my monkcher, yes I do. That is why I made the wizard. I play the game for fun, not for a joyless slog.[...].Thus the wizard

If that is true for a ranged (2nd most powerful playstyle atm), then we have to agree that melees are subpar when confronted to casters, therefore no amount of videos of a caster running anything will convince me caster aren't the training wheel, safe mode, cheese builds i think they are.

Come on, i challenge the whole forum. If You think melees don't need fixing, prove it. Or else stop deflecting and trolling treads about melees needing fixing.

[Rys]

I'm not the one claiming melees are ok the way they are, am i? If melees are soooooo ok, then show me where i'm doing wrong, show me how a "competent" player run r10 on a melee solo, or duo with another melee. Or else she woulnd't have said:



If that is true for a ranged (2nd most powerful playstyle atm), then we have to agree that melees are subpar when confronted to casters, therefore no amount of videos of a caster running anything will convince me caster aren't the training wheel, safe mode, cheese builds i think they are.

Come on, i challenge the whole forum. If You think melees don't need fixing, prove it.

And am I the one claiming the melees are ok? You are crying on the wrong grave, fam.

They for sure won't get finer by nerfing casters.

[Baddesign]

I'm not the one claiming melees are ok the way they are, am i? If melees are soooooo ok, then show me where i'm doing wrong, show me how a "competent" player runs r10 on a melee solo, or duo with another melee. Or else she woulnd't have said:



If that is true for a ranged (2nd most powerful playstyle atm), then we have to agree that melees are subpar when confronted to casters, therefore no amount of videos of a caster running anything will convince me caster aren't the training wheel, safe mode, cheese builds i think they are.

Come on, i challenge the whole forum. If You think melees don't need fixing, prove it. Or else stop deflecting and trolling treads about melees needing fixing.

Make melees able to solo r10 is not a good thing but yes melee play style is hella boring atm.

I'm surprise he didn't link his super 34 str melee build crushing LTS yet xD.

[Wizza]

I'm not the one claiming melees are ok the way they are, am i? If melees are soooooo ok, then show me where i'm doing wrong, show me how a "competent" player runs r10 on a melee solo, or duo with another melee. Or else she woulnd't have said:



If that is true for a ranged (2nd most powerful playstyle atm), then we have to agree that melees are subpar when confronted to casters, therefore no amount of videos of a caster running anything will convince me caster aren't the training wheel, safe mode, cheese builds i think they are.

Come on, i challenge the whole forum. If You think melees don't need fixing, prove it. Or else stop deflecting and trolling treads about melees needing fixing.

People have suggested fixes for melees (actually a lot of suggestions, for different situations and purposes, according to different people's opinions), but every suggestion has been turned down. Then it turned* into a "nerf casters-ranged" thread as per usual.


*Definition of turned: it was like that from the beginning, except it was hidden behind lots of words.

[Hugoleo]

People have suggested fixes for melees (actually a lot of suggestions, for different situations and purposes, according to different people's opinions), but every suggestion has been turned down. Then it turned* into a "nerf casters-ranged" thread as per usual.


*Definition of turned: it was like that from the beginning, except it was hidden behind lots of words.

Is it unreasonable to ask for nerfs to ranged instead of continuing the endless buff cycle that made us end up in this mess to begin with?

[Wizza]

Is it unreasonable to ask for nerfs to ranged instead of continuing the endless buff cycle that made us end up in this mess to begin with?

Nerfing casters will surely help your melee.

Read above

[GroundhogDay]

And am I the one claiming the melees are ok? You are crying on the wrong grave, fam.

They for sure won't get finer by nerfing casters.

If that's all you have to say, by which i mean you keep up deflecting from the fact that you're not answering one simple question, then we have nothing to talk anymore. I have nothing to say to someone without the honesty to debate.

By the way, you're telling that melee players have to git gud or git out. Soooo, yeah, you're deflecting the hell out of this.

