Just Curious For Assassins

[Nokills]

Which stat do you guys prefer and why on your assassin: Int or Dex as main? =D

[Nightmanis]

Which stat do you guys prefer and why on your assassin: Int or Dex as main? =D

I'm pretty sure there's no way to get int higher than dex, so for that reason only I think most actual melee assassins go with dex.

There is the full int based assassin build here on the forums. I've done it, though mine was more harper than assassin at that point. Took the tier 5 Improved Deception, maxed out MP, etc. Made for a fun Khopesh build, that's for sure.

[nokowi]

Which stat do you guys prefer and why on your assassin: Int or Dex as main? =D

Dex assassin saves a feat (no insightful reflexes), have higher SA damage, better stealth skills, and better synergy with acrobat tree, reaper trees, and the epic feat for Move Silently to damage. Dex also goes nicely with Halfling which has extra self-healing.

The only reason to consider Int build is if you can't get the gear to Search for traps, or if you use traps extensively and can't get high enough Disable Device on the difficulty setting you prefer (Mechanic Tree - Improved Traps). It is much easier to fix any issues by getting better gear on a Dex build, or adding a few AP to skill boosts, than to eventually have to redo your entire build from Int to Dex.

[Saekee]

just to add
minor bonuses to going INT:
1) You must do strategic combat which means you can have a strong KtA
2) Strategic combat gives INT to hit & damage with any weapon. That gives some flexibility with weapon switching. A dex assassin might take weapon finesse for using dex on any light weapon, and TA will give dex on staves, but sometimes someone will have in their bank a nice crafted martial weapon or undead beater that is not light/staff. Plus, an INT assassin can use GxBows (dex can too; 1 ap in mech tree) but do some decent damage with them, even if RoF is appalling, hence there is a weak ranged option (that will also benefit from sneak damage and, I believe, lethality.)
3) INT assassins, since they are taking improved traps, can take wand & scroll mastery too.
4) you can ER into a mechanic with almost the identical gear

[CThruTheEgo]

They each have their advantages and ultimately it's a matter of personal preference. The advantages are as follows:

Int based: Overall, better CC and higher base/boss dps
~Better DCs on traps from improved traps in mechanic. This can provide some solid CC with web traps.
~Higher base and boss dps due to int based plus know the angles.
~Higher dire charge DC due to know the angles.
~See slarden's build or nokowi's build for examples.

Dex based: Overall, better damage avoidance
~Can reach around 50% dodge through acrobat enhancements.
~Defensive roll procs below 50% health with improved defensive roll from acrobat.
~Immunity to slippery surfaces and knockdowns from acrobat core 4.
~Higher damage against helpless enemies (twist balanced attacks for knockdown on vorpal) due to no mercy from acrobat.
~See my build for an example.

I haven't done assassinate DC calcs in a while, but I don't think either dex or int has an advantage there anymore. The dps advantages they each have is not significant enough to be a major difference either. Int based will be more party friendly due to the CC. While I definitely see the advantages of dire charge from a meta perspective, thematically I could not bring myself to use dire charge on an assassin. Personally, I love having 50% dodge, 25% incorp, and 50% concealment from constant displacement for about a total of 80% damage avoidance. So it really comes down to what do you want your assassin to do.

[Chai]

Int.

Much of the concealment and dodge is negated in reaper.
More weapon variety.
Trap DCs will land more often.
---both for finding and removing traps and...
---setting traps for CC purposes
Crossbow damage when applicable (even with zero ranged feats its still useful from time to time situationally)
KTA for better base damage.

[CThruTheEgo]

Much of the concealment and dodge is negated in reaper.

"Much" is an exaggeration. Do you have any evidence to back up this claim?

Only some mobs have true seeing, which negates all concealment.

I think dodge bypass was implemented in reaper, but I'm sure that not every mob has it, and of those who do, I wouldn't expect it to be more than 15% at most.

I've only been playing my monk recently, who has 25% dodge and 20% concealment. I see these scroll over my head quite often in reaper.

[nokowi]

nokowi's build for examples.

Ouch, only DC 73!

U23 is old enough I wouldn't recommend following this one any more.

[CThruTheEgo]

Ouch, only DC 73!

U23 is old enough I wouldn't recommend following this one any more.

None of the builds I linked have been fully updated for a long time now. slarden doesn't take improved traps on his build and your build doesn't go to level 30. So together they should give the OP a pretty good idea of what an int build should look like.

[Saekee]

for me the most exciting change to stealth (in the face of the heartrending aggro changes) has been the WAI stacking faster sneak speed buffs from multiple trees. It is hard for assassins to take advantage of this because the capstone is so good. Monk splashes are hard for assassins since they will be uncentered save with poor crit profile weapons or EMGs...You could do 18 rogue/2 DWS for the sneak speed boost and gain a feat too; I might try this for an heroic TR. 19!rogue/1 monk or 18 rogue/1 monk/1 other?

[Unsinful]

My monk expertise is not of the highest caliber. However, that said, wouldn't taking a monk level make it so you cannot use daggers because you are uncentered? Unless you use short swords you are uncentered but at that point you may not care to be centered. Interesting idea though.

[nokowi]

None of the builds I linked have been fully updated for a long time now. slarden doesn't take improved traps on his build and your build doesn't go to level 30. So together they should give the OP a pretty good idea of what an int build should look like.

Maybe Chai could post his current Int build - that would have imp traps and current gear choices.

[Chai]

"Much" is an exaggeration. Do you have any evidence to back up this claim?

Only some mobs have true seeing, which negates all concealment.

I think dodge bypass was implemented in reaper, but I'm sure that not every mob has it, and of those who do, I wouldn't expect it to be more than 15% at most.

I've only been playing my monk recently, who has 25% dodge and 20% concealment. I see these scroll over my head quite often in reaper.

Evidence - playing DDO.

Much is not an exaggeration. It helps alot less than it does on elite, which is what people were used to in the past.

[CThruTheEgo]

Evidence - playing DDO.

Much is not an exaggeration. It helps alot less than it does on elite, which is what people were used to in the past.

Your arguments are always so sound. What was I thinking challenging your claims.