[GroundhogDay]

People have suggested fixes for melees (actually a lot of suggestions, for different situations and purposes, according to different people's opinions), but every suggestion has been turned down. Then it turned* into a "nerf casters-ranged" thread as per usual.


*Definition of turned: it was like that from the beginning, except it was hidden behind lots of words.

Yes, the same people that play melees, while every suggestion has been turned down by someone playing a caster or a ranged with the strawman that "we just want to pwn aevery quest".

Then yeah, nerf the hell out of casters, i'd be good with that. Bring everybody down to the same level of ****. If there's is **** to be eaten, at least let everyone have a spoonful.

[Rys]

If that's all you have to say, by which i mean you keep up deflecting from the fact that you're not answering one simple question, then we have nothing to talk anymore. I have nothing to say to someone without the honesty to debate.

By the way, you're telling that melee players have to git gud or git out. Soooo, yeah, you're deflecting the hell out of this.

I didn't want to talk to you in the first place since I was answering questions by Pyed-Pyper so fine by me.

And don't get so defensive now about git gud while you 'challenge' me to do something. Your fight. Not mine.

[GroundhogDay]

I didn't want to talk to you in the first place since I was answering questions by Pyed-Pyper so fine by me.

And don't get so defensive now about git gud while you 'challenge' me to do something. Your fight. Not mine.

Translation: I don't want to run a melee because i know i couldn't pwn r10 like i do with training wheels and that would totally undermine all the snark i've thrown around while not talking to the people discussing the matter.

Goodbye.

[Hugoleo]

Read above

Yes, that's exactly right! I am glad that you get it

[Wizza]

Yes, the same people that play melees, while every suggestion has been turned down by someone playing a caster or a ranged with the strawman that "we just want to pwn aevery quest".

Then yeah, nerf the hell out of casters, i'd be good with that. Bring everybody down to the same level of ****. If there's is **** to be eaten, at least let everyone have a spoonful.

Suggestions have been thrown around by both melees and non-melees.

But hey, nerf those evil casters! That will surely make you come back to the game that you don't play in a mode that you have never tried...amirite?

Yes, that's exactly right! I am glad that you get it

Flawless logic!

[GroundhogDay]

Ok, now that we established melees need fixing and it looks like no one can prove otherwise (for some reason), can we please do away with all the strawmanning and have an actual conversation? If you think melees just want to pwn everything or are op, please open a tread about it. I don't see why this one has to continually get off topic just because some players are afraid.

[GroundhogDay]

But hey, nerf those evil casters! That will surely make you come back to the game that you don't play in a mode that you have never tried...amirite?

That would take me back for sure, and i'd play a caster just to rub you the wrong way. You people really don't know me.

[Wizza]

That would take me back for sure, and i'd play a caster just to rub you the wrong way. You people really don't know me.

Rub me the wrong way? Lolz.

I assure you that I'm having tons of fun reading your cries here on the forum, on a game that you haven't played in a year.

Sorry I mean nooooo please don't make a caster, no! How could you do that to me!!!!!

And I am also not interested in knowing you, thanks for the offer though.

[GroundhogDay]

Rub me the wrong way? Lolz.

I assure you that I'm having tons of fun reading your cries here on the forum, on a game that you haven't played in a year.

Sorry I mean nooooo please don't make a caster, no! How could you do that to me!!!!!

And I am also not interested in knowing you, thanks for the offer though.

eh, you're welcome, now, don't you have to grease the training wheels on your caster?

goodbye.

[KingNite]

People have suggested fixes for melees (actually a lot of suggestions, for different situations and purposes, according to different people's opinions), but every suggestion has been turned down. Then it turned* into a "nerf casters-ranged" thread as per usual.

Spot on.

[KingNite]

When you reduce the damage of charmed mobs, it's true that the way you fight does not change. However, since fights will take longer, other abilities become relatively more efficient. People could have used the same charm tactics in heroics for years, but they didn't since it was too slow compared to other tactics.

It would have a big impact in boss fights too.